Joystick "slipping" against gate in one direction, weird feel

[BazookaBen]

So I finally got my LS-56 set up with an octogate and the kowal shorth-throw spacers to get it close to being the perfect shooter stick.

One annoying thing though. In three directions: up, left, right, it hits the gate and stops firmly. But when I hit down, it hits the gate, then the entire stick pulls up and back towards me, by maybe a millimeter or two, which feels like it's moving a little more.

In other words: I pull down, it hits the gate, I put a little more pressure, it slips upwards in the gate (towards the ceiling/top of the box" which and allows the stick moves a little more. Like it has two "stages" of movement

I don't know if I explained it well, but it means that hitting down feels different than the other three directions. It doesn't stop completely when it hits the gate.

Has anybody deal with this particular issue? How'd you fix it?

[Konsolkongen]

One of mine did something similar with the square gate. Had to buy three LS-56’s to get two good ones. This was maybe ten years ago.

I guess the quality control is just not very good.

[Lander]

I had a similar experience when I got my LS-56; octogate, both kowal spacers, and undesirable slippage when pressing hard to the right.

It ended up being down to the double spacer + gate combo raising the profile of the housing too much; the actuator isn't long enough to keep a clean interaction with it after a certain point, so you end up with the two-stage effect.

You should be able to fix it by removing one of the spacers. I ended up shuffling mine between a few different configurations, eventually ditching the octogate for a square one and keeping the spacers (though I forget whether I have one or two in there).

[BazookaBen]

Well damn those weren't the answers I was hoping for haha. I love how short the throw is now, I'd hate to remove a spacer. Or gamble on another stick

I forgot to mention, I did put a different tension spring in the stick. I was thinking a 4lb spring was a little to heavy anyway, maybe the problem will go away with a 2lb spring

[Dochartaigh]

I forgot to mention, I did put a different tension spring in the stick. I was thinking a 4lb spring was a little to heavy anyway, maybe the problem will go away with a 2lb spring

Maybe my notes are wrong as they're from years ago, but I have written down that the stock LS-56 spring is 1.03 lbf (pounds)... and even the spring kits like the ArcadeShock LS-56 exclusive with spring kit I bought has a MAX of 2 pounds... so maybe the super duper strong spring you're using isn't helping things with your issue? Here's my two I built into my wireless 360 sticks (used on PC mostly) and don't have any issues with (I do light them super light however):

Seimitsu LS-56-01-AS Multi Tension Joystick [ArcadeShock Exclusive]
--Comes w/ 4x Springs: 2, 1.12, 0.9, 0.4 lbf (installed) --stock is 1.03 lbf
--KOWAL LS.ST Short Throw Mod
--Seimitsu Octogate (Restrictor Plate)

Seimitsu LS-56-01-SC-K Joystick, w/ 0.9 lbf spring (stock is 1.03, so 13% less)
--Seimitsu Octogate (Restrictor Plate)

They now have Phreak Mods The Link EX Groove (quick detach shaft) on them, but were likewise fine with the stock shafts.

[Lander]

It's probably also worth mentioning that specific diagonals started becoming hard to hit when I had the full 2-spacer + octo setup - it wasn't immediately obvious, but ended up causing noticeable missed inputs in cases where I wasn't pushing the stick hard enough to risk the slip effect. Might be worth checking with a controller tester program like Windows' control panel.

I figured it was a case of having mis-tensioned the screws, so spent some hours disassembling and reassembling to try and get the perfect alignment, but to no avail.
Perhaps it's a build quality thing, but the diagonal trigger zones are so small at that point that it felt like you'd need a top-binned stick, shorter-engage microswitches, or a customized actuator in order to actually make it viable.

[Rastan78]

One thing you can do is use the Seimitsu NT shafts that allow you to remove spacers and shorten the length of the shaft. It comes as a separate part for most of their sticks or is already included on the SEL-70 which is sort of an upgraded 56.

Whenever you shorten the shaft you also decrease the overall throw a bit. With one or both spacers removed you'll likely want to adjust the height of the joystick if it's not already sitting just below the control panel. I have a custom stick where I just had to remove some washers to compensate. For other setups you might want the Seimitsu step plate for the LS-58 that will raise the joystick up so you can have a short shaft at a comfortable height.

Just me but since the LS-56 has a fairly long shaft I'd reduce that to minimize throw first off. That way you can get noticeably less throw without risking other side effects of aftermarket mods like the iffy diagonals and extra popping movement after the gate. Then you can see where you need to go from there.

[BazookaBen]

One thing you can do is use the Seimitsu NT shafts that allow you to remove spacers and shorten the length of the shaft.

I don't see how this would change throw distance in a useful way, unless it change the pivot point of the stick. But the bottom part of the stick, below the panel, still has to travel the same distance, if I'm understanding correctly how these shafts work.

And yeah, my stick is already mounted directly to the bottom of the panel, no bracket.

[Lander]

Shortening the shaft reduces the lateral distance traveled by your hand, since it moves the top of the lever closer to the fulcrum, but also increases the amount of force needed to actuate it.
So it effectively retains the same engage / throw ratios, but squashes them down into a smaller space. Easy to test by playing a round while gripping the stick lower than usual - it's effectively another trade-off, but with spring / switch tension instead of constraint distance.

In terms of the physics of it I think the ideal is a long lever and tight restrictor gate with appropriately weighty spring, mounted low to keep a proper height relative to the panel, but that's the realm of custom stuff and the hard-to-find Suzo Inductive.

[Gunstar]

Is this a different issue to the LS-32 pivot "hop" thing?