Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
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MOSQUITO FIGHTER
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Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
Just got this one. Plays a lot like Hagane mixed with Shinobi 3. I've only played a few levels so far but it doesn't seem to be as good as Blazing Chrome. Very cool pixel art.
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
Yep. Just had a quick 30 minutes with it (PS5). Here are some quick thoughts I just sent to my buds:
First impressions: stiff.
The controls need tuning up. Your sword slash is too slow. Taking Ninja Gaiden as an example, drawing your sword is lightning quick. In that game, you can jump, slash, slash again at the apex of your jump, and slash again coming down. This is too slow, lucky if you can get two slashes in.
There is a diving kick you can do, but it's awkward and can leave you open to attack from gunfire or aerial enemies as you freeze momentarily in the air before coming down.
You have a walk and a run. Double tap left/right, or hold R2 to run. The walk is egregiously slow. Unbearable. You will want to be running all the time. It would be nice if there was an option to have Run on at all times, were it not for...
The running slash. When you attack whilst running, you perform a lungeing attack, which causes increased damage. Nice. The only issue here is that you often lunge into an enemy whilst performing the attack, making body contact. This is not so bad for zako. If this is an enemy with high HP like a boss or midboss, you will take damage, as it appears this does not disable the enemy hitbox, making the attack incredibly high risk. A couple of i-frames here to at least be able to back away would be nice.
Blazing Chrome was really good, so I had high hopes for this, but so far a little disappointed.
I'll stick with it though, only played a short while.
First impressions: stiff.
The controls need tuning up. Your sword slash is too slow. Taking Ninja Gaiden as an example, drawing your sword is lightning quick. In that game, you can jump, slash, slash again at the apex of your jump, and slash again coming down. This is too slow, lucky if you can get two slashes in.
There is a diving kick you can do, but it's awkward and can leave you open to attack from gunfire or aerial enemies as you freeze momentarily in the air before coming down.
You have a walk and a run. Double tap left/right, or hold R2 to run. The walk is egregiously slow. Unbearable. You will want to be running all the time. It would be nice if there was an option to have Run on at all times, were it not for...
The running slash. When you attack whilst running, you perform a lungeing attack, which causes increased damage. Nice. The only issue here is that you often lunge into an enemy whilst performing the attack, making body contact. This is not so bad for zako. If this is an enemy with high HP like a boss or midboss, you will take damage, as it appears this does not disable the enemy hitbox, making the attack incredibly high risk. A couple of i-frames here to at least be able to back away would be nice.
Blazing Chrome was really good, so I had high hopes for this, but so far a little disappointed.
I'll stick with it though, only played a short while.
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
I'm curious to hear what everyone thinks of it. I almost bought it day one because of Blazing Chrome, but it sounds like Moonrider might need a little tuning up first. Maybe I'll hold off for now.
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
The diving kick needs to be aimed to do it diagonally, which is a slight bit awkward. Keep doing straight down ones by accident.
Last edited by BrianC on Sat Jan 14, 2023 2:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
I just looked at bits of some gameplay videos, but noticed two things that I didn't like.
There seems to be a lot of wall jumping. I don't mind wall jumping in small amounts but it seems to be a core gameplay mechanic here from what I was watching.
The blood sprays seem excessive and out of place. They stand out far too much given the rest of the color palette of the game. Is there an option to turn off or reduce that? It's a me problem I'm sure as I don't like this in general in games.
I might still get it eventually, but I will wait to see if someone that isn't LRG releases it physically on PS4. I just ordered the Blazing Chrome PS4 disc from Pix'n Love earlier in the week.
There seems to be a lot of wall jumping. I don't mind wall jumping in small amounts but it seems to be a core gameplay mechanic here from what I was watching.
The blood sprays seem excessive and out of place. They stand out far too much given the rest of the color palette of the game. Is there an option to turn off or reduce that? It's a me problem I'm sure as I don't like this in general in games.
I might still get it eventually, but I will wait to see if someone that isn't LRG releases it physically on PS4. I just ordered the Blazing Chrome PS4 disc from Pix'n Love earlier in the week.
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MOSQUITO FIGHTER
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Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
I'm honestly not too crazy about this game.
The motorcycle stages are really really awful and there are multiple motorcycle stages and they are long. Really hate the motorcycle stages. Did I mention that the motorcycle stages are bad? Because they are. Why are they in here? Terrible. I can't imagine why anyone would like those stages. It's almost like when they used to throw mode 7 into snes games just to use it as a selling point on the back of the box.
This really is like a pseudo sequel to Hagane. I think Hagane is a alright game. I've never been too crazy about it. I never think damn I really have to fire up Hagane it's so good. I'd usually rather play something else. I don't think it's bad but it's definitely not my first choice.
I think speed runners will get a kick out of it. It really does seem like that is the play style that the game is designed for.
It has a item in the game that can be equipped and it makes any hit an instant death. I'm hoping that playing that style makes the game more interesting because I've never cared much for speed running games.
I'm glad I bought it. I like the game if for no other reason than it makes me feel like I got a new cool looking Sega Genesis game. I'll probably get my money's worth out of it. But I feel this is kind of lacking unless you are a Hagane super fan.
I'm honestly disappointed. I think Blazing Chrome is a high quality game and I was really looking forward to this.
The motorcycle stages are really really awful and there are multiple motorcycle stages and they are long. Really hate the motorcycle stages. Did I mention that the motorcycle stages are bad? Because they are. Why are they in here? Terrible. I can't imagine why anyone would like those stages. It's almost like when they used to throw mode 7 into snes games just to use it as a selling point on the back of the box.
This really is like a pseudo sequel to Hagane. I think Hagane is a alright game. I've never been too crazy about it. I never think damn I really have to fire up Hagane it's so good. I'd usually rather play something else. I don't think it's bad but it's definitely not my first choice.
I think speed runners will get a kick out of it. It really does seem like that is the play style that the game is designed for.
It has a item in the game that can be equipped and it makes any hit an instant death. I'm hoping that playing that style makes the game more interesting because I've never cared much for speed running games.
I'm glad I bought it. I like the game if for no other reason than it makes me feel like I got a new cool looking Sega Genesis game. I'll probably get my money's worth out of it. But I feel this is kind of lacking unless you are a Hagane super fan.
I'm honestly disappointed. I think Blazing Chrome is a high quality game and I was really looking forward to this.
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
From what I understand the game is not at all meant to be their next "big piece". When it was having early footage shown, they said it was just a side project. So that might explain the rigidity of the game assuming they still kept to that mindset.
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Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
Well... I do like them.MOSQUITO FIGHTER wrote:The motorcycle stages are really really awful and there are multiple motorcycle stages and they are long. Really hate the motorcycle stages. Did I mention that the motorcycle stages are bad? Because they are. Why are they in here? Terrible. I can't imagine why anyone would like those stages. It's almost like when they used to throw mode 7 into snes games just to use it as a selling point on the back of the box.
They are quite easy, but I found them to be a nice change of pace from the rest of the game, and nice pieces of "eye candy" (the sequences, especially the last one, look quite nice visually; it reminded me of a bit of games like Night Striker).
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I finished the game earlier today, and I found it to be a solid "16-bit style" action title.
There's room there to improve things with a few tweaks, but I certainly enjoyed my time with it.
Last edited by FunktionJCB on Sun Jan 15, 2023 12:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
Iconoclast really likes it. He has a video up on youtube for the game. He says it's his favorite Joymasher title so far.
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
It feels like they took ideas from various Ninja and Samurai games and mashed them together. Problem is they took some of the bad ideas like the area with the double jump ability, small platforms, and some blind jumps ala Super Shinobi. The sword slash is similar to Hagane with a combo added, but slower sword speed. The standing combo is a good thing, the slower speed is not. I don't dislike the game, but it does feel rough around the edges.
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Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
Indeed it does.BrianC wrote:It feels like they took ideas from various Ninja and Samurai games and mashed them together.
Kind of like a mix between Shinobi and Strider.
Which made me crave for a Shinobi revival. It's a crime a series as popular as Shinobi once was, has been totally forgotten by SEGA.
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
We did get that awesome Sega Ages of the original AC game for Switch.
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
Played through the demo...not bad, but stiff and slow. Simply not fun enough.
Tänzer on the Mega Drive does it better.
Tänzer on the Mega Drive does it better.
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
Got the 1CC earlier today.
Gotta say, I've warmed to it. Controls aren't perfect, but can certainly be adapted to. For me, it's all about managing that run button, and making sure not to dive headlong into a boss whilst performing the running attack. It's really good for the stages for whipping through zako, but you wanna be a little more tactful with the bosses, or your timing and distancing better be shit-hot. Iconoclast's 1CC playthrough definitely gave me some impetus to get a handle on it. It's generous with extra lives, you just have to find them. I had 11 lives at one point.
The Dark Portal subweapon (think that's what it's called) is a beast and tears bosses apart. Unleashes a devastating tentacle attack. Go all Urotsukidoji up they ass!
Gotta say, I've warmed to it. Controls aren't perfect, but can certainly be adapted to. For me, it's all about managing that run button, and making sure not to dive headlong into a boss whilst performing the running attack. It's really good for the stages for whipping through zako, but you wanna be a little more tactful with the bosses, or your timing and distancing better be shit-hot. Iconoclast's 1CC playthrough definitely gave me some impetus to get a handle on it. It's generous with extra lives, you just have to find them. I had 11 lives at one point.
The Dark Portal subweapon (think that's what it's called) is a beast and tears bosses apart. Unleashes a devastating tentacle attack. Go all Urotsukidoji up they ass!
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
Yes, but the Shinobi games on the Genesis are stuck on the god-awful Sega Classics Collection, with 8+ frames of lag, no remappable controls (unless it was already in the Genesis game) and an ugly, laggy, lazy wrapper.BrianC wrote:We did get that awesome Sega Ages of the original AC game for Switch.
Sega Ages Shinobi 3 when? I dunno, maybe it was already released on Xbox 360 yonks and yonks ago. But they never brought it to Switch. Most of the Sega Ages line that predate Switch were never ported over to Switch or any modern consoles. Golden Axe 3 has a sega ages/m2 release IIRC, but it's not for modern consoles.
I've sperged at length about Shinobi-like, Elevator Action-like, Rolling Thunder-like styles of games. I would be very happy if we saw more of these. They're in sort of a middle point between a full tactical shooter (just in 2d) and a run 'n' gun. Tactical Shooting Action.
But Moonrider seems like more of a Hagane-like than Shinobi-like to me.
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
Super Shinobi II/Shinobi III is also part of that online expansion. Disappointing that it's locked to that, but at least is in on Switch in better emulated form. However, the collection is multiplatform, and the emulation isn't the best even on the less laggy versions. Not to mention the original AC Shinobi is still one of the better games in the series and on Switch in good form. At least this proves that the series hasn't been totally forgotten by Sega, though it is oddly omitted in the Yakuza series. Lost Judgement even chose games that didn't come out in Japan over it (and oddly, Secret Command(o) over Ashura). ouch.Sima Tuna wrote:Yes, but the Shinobi games on the Genesis are stuck on the god-awful Sega Classics Collection, with 8+ frames of lag, no remappable controls (unless it was already in the Genesis game) and an ugly, laggy, lazy wrapper.BrianC wrote:We did get that awesome Sega Ages of the original AC game for Switch.
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
Yeah M2 was involved with the emulation on the Sega online platform. The SNES and NES ones are great and low lag although handled by NERD. The native first party SNES controller feels great with them.
Yeah there are problems with Switch online and there are plenty of valid complaints. At the same time I think that sort of overshadows the quality of the emulation offered and led to it being underrated. People definitely sleep on the fact that M2 emulated MUSHA is on there.
Yeah there are problems with Switch online and there are plenty of valid complaints. At the same time I think that sort of overshadows the quality of the emulation offered and led to it being underrated. People definitely sleep on the fact that M2 emulated MUSHA is on there.
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Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
See also: All of their other belting arcade IPsFunktionJCB wrote:Indeed it does.BrianC wrote:It feels like they took ideas from various Ninja and Samurai games and mashed them together.
Kind of like a mix between Shinobi and Strider.
Which made me crave for a Shinobi revival. It's a crime a series as popular as Shinobi once was, has been totally forgotten by SEGA.
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Squire Grooktook
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Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
I only played Oniken and Odallus, and from those I always had a somewhat low opinion of Joymasher tbh.
Aesthetically their games are like "I haven't watched much anime but man weren't over the top 80's-90's ova's cool??? (I've only seen a few gifs of them on tumblr)" which is OKAY I guess, but their gameplay always struck me like it didn't have much thought put into it. Boring boss patterns, mechanics and level design not particularly interesting or unique, etc. just kinda okay but nothing special which feels like a waste.
I heard Blazing Chrome getting praised to the moon, even around here. Haven't gotten around to it but I took that as maybe they improved. This game is making it sound more like a fluke though.
Aesthetically their games are like "I haven't watched much anime but man weren't over the top 80's-90's ova's cool??? (I've only seen a few gifs of them on tumblr)" which is OKAY I guess, but their gameplay always struck me like it didn't have much thought put into it. Boring boss patterns, mechanics and level design not particularly interesting or unique, etc. just kinda okay but nothing special which feels like a waste.
I heard Blazing Chrome getting praised to the moon, even around here. Haven't gotten around to it but I took that as maybe they improved. This game is making it sound more like a fluke though.
Aeon Zenith - My STG.RegalSin wrote:Japan an almost perfect society always threatened by outsiders....................
Instead I am stuck in the America's where women rule with an iron crotch, and a man could get arrested for sitting behind a computer too long.
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
Blazing Chrome is much better than Odallus and Oniken. I didn't care for Odallus. The nicest thing I can say for Odallus is I like the visuals (berserk sure was a fun anime, wasn't it, fellow kids?)
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
Oniken isn't very good, but I'm sad about that, because I think everything about it surface-level makes it seem like a game I would absolutely adore if it had been well made.Squire Grooktook wrote:I only played Oniken and Odallus, and from those I always had a somewhat low opinion of Joymasher tbh.
(...)
I heard Blazing Chrome getting praised to the moon, even around here. Haven't gotten around to it but I took that as maybe they improved. This game is making it sound more like a fluke though.
Odallus is at best enjoyable if you're in the mood for the game it's trying to be (which is a lot less arcade like), but it's super janky in a lot of ways.
In general both games feel to me like they had their heart in the right place, but lacked the skill to carry it through.
Blazing Chrome is a completely different story, they massively came together for that one. The whole game can be a slightly bumpy ride, there are some segments which get a little boring, and others which are pure memorizer in a very painful manner, but I honestly don't think that's different from most of the better run n guns from the era it's mimicking, so it's hard to really fault it for that. Overall it's a very very good run 'n gun, something that is rare not just today, but honestly something that always has been disappointingly rare outside of Contra and Metal Slug.
Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
Never understood the dislike for Oniken in here, I enjoy it quite a bit. To play the devil's advocate, have you seen the boss patterns in the OG Ninja Gaiden? They don't get interesting until the fourth or fifth boss.
Odallus was fun, but probably not something I'll replay, unlike Oniken and Blazing Chrome.
Odallus was fun, but probably not something I'll replay, unlike Oniken and Blazing Chrome.
No matter how good a game is, somebody will always hate it. No matter how bad a game is, somebody will always love it.
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Re: Vengeful Guardian: Moonrider
It's no secret that Ninja Gaiden's bosses, safe from the last two final boss phases, are incredibly boring, but they are also quite inoffensive at that. It's not where the game gains its brilliant reputation.