Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

[BrianC]

I have that collection on Switch and I have mixed feelings about it. On one hand, it gives a proper translation to a good chunk of games that have never been translated before. On the other hand, it definitely feels more laggy than other versions of the game. A few of the games are also on the Nintendo Switch online service and play better there. It also lacks the JP Double Dragon II, which can be played from the FC Switch Online download from the JP eShop.

[velo]

The turrican collection is on sale on the eshop. I never played turrican. Any good? Or is it too jank and confusing?

Everybody else covered this pretty well. But personally, that collection was my first real exposure to Turrican, and I ended up liking them quite a bit, especially Turrican 2. There's a lot in there I can't defend, the camera in particular, but I had a good time with it and didn't find it "unplayable" by any means. T1 and T2 are unique games to this day, but by most standards Gunlord does the same thing much better. (I played Gunlord first)

The collection itself is pretty good in terms of features, but iirc a more complete one is due to come down the line at some point, with more games.

[BIL]

I have that collection on Switch and I have mixed feelings about it. On one hand, it gives a proper translation to a good chunk of games that have never been translated before. On the other hand, it definitely feels more laggy than other versions of the game. A few of the games are also on the Nintendo Switch online service and play better there. It also lacks the JP Double Dragon II, which can be played from the FC Switch Online download from the JP eShop.

Good to know it's not just me - the PS4 version feels decidedly laggy, as well. It's not unplayable, just at that irritating Capcom Arcade Stadium (PS4) level, where I know I'm working against it.

Coming in from the subject of framerates and fluidity, this is my #1 turnoff. Never mind the bed - input lag is shitting in my fridge. I'll put up with a hell of a lot (see SNK40th), as long as the input response is decent, and that crucial chain of command between me and my avatar is intact. The Hard Gaming, scrolling or polygonal, is a tactile process. The distinguishing quality between beloved Umechan and reviled Micronics is ultimately handling precision; the frame-precise, pixel-perfect dicings with death, duelling on the razor's edge between triumph and disaster. Bloodlines or Bloodborne, that's ultimately what I'm here for!

Break that chain, and as far as I'm concerned, what you are selling me is not a game. It's an interactive brochure. The most fundamental component of a car's handling is ultimately its tyres. Even the most gorgeous supercar-deluxe code is gonna go straight into a wall, when Big Value Software Co is in charge of keeping rubber to the road.

All this said, good on 'em for the translation efforts! Maybe something better can be salvaged from that.

[Sima Tuna]

I have that collection on Switch and I have mixed feelings about it. On one hand, it gives a proper translation to a good chunk of games that have never been translated before. On the other hand, it definitely feels more laggy than other versions of the game. A few of the games are also on the Nintendo Switch online service and play better there. It also lacks the JP Double Dragon II, which can be played from the FC Switch Online download from the JP eShop.

Yeah, the collection on switch is kind of mediocre. On the one hand, I love having *any* version of Downtown Samurai Kunio-Kun (whatever that game BIL was talking about is called) and all of the killer Kunio sports games. Hockey and Dodgeball are the big stand-outs for me there. And Double Dragon 1 FC is still a timeless classic, worthy of standing alongside RCR. But I complained earlier in this thread about perceiving some lag. I definitely think there is a little bit of lag in the collection, although I did eventually adjust to it. If you compare Double Dragon 1 from the collection with Double Dragon 4 (not on the collection,) DD4 definitely feels snappier to me.

RCR is a treasure. One of those brawlers that'll always put a smile on my face - it's so uproariously brutal and mean-spirited yet cute! Technos/Miracle Kidz had a priceless mastery of chibified brawler violence, with their pouting, snarling, bug-eyed expressions, inimitably grainy, heavy *BAP-BAP-BWAP* hit SFX, and Kunio-vintage stagger/knockdown/ground-pound action. Image

Its world is a model of ARPG balance, too. Big enough that sprinting from one end to the other feels like a significant journey, let alone taking a relaxing amble through, but not so massive that going for short, deadly Hard runs is at all an issue.

RCR is definitely a masterpiece of game design, especially in the open world balance. It gets right what so many open worlds nowadays flub. The size and density of *any* open world is often the biggest obstacle to the game's greatness. When you look at open world games, the ones that tend to hold up the best also have the most dense open worlds. A "big" open world is not desirable if it results in content being spread too far. My favorite open world games, like Vice City, Baldur's Gate, RCR and Dork/Demon's Souls/Bloodborne, have fairly smallish worlds with a lot of dense packing. Every screen in RCR has something to do there. Sure, maybe you will run through a few of the screens if you know where you want to go and have a mission plan, but there's always some activity happening in every screen. Like Baldur's Gate, the game is as "big" as you want it to be. If you decide to beeline through the content, it's pretty short but sweet. Or you can explore everything, fight everyone, buy everything... Whatever you want!

In my opinion, RCR is the high point of Technos game design, in every way. The comedic violence, the fantastic soundtrack, hilarious visuals that communicate exactly what they set out to... Even the combat, which is often kinda jank in Technos titles (I'm thinking of combatribes lol,) is rock solid here. RCR even does weapons better than anyone else! None of that weapon durability shit here, if you can retain hold on a weapon then you can keep it forever and take it anywhere.

[BEAMLORD]

Now, I was playing me some Ninja Gaiden, or Shadow Warrior to be exact (PAL version, bumped up to 60hz via my NT Mini). I was at the 4.4 boss, Kelbeross I believe.

As you know, these toad-like demons spawn atop two stone pillars, kill one, kill the other. Well, I took one of them out, and then 2 more of them spawned on the stone pillars, so there were 3 of the cunts bouncing around!

Observe https://twitter.com/B3AMLORD/status/150 ... 7YP6w&s=19

Needless to say it ended my run, as I fumbled with my phone to capture the anomaly. Anybody else had this happen before?

[Herr Schatten]

Anybody else had this happen before?

Yeah, that happened to me, too. Luckily, only once, so it seems it's a rather rare glitch.

[Sir Ilpalazzo]

I've ran into that NG bug too. IIRC, only one of the two enemies in that fight is actually the boss (something I learned from this thread way back, originally I thought it was a dual boss fight), and the glitch seems to only happen if you kill the "fake" one and then linger long enough, I think.

-

This final boss rush in Crime Fighters 2 is no joke. Some scattered thoughts about the gauntlet:

-Every one of these fights is singularly tough. Even the milder opening round with Buzzsaw and Missing Link is the probably the third-hardest fight of the game (not sure if the first Rude brothers fight is scarier, still). Missing Link's jump attack is just a free punish opportunity in stage 2, but here it's terrifying, given the limited room you have to maneuver and how badly Buzzsaw can damage you if you wander into him while doing the necessary movements to misdirect Missing Link. Actually, both bosses play support for each other really well, given that both of them have such massive off-axis hitboxes on their swings. At least Buzzsaw wastes time taunting if you manage to separate the two bosses and get far away from him.

-I hate the smaller Rude brother. Evil little bastard - it's comical that the ultimate challenge of the second round is just to land one single hit on him (after depleting most of his health via a tossed drum from the previous arena) and that that is still probably the most dangerous moment in the whole game. It seems a bit easier now that I've realized you can more reliably land that hit with a thrown box rather than trying to time a kick on him as he jumps around, at least.

-Grabs (or really, anything that can stun you) are always kind of worrying throughout the game but become deeply dangerous in the final gauntlet. Ohsugi's chain grab, the dominatrix enemy's whip grab, Faust's poison breath stun - is there a particularly effective method for escaping these with reliable timing? It's unclear just how much you have to mash movement commands until you recover, and if (when, in these fights) someone attacks you as you're recovering from the stun - potentially with another stun attack - it's hard to get away since you're not sure exactly when you can transition from d-pad mashing to evasive movement.

-The last battle is very rough. Kurt and Faust don't complement each other as well as the preceding pair-ups - it's not hard to navigate them when they're the only ones on the field - but their enemy backup makes the fight very chaotic and difficult, and it's very hard to manage to kill the knife guy before the karate guy takes the field. Faust's propensity for coming to kick you once you've taken a knockdown is very frustrating too; being knocked down with even a bit less than full health while you're anywhere near him is a death sentence, which makes the lackeys even more problematic.

Very volatile fights with a lot that can go wrong. It's definitely a lot to learn to get down reliably and a big jump from the rest of the game.

Tremendously fun game on the whole. The combat is so visceral, tactical and tactile, and the presentation and pacing are both excellent - though it has some minorly rough and cruel edges, it's great. I didn't expect to feel so positively about a Konami arcade brawler, given both what seems to me the style-over-substance trend of Konami's arcade entries in this genre and that I haven't really clicked with any arcade brawlers for several years.

[BEAMLORD]

Very interesting, thanks both Schatten and Ilpalazzo

[Ghegs]

I can't remember what prompted me to check, but I discovered that my local gaming shop still has Wii2HDMI's in stock, so I went and picked one up. Works great and it's so much more convenient with my current setup than using the console with the CRT. My return to Wii gaming shall start with finally beating Contra Rebirth properly, which I bought way back in 2009, but never 1CCed. The debug menu (only available in the EU version?) also makes practicing stages a breeze.

[BIL]

The extra Cerberus bug comes up every few years ITT, haha. Happens in the FC and NES versions, too - good to get confirmation of PAL as well! Been forever since I saw it, owing to a more famous quirk of NG1's code.

ANIMAL CONTROL NO OUGI

Spoiler

Ohsugi's chain grab, the dominatrix enemy's whip grab, Faust's poison breath stun - is there a particularly effective method for escaping these with reliable timing? It's unclear just how much you have to mash movement commands until you recover, and if (when, in these fights) someone attacks you as you're recovering from the stun - potentially with another stun attack - it's hard to get away since you're not sure exactly when you can transition from d-pad mashing to evasive movement.

Vertical evasion, one of CF2's strongest assets, becomes especially vital in the boss rush, nowhere moreso than with Ohsugi. It's been a month now, but muscle memory is telling me you'll always need at least a second to escape his lasso, no matter how rapidly you spin the pad/hit the buttons.

The best approach, by far, is to aggressively evade his lane (this also goes for his shuriken). He can really foil a seemingly certain win, even when it's just Frank Rude left alive - not to be underestimated. Of course, both of them have poor defense, and will eat raw PPPs nonstop. Even here, though, Ohsugi tends to actively hop away. Kinda neat how a throwaway midboss finds his groove as an especially evil third mic, haha.

Vigilance is the watchword for this stage, basically. Boomer has quite a bit going for him, between evasion, P+K knockdowns, and strategic weapon use (mostly on Caveman, Freddy Rude, and bricking Faust/Kurt's meaner supports), plus a fair amount of HP restores - but with CF2's already punishing damage scale, and the deadly roster, getting cornered or blindsided will kill you fast.

From a quick revisit of the demo clips I'd recorded, I recall something else, always forgotten when not at the controls: aggressively keeping enemies floored with PKs. Knockdowns aren't for doing damage, ofc, but freeing up time and space. CF2 gives you remarkable freedom to floor enemies, and exploiting this (along with its Double Dragon-quick movement) is key to surviving its crowds. Piling on a good stomping where possible is no bad thing either, circumstances allowing.

The below clips are a bit idealised, coming from practice sessions, but I'm including just in case they help illustrate this slightly nebulous post.

Buzzsaw/Caveman - I wish I'd recorded a "normal" run. That instakill happens about 50% of the time; the requisites are 1) that Caveman trip and fall on his face, and 2) that he do the "big windup" on recovery, which seems to take damage per-frame.

Even without this happy event, I feel pretty good about the fight. I've learned to very aggressively shut down Caveman's triple stomp, when I'm near him; time Boomer's standing PK, so it swings around and claps him in the face immediately post-takeoff, and that's that. If I get knocked down by it (or Buzzsaw), rather than scrambling back to my feet for evasion/counter-attack, I just chill. With a bit of practice timing it, Boomer's grounded recovery kick is an excellent counter, and a much safer alternative.

Note also that the Oil Drums will do some meaty damage to Caveman, if positioned right. You want to knock him down with the throw, then have the drum roll over him, racking up tons of hits. I never use drums on Buzzsaw, at least outside of emergencies.

Ohsugi/Rudes - while I find Buzzsaw+Caveman easy to survive, what's trickier is beating them without using all the crates. As shown, a thrown crate is an excellent anti-Frank solution. This goes to a lesser extent for Rude/Ohsugi; it's nice being able to carry an extra chicken into the final round.

Faust/Kurt - tail end. This one's very outdated, from before I realised just how aggressively you can attack Kurt (note that his spin-telegraphing strikes are harmless, despite sharing animation frames with his actual attacks; just like Caveman's equivalent triple stomp telegraph, you'll be buffeted back at 0HP cost).

Still, it demonstrates some of the vertical evasion I mention, as well as a near-fatal lapse of it. I could've very easily died to that Mohawk's leap - shouldn't have approached him head-on! Fortunately, I land next to Faust who, instead of getting to back up and deliver a lethal punt (as you've noticed, he'll very deliberately do this), eats a barrage of defensive kicks

On that subject, those aren't to be underestimated; in a sense, they're CF2's way of giving a Technos-styled brawler an emergency recovery move, and (as seen here), they actually do some pretty nasty damage in their own right. Also an excellent concessionary hit on Frank Rude, who'll usually try to diveclaw you. Particularly in the rush's 50%HP context, that revenge hit can be game-changing.

I'm feeling pretty confident about my strategies - was getting consistent stage clears when the inevitable happened, and my dpad died. >_< A bit annoyed with Sony's controller build quality ATM. It's clear the DS4 is an ongoing subscription service, so rather than forking out for my fourth in less than three years, I'm gonna chill out with Bloodborne and Dark Souls while sorting out a nice AC stick. Got an old DC Hori I'm gonna put a Brook with Seimitsu parts in, then go balls-out.

Or I might do another patch job with some third-party underlays. >_> Balls will fly either way! I got a few scores to settle.

Tremendously fun game on the whole. The combat is so visceral, tactical and tactile, and the presentation and pacing are both excellent - though it has some minorly rough and cruel edges, it's great. I didn't expect to feel so positively about a Konami arcade brawler, given both what seems to me the style-over-substance trend of Konami's arcade entries in this genre and that I haven't really clicked with any arcade brawlers for several years.

I was genuinely surprised by CF2's quality, as well. The first game is wickedly rough-edged; I like it, but always have to attach a bunch of caveats. And Technos-style PKJ brawling, emphasising brutal staggers and the walloping punishment they enable, seemed to vanish post-Final Fight. Here is a categorically Technos-styled post-FF that's also uncommonly well-judged in the player's favour, without losing the wicked intensity essential to the genre.

It's really part of the same 1991 set as Sunset Riders and XEXEX: committedly hardcore yet generously smoothed-out AC staple genre highlights. Also something of a swan song for the Technos scrool, at least pending Violent Storm.

[Sumez]

Now, I was playing me some Ninja Gaiden, or Shadow Warrior to be exact (PAL version, bumped up to 60hz via my NT Mini).

Worth noting PAL Ninja Gaiden is probably better played in 50hz. The timings in the game are actually adjusted to account for the slower video refresh speed in PAL regions, which was honestly rare on the NES.
And from what I can tell it actually seems to be one of the better efforts at doing that, even though a perfect 1:1 is literally impossible. And I think only Ryu's movement is adjusted, while enemies remain the same (which is quite a common approach).

Here's a test I ran about a year ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1iEpl4Nn54

[Randorama]

It's really part of the same 1991 set as Sunset Riders and XEXEX: committedly hardcore yet generously smoothed-out AC staple genre highlights. Also something of a swan song for the Technos scrool, at least pending Violent Storm.

Sorry for cutting to the final line of the post and take it out for a walk of shiratori-like discussion...

Violent Storm represents a different style that partly anticipates Aliens vs. Predator. It gives tons of power to players (the move-set is impressive) and can give the feeling of being "high-speed synchronised chaos", when played at speed: players can literally pierce through stages (and the first part of stage 2-3 gives you 30 seconds to do this).

Actually, Metamorphic Force attempts to do this while also keeping some Technos-based ideas. You can slam enemies down and stomp them to death in 1-2 seconds, and the EU/US versions force you to approach the game in this way via the energy consumption mechanics (which sucks, in my opinion).

Konami tried this style mostly with the Turtles games, though the results were quite more mixed (game balance was a nightmare; we discussed this topic years ago, didn't we?). I remember that Cadillacs'n Dinosaurs anticipated some of these ideas via the charge attacks and the quick combos (in 1992, right?), but Captain Commando and Taito's Warrior Blade introduced these ideas in a more embryonal form, in 1991.

So, I'd claim that CF2 might be almost the final hurrah for the " slow pressure cooker" style of bmup, though I am wilfully ignoring other titles wedged between the release of this title and the "high-speed synchronised chaos" style advent (e.g., Arabian Magic from Taito, and a few other late 1991-1992 releases). I say "almost", because anyway Shadow Force by Technos themselves is 1993 or 1994, and is a quite good "slow pressure cooker" title

Btw, we may have an entire thread to discuss these topics *nudge nudge wink wink*.

[BEAMLORD]

Worth noting PAL Ninja Gaiden is probably better played in 50hz. The timings in the game are actually adjusted to account for the slower video refresh speed in PAL regions, which was honestly rare on the NES.
And from what I can tell it actually seems to be one of the better efforts at doing that, even though a perfect 1:1 is literally impossible. And I think only Ryu's movement is adjusted, while enemies remain the same (which is quite a common approach).

Here's a test I ran about a year ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1iEpl4Nn54

Thanks, I'll give it a go tonight. It certainly doesn't look way out, judging by your video.

[BareKnuckleRoo]

Actually, Metamorphic Force attempts to do this while also keeping some Technos-based ideas. You can slam enemies down and stomp them to death in 1-2 seconds, and the EU/US versions force you to approach the game in this way via the energy consumption mechanics (which sucks, in my opinion).

It's even more ridiculous when you discover Max's low air attack allows you to hit grounded enemies and standing enemies at the same time, making repeated hopping jump kicks super effective for crowd control. The energy drain mechanics in the US and EU versions are definitely awful.

[BIL]

ACA Rolling Thunder out today (in Japan). I see there's "Early," "Later" and "Final" revisions. This game always confused me a bit, on that count - IIRC, the conversion in Namco Museum Encore (PS1), while great fun on its own terms, was some kind of hybrid. Hopefully this is a definitive console preservation of the game in total.

[BloodHawk]

ACA Rolling Thunder out today (in Japan). I see there's "Early," "Later" and "Final" revisions. This game always confused me a bit, on that count - IIRC, the conversion in Namco Museum Encore (PS1), while great fun on its own terms, was some kind of hybrid. Hopefully this is a definitive console preservation of the game in total.

That's pretty cool that ACA has 3 versions. I bought the Namco Museum collection on Switch last weekend and it only has 1 version of Rolling Thunder. Does anyone know if it's the same Hybrid revision as the PS1 collection?

[Rastan78]

It could be that the version on Namco Museum Switch is that hybrid middle version. You see the title screen of the new version (notice there are animated henchmen at the controls of the computers), but the Stage 1 music is the track from the old rev.

Will be interesting to see how the ACA one compares. The NM one has some nice features like pixel perfect scaling, something Hamster stiiiiill cannot get right, and there are some well done bezel art options on a per game basis. Also scanlines look like the ones from M2 ports and don't induce a hazy scaling filter. And the presence of RT2 and Splatterhouse make the collection a slam dunk IMO. Hopefully we'll see those coming to ACA down the road.

For a while, between Shinobi, RT and RT2, Switch has been the place to be for DDSMFITN style run n guns. Duck Down Shoot MoFos In The Nuts

[BIL]

Duck Down Shoot MoFos In The Nuts

Super Secret Agent ALBATROSS can blast ten average-sized ballbags at fifty paces apiece, before the unfortunate targets have time to yell "Christ me fookin plums!"



Not even those headed to the floor are spared!

[Sima Tuna]

Is Rolling Thunder the first/original "Elevator Action Returns" -like? I'm struggling to figure out what to call this subgenre of run and gun. Because there's a clear division in gameplay between Elevator Action Returns, Huntdown, E-SWAT etc, and your Contras and Metal Slugs.

I guess I'd categorize their traits like this:

Elements of EAR-likes:

-slower character movement
-slower scrolling
-heavy use of cover/changing planes to avoid damage
-dense/clever enemy formations which require slow, careful play to pick apart (almost puzzle like)
-limited ammo/limited ability to output damage
-heavy movement inertia/moves can't be canceled or taken back
-stage design doesn't allow for mindless run2theright gameplay and is full of traps to slow casual R2Rers

I've been wanting to collect up all the EAR-like games into a big list and then gradually play them all. It's a pretty arbitrary little subgenre I've """discovered""" but I really do feel there's a big difference between the gameplay of these and standard run2therightkillmotherfuckers titles. Maybe we could call these Tactical Scroll Action, a la Kojima?

[Sir Ilpalazzo]

No-missed Crime Fighters 2 on stream earlier. Thanks for all of your primers BIL, that really helped carry me through!

Great game. Its violence is tremendously lovable; so well-rendered and, again, tactile. Grappling and landing stomps is endlessly satisfying, as is tearing through enemies with high-tier weapons like the brick and bottle. I'm impressed with how reasonable and readable the bosses generally are too - none of the sudden i-frame use or completely nonsensical combo escapes Konami bosses are wont to pull on you. Its difficulty balancing is interestingly uneven, though not unpleasant - the game gives you plenty of health and plenty of powerful weapons, but uncautious play can see even grunts kill you faster than Double Dragon's equivalents, so even during the easier parts of the game, you feel like you're walking a bit of a tightrope.

If I had any particular criticisms, I'd say that the elite enemies (football mask guys, trenchcoat bombers, fat wrestlers, and maybe also the martial artists) feel a little too overbearing. Their instant, decent-range grabs and especially high HP make fighting them directly feel unreasonable, with your only real recourse being either saving powerful weapons to get rid of them (satisfying, if not always the most tactically interesting) or just peppering them with off-axis knockdown blows, likely to push them offscreen. There's still fun to be had with having to land those precise strikes repeatedly, but I can't help but wish fighting them was more involved, and demanded a fuller use of your toolset.

[Volteccer_Jack]

Runner AD2025 intensifies
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkDhI7qStP4

[mycophobia]

Is Rolling Thunder the first/original "Elevator Action Returns" -like? I'm struggling to figure out what to call this subgenre of run and gun. Because there's a clear division in gameplay between Elevator Action Returns, Huntdown, E-SWAT etc, and your Contras and Metal Slugs.

I guess I'd categorize their traits like this:

Elements of EAR-likes:

-slower character movement
-slower scrolling
-heavy use of cover/changing planes to avoid damage
-dense/clever enemy formations which require slow, careful play to pick apart (almost puzzle like)
-limited ammo/limited ability to output damage
-heavy movement inertia/moves can't be canceled or taken back
-stage design doesn't allow for mindless run2theright gameplay and is full of traps to slow casual R2Rers

I've been wanting to collect up all the EAR-like games into a big list and then gradually play them all. It's a pretty arbitrary little subgenre I've """discovered""" but I really do feel there's a big difference between the gameplay of these and standard run2therightkillmotherfuckers titles. Maybe we could call these Tactical Scroll Action, a la Kojima?

rolling thunder is a "plane-swapping sidescrolling action" game. like shinobi, shadow dancer, sunset riders and mystic warriors (the pinnacle of the genre). im not sure i would even put EAR in that genre

[Sengoku Strider]

For a while, between Shinobi, RT and RT2, Switch has been the place to be for DDSMFITN style run n guns.

I play that M2 Shinobi port literally every night before bed. Only a credit or two, so it's slow-going to the 1CC, but I'm getting there. It just feels so freaking good. Playing it next to Rolling Thunder, you really see just how much Shinobi innovated. Like, it feels really weird to play Rolling Thunder and not have a melee attack when enemies get close. Using the plane-switching to surprise/stealth attack enemies from behind is also much more deliberate in Shinobi's level design, as only the ninjas can follow you between planes.

That being said, that Switch Namco Museum collection is kind of a must-own. It's on sale right now for 75% off, so like $6. For that price the lineup is just absolutely killer:

Rolling Thunder
Rolling Thunder 2
Splatterhouse
Galaga
Galaga '88
Pac-Man
Pac-Man VS
Dig Dug
Tower of Druaga
Sky Kid
Tank Force

I mean, I'd gladly pay that much for Splatterhouse alone. Having save states, challenge modes & (pretty active) online leaderboards for all these games is great, and they really suit the Switch well with their pick up & play nature. They're quick to get into and something like Galaga doesn't lose much on a smaller screen.

[trap15]

rolling thunder is a "plane-swapping sidescrolling action" game. like shinobi, shadow dancer, sunset riders and mystic warriors (the pinnacle of the genre). im not sure i would even put EAR in that genre

Agreed with this. I've called them Rolling Thunder clones, as I'm quite sure it was the first with such a play style. "Plane-swapping side scroller" is probably a reasonable name, though it's maybe not specific of a name as you could imply that it also means games like Guardian Heroes and SNES Power Rangers The Movie, which do not play at all like Rolling Thunder/Shinobi/etc

[BIL]

No-missed Crime Fighters 2 on stream earlier. Thanks for all of your primers BIL, that really helped carry me through!

Excellently done! Marked for the big index update, which I swear is still a thing.

[Sumez]

For Rolling Thunder style games I've always used the term "spy action". It seems fitting with every game in the genre, even when spies is not the theme.

Off the top of my head, here's some more or less notable games that I feel are fitting.

Rolling Thunder 1-3
Elevator Action Returns
Shinobi
Shadow Dancer
Code Name: Viper
Ninja Five-O/Ninja Cop
Sly Spy
ESWAT
City Hunter
ThunderJaws if you're open for some kusoge
Rough Ranger if you're really into kusoge

I'm sure I forgot a bunch, but overall it really is a genre I wish we'd seen more of. Huntdown definitely touches on a lot of the same core elements IMO but I can see why you wouldn't really want to throw it into quite the same box. On the other hand I wouldn't throw Mystic Warriors or Sunset Riders into this category either. They are similar, but much more frantic action games, veering closer on the Contra side of things.

Honestly, despite the more simplistic level design, the original Elevator Action fits well. With its slow and methodical action that still requires a constant overview of what is going on, and the occasional quick reaction and decision making. Bionic Commando has elements of it too.

[Ghegs]

I wouldn't throw Mystic Warriors or Sunset Riders into this category either. They are similar, but much more frantic action games, veering closer on the Contra side of things.

Seconded, they're definitely in the run 'n gun category (despite the lack of guns in Mystic Warriors).

"Tactical Scroll Action" does have a nice ring to it, though it'll forever require explaining just what type of games that means.

[Sengoku Strider]

For Rolling Thunder style games I've always used the term "spy action". It seems fitting with every game in the genre, even when spies is not the theme.

Off the top of my head, here's some more or less notable games that I feel are fitting.

Rolling Thunder 1-3
Elevator Action Returns
Shinobi
Shadow Dancer
Code Name: Viper
Ninja Five-O/Ninja Cop
Sly Spy
ESWAT
City Hunter
ThunderJaws if you're open for some kusoge
Rough Ranger if you're really into kusoge

I'm sure I forgot a bunch, but overall it really is a genre I wish we'd seen more of. Huntdown definitely touches on a lot of the same core elements IMO but I can see why you wouldn't really want to throw it into quite the same box. On the other hand I wouldn't throw Mystic Warriors or Sunset Riders into this category either. They are similar, but much more frantic action games, veering closer on the Contra side of things.

Honestly, despite the more simplistic level design, the original Elevator Action fits well. With its slow and methodical action that still requires a constant overview of what is going on, and the occasional quick reaction and decision making. Bionic Commando has elements of it too.

It's kind of a grey area, but then I remember the second level of ESWAT is kind of a remix take on the Elevator Action concept. I might argue that Bionic Commando feels like it belongs in a different category, because the vertical platform shifting is more of a ancillary property of a more broadly applicable mechanic. But I can also understand why you would mention it.

You could consider grouping in titles like Son Son & Psycho Soldier as well. Aside from the forced scrolling they're not fundamentally all that different.

[BIL]

I almost think of Son Son, Psycho Soldier and Mr. Goemon as their own weird little micro-genre. The last doesn't autoscroll, but if you've played the previous two, it'll be instantly familiar. I wonder if there are any more? They feel like a quaint little diversion between single-screen platformers and the more sophisticated sidescrollers that became de rigeur from the mid-80s onward.

[Bassa-Bassa]

For Rolling Thunder style games I've always used the term "spy action". It seems fitting with every game in the genre, even when spies is not the theme.

Off the top of my head, here's some more or less notable games that I feel are fitting.

Rolling Thunder 1-3
Elevator Action Returns
Shinobi
Shadow Dancer
Code Name: Viper
Ninja Five-O/Ninja Cop
Sly Spy
ESWAT
City Hunter
ThunderJaws if you're open for some kusoge
Rough Ranger if you're really into kusoge

I'm sure I forgot a bunch, but overall it really is a genre I wish we'd seen more of. Huntdown definitely touches on a lot of the same core elements IMO but I can see why you wouldn't really want to throw it into quite the same box. On the other hand I wouldn't throw Mystic Warriors or Sunset Riders into this category either. They are similar, but much more frantic action games, veering closer on the Contra side of things.

Honestly, despite the more simplistic level design, the original Elevator Action fits well. With its slow and methodical action that still requires a constant overview of what is going on, and the occasional quick reaction and decision making. Bionic Commando has elements of it too.

They're at the very least predecessors to this subgenre, aren't they? Nichibutsu's Cop 01 and Green Beret had to played by Rolling Thunder's authors as well.

Add to your list Taito's Crime City, which always gets forgotten despite being one of the best. Konami's Surprise Attack too. If you're into Famicom, Mottomo Abunai Geka and Dead Fox are likely only two more of them.

Which brings the question - why not including the whole 2D Shinobi series? Megadrive ESWAT? And Sunsoft's City Hunter?

I almost think of Son Son, Psycho Soldier and Mr. Goemon as their own weird little micro-genre. The last doesn't autoscroll, but if you've played the previous two, it'll be instantly familiar. I wonder if there are any more? They feel like a quaint little diversion between single-screen platformers and the more sophisticated sidescrollers that became de rigeur from the mid-80s onward.

Check Face's Hany on the Road. A guy I follow mentioned it together with yours the other day when pointing out that this was just released:

https://www.weatheredsweater.com/skator-gator