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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:02 pm 



Joined: 12 Jun 2017
Posts: 187
Some ESPs will accept up to 10v on their Vin if the have a regulator, the LoLin does for exemple
.


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:17 pm 


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Location: UK
shift838 wrote:
I can at least answer one of your questions. the power that you reference puts out 5v, which is too much for the ESP8266.

You need to use the 3.3v by the SDA/SDL connections. This is how I tapped mine and powers it good.


Hmm wiki isn't recommending the use of 3.3v from the GBS, I'm a little confused about that, not sure what the issue it causes might be.

Ryoandr wrote:
Some ESPs will accept up to 10v on their Vin if the have a regulator, the LoLin does for exemple
.


I have a LoLin v3. I came across this thread which had a bunch of people experiencing the decoupling caps exploding at various voltages (as low as 7.2v).

I'll probably stick to 3.3v then. Thanks for the help on that question, guys.


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:39 pm 



Joined: 08 Mar 2017
Posts: 1324
Gunstar:
Don't replace R34. Instead, use a 100 Ohm resistor and wire wrap it around the S and G pins.
This is so you can easily remove it, should you ever want to connect a VGA source.
Instead of more explanation, here's a pic :)
Image

Regarding power, I recommend the following:
- If your power supply for the GBS is > 7.5V, then use the 3.3V pin header to power your ESP8266.
- Otherwise (main PSU is 5V ... 7.5V), it's best to use split it at the 2 pin header you marked in your picture,
then power the ESP8266 from that (into the Vin pin, so the ESP board regulates down to 3.3V).

shift838:
Not sure what issues your Geneve shows. A picture will help :)
A sync stripper is probably not required.

Ryoandr:
Please google this. You'll find a few guides and need to decide which is best for your spare parts etc.
But basically, you want to combine H+V and do it in a way that protects your source (GBS) and the sink (TV).


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:48 pm 



Joined: 28 Nov 2018
Posts: 23
rama wrote:
Gunstar:
Don't replace R34. Instead, use a 100 Ohm resistor and wire wrap it around the S and G pins.
This is so you can easily remove it, should you ever want to connect a VGA source.
Instead of more explanation, here's a pic :)
Image

Regarding power, I recommend the following:
- If your power supply for the GBS is > 7.5V, then use the 3.3V pin header to power your ESP8266.
- Otherwise (main PSU is 5V ... 7.5V), it's best to use split it at the 2 pin header you marked in your picture,
then power the ESP8266 from that (into the Vin pin, so the ESP board regulates down to 3.3V).

shift838:
Not sure what issues your Geneve shows. A picture will help :)
A sync stripper is probably not required.

Ryoandr:
Please google this. You'll find a few guides and need to decide which is best for your spare parts etc.
But basically, you want to combine H+V and do it in a way that protects your source (GBS) and the sink (TV).



Hi.

Please any form to connect Svideo to the GBS8200 ?


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:50 pm 


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@Rama - Appreciate the pic and the info on powering the EPS8266. I'll be using a 5v 2a PSU so should be okay to tap there. Are the SMD sizes/ratings okay? Also, I take it that I don't need to do the mod (SMD caps) on the underside of the PCB?

Thanks!!


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:57 pm 



Joined: 08 Mar 2017
Posts: 1324
Shiver_169:
No. Composite / S-Video require special decoders that aren't present on the GBS.

Gunstar:
Yeah, you can ignore the underside components.
All the rest is fine.


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2020 8:23 pm 


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Awesome, thanks, Rama!

Updated the image for other beginners who have a v4

Image

There was some discussion a while back about changing the heatsink to another material to attract less noise, has anybody done that?


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 3:36 am 



Joined: 28 Nov 2018
Posts: 23
rama wrote:
Shiver_169:
No. Composite / S-Video require special decoders that aren't present on the GBS.


Ok I understand, but what if I used the GBS 8200 in series with this equipment https://www.ebay.com/itm/333472448866 is a Svideo to VGA transcoder but the problem is that it seems to make Upscale of the image Do you think work? Now it will not be that this device uses something similar to the GBS 8200 that can be modified in the same way.


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 5:28 am 



Joined: 04 Sep 2019
Posts: 15
@Rama

if using the 'gbscontrol' firmware is any of these hardware modifications that Gunstar referenced even needed? I know I saw on the wiki page that gbscontrol should cover most of these already without doing hardware mods, but does not state which ones are not covered.

If not, which ones should a GBS8200 v4.0 really be done with the 'gbscontrol' firmware?


i'll get a photo tomorrow of my unit. The image is fairly clear, much better than i thought it would be and definitely usable. Sharp and bright.

The only issue I really see is on lighter colors like blue i can see faint vertical lines in the bottom of the 1/4 of the screen. not even sure they will show up in a photo. maybe there is an adjustment that I'm not aware of on the 'gbscontrol' webgui i can do or if it is a hardware mod that needs to happen. like sram signal interference. some copper tape perhaps.


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 11:53 am 



Joined: 08 Mar 2017
Posts: 1324
Shiver_169:
Of course this will work, but the quality will be entirely dependent on the first device.
Also, there is little point of chaining the GBS after it, as the first device already upscales.

There aren't any really cheap devices to process S-Video / Composite, if you want some quality.
Mike Chi's Retrotink devices are the most affordable quality solution, so I definitely recommend those.
Example: https://twitter.com/Raycommend/status/1 ... 3705644032

shift838:
The mods *may* help, as they improve electrical performance of the device.
I can't tell whether they'll fix *your* particular issue though.
To say anything about that, I need to see what the issue is (not your device, but the problem).


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 4:19 pm 



Joined: 04 Sep 2019
Posts: 15
rama wrote:
shift838:
The mods *may* help, as they improve electrical performance of the device.
I can't tell whether they'll fix *your* particular issue though.
To say anything about that, I need to see what the issue is (not your device, but the problem).


i took a photo and hopefully you can see what i'm talking about. I boxed in the red areas that really show.

Image


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 5:59 pm 


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Gunstar wrote:
There was some discussion a while back about changing the heatsink to another material to attract less noise, has anybody done that?

Yes, I have a ceramic heatsink on mine, and I have no problems with wifi signal


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:15 pm 


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Joined: 09 Apr 2014
Posts: 299
Location: UK
AndehX wrote:
Gunstar wrote:
There was some discussion a while back about changing the heatsink to another material to attract less noise, has anybody done that?

Yes, I have a ceramic heatsink on mine, and I have no problems with wifi signal


Which one did you get? I'm having trouble finding one that matches the 28*28 size of the original

EDIT: Thanks Rama and AndehX


Last edited by Gunstar on Sat Feb 15, 2020 8:15 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:44 pm 



Joined: 08 Mar 2017
Posts: 1324
Heatsinking:
I have one test GBS where I simply removed the heatsink and let it run like that.
The heat transfers well into the PCB, and the chip doesn't get too hot to touch.
I won't go so far as to recommend it, but surely cooling isn't a big issue.
Use any ceramic of somewhat fitting size. You'll be fine.

Just as a back of the envelope calculation, that entire GBS board uses 5V / 0.8A.
That's 4W of power, distributed across the board.
I'd say the main chip dissipates maybe 2W or so.
That's right at the border of free air cooling vs requiring some kind of heatsink.

shift838:
I can't see the discoloration, but I can spot the jailbars.
You can try different output presets, try auto adjust on your display, try using a VGA to HDMI dongle, or try a different VGA cable.
The effect will go away from one of these tweaks.


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 8:12 pm 


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Gunstar wrote:
AndehX wrote:
Gunstar wrote:
There was some discussion a while back about changing the heatsink to another material to attract less noise, has anybody done that?

Yes, I have a ceramic heatsink on mine, and I have no problems with wifi signal


Which one did you get? I'm having trouble finding one that matches the 28*28 size of the original

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/171948256827


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:59 pm 



Joined: 04 Sep 2019
Posts: 15
rama wrote:
shift838:
I can't see the discoloration, but I can spot the jailbars.
You can try different output presets, try auto adjust on your display, try using a VGA to HDMI dongle, or try a different VGA cable.
The effect will go away from one of these tweaks.


I have tried a couple of different VGA cables and VGA to HDMI dongle.

One VGA cable seemed to be a little better but not much. As far as the VGA to HDMI dongles, neither of them worked at all. I received no signal on my HDMI input of my monitor.

The photos that I showed previous were with changing the different output presets to the best one that worked with my monitor and Auto Adjust already selected.

Since my color seems to be off on the bottom of the screen, not sure why, it appears lighter than the top. would removing the pots and jumpering a wire have any effect at all?


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 12:29 am 



Joined: 08 Mar 2017
Posts: 1324
Well, all I can say is that I can always make even my bad GBS look okay *somehow*.

The HDMI dongle is a good first attempt.
I haven't had a VGA to HDMI solution be not accepted at all.
Some TVs don't take the VESA resolutions, but they all work with 720p/1080p from a dongle.

Next, make sure to have at least 2 or 3 SMD caps installed.
They help smooth out the important 3.3V line that the DAC uses for reference.
It'd be great if the GBS board design allowed for separate feeds to the analog and digital domains, but alas, they're $15 products.

So one more thing you can try is different memory clocks (web ui Development tab).
This changes the beat pattern from SDRAM accesses, that tend to be visible in some situations.
Some patterns simply disappear into noise, which is what you want.

For the color issue, that could be caused by cable problems from your retro machine, potentially the AC coupling capacitors.
The pots shouldn't affect this, but you never know. Try the mod, as it's an improvement in any case.


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 6:09 am 



Joined: 04 Sep 2019
Posts: 15
rama wrote:
Well, all I can say is that I can always make even my bad GBS look okay *somehow*.

Next, make sure to have at least 2 or 3 SMD caps installed.
They help smooth out the important 3.3V line that the DAC uses for reference.
It'd be great if the GBS board design allowed for separate feeds to the analog and digital domains, but alas, they're $15 products.



Is this the mod you are talking about using the 0805 10uf capacitors? https://github.com/ramapcsx2/gbs-control/wiki/Power-supply-bypass-capacitors

I did remove the pots from the unit the colors are still the same. it could be my LED monitor too i guess. i'll try a different one.


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 2:07 pm 



Joined: 08 Mar 2017
Posts: 1324
Yes, and good idea :)


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 10:57 pm 



Joined: 04 Sep 2019
Posts: 15
rama wrote:
Yes, and good idea :)


I’ll be doing the capacitor mod later tonight. I was able to find a vga to hdmi converter that worked and the picture is better.

I remembered I had one that you need to supply power to and that did the trick.

https://www.amazon.com/VicTsing-Converter-Adapter-Output-Female/dp/B00K4W62R4


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 4:50 am 


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Joined: 07 May 2018
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Location: Escondido, CA, USA
Testing the 15khz downscaling. The title is PS2 Street Fighter Alpha Anthology, which imho looks pretty terrible in both 480i and the optional 480p, compared to what we all know and love from the games' original arcade iterations.

I’m no whiz with the camera, in terms of capturing displays. And it’s a Samsung S8 to boot, which is probably lacking something in this department as well. But, I will say that clean scanlines are there and no shimmer. It looks really good on my 27” Trinitron!
Spoiler: show
Image

Image

Image


For shirts and goggles, I thought I’d take the 15khz output from one GBS-8200 and upscale it with a second GBS-8200. At that point, it still looks like a deinterlaced signal and I’m guessing that bypassing a second GBS and sticking with a single unit to deinterlace 480i will give a better result.



The 15khz downscaling feature is nonetheless quite a treat for native 15khz displays and higher res outputs.


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 9:52 am 



Joined: 08 Mar 2017
Posts: 1324
Hm, it's okay on the CRT but the capture looks like the source was 480i.
If you have a choice with these originally 240p games, use 480p and downscale that.
With 480p, there is no need to decide on a field priority and also no need to deinterlace anything.
The 15kHz option will look much better with that.
I only have 480i support here so it's less of a hassle to switch resolutions :p


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 11:34 am 


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@NoAffinity - I wanted to test Alpha Anthology and the PS2/Xbox versions of 3rd Strike with this new feature (still waiting for parts to be fully setup) good to see Alpha Anthology looking great on your CRT. I wonder how it would look piped into an OSSC. Great vids on your channel btw.


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 12:40 pm 


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@Gunstar - Thank you sir. I will give the ossc a test as well as gbs deinterlacing compared to downscale/re-uspcale of the same source, and post those results. Will get some 480p downscale as well, just to cover all the new bases. :)

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 1:11 pm 



Joined: 08 Mar 2017
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Oh gee, I always shudder when thinking of the deinterlacer.
It's a barely okay solution to a terrible problem. I mean, at least still images don't bob.
But as soon as anything moves, the large juddering blobs around it.. they just look terrible.

Edit:
I'm thinking of maybe offering a different deinterlacer mode.
It would lean towards pure weave, but with minimal motion detection still in there.
The judder blobs would be much smaller, possibly undetectable, but large motion would tear up into purely weave artefacts.
The recent video of the PS1HDMI captures makes pure weave seem almost good!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4rlQIp ... u.be&t=623


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 2:10 pm 



Joined: 19 Mar 2017
Posts: 242
rama wrote:
Edit:
I'm thinking of maybe offering a different deinterlacer mode.
It would lean towards pure weave, but with minimal motion detection still in there.
The judder blobs would be much smaller, possibly undetectable, but large motion would tear up into purely weave artefacts.
The recent video of the PS1HDMI captures makes pure weave seem almost good!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4rlQIp ... u.be&t=623


Weave is actually very good. People complain about the UltraHDMI combing artefacts but you can pretty much eliminate them with a small vertical filter which ads a touch of softness to the image.

Death to bob (not RetroRGB Bob).


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 2:37 pm 


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@rama - can you offer some suggestions for getting 2 gbs/esp's on wifi at the same time? When i was doing that testing of downscaling/re-upscaling, the devices kept kicking each other off the network. Im guessing i need to give each device a unique name in the arduino code? But how would i access via the web ui - can i change the web page name in the code also...something like adding a '2' to http://gbscontrol.local?

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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 4:25 pm 



Joined: 08 Mar 2017
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Rename the 2nd device here:
https://github.com/ramapcsx2/gbs-contro ... ol.ino#L79


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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 4:36 pm 


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rama wrote:
Cool, thanks! And in order to access both via web ui, should i change the port on one of them, say to port 81? And then use http://gbscontrol:81 to access that one?

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 Post subject: Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project
PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 10:17 pm 



Joined: 08 Mar 2017
Posts: 1324
Port can stay the same.


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