Of shmups, sims, and everything in between.

Iori Branford · Post by **Iori Branford** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 10:13 pm

A thought just came to me. Notwithstanding any anti-3D bias, what would be (or is) your kind of flight sim? Given that first-person shooting evolved from top-down maze shooting, does it not seem like flight sims are kind of a next step up from shmups?

(Nowhere am I suggesting that we all junk our 19XX's for Red Barons or whatever. Hell, you couldn't pay me to end my shmup career, or my retro gaming career at that. Nor do I claim that flight sims were necessarily intended as first-person shmups.)

I am actually a pretty newby flight simmer. Before, I was always turned off by the seemingly infinite complexity and difficulty of such as TIE Fighter, Falcon, and Wing Commander. But Freespace 2 won me over with a learning curve that isn't a cliff and combat that isn't a chore.

Oftentimes, though, I want to ditch realism altogether and let fun be fun, and this is where Descent and Terminal Velocity come in. Their extremely simplified flight controls and flight models, as well as a strong emphasis on shooting over exploration or vehicle micromanagement, have put these games squarely into the first-person shmup category, and quite high on the fun scale too.

Eps · Post by **Eps** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 11:14 pm

I absolutely adore first-person space combat games ever since my first exposure to Elite back in the day. Obviously that was slower-paced and less combat-oriented, but when I first got to play Starglider 2 for the Amiga, I really did think I'd been placed in the cockpit of a ship from a shoot-'em-up

And as for X-Wing on the PC... well, that just sealed the deal for life!

Ganelon · Post by **Ganelon** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 11:58 pm

Descent makes me want to throw up, both physically and figuratively...

Post by **Shatterhand** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 2:03 am

I am sorry, but this is no shmups talk

Moved to off-topic

benj · Post by **benj** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 2:26 am

None of the games you mentioned are flight sims. They are all 3D action games. An actual flight sim would be something like Airbus for the Amiga or Microsoft's Flight Simulator series for the PC.

raiden · Post by **raiden** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 3:03 am

I prefer flight games without a simulation aspect: Ace Combat series, Airforce Delta, Crimson Skies, Heroes of the Pacific, Blazing Angels. It´s not the simulation of physics that´s putting me off - I like Pilotwings - it´s rather the overcomplicated interface. As a formula: When I have to press more than one button to take off, I don´t like the game.

whoisKeel · Post by **whoisKeel** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 3:52 am

A great game is Star Wars Rogue Squadron II: Rogue Leader for Gamecube. Very action oriented and not at all a sim, but worth mentioning as it fits the 3D flight genre. It's the Starfox of this gen. The 3rd one in the series is not nearly as good so try the 2nd one first.

Post by **Shatterhand** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 4:23 am

If you're talking about 3D spaceflight games...

Freespace 2 it's the best one I ever played. Nothing has come close to it.

I love this kind of game. Even Epic on Amiga, which was bashed by the criticis. I loved every bit of Epic ...

SAM · Post by **SAM** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 5:52 am

Iori Branford wrote:I am actually a pretty newby flight simmer. Before, I was always turned off by the seemingly infinite complexity and difficulty of such as TIE Fighter, Falcon, and Wing Commander. But Freespace 2 won me over with a learning curve that isn't a cliff and combat that isn't a chore.

I cann't handle flight sim, I cann't keep the enemy on the screen for more than 2 sec.

And I keep being shoot at during the game.

You cann't Jump-Cancel to make the enemy centre in front of you in flight sim.

Eps · Post by **Eps** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 3:42 pm

I used to love Aces Over Europe and Aces Over the Pacific, if we're talking flight sims. Not as realistic as combat sims get now, but realistic for the time and damn good fun.

Andi · Post by **Andi** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 8:17 pm

Shatterhand wrote:If you're talking about 3D spaceflight games...

Freespace 2 it's the best one I ever played. Nothing has come close to it.

Uh-huh. That's why every game in the genre since has been described as "kinda like Freespace."

X: Beyond the Frontier was pretty fun. It came out about 6 years ago for PC and has the voice of Bruce Campbell as the main character. The game is pretty fun actually, there's lots to do.

5parrowhawk · Post by **5parrowhawk** » Wed Apr 26, 2006 1:57 am

To wrestle this back to some semblance of on-topicness, has anyone tried Raiders' Sphere? Impressions?

it290 · Post by **it290** » Wed Apr 26, 2006 2:33 pm

I like Cinemaware's Wings. I dunno why, I just have a soft spot for it (actually, I like most of Cinemaware's games, but that's another story). The dogfighting is fun, as are the strafing and bombing missions, and I like how the game has a well-written storyline. It actually got remade for the GBA a few years back, and that version is fun as well, although it changes the gameplay somewhat.

Post by **Shatterhand** » Wed Apr 26, 2006 2:41 pm

Wings was real fun. It's my fav Cinemaware game with TV Sports Boxing.

And it's not just a flight game, it also has some "nearly" shmup levels and stuff.

shmups.system11.org

Of shmups, sims, and everything in between.

Of shmups, sims, and everything in between.

Re: Of shmups, sims, and everything in between.