Questions that do not deserve a thread

[dunpeal2064]

I'm looking for some help in getting 240p out of the 360. Spent the last few days on Fudoh's Scanlines Demystified page and googling around, but I thought I'd check in here to get some advice on my specific setup goal.

I specifically want to hook my 360 up to my PVM 20M2U to play the Cave ports and Raiden Fighters Aces. I don't need any other functionality out of the device, but if it can do more for a similar cost thats great too. I think (hope) an Extron RGB would suffice here, since that seems like it would save me a bunch of money. Is there a list of Extron RGB units that would work for this? I searched around on ebay and there are a ton of devices under this name.

I'm also not positive what else I'd need other than that unit and VGA out of the 360. I've read that I might need a sync stripper and/or sync combiner? Not sure how/where to buy these either, if I do end up needing them. Was also curious if there was a way to just use Component out of the 360 for this to avoid the sync problems altogether, since the quality difference between the two isn't that bad to me, but I assume the RGB units only output RGB and thus I may as well just use VGA.

Hopefully this makes sense, I'm fairly new to the world of RGB and sync and all that, just got the PVM and have just been using Component so far, so this is my first venture into these waters, and its a bit overwhelming

[Fudoh]

The RGB interface "tricks" only works well on games that offer proper unfiltered linedoubling (Raiden Fighters, Death Smiles, Futari, ESPGaludaII, MMP, Delta Zeal). The high-res only Cave titles don't look so good this way. And yes, you can input and output component into these interfaces. No problem - and it's even way easier to connect them this way compared to RGB, since your 360 won't output 15khz through the VGA cable, so you'd indeed need a Scart cable with sync cleaner....

For better 240p conversion, look here:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=63226&hilit=corio

[dunpeal2064]

The RGB interface "tricks" only works well on games that offer proper unfiltered linedoubling (Raiden Fighters, Death Smiles, Futari, ESPGaludaII, MMP, Delta Zeal). The high-res only Cave titles don't look so good this way. And yes, you can input and output component into these interfaces. No problem - and it's even way easier to connect them this way compared to RGB, since your 360 won't output 15khz through the VGA cable, so you'd indeed need a Scart cable with sync cleaner....

For better 240p conversion, look here:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=63226&hilit=corio

Thats a shame that the RGB units don't work well with the high-res games. The C2 units do look promising, but the prices on confirmed-working units on ebay is pretty high, I think maybe higher than a Genius II would cost? I do see an Emotia on ebay for around $300 as well, so I'm guessing thats the price ballpark I'd be in to get 240p looking good with the high-res games.

For how cheap the RGB units seem to be, I'm tempted to just start with that. Most of my favorites would still work well with it, and since I could just run Component, it'd let me play those while learning a bit more about all these devices and such. I think if I then upgrade to an Emotia later I could still use the RGB unit to fix the line combining the Emotia does, if I understood your write-up correctly.

Any advice on what to look for in the Extron RGB units? Either model numbers or certain specs would help, there seem to be a ton and I imagine they don't all work.

Appreciate the help as always Fudoh

[Fudoh]

The C2 units do look promising, but the prices on confirmed-working units on ebay is pretty high

yeah, it's easy to overpay for these. Only a few months back it wasn't too hard to find something under $100.

Any advice on what to look for in the Extron RGB units?

most will work fine. Honestly I have never figured out why some models won't work - I would imagine that in the end it depends on the monitor. You could go for something confirmed working like a 580.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/143272213027

To input component into the HD15 connector, you need a HD15 to RCA breakout cable or adapter.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/310799037608

[dunpeal2064]

You could go for something confirmed working like a 580.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/143272213027

To input component into the HD15 connector, you need a HD15 to RCA breakout cable or adapter.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/310799037608

Perfect! I see the 190 on ebay for quite cheap too, and I think those are supposed to work just as well? If so, I might shoot for one of those, it looks a little less bulky and costs about half as much. If those aren't confirmed I'll just go with the 580.

So the setup would just be 360 Component > HD15 to RCA > Extron RGB with DDSP dip set on > 3 Male-to-Male BNCs > PVM?

I imagine this will still be an improvement for the high-res games over pure 480i too, even if they don't look perfect. I wonder if this could also work on a PS2 via Component for some of the 480i titles that don't work well with patching for 240p (Thinking stuff like Dragon Blaze, Third Strike, etc).

Thanks again Fudoh, you're a lifesaver.

[Fudoh]

So the setup would just be 360 Component > HD15 to RCA > Extron RGB with DDSP dip set on > 3 Male-to-Male BNCs > PVM

yes. Whether the DDSP switch has to en- or disabled for 240p depends on the internal settings of the sync polarity dip switches.

I imagine this will still be an improvement for the high-res games over pure 480i too

you have to check it out for yourself. On true high-res titles the two adjacent lines, which the RGB interface will put on top of each other, simply aren't supposed to be stacked on top of each other. This way you're getting rid of "one kind" of flicker, but you're introducing "another kind" of flicker instead.

I wonder if this could also work on a PS2 via Component for some of the 480i titles that don't work well with patching for 240p (Thinking stuff like Dragon Blaze, Third Strike, etc).

never played 3rd Strike on PS2, but Dragon Blaze and Sengoku Blade look amazing this way. The Taito Memories collection on the other hand are heavily filtered, so they don't look as "pure" as they should running in 240p.

[nmalinoski]

I can't vouch for how safe it is in terms of thermal performance, but the Noctua NF-A6x25 can be installed in an OG Xbox without having to cut anything.

That Noctua probably fits without cutting anything because it's the wrong size; the Xbox was designed to accommodate a 70mm fan; installing a 60mm fan is going to mean gaps on the sides that might interfere with or defeat the desired/expected airflow, plus you'll have to figure out some other way to keep it secured in the case.

If one were to get crafty about it, I could see a making a shroud to ensure proper suction and include some way to secure it. With a dismantled Xbox, a micrometer, Autodesk and a 3d printer. Something like that would run ehhhh, $20 printed in Hp multijet fusion and shipped from sculpteo. Just make sure the walls are 2mm thick at least.
Of course, this is all "the extra mile."

Greg Collins might be up for building a 3D-printable shroud for a 60mm fan; not sure when he'd be able to get to it, though.

[Einzelherz]

I just play 360 cave games on an old pc crt.

[Axelay]

Anyone know if the messenge on ps4 plays or runs better then the switch version?

Any subtle differences?

Kind regards.

Katana zero has got me in a 2d side scrolling fever i need moar

[vol.2]

There's some weird (visual) noise present in my PSone playing through an RGB cable. The cable is the same one I use with my PS2, but its actually supposed to be a PlayStation cable. (sony to scart).
Is this a known issue with the little PSone systems? If not, and bright ideas as to what's causing it?

[seacow]

Where does someone look to learn all about scoring?

[Einzelherz]

There's some weird (visual) noise present in my PSone playing through an RGB cable. The cable is the same one I use with my PS2, but its actually supposed to be a PlayStation cable. (sony to scart).
Is this a known issue with the little PSone systems? If not, and bright ideas as to what's causing it?

Composite video as sync, I'd wager.

[Namingway_PL]

Hello everyone!

Quick question:

Will the power supply from a BVM-20F1 work with a BVM-D20F1/ D24?

[Listai]

Is their a known issue with Jurassic Park on a 1chip SNES?, I can't get the hud and map to display properly. I have replaced C11 to fix the ghosting issue and I'm wondering if this is a side effect?

[vol.2]

There's some weird (visual) noise present in my PSone playing through an RGB cable. The cable is the same one I use with my PS2, but its actually supposed to be a PlayStation cable. (sony to scart).
Is this a known issue with the little PSone systems? If not, and bright ideas as to what's causing it?

Composite video as sync, I'd wager.

Thanks. I asked around on the PsX reddit, and those folks say the slim PSoneis plagued with leaky caps on the sync lines, so I just have to replace those, and probably the audio caps.
I believe they have clean sync otherwise though. The video output chip has a separate pin for c sync from its own composite video. Although, I actually don't know if that means it's clean to be honest.

[SavagePencil]

Where does someone look to learn all about scoring?

This is a good place for understanding game systems & mechanics. And strategies for scoring!

viewforum.php?f=5

[dunpeal2064]

So, I got the Extron RGB 190f in the mail, as well as the adapter and BNC cables. Got everything hooked up and am getting an image, but it appears to still just be 480i.

yes. Whether the DDSP switch has to en- or disabled for 240p depends on the internal settings of the sync polarity dip switches.

I've tried with this switch in both positions (All other switches off), and I've tried moving the image a bit both in-game and in the service menu in the pvm, in case things weren't lined up, but it doesn't seem to make a difference. I'm testing this with Futari 1.5 in Arcade mode, and smoothing and the various filters are all off. I'm using the "Computer" VGA port on the 190f, as the monitor input doesn't show a display at all. The 360 itself is just set to "TV", so 480i. The Horizontal Shift knob doesn't have any effect on the image whether the DDDSP is set to on or off, but this might also be because I am using Component and not RGB.

Setup is 360 Component > D-Sub Converter > RGB 190f > PVM 20M2U

Hoping there is just some small thing I am missing, and not that the 190f either doesn't work for 240p (I saw another user confirm it does so I doubt its that), or that my particular unit isn't working properly. I'm not sure what exact settings are needed, if any, to get the games to be perfectly linedoubled (I notice Zoom having a DbD at exact 2x and 3x ratios, not sure if the game needs to be zoomed to those specific ratios), or if any of the other dips switches (Level, Sog, Serr, No mon, spare) need to be on.

Anyone have any ideas for things I could try to fix this?

[vol.2]

So, I got the Extron RGB 190f in the mail, as well as the adapter and BNC cables. Got everything hooked up and am getting an image, but it appears to still just be 480i.

yes. Whether the DDSP switch has to en- or disabled for 240p depends on the internal settings of the sync polarity dip switches.

I've tried with this switch in both positions (All other switches off), and I've tried moving the image a bit both in-game and in the service menu in the pvm, in case things weren't lined up, but it doesn't seem to make a difference. I'm testing this with Futari 1.5 in Arcade mode, and smoothing and the various filters are all off. I'm using the "Computer" VGA port on the 190f, as the monitor input doesn't show a display at all. The 360 itself is just set to "TV", so 480i. The Horizontal Shift knob doesn't have any effect on the image whether the DDDSP is set to on or off, but this might also be because I am using Component and not RGB.

Setup is 360 Component > D-Sub Converter > RGB 190f > PVM 20M2U

Hoping there is just some small thing I am missing, and not that the 190f either doesn't work for 240p (I saw another user confirm it does so I doubt its that), or that my particular unit isn't working properly. I'm not sure what exact settings are needed, if any, to get the games to be perfectly linedoubled (I notice Zoom having a DbD at exact 2x and 3x ratios, not sure if the game needs to be zoomed to those specific ratios), or if any of the other dips switches (Level, Sog, Serr, No mon, spare) need to be on.

Anyone have any ideas for things I could try to fix this?

this thread might help you... viewtopic.php?f=6&t=36914&start=150

[strayan]

Does anyone have any knowledge re: recording 480p content to optical media using a DVD recorder via SCART? Any good devices to look out for?

A cursory search seems to indicate that most of the DVD recorders won't record RGB on the SCART input (just composite). Is this true?

I just want to be able to click record when I boot up my gamecube and capture the whole session then have the option of rewriting the disk the next time I play.

[Fudoh]

Does anyone have any knowledge re: recording 480p content to optical media using a DVD recorder via SCART?

DVD is 480i per definition. When authoring you can set flags to accomodate 480p24 and 480p30 material, but that's not what you have in mind.

A cursory search seems to indicate that most of the DVD recorders won't record RGB on the SCART input (just composite).
Is this true?

no, most did actually record RGB.

I just want to be able to click record when I boot up my gamecube and capture the whole session then have the option of rewriting the disk the next time I play.

don't you think something more modern, like a portable h264 encoder that records to SD card might make more sense?

[Timrod]

Hi! I have a question regarding capturing off a CMVS Neo Geo. I bought one off a guy in Italy (it's supposedly custom-made, but I don't know what the supergun in it is) that outputs RGBS via a VGA -> SCART cable, with the VGA connector on the console and the SCART going into the TV. Unfortunately, I don't have a SCART CRT so I'm forced to use an OSSC, as that's the only thing I have that can take SCART input. I do have a SCART to Component transcoder that I was using with a Retrotink 2x, but that was such a pain to set up compared to the OSSC that I don't bother.

I want to try to record video off it. I have a Startech USB3HDCAP (the re-branded Micomsoft card) but the problem is that it won't read the video output no matter what I do. I've tried connecting it directly via the component transcoder, as well as through HDMI from the Retrotink and through HDMI from the OSSC.

Is there something I can do to make this work, or do I need a new capture card? If so, which one?

[strayan]

I just want to be able to click record when I boot up my gamecube and capture the whole session then have the option of rewriting the disk the next time I play.

don't you think something more modern, like a portable h264 encoder that records to SD card might make more sense?

There's a bloke up the road selling his DVD recorder for $3.50. Should be able run the HDMI cable from the cube to my display and the component/rgb to the recorder and press record button.

[Fudoh]

There's a bloke up the road selling his DVD recorder for $3.50

certainly worth a try

[RIP-Felix]

I'm sure this has been asked a million times, which is why I'm posting here.

There is a LOT of confusion surrounding the Voltage regulator on the Dreamcast's 12v rail, and how to resolve the heat issue after removing the GDROM load. I've seen Bob's "Ultimate Sega Dreamcast Hacks and Mods for 2019!!!" video showing us that the Regulator can simply be removed, but he didn't remove the SMD resistor.

Spoiler

I've read guides that recommend removing it too. It looks to me that it just bridges the Input and Ground, but I can't tell if it's electrically isolated otherwise. If so, it's should be fine to leave it in, right? It would certainly be easier to just solder the Regulator back in, if you ever needed to reverse the mod. That's something a novice could do pretty easily. The SMD resistor is much harder to solder back in if you remove it, relatively speaking. If it needed to be removed too, then the easier mod would be to just ram a 1watt 300Ohm resistor in there. Performing/Reversing that mod is way easier, even if it's isn't as efficient (electrically speaking).

So is that SMD isolated and fine to leave in place if you de-solder the regulator?

[vol.2]

Retail DVDS are 480i and not 480p, correct?

(and therefore, my progressive scan dvd player is de-interlacing when I turn on progressive mode)

[nmalinoski]

Retail DVDS are 480i and not 480p, correct?

(and therefore, my progressive scan dvd player is de-interlacing when I turn on progressive mode)

My limited understanding is that the format supports both, and which you get likely depends on the content. If the source material is a TV show, for example, it's likely on the DVD as 480i60/576i50; however, if the source material is film, it may be stored on the disc as 480p24, 480p30, or 576p25.

If your player doesn't tell you what the video is encoded at, I'm not sure there's a good way of telling without popping the disc into your PC and using something like Handbrake to analyze it.

Now, whether or not you enable progressive mode on your DVD player will depend on whether you want your player to perform deinterlacing (or your TV doesn't do 480i for some reason) or you want your TV to do deinterlacing (Or if you're watching on an SD-only CRT, or your TV doesn't do 480p for some reason).

[Fudoh]

Official DVD specs force the MPEG2 decoder on any DVD player to output 480i.

Progressive scan players will therefore have to apply deinterlacing to gain a 480p or upscaled output.

MPEG2 compression though supports p24, p25, p30, i50 and i60. Progressively encoded DVDs were introduced in late 2001/early 2002. The DVD really contains the 24 progressive frames, but the MPEG2 decoder in the player will still only output i60 from these.
DVDs prior to 2002 used a hard telecine (same as VHS or laserdisc), while the DVDs after that mostly used a soft telecine (24p to i60 conversion by the decoder).

A good progressive scan player will have no problem to eliminate the soft telecine 100%.

When ripping DVDs (without reencoding) is makes a big difference though, since p24 MKVs are easily played on all players, while i60 MKVs again require deinterlacing and most media players just aren't equipped to do that (nor are more software players, just usually simply apply video deinterlacing although you might be dealing with film based content).

or in short: yes, your DVD player applies deinterlacing, but not because the DVDs are 480i (most are 480p), but because the MPEG2 decoder within the machine is limited to 480i for political reasons.

[vol.2]

Now, whether or not you enable progressive mode on your DVD player will depend on whether you want your player to perform deinterlacing (or your TV doesn't do 480i for some reason) or you want your TV to do deinterlacing (Or if you're watching on an SD-only CRT, or your TV doesn't do 480p for some reason).

Gotcha. Thanks.

or in short: yes, your DVD player applies deinterlacing, but not because the DVDs are 480i (most are 480p), but because the MPEG2 decoder within the machine is limited to 480i for political reasons.

Thanks for the detailed answer Fudoh.

Ok. I've got a Sony KV-32HS510 that I understand upscales everything to 480p on every input (unless it's already 480p). Assuming this is correct, I'm guessing the best way to handle it is to use an OSSC to get all my content (DVDs and systems) up to 480p (with or without scanlines) before I connect to the KV-32HS510.

Does this make sense? (or am I missing something here)

Thanks,

[Fudoh]

The OSSC is not suited to deinterlace and/or upscale video/film. Film mode deinterlacing is something very different from video deinterlacing or simple doubling (bob'ing) as the OSSC offers.

What DVD/BD player are you using? Usually it's best to let these handle the output. Any 60 EUR BD player these days offers exceptional DVD upscaling. If you got a progressive DVD player with component outputs, you can easily check if the TV handles the material than the player. Simply switch on the player between 480p and 480i output and check if you see any difference.

[vol.2]

The OSSC is not suited to deinterlace and/or upscale video/film. Film mode deinterlacing is something very different from video deinterlacing or simple doubling (bob'ing) as the OSSC offers.

What DVD/BD player are you using? Usually it's best to let these handle the output. Any 60 EUR BD player these days offers exceptional DVD upscaling. If you got a progressive DVD player with component outputs, you can easily check if the TV handles the material than the player. Simply switch on the player between 480p and 480i output and check if you see any difference.

I've got a Phillips player that I picked up in ~2007. I think a PHILIPS DVP642. It's got component out and it's easy to hack it to region-free (which is why I bought it at the time). Perhaps the deinterlacing on it isn't really great tho. I hooked it up last night and there were artifacts. I think it was a bit better when I let the TV do the deinterlacing, but it still wasn't the best I've seen.

So maybe I just need a better DVD player then for movies. What do you think about games in this situation (to the 32HS510)? Seeing as how everything ends-up 480p, shouldn't I try to feed it a pre-upscaled 480p image with the scanlines? Isn't OSSC the way to go with that at least; or maybe I should be looking at the TVONE or the XRGB mini?

Thanks,