CD-R / DVD-R media recommendation?

[ASDR]

I always hear that CMC is shit and Taiyo Yuden the shit. But from what I understand CMC actually bought Taiyo Yuden and even major brands like Verbatim are mostly rebranded CMC media as well, so I'm unsure what to buy. The goal is of course to have media that lasts as long as possible and has the least compatibility issues with the various CD and DVD drives in older consoles. Is there still some kind of high-end, archival grade optical media available or is that all dying out with the obsolescence of those formats?

[garrz32]

What consoles are you referring to?

I've used Verbatim discs on Saturn. PCE & PS1 in the past and never had a problem, once I had a crappy disc that the PCE would not look at and copied the data onto a Verbatim with success.

But with the Saturn ODE/PSIO and System 3, discs are now obsolete for me anyway.

[ASDR]

It seems there are different types of Verbatim discs, but the normal ones you can buy at every consumer electronics stores are just rebranded CMC discs and identify as such. Taiyo Yuden is also just a brand for CMC now, so probably no point in shelling out for these branded discs if they're just the same stuff.

So ODE wise I'm not a fan of PSIO and SSDS3 and those systems would remain CD-based till a different solution comes along. Also not a fan of the Rhea/Phoebe (ordering process and tied to specific hardware), thankfully we'll get the Satiator this year.

For the Saturn I never had a problem. I have like 50+ CD-Rs and they all work, always. And yes, Satiator soon. For the PS1 I have a new-old-stock replacement laser and things seem to work great for countless hours of play with many titles, but I noticed two games that had some issues and I just wonder if maybe a different CD-R media could help. I mean could be the laser, the drive writing the disc, some corruption somewhere in the chain, the modchip, who knows, but trying a higher quality media seemed like a easy first shot at the problem. Also by the time I put a GDemu in my DC I had noticed some of my old CD-Rs had gone bad. I also still haven't gotten around to setup a larger HDD for my softmodded OGXB and might want to burn DVDs for that.

So I'll probably use optical discs in a console or two for a while longer and also do DVD-R based backups from time to time, I wouldn't be opposed to spending some more on media if it gets me better reliability and compatibility. It just seems like the usual highend brands these days are just fronts for the same cheap stuff and I'm a bit lost on where to get high-end, archival grade optical media in 2019.

[maxtherabbit]

real no-shit T-Y blanks can still be had on ebay

yes CMC owns them now, but there is still NOS floating around

[Lawfer]

I always hear that CMC is shit and Taiyo Yuden the shit. But from what I understand CMC actually bought Taiyo Yuden and even major brands like Verbatim are mostly rebranded CMC media as well, so I'm unsure what to buy.

Taiyo Yuden was the last hold-out who still manufactured "Made in Japan" CD-R all the way until 2014/2015, all the other japanese companies stopped all japanese-made manufacturing back in late 90's/early 00's.

Taiyo Yuden was actually Sony's company of choice for the PS1 and PS2, both console's developer Master Disc was from Taiyo Yuden.

PS1:







PS2:

The goal is of course to have media that lasts as long as possible and has the least compatibility issues with the various CD and DVD drives in older consoles. Is there still some kind of high-end, archival grade optical media available or is that all dying out with the obsolescence of those formats?

The good media is something that was manufactured 15-20 years ago, none of the readily available medias being sold now are worth calling "archival grade".

on where to get high-end, archival grade optical media in 2019.

Auction websites like Ebay.

[ASDR]

Fascinating, thanks guys. Sometimes I feel like all the good stuff is from the past, like the best MacBooks are maybe 2015 like the last good CD-Rs

I've seen TY media on eBay, but I wasn't sure if that's the genuine stuff or the new rebranded crap. Is there a solid way to tell?

[Lawfer]

I've seen TY media on eBay, but I wasn't sure if that's the genuine stuff or the new rebranded crap. Is there a solid way to tell?

Buying Taiyo Yuden own's brand "That's", such as these:






Buying these would be an assured way of getting real Taiyo Yuden media.

[ASDR]

Sweet, I guess they retired that brand once they were acquired by CMC? I'll see if I can find some on eBay...

[Lawfer]

Sweet, I guess they retired that brand once they were acquired by CMC?

Exactly.

[NJRoadfan]

Sweet, I guess they retired that brand once they were acquired by CMC? I'll see if I can find some on eBay...

TY media was branded as JVC (Victor Advanced Media Co.) during their final years. It was an attempt to increase sales and distribution by putting a trusted/well recognized brand on their media for sale in retail channels worldwide. The "That's" brand never saw much use outside of Asia. The vast majority of TY media sold retail in the US was under various makes like Fujifilm. The "white label" pre-JVC TY media was only for sale via bulk blank media distributors online.

For DVDs, Verbatim is still selling their highly rated AZO dye blanks. They aren't all that common in retail stores nowadays (Microcenter still carries them), but you can still buy them online. The commonly seen Verbatim "Life Series" blanks are CMC. You need to find the ones that specifically say "AZO" on the packaging.

Regarding "archival" quality CD-Rs, if the intended use is copies of games for game consoles, I wouldn't worry about it. Just keep an ISO copy around and burn a new copy when needed. I haven't had problems with random CMC and Ritek blanks with even the oldest CD drives around (think 1988-89!).

[maxtherabbit]

Sweet, I guess they retired that brand once they were acquired by CMC? I'll see if I can find some on eBay...

TY media was branded as JVC (Victor Advanced Media Co.) during their final years. It was an attempt to increase sales and distribution by putting a trusted/well recognized brand on their media for sale in retail channels worldwide. The "That's" brand never saw much use outside of Asia. The vast majority of TY media sold retail in the US was under various makes like Fujifilm. The "white label" pre-JVC TY media was only for sale via bulk blank media distributors online.

For DVDs, Verbatim is still selling their highly rated AZO dye blanks. They aren't all that common in retail stores nowadays (Microcenter still carries them), but you can still buy them online. The commonly seen Verbatim "Life Series" blanks are CMC. You need to find the ones that specifically say "AZO" on the packaging.

Regarding "archival" quality CD-Rs, if the intended use is copies of games for game consoles, I wouldn't worry about it. Just keep an ISO copy around and burn a new copy when needed. I haven't had problems with random CMC and Ritek blanks with even the oldest CD drives around (think 1988-89!).

the JVC branded discs are the easiest to find on ebay, and they are what I've used for several years with excellent results

[ASDR]

My current experience with cheap CD-Rs is that I had some DC games go bad after ~10 years and I have maybe a dud or two out of 30 that fails the verify after burn plus now a PS1 game or two where I'm suspicious that some random glitches might be the fault of the disc. That's basically the extend of it.

So seems like the AZO Verbatim discs like these



are cheaply and readily available at Amazon.

And on eBay I also found 'JVC-Taiyo Yuden'. Good to know about the JVC part, just searching for Taiyo Yuden results in plenty of listing with the CMC rebranded ones.

[Lawfer]

My current experience with cheap CD-Rs is that I had some DC games go bad after ~10 years and I have maybe a dud or two out of 30 that fails the verify after burn plus now a PS1 game or two where I'm suspicious that some random glitches might be the fault of the disc. That's basically the extend of it.

So seems like the AZO Verbatim discs like these



are cheaply and readily available at Amazon.

And on eBay I also found 'JVC-Taiyo Yuden'. Good to know about the JVC part, just searching for Taiyo Yuden results in plenty of listing with the CMC rebranded ones.

If you buy Verbatim you're just gonna just gonna get CMC CD-R with Phtalocyanine dye, both of which are bad for consoles, Mitsubishi (Verbatim) used to make their own CD-R with their own proprietary dye, but that was about 20 years ago.

[ASDR]

So wait, you're saying Azo == Phtalocyanine dye, but it seems they're on the opposite end of the longevity chart here?

I remember when CD writers first became widely available in the 90s gold discs were quite common, guess you can't buy those anymore :/

[Lawfer]

So wait, you're saying Azo == Phtalocyanine dye

Azo is Azo, Azo used to be a proprietary dye by Mitsubishi Chemical Corporation, sold in the West as "Verbatim", but that was a long time ago. Earlier Azo CD-R had a very dark blue color:

First generation Metal Azo dye (ATIP = 97m 34s 20f) dark blue

Second generation Metal Azo dye (ATIP = 97m 34s 21f) dark blue

There was a 3rd generation of Azo which were of a dark green color (similar to Taiyo Yuden CD-R color actually)

But that was something from 20 years ago, now it's just CMC Magnetics selling their 52x phtalocyanine CD-R with the "Verbatim" name plastered on it.

[NJRoadfan]

So wait, you're saying Azo == Phtalocyanine dye, but it seems they're on the opposite end of the longevity chart here?

I remember when CD writers first became widely available in the 90s gold discs were quite common, guess you can't buy those anymore :/

The linked graphic comes from MAM-A, a company notorious for..... aham.... biased reporting on longevity. MAM-A landed up with the patents for phthalocyanine dyes and pushes "gold" colored discs, of course they'll be at the top of the chart! The reason those gold discs vanished from the market is that dye formations improved and gold doesn't mean a better disc, in many cases it hurts rather than helps since its less reflective than silver. Taiyo Yuden used cyanine based dyes on their CD-Rs and nobody is disputing their quality.

The chart doesn't even make much sense, no CD-R or DVD-R is going to outlast a properly stamped CD or DVD.

http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/media/6 ... -gold.html

On a side note: I've been burning optical media for 20+ years now. Even the really early stuff that I have (Taiyo Yuden and TDK "gold") still reads without issue.

[Lawfer]

in many cases it hurts rather than helps since its less reflective than silver. Taiyo Yuden used cyanine based dyes on their CD-Rs and nobody is disputing their quality.

Indeed, CMC + Phtalocyanine is just gonna wear out your laser and you're gonna have a bad performance in terms of loading and audio (such as skips and clicks).

On a side note: I've been burning optical media for 20+ years now. Even the really early stuff that I have (Taiyo Yuden and TDK "gold") still reads without issue.

Yep, quality stuff.

[Steamflogger Boss]

I use MAM-A 650MB CDRs for PCE and Saturn. Probably overkill, but I've never come close to having an issue.

Site: http://www.mam-a.com/

If you wait for sales/clearances it is a lot more reasonable.

[ASDR]

Things are always more complicated than they seem Seems like the best available option for me right now are the JVC branded new-old-stock TY discs from eBay.

[Gara]

Things are always more complicated than they seem Seems like the best available option for me right now are the JVC branded new-old-stock TY discs from eBay.

How are you guys distinguishing old stock from all the other listings? Where they are made doesn't seem helpful. The only other big difference I see is that some are rated at 48x. 48x-52x are not very old. Is there some date code I am not seeing?

[ASDR]

How are you guys distinguishing old stock from all the other listings? Where they are made doesn't seem helpful. The only other big difference I see is that some are rated at 48x. 48x-52x are not very old. Is there some date code I am not seeing?

"TY media was branded as JVC (Victor Advanced Media Co.) during their final years" - so hopefully the new CMC stuff is not JVC branded? But then again I just found an eBay listing that has both

"CMC Pro Value Line" and "JVC Art.Nr.: J-DMR47WPP-SK-B" in it... confusing.