Prelude to the Apocalypse

[Zen]

Ugh, genetic racism.

What is "genetic racism"?

So you mean to say that Europeans should make-up pan-European, or vaguely nationalist identity myths, rather than discovering identity?

Could you explain more precisely, what you mean here?
Why would White peoples, need to "make up" identity myths?

And what do you mean by; "rather than discovering identity"?

But on the culture plank, I keep getting back to the same thing - if your culture is superior, then it 'obviously' will take care of itself. You don't need the government to protect it.

What do you mean by "the culture plank" and which "culture" are you referring to here?

Also gotta say, I'm getting weirded out by all the casual racism

I trust you do not refer to this thread, surely?

that insists it's OK to be proud to have European heritage, when you might not have had an ancestor in Europe for three centuries,

If by "European", you mean White, then irrespective of timeline, if you are White, you are "European" and the three centuries you mention, changes that fact not one jot.

but it's not OK to be proud you had an Indian in your family in the late 1800s

Again, if you are inferring that this has been said here, in this thread, I would be obliged if you would point out where.

[Ed Oscuro]

The natives are not some kind of long dead or mythical extinct species with mystic powers. This kind of stuff only contributes to making them and their concerns invisible.

See, miracles happen when BryanM gets serious This is an adequate representation of the truth.

It is worth mentioning, though, that my complaint about Bob Hoskin Jr.'s response to Warren is that some people in Indian Country seem to think that they are the only Indians, because they have a treaty that says so (which doesn't imply so much that the US Government says who is Indian, but rather an imported concept of nationalism applies - that if you are not joined up with the cool kids, then you cannot be an Indian - as absurd a situation as if there was suddenly a German Society which decided to exclude anybody from Baden-Württemberg). Nobody is pooh-poohing their concerns, but the argument that Bob Hoskin Jr. speaks for all Cherokee peoples shows a hilariously inflated sense of importance by any reasonable standard. If it appears that their concerns are simply those you'd have heard from a leader like Red Jacket in the 1800s, it's not true. The 'blood quantum' / treaty-gating argument is not identical to the original concerns about survival, nor even to concerns about economic justice, cultural survival, and so on. Just a few details of the history - from the early Cherokee gambit on assimilation to the modern casino wars - realizes that the people who argue for a exclusionary definition of Indianness are on the wrong side of tradition. "Tradition," of course, does not mean an exact lifestyle - that was always going to change, and even before the arrival of Europeans indigenous societies were changing. It seems to me that being thoughtful and respectful of others is more to the core of native 'tradition,' especially in political and cultural systems.

The bottom line is that you cannot claim to support a living culture if nobody from outside can join that culture, when people who speak the languages are dying off, when people are leaving and others intermarrying and diluting the 'blood quantum' that way. You cannot support this idea unless your idea of a living culture is one that simply dies out, like the Shakers. Is that what European Identity is going to be?

Further @ Rob: It is as if I haven't met more than my share of distinguished online commentaries on the depredations of Kwanzaa, etc, or whatever is brewing in the fever swamp at the moment. I am sorry that your viewpoint appears undifferentiated from such distinguished thinkers. If you wish to enlighten us further, you're always free to do so. You are always free to explain how Elizabeth Warren's heredity claims are part of a plan to impurify our precious bodily fluids, if I have misinterpreted you.

BryanM:

Lots of airtime everyone where can see how much Trump and Warren care about themselves, however. It's like being in highschool again, but in an exaggerated Hollywood movie! Exciting.

Again with the psuedo-equivalency! Warren clammed up about the topic after the initial discussion.

Also, your concept of 'proof' is strangely not applied by people looking to find out if they had a Roman ancestor, or something similar. Your comment about the DNA test not proving ancestry seems directly equivalent to people claiming the fossil record isn't proof of evolution. The absolute standard of proof won't apply as it would with a math proof; that's just the nature of the science. It's disingenuous to pull out this criticism when literally nobody has been making such a fuss about claims of Neandertal heritage, or that the hominid skeleton named Lucy is universally considered to be a relative. Warren's test is about as good as they get these days.

[Mischief Maker]

which "culture" are you referring to here?

Pretty sure he means this one.

[Ed Oscuro]

Hey, that is a cool channel.

My favorite example of "Western Culture" is Beaker Culture. Nearly 3,000 BC, and there was a trading and cultural network extending from the northernmost points of modern Ireland and Scotland, to the southernmost reaches of Sicily. Covering the mass of Europe there were also Cordedware and Funnelware groups. But the Beaker Culture is the most striking because it shows how free cultural exchange was, and how happy people were for it, in millennia before container ships and YouTube.

[BryanM]

Also, your concept of 'proof' is strangely not applied by people looking to find out if they had a Roman ancestor, or something similar.

If there's a politician who wants to brag about an imaginary Roman gladiator ancestor from 34 generations back for some incomprehensible reason, please point them out and I'll josh them well.

In the meantime we're now talking about a better person: Dennis. His UFO story is emblematic of how easy it is for the media to ignore substance.

[Ed Oscuro]

I WANT TO BELIEVE the women (TM)

We're not in Europe though - over hear in the STATES we only care about...cow-boys and corn-bread? And if you watch the Histr'y Channel, you know that Jesse James, The Outlaw is serious business.

That's the other part you missed: Warren, like I said, shut up after the initial discussion. It was solely Trump and the media that kept it going. I looked at her Twitter account and didn't even find any reference to it. And, as I've pointed out before, she's been saying she is proud of her Native ancestors since a time when it was not really cool, and long before she wanted to be political.

In any case I will admit this - a lot of the Democratic candidates out there should stay in Congress. They will fail their CHA roll every time. That's more than I should say...

[Mischief Maker]

Look, if we want to be serious about race science, let's stop beating around the bush and say the truth people are too politically correct to admit:

Spoiler

White people were created by the scientist Yakub on the island of Patmos 6,600 years ago.

[Rob]

Zen asked all of the questions I was too bewildered to ask. Thanks, buddy.

So you mean to say that...

I'm saying that there are perfectly valid biological reasons for ethnocentrism, which is why every unenlightened person in the world does and will continue to engage in it.

living a life based entirely around the phenomenon of evolution

...or simply living in the real world - the one where people like above-named "Bret Fucking Stephens" are keenly aware of their identity and interests related to that identity, and the one where the isolated modern man gets manipulated by opinion makers like Bret Stephens, or thinks neocons push(ed) for endless war in the Middle East because of "democracy" or oil or whatever.

[quash]

Also gotta say, I'm getting weirded out by all the casual racism that insists it's OK to be proud to have European heritage, when you might not have had an ancestor in Europe for three centuries, but it's not OK to be proud you had an Indian in your family in the late 1800s (for example; nobody really knows when Warren's ancestor likely lived. But the genetic test makes it quite evident she had one).

Getting a DNA test to prove to the world that you aren't racist is a colossal self own, and at least the people saying they're proud to be white are more than 1/32nd what they claim to be proud of.

I have 0.01% unassigned DNA in my 23andme. Would you think it'd be normal and healthy for me to be proud to be a descendant of an alien that was held at Area 51?

[Ed Oscuro]

I am going to skip past Rob's response because he's not as entertaining, sorry

Getting a DNA test to prove to the world that you aren't racist

She bit her dog, eh?

more than 1/32nd what they claim to be proud of.

So if you're less than 1/32nd of something, you...cease to be related to that thing?

Keep in mind we are talking about ancestry and not culture. If you want to get down to it, you can be proud of your dog/cat/whatever. It is obviously not you, but there is no reason to limit one's affection based on degree of relatedness.

I have 0.01% unassigned DNA in my 23andme. Would you think it'd be normal and healthy for me to be proud to be a descendant of an alien that was held at Area 51?

Yes, I have always suspected there was some answer for your unique condition.

If you are a space lizard, that is OK by me. Us liberals have big enough hearts for everybody! As one of our members says in his sig, even aliens are God's creatures.

[Ed Oscuro]

I am going to skip past Rob's response because he's not as entertaining, sorry

Getting a DNA test to prove to the world that you aren't racist

She bit her dog, eh?

more than 1/32nd what they claim to be proud of.

So if you're less than 1/32nd of something, you...cease to be related to that thing?

Keep in mind we are talking about ancestry and not culture. If you want to get down to it, you can be proud of your dog/cat/whatever. It is obviously not you, but there is no reason to limit one's affection based on degree of relatedness.

I have 0.01% unassigned DNA in my 23andme. Would you think it'd be normal and healthy for me to be proud to be a descendant of an alien that was held at Area 51?

Yes, I have always suspected there was some answer for your unique condition.

If you are a space lizard, that is OK by me. Us liberals have big enough hearts for everybody! As one of our members says in his sig, even aliens are God's creatures.

I'm saying that there are perfectly valid biological reasons for ethnocentrism, which is why every unenlightened person in the world does and will continue to engage in it.

I am not sure what you are saying here. Is ethnocentrism good? Is ethnocentrism a license to exclude the possibility of cultural exchange? Does ethnocentrism mean a person must adhere to every particular part of a culture? I'm not even getting into lederhosen, man.

[fables like he] thinks neocons push(ed) for endless war in the Middle East because of "democracy" or oil or whatever.

I'm glad to see you rose to the occasion by trotting out your own distortion of the other side's thought. I'll raise you the fact that Trump literally said "we should have taken the oil." So, no, I personally don't know why Bush the Second's cabinet was planning for war in Iraq before there was a pretext, but I am willing to say I don't think it was oil. So what? And Cheney at Haliburton was just the kind of conflict of interest that we've been repeatedly told is OK, nothing to see here, nobody's selling out Uncle Sam's reputation, the troops, or the debt, just for a buck. It was, at the very least, a fishy connection.

[quash]

Dude, come on. This is one of the best/worst examples of shitting the bed in all of modern politics.

So if you're less than 1/32nd of something, you...cease to be related to that thing?

No, but when you use such a marginal connection to grant yourself opportunities that would not have otherwise been available, I think that deserves to be called out. Especially when it comes to Native American ancestry, which is often times only recognized if it's over a certain amount, because, well, a lot of people in the US are barely Native.

If you are a space lizard, that is OK by me. Us liberals have big enough hearts for everybody! As one of our members says in his sig, even aliens are God's creatures.

This is an odd endorsement of the one drop rule, but hey, I'll take it. Where do I sign up for reparations? Because aliens were used for experiments and shit.

[Ed Oscuro]

Dude, come on. This is one of the best/worst examples of shitting the bed in all of modern politics.

Yes, hang on to it as long as you want. Because god knows Trump doesn't want to talk about the trade war, the stock market, illegal immigrants...

And I think we will see how long your definition of "shitting the bed" holds on when hindsight shows that "the Warren comments scandal" was more about the true-to-form dirty GOP tricks than it was about the actual issue...

...and after the totality of the awfulness of Trump's spanking new campaign ad that attempts to blame Democrats (and migrants in general) with the murder of two police officers - by an immigrant who came into the country under George W Bush's Administration.

No, but when you use such a marginal connection to grant yourself opportunities that would not have otherwise been available

No, nobody has said this, outside delusional fever-swamp inhabitants (and those who got caught up in the tsunami in a teacup they whipped up). Delaware nation folks specifically said she did NOT do this, and the Cherokee Nation guy said nothing on that topic either.

If she had ever made a penny off mentioning she has Indian heritage we would have been drowned in ads showing it is so; instead, the record shows that it is just a family story she liked mentioning from at least the 1970s on. It hasn't had any obvious impact on her political fortunes. It has only had any impact as being another "the liberals are bad culture guys" dog-whistle fake issue for you to slurp up. There's literally nothing more to it than that.

[quash]

https://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_5bb4 ... 6eda9a72e1

Ah yes, the well known right wing mouthpiece *squints* The Huffington Post.

[Zen]

which "culture" are you referring to here?

Pretty sure he means this one.

By God, I think you may be right! It would explain a lot of Ed's posts.


With that being said;
Mischief Maker, you fucking terrorist! Undeclared Sam Seder and ContraPoints videos?
And now, the second video of this persons Jabberwocky, that you have linked.
You need to be put on some kind of link-watchlist!

This person is attempting satire, yes? This person, this nadir of Western decline, this caricature of a Social Sciences victim . . . this is amateur dramatics, right? Right?!

On the off chance that it is not, let me say this;
William Parrott, should be able to express himself in any way he chooses but before I get to his "arguments"; good God, Mischief Maker, what are you subjecting us to here?!; https://youtu.be/xVMx5EYEYKo

My issue, is with the dishonesty within his arguments.
William here, gives an exhibition in some of the most absurdly infantile applications of Critical Theory, that I have had the misfortune to witness.
Even a novice on these issues, should be more than able to crush the "arguments" being offered by this person.

To define "The West", he Selects criteria, that he freely admits are his own. Says they are mutually exclusive, therefore ; "The West" does not actually exist.
William, unironically, references a Guardian article by "philosopher" Kwame "Anthony" Appiah, titled, with an equal seriousness; "The is no such thing as Western Culture"
Next step; "Race is a construct", right, William?

He circumvents (by preemptively raising, demonising and mocking) "Whiteness" as a criteria for "The West", by hilariously electing to use the "Literally Hitler" trope.

He moves further into this technique, by stating that only those who equate Western culture with being White, dare to claim that, what he calls - "postmodern neo-Marxism",
is not part of White/Western Culture.
Proving, he asserts, that as "postmodern neo-Marxism" is strongly associated with, as he claims, "the Jews", that those who associate Western Culture with Whiteness while denying
"postmodern neo-Marxism" a place within it, are, wait for it . . . . antiSemites.

There are so many insane quotables in the video but I will just pull this one;

"Suffice to say, that the association between Whiteness and the West, is always lurking beneath the surface and when Whiteness rears it's head proudly,
the result is the ugliest crimes our civilisation is capable of"

Of course, without "Whiteness" "rearing it's head proudly", William Nicholas "Natalie Wynn" Parrott, would not have a Cultural, National, Social nor perhaps even physical platform
from which to spout his Cultural Marxist, White dismissing, self negating scree.
In the end, perhaps that very self loathing, is at the heart of his being.

Mischief Maker, my friend, do me a solid;
This person is a quanta away from doing a "Whiteness is a construct" video. When he does; Ninja- link that video too. I would really like to get my teeth into that one

[Rob]

Spoiler

Canadians about to have their love of "diversity" put to the test. The agreement looks to contain an incredible amount of oversight and meddling in every facet of society in order to benefit an influx of uninvited millions and whoever profits from the shuffling around of those millions.

Almost 100% of Canada's net population growth will be through immigration by 2035

So they've got a "well below" replacement fertility rate (which in a sane world would be an allowable short term blip as the population settles into something comfortable and sustainable) and the brilliant cure-is-worse-than-the-disease is undisguised replacement migration. This goes back to the idea that system11 mentioned a few pages back about not having children for the environment. Any child a conscientious person isn't having is just freed up space for a woman who thinks nothing about anything and however many of her 44 children survive to adulthood. A graph of Africa's projected future and the apparent plan for the overflow (author who appears to be anonymous on The Economist website seems to think as many as 100-200 million of these mid-century 2 billion will be heading into Europe):

Spoiler

"Destiny". "Like it or not".



"Inevitable, necessary, and desirable". "Inevitable, necessary, and desirable". "Inevitable, necessary, and desirable".

Relating this back to the hot American topic of the moment: protecting our borders and having a say about who and how many can enter is vital, even if the media has a favorite photo of a crying child.

[ED-057]

Who is in charge of the migrant army? thousands of people usually don't organize themselves spontaneously, especially in a place like honduras with its poverty, oppression, and us-backed colonial government. if these people are organized, why don't they put their own house in order, instead of travelling a thousand miles to beg at trump's doorstep?

according to domestic propaganda, Trump is a racist, fascist, dictator. The propaganda being disseminated south of the border must be somewhat different if people are still voluntarily marching up here to join their brethren in the gas chambers.

everyone who keeps going on about how "proud' they are to be white/black/green/violet needs to consider that pride is a sin (maybe christianity was right about this)

[Mischief Maker]

Who is in charge of the migrant army?

George Soros according to the Pittsburgh shooter.

You here to say he's got a point?

*dingalingaling!* *DROOL*

[ED-057]

George Soros according to the Pittsburgh shooter.

OK, that's one opinion. any evidence?

You here to say he's got a point?

Do you have a point?

[Specineff]

Here's a friendly reminder that Dey Took Er Jerbs!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont ... X4jx9fqyQI

[Rob]

everyone who keeps going on about how "proud' they are to be white/black/green/violet needs to consider that pride is a sin

I don't think "pride" is the best word to describe what healthy people should feel. More like a simple appreciation for one's ancestors and a responsibility to future generations. A complete absence of those things is a problem.

You here to say he's got a point?

Do you have a point?

Some lunatic shot people so therefore any talk of money that is supporting the thousand mile trek of thousands is out of bounds. The story you can believe is that they assembled on a whim and are surviving on smiles and whatever else they kick up along the way, and if you don't buy that then you were there with the synagogue shooter.

[FinalBaton]

Some lunatic shot people so therefore any talk of money that is supporting the thousand mile trek of thousands is out of bounds. The story you can believe is that they assembled on a whim and are surviving on smiles and whatever else they kick up along the way, and if you don't buy that then you were there with the synagogue shooter.

ok that was good

[BryanM]

lol, they really do believe that billionaires are Santa Claus and the peasants are unable to survive on their own without their benevloent succor.

Are the brain worms so intense they don't even understand basic expenses? It's trivial to survive on $0.75 a day if you don't have to pay economic rents. Even here in the USA.
__

Moving on from the rightwing obsession with their version of that meteor from that one episode of The Simpsons - another Elliot Rodger guy. 40 year old virgin. Able to grab the ass of strangers on multiple occasions, but not able to pretend to be a human for a prolonged period of time, lower his standards enough, or just pay a hooker.

Rich Evans would not approve.

Oh and there's some dumb election going on where you can vote in favor of Goldman Sachs or really vote in favor of Goldman Sachs. You can't call it a democracy, but well. Whatever.

[Rob]

lol, they really do believe that billionaires are Santa Claus and the peasants are unable to survive on their own without their benevloent succor.

Why I’m Investing $500 Million in Migrants

Yes, Bryan, George does seem to believe the non-European "peasants" he feels a solidarity with can't get along in this cruel world without his helping hand (and, yes, we know this article does not specifically mention funding exoduses, but it does give us a hint about his worldview and the aims of his philanthropy). That said, no one here is fixated on one man. The obsession with Soros and the assertions made without any proof in the conservative-nut sphere are as goofy and stupid as dismissing every possibility out of hand.

It's trivial to survive on $0.75 a day if you don't have to pay economic rents.

But even the hardiest person would have struggled to cover the roughly 30 miles every day since she joined the caravan on Oct. 14.

This is not just about "survival" while lounging on a spring-exposed couch. Have you ever done anything that requires planning or physical exertion beyond a walk to the corner store or session at the gym? To keep moving your legs for long distances you need a steady supply of calories, not just Noble Migrant-grade willpower and a memory of last month's rice and beans, and knowing where you are going to get those calories is important. This is a fair sized town of people traveling a thousand plus miles through areas that aren't known for abundance.

[Rob]

Duty done. Voted for reams of red tape (Stand for Salmon), the ousting of a few judges, the removal of Emma Lazarus' poem from the Statue of Liberty, coils of razor wire and a manly coldness of heart.

Oh and there's some dumb election going on where you can vote in favor of Goldman Sachs or really vote in favor of Goldman Sachs.

Goldman Sachs and every other Fortune 500 company agrees with "progressives" on immigration.

[Mischief Maker]

No, you voted out of fear. The fear that you can't out-fuck a Latino.



You're a fan of science, Rob, did you know MRI studies have found that conservatives have an oversized fear and anxiety center in the brain while lefties have a larger ethical decision-making center?

[quash]

I had to vote for either Feinstein or De Leon. It was hard to decide which one was the accelerationist choice, but I decided that I couldn't sleep at night knowing that I was even marginally responsible for Dianne Feinstein staying in office.

[Mischief Maker]

I had to vote for either Feinstein or De Leon. It was hard to decide which one was the accelerationist choice, but I decided that I couldn't sleep at night knowing that I was even marginally responsible for Dianne Feinstein staying in office.

God damn, I never thought I'd be applauding a quash vote!

[quash]

Whoever wins, I hope they do their due diligence in ruining California's reputation with the rest of the country.

[Domino]

And Florida appears to go Red for both Gov and Senate. Good job Dems, but you guys don't turn out for midterms.

Personally I'll take the Trump puppet's eco policies (good for me), but not his social policies (bad for me).