BVM models "operating hours" and standy time

[kazaakas@hotmail.com]

So many people seem to attach great importance to the operating hours of Sony BVM's and so do I. However, I'm hearing quite conflicting statements about whether this includes stand-by time or not. The BVM-A series have two hour counters "OPERATION TIME" and "CRT TURN ON TIME", so it would be logical to assume that the operation time does increase while on standby, because this counter is often at least twice as high. Now their analog RGB brothers, the fabled BVM-D's, only have the OPERATION TIME, so it would be natural to assume that this single counter also includes stand-by time and therefore making it quite an unreliable measure (next to from possible tube swaps).

However, I tested this on my non A/D series BVM-20F1E and its sole OPERATION TIME counter does NOT go up in stand by! Left it on stand by for a whole night and not a single extra hour on the counter.

This would imply that the OPERATION TIME counter has different meanings betwen different models, because how else can it have different values than CRT TURN ON TIME on the A-series?

I would very much like to hear if anyone with an A or D series BVM has tested or can test this so we can make an overview about what these counters mean for different models.
I'll start out the thread with:

BVM-20F1E: OPERATION TIME does NOT increase in stand by!

[kukrapok]

BVM-D24E1WE: OPERATION TIME does NOT increase in stand by!
edit: manufactured in September (iirc) 2005, software version 1.21.

[Ikaruga11]

Does standby mode age the phosphors of a BVM?

[Dochartaigh]

Does standby mode age the phosphors of a BVM?

No. That would only happen while electrons are being shot onto the phosphor coating of the screen - which doesn't happen when the BVM physically has power (i.e. switch on the back is "on"), but is turned off (red light on front) and not displaying a picture.

[Ikaruga11]

Does standby mode age the phosphors of a BVM?

No. That would only happen while electrons are being shot onto the phosphor coating of the screen - which doesn't happen when the BVM physically has power (i.e. switch on the back is "on"), but is turned off (red light on front) and not displaying a picture.

Oh, I see. So when a BVM is powered on but the screen is off, it's in standby mode?

I've been hearing conflicting reports about whether it's better to keep a BVM on or turn it off when not in use. Some people say BVMs love to stay on and turning them on/off is very stressful on them. Others say that keeping them off when not in use is recommended.

[Dochartaigh]

I forget the actual verbiage which they use - could very well be standby mode, but there's basically 3 modes: Power switch on the back off. Power switch on the back on, and the monitor on (which is how we use it when playing games on it, and is the only time when it's counting up operation time). And the last is power switch on the back on, but the monitor itself off (which operation time does NOT count up).

[Ed Oscuro]

An actual BVM owner should be able to confirm or refute what follows, but I think this is accurate:

BVM standby mode seems intended for operating the unit externally - for corporations with banks of monitors that must all be operated together, and turned on from software or an external switch. As a single monitor user you probably should disregard standby mode. The people discussing supposed stresses on the BVMs when being turned on and off may not be talking about standby mode at all. (The one thing worth clarifying is whether your BVM auto-executes degaussing when it's turned on, but even that is not something I would consider a great risk to the monitor, and isn't really related to standby mode AFAIK.) BVMs generally seem designed to operate well in more demanding conditions, but you should not assume that aging electronic components will never need to be replaced or tuned.

I would say you could do worse than to use your common sense: Don't move it around more than necessary, have a good surge suppressor plugged into it, and don't leave it plugged into the wall for a week straight just so you can use it part of one day.

[Dochartaigh]

An actual BVM owner should be able to confirm or refute what follows, but I think this is accurate:

BVM standby mode seems intended for operating the unit externally - for corporations with banks of monitors that must all be operated together, and turned on from software or an external switch. As a single monitor user you probably should disregard standby mode. The people discussing supposed stresses on the BVMs when being turned on and off may not be talking about standby mode at all. (The one thing worth clarifying is whether your BVM auto-executes degaussing when it's turned on, but even that is not something I would consider a great risk to the monitor, and isn't really related to standby mode AFAIK.) BVMs generally seem designed to operate well in more demanding conditions, but you should not assume that aging electronic components will never need to be replaced or tuned.

I would say you could do worse than to use your common sense: Don't move it around more than necessary, have a good surge suppressor plugged into it, and don't leave it plugged into the wall for a week straight just so you can use it part of one day.

I currently own 2 BVM's (BVM-D20F1U, and BVM-20F1U), ex-owner of like 3 others... Most people who still use these today almost always have them in standby mode I would bet - and use the front power button to turn them on/off and leave the switch in the back alone. For a comparison, it would be like turning off your desktop computer twice - one through Start>Shutdown (or the power button up front), then turning it off again via the power supplies on/off toggle switch on the back of your computer. Sure, some people may do that, but I'll bet it's not the norm and certainly not needed to turn something off twice.

[kazaakas@hotmail.com]

Thanks guys, now I'm just wondering.. What counts as CRT TURN ON TIME for the A-series?

[Ikaruga11]

So is it better to turn the BVM completely off when done with games, or leave the power on but the screen turned off? In terms of lifespan.

[kukrapok]

Personally I've always turned appliances off when not needed (including TVs/monitors) and never had any issues doing so.
However one of my PC CRT monitors once refused to wake up from sleep mode (after not moving the mouse for a few hours without turning it off, so not actual standby mode like when you put a TV on standby with the remote), and something similar already happened to a friend of mine with an LCD, power LED remained orange and it simply wouldn't work anymore.
BVMs are built differently so my statements are probably irrelevant, but I'd rather turn a monitor on and off if I use it once or twice a week like I currently do.

[Ed Oscuro]

So is it better to turn the BVM completely off when done with games, or leave the power on but the screen turned off? In terms of lifespan.

It probably doesn't matter. I just wouldn't waste power keeping it in standby mode for days at a time. That's not really related to lifespan, aside from the slight risk of a lightning strike killing your unit when plugged in...

[Ikaruga11]

So is it better to turn the BVM completely off when done with games, or leave the power on but the screen turned off? In terms of lifespan.

It probably doesn't matter. I just wouldn't waste power keeping it in standby mode for days at a time. That's not really related to lifespan, aside from the slight risk of a lightning strike killing your unit when plugged in...

What is it's plugged into a surge protector, but turned completely off?

I talked to Savon-pat a few days ago and he said to turn the BVM completely off when not using it, in a home environment. I think it mentioned something like that too in the user manual and brochure.

[Ed Oscuro]

Definitely listen to Pat.

There are only two reasons I like to unplug things when not in use: To prevent a freak lightning strike (or similar) from frying the equipment, and to eliminate any possible power drain (though there shouldn't be one with the back power switch off).

I think you're worrying about this more than needed, but hopefully it's an educational experience I've been there myself, on multiple topics.

[kazaakas@hotmail.com]

About Pat:
He says that BVM's are fine up until about 30000 hours for professional purposes, and gamers who just need "good enough" colour can use them for at least 60000.
But this iis just about color.. How about reduced sharpness and brightness due to aging? Especially having to adjust the contrast on old dimmer monitors excacerbates the sharpness reduction. Quite frankly, most people are always thinking solely about the color issues that arise after a lot of usage hours, but I've heard of a couple of GDM's that can't retain a sharp image anymore because of their usage hours and those use similar if not the same tubes.

I've luckily acquired a D24 this weekend, with 26K hours on it. Still looks great, I wonder how long it will last! It was cheap relative to eBay prices, but unfortunately it reeks of cigarette smoke quite badly. I can live with it, given its rarity, but it's a damn shame.

[Ikaruga11]

Definitely listen to Pat.

There are only two reasons I like to unplug things when not in use: To prevent a freak lightning strike (or similar) from frying the equipment, and to eliminate any possible power drain (though there shouldn't be one with the back power switch off).

I think you're worrying about this more than needed, but hopefully it's an educational experience I've been there myself, on multiple topics.

Yeah, I will. He is the most reliable and credible source, since he serviced and calibrated Sony PVM/BVMs for a living.

Would a surge protector keep the BVM from being fried if it was plugged in and lightning struck? And when you say power drain, is that just a higher electric bill?

Yeah, I am worrying about this more than needed, but I want to take absolute pristine care of my BVM. It definitely was an educational experience. Thanks!

About Pat:
He says that BVM's are fine up until about 30000 hours for professional purposes, and gamers who just need "good enough" colour can use them for at least 60000.
But this iis just about color.. How about reduced sharpness and brightness due to aging? Especially having to adjust the contrast on old dimmer monitors excacerbates the sharpness reduction. Quite frankly, most people are always thinking solely about the color issues that arise after a lot of usage hours, but I've heard of a couple of GDM's that can't retain a sharp image anymore because of their usage hours and those use similar if not the same tubes.

I've luckily acquired a D24 this weekend, with 26K hours on it. Still looks great, I wonder how long it will last! It was cheap relative to eBay prices, but unfortunately it reeks of cigarette smoke quite badly. I can live with it, given its rarity, but it's a damn shame.

Yep, Pat said that in the interview with RetroRGB. In fact, BVMs can be used up to 100,000 hours for video games and possibly movies too.

I know that colors and brightness become dimmer as a CRT gets older, but I'm not sure about reduced sharpness. How many hours did the GDM have before losing sharpness? I'm thinking about getting a GDM.

Also, congrats on getting one of the best CRTs ever made! 26K is pretty low, so it should last a long time depending on how much you use it. You can probably get rid of the smoke smell by scrubbing it with a de-odorizing fragrance and getting some air flow into the room.

[gray117]

As bad as any smell seems it will likely eventually wear off.

To speed it up (and prevent you having to face it yourself or infect everything else, or if not able to air out etc.) I recommend wrapping it in a garbage bag along with a bunch of baking soda, or even charcoal, for at least 48 hours preferably 3 days ... be careful not to get the dust all over your kit. You'll probably want to repeat, but extent of smell should be greatly reduced after first treatment. At the end of this then then goto scrubbing/de-odorizing fragrance - minimising the amount that needs to be used to help override the now weaker smells... Obviously try to avoid internals and certainly don't soak them ... if in doubt allow to ventilate + dry for 48 hours again and you should be totally fine (any residue from a light spray for example is likely less than the dust already around).

General pro crt lifespan over home use would generally exceed 40k / 10 years easily, lifespan in hours seems to relaibly exceed that near double with decent 90s sets... General age of anything around high power areas will be a likely weak point these days, generally best to isolate using a switch or unplug when not in use for periods over 2 hours imho. Turning anything on and off a lot generally causes more static wear when brand new, but not passing any electricity through it when older and when not in use is probably best - especially for any transformer or similar component. Plus even if you are on a surge, a physical switch, or an unplug, means you'll not leave it plugged in during a thunderstorm while you're at work

[kazaakas@hotmail.com]

Yep, Pat said that in the interview with RetroRGB. In fact, BVMs can be used up to 100,000 hours for video games and possibly movies too.

I know that colors and brightness become dimmer as a CRT gets older, but I'm not sure about reduced sharpness. How many hours did the GDM have before losing sharpness? I'm thinking about getting a GDM.

Also, congrats on getting one of the best CRTs ever made! 26K is pretty low, so it should last a long time depending on how much you use it. You can probably get rid of the smoke smell by scrubbing it with a de-odorizing fragrance and getting some air flow into the room.

I was emailing back and forth a bit with a guy selling a GDM-FW900, but he said that the monitor, while still good, is not as vivid or sharp as it once was. And I indeed have seen it happen on consumer sets as a kid. The thing I'm wondering is how much of this decay in sharpness is fixable through by adjusting the focus pot(s) on the flyback transformer.

As bad as any smell seems it will likely eventually wear off.

To speed it up (and prevent you having to face it yourself or infect everything else, or if not able to air out etc.) I recommend wrapping it in a garbage bag along with a bunch of baking soda, or even charcoal, for at least 48 hours preferably 3 days ... be careful not to get the dust all over your kit. You'll probably want to repeat, but extent of smell should be greatly reduced after first treatment. At the end of this then then goto scrubbing/de-odorizing fragrance - minimising the amount that needs to be used to help override the now weaker smells... Obviously try to avoid internals and certainly don't soak them ... if in doubt allow to ventilate + dry for 48 hours again and you should be totally fine (any residue from a light spray for example is likely less than the dust already around).

General pro crt lifespan over home use would generally exceed 40k / 10 years easily, lifespan in hours seems to relaibly exceed that near double with decent 90s sets... General age of anything around high power areas will be a likely weak point these days, generally best to isolate using a switch or unplug when not in use for periods over 2 hours imho. Turning anything on and off a lot generally causes more static wear when brand new, but not passing any electricity through it when older and when not in use is probably best - especially for any transformer or similar component. Plus even if you are on a surge, a physical switch, or an unplug, means you'll not leave it plugged in during a thunderstorm while you're at work

Thanks, though I think it would be best to just see what time does to the smell (according to you guys) before doing anything more invasive. I do turn the monitor off using the PSU switch when I'm done using it, but that's mainly because it's in my bedroom and the fan keeps running if I don't turn it off completely. Pretty weird actually. Might have something to do with its firmware version 1.20?

I do have some issues with its black level still. There is a faint luminant grey hue when blacks are displayed. It's a lot less now that I've turned down the brightness and turned up the contrast a bit, but it's still extremely notable when the screen is (nearly) all black. I'm not sure if that's an adjustment issue. I hope it is, because it worries me.

[Bear112274]

I can’t understand why anyone would think the operating hours would increase in standby. The operating hours are for two things: to establish the operating time of the crt and drive circuits, and to establish if warranty is valid on the crt back when they were new. Sony only guaranteed their CRT’s for a certain life time of hours. I can’t remember what this was as it’s such a long time ago!
The performance of a crt is not just dependent on hours. The brightness and contrast settings play a major role in the hours the crt will achieve before significant picture degradation is noticed. These are poor focus on bright parts of the picture and significant reduction in brightness and contrast output making the picture look ‘flat’ etc.