HDMI 2.1 Specification Done

[ASDR]

Sounds exciting:

https://www.anandtech.com/show/12095/hd ... n-released

Some of the things that could be awesome for older systems in combination with devices like the OSSC:



- "The new HDMI 2.1 standard also cannonizes variable refresh into an official HDMI standard"

Obviously useful for gaming in general, but I wonder if that means consoles like the SNES with its 60.08Hz would also benefit. Currently many displays are either incompatible or you'll have to live with judder as it is normalized to a standard refresh rate.

- "Quick Media Switching (QMS) and Quick Frame Transport (QFT). The former is focused on videos and movies, allowing source devices to switch resolution or frame rate of the content instantly. The idea is to mitigate potential delays and interruptions when switching between media with different resolutions, refresh rates, or TV viewing modes."

So no more blackouts during 240p <> 480i transitions? I guess modern consoles could also do things like switch to 24p mode for a cinematic feel in cutscenes.

- "As for QFT, the HDMI Forum described the feature as allowing video frames to transmit faster from the source without increasing the source frame rate."
- "Adjacent to these refresh rate features is the new Auto Low Latency Mode (ALLM), utilizing what is described as latency mode auto-switching from applications such as movies and videos to low latency applications, e.g. gaming and VR."

Any kind of low-latency mode sounds great.



I don't know if these features of HDMI 2.1 actually work like I imagine them to and if TV manufacturers will implement them properly, but it looks like HDMI just got a bunch of features that could be really neat for both current gaming systems and a potential OSSC 2.0 / Framesupermeister with HDMI 2.1 support. Let me know when the pre-orders are open!

[TestType]

This all sounds great and very exciting, but I'm pretty sure (and I could be wrong here) that the devices connected on both ends need to specifically support these features. So that definitely rules out the Framemeister and I would not expect the OSSC to be able to updated to take advantage of these features in its current iteration. Plus you would likely also need to buy a new TV with HDMI 2.1 support to take advantage of these features.

[bobrocks95]

I'm excited as well, but pretty skeptical about what we'll actually end up getting. It all depends on what manufacturers actually bother to implement, and gaming definitely isn't what sells TVs or we'd see manufacturers putting out low lag sets consistently instead of accidentally.

And if we do get variable refresh rate TVs, I hope they don't get something like the GSync tax just because it's new tech...

So no more blackouts during 240p <> 480i transitions? I guess modern consoles could also do things like switch to 24p mode for a cinematic feel in cutscenes.

Don't hold your breath on 240p/480i transitions. Unless the implementation is super general, 240p is not the focus on a format that now supports 10K. Game devs likely wouldn't bother with the 24p thing since not even all sets now can display in a 24p mode. If there's any chance at all that someone's TV won't display the mode, they're not going to put in the effort to implement it.

Let me know when the pre-orders are open!

The press release pointed out that the certification specs won't be finished until something like Q3 2018, so we won't be seeing any 2.1 devices until 2019. The outlier is the Xbox One X, and it's going to be really unfortunate if it ends up not supporting 2.1 features because it was made before the spec was finalized. Maybe they can fix it with a firmware update?

[ASDR]

This all sounds great and very exciting, but I'm pretty sure (and I could be wrong here) that the devices connected on both ends need to specifically support these features. So that definitely rules out the Framemeister and I would not expect the OSSC to be able to updated to take advantage of these features in its current iteration. Plus you would likely also need to buy a new TV with HDMI 2.1 support to take advantage of these features.

Yes, obviously. This will require brand new TVs and scalers. It also seems like we'll have to wait till 2019 before any TVs will begin shipping with HDMI 2.1. More of a long-term thing.

[Lawfer]

This all sounds great and very exciting, but I'm pretty sure (and I could be wrong here) that the devices connected on both ends need to specifically support these features.

All devices need to be 2.1, you can't hook say a PS4 or a PC that are HDMI 2.0 to a TV that is 2.1 with a 2.1 HDMI cable, you need to upgrade everything to 2.1.

[ASDR]

Don't hold your breath on 240p/480i transitions. Unless the implementation is super general, 240p is not the focus on a format that now supports 10K.

I think this might actually have a good chance of helping. On something like the OSSC 240p is generally at least line doubled to 480p. Now you still get a video mode switch when transitioning between 480i and 240p even though can be processed and are sent over HDMI as 480p. The difference is the refresh rate, which is different between 240p and 480i, even if both are line doubled / deinterlaced to 480p. Now if new TVs would support refresh rate changes without doing the whole cut to black and wait 5 seconds to re-sync dance, that should fix this on a potential HDMI 2.1 scan converter.

[bobrocks95]

Don't hold your breath on 240p/480i transitions. Unless the implementation is super general, 240p is not the focus on a format that now supports 10K.

I think this might actually have a good chance of helping. On something like the OSSC 240p is generally at least line doubled to 480p. Now you still get a video mode switch when transitioning between 480i and 240p even though can be processed and are sent over HDMI as 480p. The difference is the refresh rate, which is different between 240p and 480i, even if both are line doubled / deinterlaced to 480p. Now if new TVs would support refresh rate changes without doing the whole cut to black and wait 5 seconds to re-sync dance, that should fix this on a potential HDMI 2.1 scan converter.

Ah you're right, I wasn't thinking in terms of the OSSC. If we do get VRR TVs there won't be any kind of mode change, they should just accept the new refresh rate as soon as it changes. At least, that's how a Freesync PC monitor would handle it.

[Syntax]

All I see is the same 20 wire cable with new marketing attached...

[bobrocks95]

All I see is the same 20 wire cable with new marketing attached...

Bandwidth increased from 18Gbps to 48Gbps. Cables, TVs, repeater chips, etc. will all need to be updated this time around. It's a pretty significant jump. Wikipedia has more technical details if that interests you- the data encoding scheme is completely changed as well, with the clock signal embedded among other things.

[copy]

- "The new HDMI 2.1 standard also cannonizes variable refresh into an official HDMI standard"

Obviously useful for gaming in general, but I wonder if that means consoles like the SNES with its 60.08Hz would also benefit. Currently many displays are either incompatible or you'll have to live with judder as it is normalized to a standard refresh rate.

I would think future TVs designed to support VRR would also be more overall tolerant of weird refresh rates, even from pre-HDMI 2.1 devices. That's my hope, anyway.

[Syntax]

All I see is the same 20 wire cable with new marketing attached...

Bandwidth increased from 18Gbps to 48Gbps. Cables, TVs, repeater chips, etc. will all need to be updated this time around. It's a pretty significant jump. Wikipedia has more technical details if that interests you- the data encoding scheme is completely changed as well, with the clock signal embedded among other things.

What I'm getting at is it's the same cable. Naming it 2.1 cable is a joke. I think some people think there's this new magic 2.1 cable.

2.1 hardware is what it is. And you'd need 2.1 compatible hardware either end for it to make a difference.

[bobrocks95]

All I see is the same 20 wire cable with new marketing attached...

Bandwidth increased from 18Gbps to 48Gbps. Cables, TVs, repeater chips, etc. will all need to be updated this time around. It's a pretty significant jump. Wikipedia has more technical details if that interests you- the data encoding scheme is completely changed as well, with the clock signal embedded among other things.

What I'm getting at is it's the same cable. Naming it 2.1 cable is a joke. I think some people think there's this new magic 2.1 cable.

2.1 hardware is what it is. And you'd need 2.1 compatible hardware either end for it to make a difference.

I mean... There will be a new 2.1 cable. Most of the longer 18Gbps cables don't even meet the speed requirements, so something will need to happen on that front.

But I think I know what you're getting at? It's a lot harder for the HDMI conglomerate to market transmitter chips, spec sheets, or connectors than it is a cable though.

[Lawfer]

Naming it 2.1 cable is a joke.

It's not a joke, it adds a big amount of improvements when compared to the the other HDMI revisions, and not only that, when 2.1 releases it would have finally caught up to DisplayPort but also surpassed it.

The issue, is that everytime there is a new HDMI revision, you basically need to "upgrade" EVERYTHING to take advantage of it, now THAT'S a joke.

They could offer an "HDMI upgrade" of some sort for people to upgrade their equipment HDMI ports to the latest HDMI revision, but it's much easier (and better) for manufacturers and retailers to not offer anything of the sort and instead make all the enthusiasts replace their setups every few years in an effort to stay up-to-date.

[BuckoA51]

"The new HDMI 2.1 standard also cannonizes variable refresh into an official HDMI standard"

Wonder if NVidia will finally give up on Gsync and support this? I love variable refresh but hate gaming on a tiny monitor.. and paying the Nvidia tax for Gsync of course (yes I know I could go AMD but NVidia seems consistently better in other areas).

[bobrocks95]

"The new HDMI 2.1 standard also cannonizes variable refresh into an official HDMI standard"

Wonder if NVidia will finally give up on Gsync and support this? I love variable refresh but hate gaming on a tiny monitor.. and paying the Nvidia tax for Gsync of course (yes I know I could go AMD but NVidia seems consistently better in other areas).

Vega's pretty competitive unless you have the budget/need for a 1080 or better.

[Syntax]

Bandwidth increased from 18Gbps to 48Gbps. Cables, TVs, repeater chips, etc. will all need to be updated this time around. It's a pretty significant jump. Wikipedia has more technical details if that interests you- the data encoding scheme is completely changed as well, with the clock signal embedded among other things.

Show me a difference then.
Like I've already stated it's the same copper cored 20 wire plug.
What magic do you think they do to increase bandwidth along copper line?? Lol.
The bandwidth increase is on hardware end only.
Of course long cables have signal dropout, that's a no brainer.

[DirkSwizzler]

Like I've already stated it's the same copper cored 20 wire plug.
What magic do you think they do to increase bandwidth along copper line?? Lol.

You can easily quintuple bandwidth by dipping the connectors in snake oil. Monster has been doing it for years.

[bobrocks95]

Bandwidth increased from 18Gbps to 48Gbps. Cables, TVs, repeater chips, etc. will all need to be updated this time around. It's a pretty significant jump. Wikipedia has more technical details if that interests you- the data encoding scheme is completely changed as well, with the clock signal embedded among other things.

Show me a difference then.
Like I've already stated it's the same copper cored 20 wire plug.
What magic do you think they do to increase bandwidth along copper line?? Lol.
The bandwidth increase is on hardware end only.
Of course long cables have signal dropout, that's a no brainer.

Christ what the hell do you want from me? If you're trying to push 4K@144Hz or 8K@60Hz you're probably going to need a fiber optic cable even for short runs. Sorry to burst your bubble.

[citrus3000psi]

Show me a difference then.
Like I've already stated it's the same copper cored 20 wire plug.
What magic do you think they do to increase bandwidth along copper line?? Lol.
The bandwidth increase is on hardware end only.
Of course long cables have signal dropout, that's a no brainer.

I do know that the some users had trouble running audio + 5x OSSC with certain HDMI cables. And they needed newer cables. So cables and shielding do matter to some degree.

[Syntax]

Only if the manufacture is a cheap prick and decides to not include all 20 wires.

If everyone followed the initial HDMI standard cables would not of changed at all but the initial one only required 16 wires, with 4 being saved for future use. Groups of 2 shielded.

It's now the future and those 4 wires are used for things like ARC but they should of always been there anyway.

Blame penny pinching cheap ass manufactures