Nintendo 64 RGB Blur fixing

[tjstogy]

N64 is one of my favorite systems. I got it when it came out for my 10th birthday and some of those games are still my favorites. I don't think anyone anticipated people plugging it into a BVM in RGB and deblurring it, lol. So yes I agree that the n64 looked amazing on crappier tvs, it's really when you try to push the console to its limits when you see what's really under the hood.

[zeruel85]

Sorry for the delay. Here you can see the game requested:

- Majora's Mask
- Paper Mario
- Perfect Dark
- Pokemon Stadium
- Pokemon Stadium 2
- Resident Evil 2
- Star Fox 64

All games are NTSC-U. There are 4 screenshots for every game: Scanlines On/Off and De-Blur On/Off.

Hardware used: N64 NTSC-J with N64RGB v1.1 + borti4938's latest firmware (with IGR). Sync is taken from composite video but filtered in composite sync, using a sync stripper. The N64 output is connected to the OSSC v1.3 (240p X3 mode), and finally goes to an LCD monitor, Asus VX279H.

Link to my Drive folder:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B7ySz ... nFBc084cGc

I hope that these screenshots can help you.

[andykara2003]

That's fantastic, thanks very much for taking the time. On first impressions it looks like much nicer and cleaner than the Gameshark anti-aliasing removal trick.

I think that 3D graphics might be the real test though - but all the pics are of 2D elements. Is it too late to ask to see some 3D in-game graphics - i.e. Banjo, say?

[Ikaruga11]

Amazing! The de-blur really makes a huge difference! The scan lines also help tremendously with anti-aliasing the jagged edges of objects.

So this de-blur feature will only work on Tim's RGB board? This won't work on an officially modded Nintendo 64?

[bobrocks95]

Amazing! The de-blur really makes a huge difference! The scan lines also help tremendously with anti-aliasing the jagged edges of objects.

So this de-blur feature will only work on Tim's RGB board? This won't work on an officially modded Nintendo 64?

What is an officially modded N64? Are you talking about the RGB amp on launch consoles? That is just a signal amplifier, it can't modify the picture in any way.

[Ikaruga11]

Amazing! The de-blur really makes a huge difference! The scan lines also help tremendously with anti-aliasing the jagged edges of objects.

So this de-blur feature will only work on Tim's RGB board? This won't work on an officially modded Nintendo 64?

What is an officially modded N64? Are you talking about the RGB amp on launch consoles? That is just a signal amplifier, it can't modify the picture in any way.

Yes. So Tim's RGB board is better then? Can it output CSync?

[bobrocks95]

What is an officially modded N64? Are you talking about the RGB amp on launch consoles? That is just a signal amplifier, it can't modify the picture in any way.

Yes. So Tim's RGB board is better then? Can it output CSync?

If you think the de-blur makes a big difference, then Tim's board (after you flash it with Borti's firmware) is better. If yours is already RGB-modded I probably wouldn't swap it out given the cost and effort involved- picture quality is nearly identical with Tim's board on stock firmware.

Tim's board can generate and output CSync, yes.

[tjstogy]

Thanks so much. Any chance you can take a before after of some in game 3D content (not 2d main menu) on your crt? Cell phone pics are fine of course!

Sorry for the delay. Here you can see the game requested:

- Majora's Mask
- Paper Mario
- Perfect Dark
- Pokemon Stadium
- Pokemon Stadium 2
- Resident Evil 2
- Star Fox 64

All games are NTSC-U. There are 4 screenshots for every game: Scanlines On/Off and De-Blur On/Off.

Hardware used: N64 NTSC-J with N64RGB v1.1 + borti4938's latest firmware (with IGR). Sync is taken from composite video but filtered in composite sync, using a sync stripper. The N64 output is connected to the OSSC v1.3 (240p X3 mode), and finally goes to an LCD monitor, Asus VX279H.

Link to my Drive folder:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B7ySz ... nFBc084cGc

I hope that these screenshots can help you.

[Ikaruga11]

What is an officially modded N64? Are you talking about the RGB amp on launch consoles? That is just a signal amplifier, it can't modify the picture in any way.

Yes. So Tim's RGB board is better then? Can it output CSync?

Tim's board can generate and output CSync, yes.

How so? Does it just automatically output CSync from the get-go, or is there modding work required? I have a launch day Charcoal Gray Nintendo 64 with a serial number of NS100500585, so it probably uses a very early NUS-CPU-03 or very late NUS-CPU-02 motherboard, both of which have ready-to-go buffered CSync support. Would that make any difference at all, or is Tim's RGB board entirely independent?

So this only works with 240p games? Does the Ultra HDMI have the 15bit Mode?

[bobrocks95]

How so? Does it just automatically output CSync from the get-go, or is there modding work required? I have a launch day Charcoal Gray Nintendo 64 with a serial number of NS100500585, so it probably uses a very early NUS-CPU-03 or very late NUS-CPU-02 motherboard, both of which have ready-to-go buffered CSync support. Would that make any difference at all, or is Tim's RGB board entirely independent?

So this only works with 240p games? Does the Ultra HDMI have the 15bit Mode?

Tim's board recreates everything from the digital video inputs on the board- there is a CSync pad right there next the RGB outputs on his board if you look (CS# and CS75).

If you're debating between Tim's board or a buffer circuit the question is whether the de-blur is worth the additional price of Tim's board and a USB Flasher to put Borti's firmware on it, as well as the extra effort to install it (more pins to solder).

De-blur only works with 240p games, 480i games don't have the blurring applied.
I haven't heard that Ultra-HDMI has a 15-bit mode. I also haven't seen any screenshots of the 15-bit mode in action to see any improvement though.

[Ikaruga11]

Tim's board recreates everything from the digital video inputs on the board- there is a CSync pad right there next the RGB outputs on his board if you look (CS# and CS75).

Oh nice. So just get a CSync RGB SCART cable and I'm good to go?

If you're debating between Tim's board or a buffer circuit the question is whether the de-blur is worth the additional price of Tim's board and a USB Flasher to put Borti's firmware on it,

I think it's worth it. How much is a USB Flasher?

as well as the extra effort to install it (more pins to solder).

You mean Tim's RGB board? I could have RetroFixes install it for me.

De-blur only works with 240p games, 480i games don't have the blurring applied.

Oh, I never knew that! I thought all N64 games had blur applied, but it looked worse on 240p games due to the lower resolution.

I haven't heard that Ultra-HDMI has a 15-bit mode. I also haven't seen any screenshots of the 15-bit mode in action to see any improvement though.

[/quote]
Interesting. Can the Ultra HDMI's firmware be updated? That would be cool if someone could show some comparison shots of 15-bit mode on and off.

[tjstogy]

What games run in 480i?

How so? Does it just automatically output CSync from the get-go, or is there modding work required? I have a launch day Charcoal Gray Nintendo 64 with a serial number of NS100500585, so it probably uses a very early NUS-CPU-03 or very late NUS-CPU-02 motherboard, both of which have ready-to-go buffered CSync support. Would that make any difference at all, or is Tim's RGB board entirely independent?

So this only works with 240p games? Does the Ultra HDMI have the 15bit Mode?

Tim's board recreates everything from the digital video inputs on the board- there is a CSync pad right there next the RGB outputs on his board if you look (CS# and CS75).

If you're debating between Tim's board or a buffer circuit the question is whether the de-blur is worth the additional price of Tim's board and a USB Flasher to put Borti's firmware on it, as well as the extra effort to install it (more pins to solder).

De-blur only works with 240p games, 480i games don't have the blurring applied.
I haven't heard that Ultra-HDMI has a 15-bit mode. I also haven't seen any screenshots of the 15-bit mode in action to see any improvement though.

[Guspaz]

USB blasters are around $4 shipped on eBay.

[Ikaruga11]

What games run in 480i?

Pokémon Stadium 2 (240p normally, 480i with Expansion Pak)
Perfect Dark (240p normally, 480i with Expansion Pak)
FIFA 99 (240p normally, 480i with Expansion Pak)
Rayman 2: The Great Escape (240p normally, 480i with Expansion Pak)
Star Wars: Episode I: Battle for Naboo (240p normally, 480i with Expansion Pak)
Star Wars: Episode 1 Racer (240p normally, 480i with Expansion Pak)
Star Wars: Rogue Squadron (240p normally, 480i with Expansion Pak)

[andykara2003]

Donkey kong 64 and Majora's mask both require the expansion pack but still only run in 240p.

[bobrocks95]

Oh nice. So just get a CSync RGB SCART cable and I'm good to go?

Yup. You can wire it up the same way a SNES cable is expecting, just look up the pinout, or if you have an early N64 it's probably already silk screened on the board by the connector.

Interesting. Can the Ultra HDMI's firmware be updated? That would be cool if someone could show some comparison shots of 15-bit mode on and off.

People seem to be updating them somehow, I'd assume it has JTAG headers.

[cfx]

.

[Guspaz]

I'm not a fan of the early 3D era, because we went from great looking 2D games to terrible looking 3D games (and Mario 64 is a terrible game), but that era did produce some great 2D and 2.5D games too. SotN, for example.

[Ikaruga11]

terrible looking 3D games

Yeah, the PS1 does look pretty bad.

(and Mario 64 is a terrible game)

No it's not.

[RGB32E]

(and Mario 64 is a terrible game)

No it's not.

Explicitly disliking Super Mario 64 is generally an example fan entitlement syndrome. Nintendo decided to do something new that as a result jump started a new genre!

[cfx]

.

[Ikaruga11]

Yeah, a crappy genre that all but supplanted a non-crappy one for many years.

3D Platformers are inherently better than 2D Platformers thanks to more movement mechanics, non-linear designs that allows you to play whatever worlds or levels you want in any order, and much more exploration.

"Entitlement" coming from you is really rich.

Nice ad hominem fallacy.

Of course, and none of those games are on the N64.

Paper Mario, Mischief Makers, Yoshi's Story, etc.

And yes, Mario 64 is a crappy game

Care to actually back that up with sound arguments that explain the design flaws rather than just spouting the same nonsense?

threw away everything that made the previous ones good

Not at all. Super Mario 64 is still a platformer, but in 3D instead of 2D. Which allows for far more movement options and advanced level designs.

inspired everyone else to try to copy it

Nothing wrong with that.

leading to a boatload of crappy 3D platform games

If you think Banjo-Kazooie, Banjo-Tooie, Conker's Bad Fur Day, etc. are crappy, then you are delusional. Super Mario Galaxy is widely regarded as one of the best video games ever made by fans and critics, and is a 3D Platformer.

I'll stop now.

Good. You should.

[tjstogy]

Not sure why the hostility about some frickin video games, everyone...

[cfx]

.

[Skips]

what the fuck does any of this have to do with the N64 blur crap

[thebigcheese]

What games run in 480i?

Pokémon Stadium 2 (240p normally, 480i with Expansion Pak)
Perfect Dark (240p normally, 480i with Expansion Pak)
FIFA 99 (240p normally, 480i with Expansion Pak)
Rayman 2: The Great Escape (240p normally, 480i with Expansion Pak)
Star Wars: Episode I: Battle for Naboo (240p normally, 480i with Expansion Pak)
Star Wars: Episode 1 Racer (240p normally, 480i with Expansion Pak)
Star Wars: Rogue Squadron (240p normally, 480i with Expansion Pak)

Though at least on Episode 1 Racer you can simply choose not to use the expansion pak, so it will continue to run at 240p. That game is also 10x better on the Dreamcast anyway, though. Probably not even going to touch my N64 version again. Just ordered my USB blaster, gonna try this out soon. Is there a pinout for which wires need to get wired up? I am looking to use it with my NESRGB as well to flash the updated color palettes. I have done so much soldering that I don't particularly care one way or another if I have to solder to the boards, just need to know where things go. Would be nice to wire the pads up to an external port so I can upgrade without pulling everything apart... Now that I think about it, I could probably wire them into whatever sort of port the Altera thing is supposed to plug into in the first place, right? Just cut a hole in the console for it. Hmmmmmmmm...

[tacoguy64]

Sorry for the delay. Here you can see the game requested:

- Majora's Mask
- Paper Mario
- Perfect Dark
- Pokemon Stadium
- Pokemon Stadium 2
- Resident Evil 2
- Star Fox 64

All games are NTSC-U. There are 4 screenshots for every game: Scanlines On/Off and De-Blur On/Off.

Hardware used: N64 NTSC-J with N64RGB v1.1 + borti4938's latest firmware (with IGR). Sync is taken from composite video but filtered in composite sync, using a sync stripper. The N64 output is connected to the OSSC v1.3 (240p X3 mode), and finally goes to an LCD monitor, Asus VX279H.

Link to my Drive folder:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B7ySz ... nFBc084cGc

I hope that these screenshots can help you.

Thanks man!

So we can do this with any of Tims boards and borti4938's firmware?
If that's the case then I wan't to get my system modded now :p
Don't get me wrong, s-video is nice but rgb is nicer

[Josh128]

Would also like to add that Turok 2 and 3 run in 480i w/ expansion pak-- as does Indiana Jones, another Factor 5 game.

I believe Boss Studios' World Driver Championship also has a letterboxed 480i mode as well. The letterboxing helps the framerate actually stay decent.

[andykara2003]

Borti, just to say thanks for this - your hard work is very much appreciated.

[bobrocks95]

Thanks man!

So we can do this with any of Tims boards and borti4938's firmware?
If that's the case then I wan't to get my system modded now :p
Don't get me wrong, s-video is nice but rgb is nicer

Yeah, any of Tim's boards will work, though the most recent revision offers nice pads instead of having to solder extra wires straight to the CPLD.

I should also note that there was a RetroRGB interview with Tim posted today on Youtube where he mentions that he has a new logic analyzer and will be working on an auto-detection algorithm soon (think he said probably in a couple weeks).

If a couple extra wires and putting in a button combination doesn't bother you then it's not a big deal, and either way if you bought a board now you'd need something to flash it with, whether you go with Borti's firmware or a new one Tim may put out.