Shmup Related Questions That Don't Deserve a Thread

[atheistgod1999]

Actually, let me expand that to "originally released for". Just ordered Biometal on eBay, though. Thanks, trap15.

[BIL]

There's a fair bit of good-to-great localised stuff for Genesis, and the SNES to a lesser extent. No idea how much any of this stuff goes for, I should say.

Elemental Master (Genesis) is absolutely superb, and particularly well-balanced for less experienced players. Groundbased vert that derives a blistering pace from its bidirectional firing and aggressive terrain. It's manic as all hell, yet forgiving enough that beginners shouldn't have trouble learning to play by ear. Was replaying it a couple weekends ago - even knowing the highest difficulty level inside-out it's a rush every time. Toshiharu Yamanishi soundtrack a masterpiece of YM2616 beard metal.

Don't ignore ports btw, there's some great stuff particularly on Genesis. Fire Shark is an easy recommendation. Archetypal "fast aimed shots + sniper tanks" vert, deftly ported by Toaplan themselves. Hard difficulty will put a fire under your ass, Normal's quite approachable. Hellfire is a balls-hard hori, another excellent Toaplan conversion worth a look if you're feeling adventurous after clearing Gradius. As an easier alternative, I'd say Bio Hazard Battle is worth a mention. Vaguely Irem-esque with its charge shot and Bit mechanics. Has a nice difficulty curve, not punishing but quite substantial.

Thunder Force III and TFIV localisation "Lightening Force" (note the typo when searching) are staples with Tecno Soft's usual satisfying level and weapon designs... don't fall into the common newbie trap of assuming either to be pushovers, though (TFIII tends to get more of this). By their memoriser nature both will knock a new player around a little. They rapidly conform to a bit of experience, though. Great foot-to-the-floor blasters once you start learning the ropes.

Bio Metal is excellent, definitely. The SNES soundtrack is cheesy but it's worth tolerating for tactically violent action that remains pretty unique to this day. Plays almost like a horizontal Mars Matrix. Also, the SFC one's a bit pricey to pick up on impulse. I'd say give Space Megaforce (SNES ver of Super Aleste) a look too. It has the usual Compile traits of long, spacey runtime and generally low intensity, but the upper two difficulties' suicide bullets make things a lot more interesting.

[Blinge]

How many stages are there in the original Xevious? my mind is saying 16 but I don't know where that's from.
Also is there a clear indication that you've beaten one loop? I probably wouldn't notice if I just flew over some woods and repeated an area..

[TransatlanticFoe]

Twin Cobra on Genesis will put hairs on your chest. Get it.

SMS wise, you're limited with North America only because a lot of PAL stuff either flat out doesn't work or will run fast. And there's a lot more PAL titles. Power Strike isn't strictly an exclusive but it's a bit different to the MSX version and is well worth getting. Aerial Assault isn't fantastic but is decent as long as you play it on hard (a good 75% is really boring on normal). It's an early title that I don't know if it got a North American release, but Scramble Spirits is a nice (and unchallenging) conversion of an obscure arcade title. I wouldn't bother with Bomber Raid, it's pretty garish and dull.

[Stevens]

I'll add Action Fighter, Astro Warrior, and while not an exclusive there is a damn good version of Choplifter on the SMS.

[Perikles]

How many stages are there in the original Xevious? my mind is saying 16 but I don't know where that's from.
Also is there a clear indication that you've beaten one loop? I probably wouldn't notice if I just flew over some woods and repeated an area..

16 stages it has, indeed. And there is unfortunately no congratulatory message or an equivalent thereof. You start at the seventh stage of each subsequent loop, so you're probably best off to memorize that particular stage if you can't be bothered to keep track of the forests you flew over.

[pegboy]

NES/Famicom:
Over Horizon
Crisis Force
Gun-Nac
Zanac (I think there is an MSX version too, never played it though)
The Guardian Legend (enter code to only play shmup levels)
Recca Summer Carnival (best shmup on the NES/Famicom)

Sega Master:
Power Strike 1 & II

Genesis:
Thunderforce II,III,IV
MUSHA
Robo Aleste/Denin Aleste (Sega CD)

SNES:
Space Megaforce/Super Aleste
BioMetal
Axelay
R-Type III

[OmegaFlareX]

Playing Twin Cobra AC (World version in MAME), if you finish a stage without any stars, your heli doesn't land and the music doesn't change to the next stage. Is this normal? Twice now I've been killed by the stage 4 boss so I didn't get to hear the great st 5 BGM.

e: Hm, apparently it's not a zero-stars thing. It only happens if you die on a boss. Weird.
e2: Died to the stage 4 boss again, on the first bullet wave (derp), but I went on to beat them and landed. 1 bomb left. I have no idea.

[Perikles]

Playing Twin Cobra AC (World version in MAME), if you finish a stage without any stars, your heli doesn't land and the music doesn't change to the next stage. Is this normal? Twice now I've been killed by the stage 4 boss so I didn't get to hear the great st 5 BGM.

Don't know whether it's "normal" or not, but I had it happen as well when I played the game.


As for the recommendations:

My list of good (not necessarily great or outstanding; generally games I would recommend without hesitation to anyone who is into the genre and likes this particular era) shmups for the SNES and MD/Genesis would look like this (I do include interesting/faithful/superior ports as well as NTSC-J exclusives ), bolded are the titles I personally love:

MD/Genesis:
Aero Blasters/Air Buster
Battle Mania
Battle Mania Daiginjou
Crying/Bio-Hazard Battle
Darius II/Sagaia
Elemental Master
Eliminate Down
Gaiares
Gleylancer
Granada
Gynoug/Wings of Wor
Hellfire
Kyuukyoku Tiger/Twin Cobra
Musha
Phelios
Raiden Densetsu/Raiden Trad
Same! Same! Same!/Fire Shark
Senjou no Ookami II/Mercs
Slap Fight
Sol-Deace
Super Fantasy Zone
Task Force Harrier EX
Thunder Force III
Thunder Force IV/Lightening Force
Twinkle Tale
Vapor Trail
Whip Rush
Undeadline

Forgotten Worlds, Tatsujin/Truxton, Viewpoint and V-V/Grind Stormer are also decent to good, but there's no objective reason to play them. There are either better ports available (Forgotten Worlds/Tatsujin) or the conversion itself is a bit too compromised (Viewpoint/V-V).

SFC/SNES:
Area 88/U.N. Squadron
Axelay
BioMetal (get the SFC version!)
Choujikuu Yousai Macross: Scrambled Valkyrie
Darius Force/Super Nova
Flying Hero: Bugyuru no Daibouken
Gokujou Parodius
Gradius III
Jikkyo Oshaberi Parodius
Kidou Soukou Dion/Imperium (try to play the SFC version if possible, the US version underwent some bizarre changes)
Kiki Kaikai: Nazo no Kuro Manto/Pocky & Rocky
Kiki Kaikai: Tsukiyo Kayako/Pocky & Rocky 2
Märchen Adventure Cotton 100%
Parodius Da!
Pop'n TwinBee
Rendering Ranger R²
R-Type III
Sonic Wings/Aero Fighters
Super Aleste/Space Megaforce
Super E.D.F.: Earth Defense Force (US version is slightly harder)
Uchuu no Kishi: Tekkaman Blade (the best terrible game on the system)

I almost want to mention Acrobat Mission, too, despite the overall shoddy effort they've put into the port it still is pretty close to the original arcade game. It plays differently since one of the two weapons is bugged, the overall idea is still the same, though.

Edit: almost forgot Macross! For shame, for shame!

[Blinge]

You start at the seventh stage of each subsequent loop, so you're probably best off to memorize that particular stage if you can't be bothered to keep track of the forests you flew over.

Oh, so forest = new stage? That i can do. haha.
And Dying restarts the stage correct? so no need to count that patch o trees?

[Perikles]

Oh, so forest = new stage?

Precisely. Whenever you see a contiguous blob of green colour you've beaten another stage.

And Dying restarts the stage correct? so no need to count that patch o trees?

Actually, if you die toward the end of a stage, the game pushes you forward! You can actually beat a stage by dying in a manner of speaking. Other times you just get send back to an earlier checkpoint, but when you restart at a spot you haven't seen before you're in a new stage.

[EXEXEX]

I heard that the PSX and PSP port of Parodius Da! is drastically toned down the difficulty?

[Shepardus]

And the Saturn port, yes. I hear that the rank is significantly less brutal, and while I can't confirm that it certainly feels that way from the few times I've played the PSP port. Auto powerup mode is made friendlier too since it doesn't give you a second speed powerup in stage 4 (which, at least in the arcade version, causes rank to increase much faster). In addition, various point values are heavily inflated in the PSP/PSX/Saturn ports. For example, the 10k bell gives 25600 points (even though it still displays the number 10000 when you pick it up), the stage 1 boss is also worth 25600 points instead of 10000, and the final boss is worth "about 400,000 points" instead of 100k.

Edit: Just gave the PSP version another try, the rank really is a lot tamer even on "original" settings. It's worth noting, however, that the PSP version has little, if any, slowdown while the arcade version has a ton. Dunno about the PSX and Saturn versions but I imagine it's the same there.

[Perikles]

What Shepardus said. Not only are enemies generally much less aggressive, it also seems like speed-ups don't influence rank at all (or only marginally so), suicide bullets are no concern until very late in the game, and even then it's fairly mild. It's not as drastic a difference as, say, between the SFC Gradius III and the original arcade game, but there's a huge gap nonetheless.

[Synnae]

We know that the PC-Engine has a vast library of shmups, but I'd like to filter the arcade ports out (unless if they ended up better than the arcade orginals)

What are all PCE shmups that originated on PCE itself (i.e: not ports)?

[Perikles]

As far as I know (games with an asterisk originated on a home computer first, but not in the arcades):

HuCards:
Barunba
Bouken Danshaku Don: The Lost Sun-Heart
Burning Angels
Coryoon
Cyber Core*
Dead Moon
Deep Blue
Download
Final Blaster
Final Soldier
Gokuraku Chuka Taisen
Gunhed
Hana Tahka Daka!?
Hani in the Sky
Magical Chase
Override*
Paranoia
PC Denjin - Punkic Cyborgs
Power Gate
Psycho Chaser
Rock-On
Soldier Blade
Super Star Soldier
Terra Cresta II
Toilet Kids
Toy Shop Boys
Violent Soldier
W-Ring - The Double Rings

CD:
Ai Cho Aniki
Avenger
CD Denjin - Rockabilly Tengoku
Cho Aniki
Choujikuu Yousai Macross 2036
Download 2
Gate of Thunder
Ginga Fukei Densetsu Sapphire
God Panic
Hawk F-123
Image Fight II
Kiaidan 00
L-Dis
Legion
Metamor Jupiter
Nexzr
Psychic Storm
Rayxanber II
Rayxanber III
Seirei Senshi Spriggan
Spriggan Mark 2 - Re-Terraform Project
Star Parodier
Steam-Heart's
Summer Carnival '92 - Alzadick
Sylphia
Terra Forming
Winds of Thunder


I personally think that many of the PCE's finest are arcade ports, though, it'd be a horrible waste to skip them.

[Synnae]

Thank you, Perikles. I saved this on a notepad and it will certainly help a lot!

I personally think that many of the PCE's finest are arcade ports, though, it'd be a horrible waste to skip them.

If it's not too much of a bother, could you also list the ones that originated on arcade then?

That's what I originally wanted to ask, actually (filtering out PCE originals from arcade ports). But I thought it'd be a little much.

[Perikles]

Sure, here are the arcade conversions I know of:

HuCard:
1943 Kai
Aero Blasters
Atomic Robo-Kid Special
Daisenpuu
Darius Alpha
Darius Plus
Detana!! TwinBee
Dragon Saber
Dragon Spirit
Fantasy Zone
Formation Armed F
Galaga '88
Gradius
Heavy Unit
Image Fight
Kiki Kaikai
Kyuukyoku Tiger
Mr. Heli no Daibouken
Ordyne
P-47: The Freedom Fighter
Parodius Da!
Rabio Lepus Special
Raiden
R-Type
Saint Dragon
Salamander
Side Arms
Tatsujin
Xevious

CD:
Cotton - Fantastic Night Dreams
Daisenpuu Custom
Forgotten Worlds
Gradius II
Hellfire S
R-Type Complete CD
Side Arms Special
Super Darius
Super Darius II
Super Raiden
Zero Wing


If SuperGrafx-only is viable, there is also Aldynes (console-exclusive) and 1941: Counter Attack (arcade port). Darius Alpha and Darius Plus will also run on a regular PCE on the other hand.

[Synnae]

Thanks for the help again. This is very helpful. ^^

[M.Knight]

Does anyone have a list of horizontal shmups with humanoid mechas as playable characters? I can only think of Bari-Arm, Spriggan mk2 and Astebreed but am sure there are more.
I noticed that classic hori's such as Darius/Gradius/R-Type have player ship designs that seem tailored for the horizontal scrolling, with their elongated shapes and small vertical size. However, humanoid mechas have more vertical shapes so I was curious to see how games that still went this route managed to accomodate for that.

[Shepardus]

BlaZeon and Side Arms are two.

[Perikles]

Arrow Flash, Atomic Robo-Kid, CD Denjin, Choujikuu Yousai Macross (both the SFC and the PCE CD game, but I believe at least one of the arcade titles is also horizontal), Heavy Unit, MD Insector X, Kiaidan 00, Mr. Heli no Daibouken (sort of, I guess), PC Denjin, Rabio Lepus (dito), Supercharged Robot Vulkaiser and Uchuu no Kishi: Tekkaman Blade come to mind. There are furthermore quite a few more games where you play as an actual human or a humanoid mythological creature in a similar shape (Abadox, Baraduke, Battle Mania and Battle Mania Daiginjou, all those (Ai) Cho Anikis, Forgotten Worlds, Gynoug, Hana Tahka Daka!?, arcade Insector X, Section Z).

[BIL]

For more transforming mecha games, there's also Tecno Soft's Hyper Duel, and the obscure but worthwhile and seriously metal caravan doujin The Under Stellar 2. Stretching to minigames, Force Gear (hidden on the PCE-CD Tokimeki Memorial) is a very cool little mecha STG.

Always liked how HD seems to reference stuff like Side Arms, in your mech form being impervious to terrain but the jetfighter exploding on contact as per genre tradition. IIRC at least the SFC Macross does this too? Been a bit too long to recall offhand.

[BulletMagnet]

I'll toss Geppy-X for the PS1 onto the list.

[WelshMegalodon]

Don't forget Taxan's Burai Fighter and Natsume's Final Mission, though multidirectional aiming makes these closer to run 'n guns.

And of course, Gate of Thunder.

[M.Knight]

That's a lot of references! I'll go check them out.
Thanks a lot everyone.

[maximo310]

How good is the Namco System 2 driver on the newer versions of MAME? I've been playing Metal Hawk for the last few days, but the game constantly crashes for every run that I do, and I can't seem to get a workaround w/ different compatibility setups.

[WelshMegalodon]

Everything looks to be in good shape aside from driving games. It looks like there was a crashing issue with Metal Hawk that was fixed in 0.129.

[Shepardus]

Is there a way to set slider controls, specifically CPU overclocking, in the command-line arguments passed to MAME or in the game config file? It turns out that overclocking the audio CPU makes the music in Parodius Da play at the correct speed, rather than the slightly too slow speed at which it normally plays in MAME. Adjusting the slider every time I start up the game is inconvenient, though, so if there's something I can put in my batch script that I have to launch Parodius Da that would be much appreciated.

[drunkninja24]

To kinda piggyback on some of the PCE discussion above, I'm thinking of finally getting my feet wet in some PCE business, but am not looking to spend huge amounts of money. Was thinking of just picking up a base Core Grafx/II and an Everdrive, are the non-CD games generally worth it? Seems like I see a lot of discussion centered around the CD games