gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thread

[Guspaz]

Edit: Moved to http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=57420

[Guspaz]

EDIT: Moved to http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=57420

[superg]

The SCART-to-BNC breakout cable that I bought from WookieWin ended up bouncing back and forth between Montreal and Miami for a while (two round trips), but it made it here today.

I ended up not using the power brick that I bought from Amazon: it has an extremely short lead, so it was easier to just get a euro-to-canada plug adapter.

Now that I've got the Bandridge auto-switcher all hooked up, my initial impressions are good, with one quibble. I've got a SNES (csync) and PSX (luma sync) plugged into AV2 and AV3, with the audio output of an NES connected to the RCA jacks for AV1 (still waiting for NESRGB in the mail).

For the SNES and PSX via SCART, it's working flawlessly. I turn the SNES on, it instantly switches to AV2. Turn the PSX on, it instantly switches to AV3. Turn the PSX off, it instantly switches back to AV2. I can't see any degradation in image quality compared to the direct connection: I've not done a side-by-side (or otherwise immediate switch) comparison, but both consoles look the same to me.

The quibble: it doesn't auto-switch on audio, so using the switch to handle the NES audio (since the switch audio output is input into my sound network) has to be manually switched to AV1 for the NES. That by itself is incredibly minor, but the switch shuts off automatically if there is no video input for 10 minutes. So even if I manually switch to AV1 for NES audio, it will shut off after 10 minutes since nothing is connected to the video input.

When I install the NESRGB, that won't be an issue, but... I've also got an s-video GameCube that I'd replace it with, so the issue will stand until I can get every console on RGB SCART.

Current ideas: set my raspberry pi to composite video mode and just leave it plugged into AV1 video, or maybe I could rig up something that directly feeds power into the composite video jack to trick the auto-detect circuit?

I'm not sure how I'd do the latter, since my knowledge of electronics is limited. I assume I'd need a resistor on the positive lead to limit current, but I don't know what voltage composite video uses. The RPi is probably safer/easier.

Could you please create your own topic for this?

[Guspaz]

Sorry, the discussion started on the topic and then I just sort of continued it. You're right, it doesn't belong here: I've moved all my posts on the subject to a new thread and removed the old posts.

[ZellSF]

Preorders seem to be up again.

Finally ordered one. Only thing I'm slightly worried about is how I'll get it to play nice with my PS2. It apparently switches sync methods from composite video to sync on green when going from 480i to 480p.

[FBX]

Preorders seem to be up again.

Finally ordered one. Only thing I'm slightly worried about is how I'll get it to play nice with my PS2. It apparently switches sync methods from composite video to sync on green when going from 480i to 480p.

Try a cync-on-luma cable perhaps? It's what I have and it works great with my Framemeister in any mode.

[Fudoh]

Try a cync-on-luma cable perhaps? It's what I have and it works great with my Framemeister in any mode.

no, you can't output 480p in RGB from a PS2 to the FM using a Scart cable. You would have to convert from RGsB to RGBs first.

[superg]

Preorders seem to be up again.

Finally ordered one. Only thing I'm slightly worried about is how I'll get it to play nice with my PS2. It apparently switches sync methods from composite video to sync on green when going from 480i to 480p.

RetroRGB has tried PS2 in VGA mode and it passes through the switch, composite sync was used. Or am I missing something?
Another way of doing it is to split Green line to both Green and Sync SCART input to be detected by the switch, but yes, it requires cable modification.

[Fudoh]

RetroRGB has tried PS2 in VGA mode and it passes through the switch, composite sync was used. Or am I missing something?

just that the PS2 doesn't output composite sync in 31khz mode. He probably used a sync converter between the PS2 and the switch.

Another way of doing it is to split Green line to both Green and Sync SCART input to be detected by the switch, but yes, it requires cable modification.

the problem is that the PS2 always boots in 15khz RGBs mode and only switches to 31khz RGsB afterwards. If you mod the cable and route green to sync you lose 15khz compatibility.

[superg]

RetroRGB has tried PS2 in VGA mode and it passes through the switch, composite sync was used. Or am I missing something?

just that the PS2 doesn't output composite sync in 31khz mode. He probably used a sync converter between the PS2 and the switch.

Another way of doing it is to split Green line to both Green and Sync SCART input to be detected by the switch, but yes, it requires cable modification.

the problem is that the PS2 always boots in 15khz RGBs mode and only switches to 31khz RGsB afterwards. If you mod the cable and route green to sync you lose 15khz compatibility.

So in 15kHz mode the sync is provided only to Composite and in 31kHz it's mixed on Green? Is it the only difference?

Have to experiment with this myself, as always I'm snowed down with orders.

[Fudoh]

So in 15kHz mode the sync is provided only to Composite and in 31kHz it's mixed on Green? Is it the only difference?

yes, that's right. Using a sync converter before wouldn't be a problem if the PS2 would at least output clean sync, but for 15khz it's just composite video (or luma) and both don't play well with the usual sync converter boxes. So to get a universal setup you need a chain like this: PS2 > Sync Stripper > Sync converter > GScartSw

[FBX]

Try a cync-on-luma cable perhaps? It's what I have and it works great with my Framemeister in any mode.

no, you can't output 480p in RGB from a PS2 to the FM using a Scart cable. You would have to convert from RGsB to RGBs first.

News to me. I'll have to try it out with my copy of SSX 3. It has the option of 480p mode, and I must have forgotten to try it via the RGB option.

[RGB0b]

I'm actually adding a page on my site about this exact issue as we speak. There's two things being discussed here. First, my setup:

PS2 via sync-on-luma cable -> SCART to VGA with sync stripper built in (sync strike, homemade cable, etc) -> Extron Rxi -> Display

The Extron Rxi handles the change from RGBs to RGsB when the signal switches to 480p; The output of the Rxi stays RGBs, as long as you're using the BNC outputs. From there, I can feed any display that accepts 480p over RGBs, such as my BVM, the Framemesiter, my capture card, etc...all that's needed is the proper cable (BNC-to-BNC for the BVM, BNC-to-VGA for the capture card, BNC-to-SCART for the framemeister).

Next, if you use a gscartsw as the sync stripper, it still works:

PS2 via sync-on-luma cable -> gscarsw -> Extron Rxi -> Display

Basically, when you turn the PS2 on, it boots in 480i. This causes the gscartsw to switch to the proper input. Then once the PS2 switches to 480p SoG, it still works, since the gscartsw is already on the correct input. There are two issues that might interfere with this:

- If another console is powered on, it'll probably switch to that input once RGsB is enabled. That being said, I never recommend you have multiple consoles powered on at the same time.

- Phonedork told me this method only works when using input port #8 of his gscartsw. I had to lend my switch to a friend, so I haven't had time to test this myself...but I thought I remembered testing with one of the middle inputs?

I'll have the page up in a few days and will report anything else I find.

[Fudoh]

Basically, when you turn the PS2 on, it boots in 480i. This causes the gscartsw to switch to the proper input. Then once the PS2 switches to 480p SoG, it still works, since the gscartsw is already on the correct input.

makes sense - thanks!

But what I'm surprised about is that your Extron works with the PS2's sync on luma signal. It shouldn't since it doesn't work with composite as sync. You're using a standard input adapter with sync routed to the H-sync input, right ? Do you happen to have a standard RGB cable (with composite video as sync) on hand to give it a try with this one ?

Do you run your Rxi with DDSP enabled or disabled ? Maybe composite and luma for sync work with DDSP enabled, but doesn't once the systems ADSP system kicks in.... Is your Extron set to keep the sync polarity of the input signal or did you change any of the internal jumpers ?

[RGB0b]

Ugh... sorry about that, I made a mistake in my post: There's always a sync stripper in the chain. This is both for the sync stripping and SCART-to-VGA conversion.

Thanks for catching that. Post edited.

[FBX]

BTW SSX 3 has a snowboard in it that I designed myself. So I always use it for 480p tests because well, ego type thing

[austin532]

BTW SSX 3 has a snowboard in it that I designed myself. So I always use it for 480p tests because well, ego type thing

[ZellSF]

Probably a futile question, but is there any way to query the gscartsw to get the currently selected source?

[superg]

Probably a futile question, but is there any way to query the gscartsw to get the currently selected source?

Yes, there is EXT header which allows it. (you still have to solder the header)

[ZellSF]

Probably a futile question, but is there any way to query the gscartsw to get the currently selected source?

Yes, there is EXT header which allows it. (you still have to solder the header)

Sorry, but I really don't know anything about this. Solder the header to what? I can't find anything on Google on standard uses of ext headers.

Any chance you can explain this to me like I'm 5?

[superg]

Probably a futile question, but is there any way to query the gscartsw to get the currently selected source?

Yes, there is EXT header which allows it. (you still have to solder the header)

Sorry, but I really don't know anything about this. Solder the header to what? I can't find anything on Google on standard uses of ext headers.

Any chance you can explain this to me like I'm 5?

Do you own the switch?
There is a header I've routed for exactly that purpose. There are 2x4 pins. If you can DIY I can give you the pinout of that header.
If you still don't understand what I'm talking about you won't be able to do it yourself.

[ZellSF]

Yes, there is EXT header which allows it. (you still have to solder the header)

Sorry, but I really don't know anything about this. Solder the header to what? I can't find anything on Google on standard uses of ext headers.

Any chance you can explain this to me like I'm 5?

Do you own the switch?
There is a header I've routed for exactly that purpose. There are 2x4 pins. If you can DIY I can give you the pinout of that header.
If you still don't understand what I'm talking about you won't be able to do it yourself.

I have it ordered (just trying to plan how to integrate it best into my setup).

So you're saying that getting it to communicate to a computer which port it is on is too difficult to explain?

[superg]

I have it ordered (just trying to plan how to integrate it best into my setup).

So you're saying that getting it to communicate to a computer which port it is on is too difficult to explain?

I'll give you the pinout and you design your circuit. It's not difficult but obviously you should have skills.

[ZellSF]

I have it ordered (just trying to plan how to integrate it best into my setup).

So you're saying that getting it to communicate to a computer which port it is on is too difficult to explain?

I'll give you the pinout and you design your circuit. It's not difficult but obviously you should have skills.

Probably beyond my abilities then... but shouldn't the pinout be available somewhere anywhere? Or maybe it is in the manual?

While I'm asking questions, how is the pinout on VGA for a VGA to SCART cable? Are those cables somewhat standard? (Google says it's somewhat common to have sync on the vga hsync pin for some purposes).

[superg]

Probably beyond my abilities then... but shouldn't the pinout be available somewhere anywhere? Or maybe it is in the manual?

While I'm asking questions, how is the pinout on VGA for a VGA to SCART cable? Are those cables somewhat standard? (Google says it's somewhat common to have sync on the vga hsync pin for some purposes).

I've added EXT header just in case somebody wants to design some display device to show enabled input in some way. You're the first one who asked. The header provides the power, enabled input binary encoded (3 pins) and obviously ground. There is an ON/OFF switch which changes VGA sync function, I think I've explained it on the purchase page.

[Fudoh]

New preoders for EU and JP21 versions of the switch are open.

We only get another JP21 run if at least 30 units are ordered. In other words: if you're interested in getting a JP21 version of the switch, order it sometime over the next few weeks.

http://assemblergames.com/l/threads/gsc ... 13/page-87
http://www.gretrostuff.com/store/pre-or ... 1-edition/

[cloudbot]

I've ordered the JP21 version and hope to see others push it past the mark!

[superg]

Bump, I will post a status update here shortly.

[Shoryukev]

Bump, I will post a status update here shortly.

I sure hope it is an announcement of the new lite model. I have been excited to hear about that

[orange808]

After the shenanigans at the other forum, are you moving the discussion here?