shooting games & little girls: the redux

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Zen
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shooting games & little girls: the redux

Post by Zen »

Serraxor wrote:
NickPalmerDegica wrote:if you have social media, if you could perhaps share some about it, help us get the word out. We really want to bring over more of the smaller doujin titles.
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Shouldn't be too much longer! We're right in the middle of final VO and editing.
What in the actual fuck is this image? A female child with a teddy bear? And this has what to do with this a shooting game now? (Goes to Steam page. Yup, Steam page has a female child with a teddy bear)
Since the shmups player demographic is, in the main, male, late teens and up, care to explain the marketing behind this, NickPalmerDegica?
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by Nameschonvergeben »

to satisfy the demographic on this forum you should consider making a shmup where you shoot your dentures
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by AxelMill »

Zen wrote:What in the actual fuck is this image? A female child with a teddy bear? And this has what to do with this a shooting game now? (Goes to Steam page. Yup, Steam page has a female child with a teddy bear)
Since the shmups player demographic is, in the main, male, late teens and up, care to explain the marketing behind this, NickPalmerDegica?
Surprise, 90% (purely made up number) of modern shmups are about "female children". Welcome to [current year].
Now, yes, maybe Pedobear was a bit too much.
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by CStarFlare »

The girl's not surprising. Moe still sells to otakus.

I'm more amused by the description on Steam which calls the game "empowering."
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Zen
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by Zen »

Nameschonvergeben wrote:to satisfy the demographic on this forum you should consider making a shmup where you shoot your dentures
Childlike avatar? - check
Likes Touhou ? - check
Overly defensive? - check
Sad attempt at shaming? - check
Avoids answering the question posed? - check

Why so defensive,Nameschonvergeben? My question is a legitimate one and was directed to (see my post) NickPalmerDegica.
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by Zen »

AxelMill wrote:
Zen wrote:What in the actual fuck is this image? A female child with a teddy bear? And this has what to do with this a shooting game now? (Goes to Steam page. Yup, Steam page has a female child with a teddy bear)
Since the shmups player demographic is, in the main, male, late teens and up, care to explain the marketing behind this, NickPalmerDegica?
Surprise, 90% (purely made up number) of modern shmups are about "female children". Welcome to [current year].
Now, yes, maybe Pedobear was a bit too much.
Why, are "90% (purely made up number) of modern shmups are about "female children"?
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by Zen »

CStarFlare wrote:The girl's not surprising. Moe still sells to otakus.

I'm more amused by the description on Steam which calls the game "empowering."
"empowering."
Yes, I saw that. It must be ok to have a female child with a bear as marketing then! Cause "empowerment"!
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by qmish »

Why can't they be teens instead, at least? Though they dont know how to draw them, they always draw either flat lolis or "superwomen with huge breasts".

edit: forget it. and akb48 would be grown up enough :lol: :lol: :lol:
I'm more amused by the description on Steam which calls the game "empowering."
They meant weapon system.
Last edited by qmish on Fri May 13, 2016 4:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by d3vak »

Zen wrote:Since the shmups player demographic is, in the main, male, late teens and up
*JAPANESE male, late teens and up.

:lol:
HOW ARE YOU GENTLEMEN !!
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by trap15 »

You seem like a real jackass, Zen.
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by Mimeslayer »

Zen wrote: What in the actual fuck is this image? A female child with a teddy bear? And this has what to do with this a shooting game now? (Goes to Steam page. Yup, Steam page has a female child with a teddy bear)
Since the shmups player demographic is, in the main, male, late teens and up, care to explain the marketing behind this, NickPalmerDegica?
I thought we already had this fucking debate (didn't the mods even lock that thread?). Moe sells in Japan because it's what sells in their culture currently. This game, like most shmups, comes from Japan and was primarily aimed for a Japanese audience. For whatever reason, Japanese art tends to rely on the extremes of "teenage/20-something hottie with boobs larger than her head" and "[looks like a] little child" with no in-between.

Why don't we see spaceships and other arbitrary examples of "manliness" in many shmups nowadays? BECAUSE THIS SHIT SELLS MORE!

Goddammit I swear this forum is 99% troll sometimes.
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by Sakurei »

Zen wrote:
AxelMill wrote:
Zen wrote:What in the actual fuck is this image? A female child with a teddy bear? And this has what to do with this a shooting game now? (Goes to Steam page. Yup, Steam page has a female child with a teddy bear)
Since the shmups player demographic is, in the main, male, late teens and up, care to explain the marketing behind this, NickPalmerDegica?
Surprise, 90% (purely made up number) of modern shmups are about "female children". Welcome to [current year].
Now, yes, maybe Pedobear was a bit too much.
Why, are "90% (purely made up number) of modern shmups are about "female children"?
That's what sells, to give a concise answer.

Not as concise would be: In all likelihood, the game will make more money this way than it would if they made the playable(s) some random spaceship like it used to be the case 25 years ago. Saying they're all about female children may be a bit much since clearly, we have tit monsters as well but that's probably beside the point. Naturally, the reason this is done is because girls are cuter than spaceships. I'm sure you will agree with that. Of course, I know many of you will say that cuteness doesn't matter in shmups and you may be right with that, but find it weird or creepy as you might, neither you nor I are part of the intended audience Japanese game developers want to reach.
The Japanese society values cuteness greatly not only in games but also other areas of entertainment (anime/manga, visual novels, regular TV, idols/voice actors, video games in general not just shmups, etc). This is prevalent even in sports, not in girl form here but as mascots, although here their cute may differ from yours or mine. The reason why game developers choose to pick girls are characters and not puppies, kittens or some weird ass mascot is because of race. It's easier to identify yourself with a human-character than it is with an over sized plush that looks like a mix of three different animals. This current fad, which no doubt will disappear in a decade or two, also explains how new games like SDOJ have the typical Japanese squeaky voices while you play. That's cute over there (although I admit that in SDOJ's case, it's also clearly geared towards sexy and not just cute). At this point, I again want to say that you can tell me that it's creepy or that the voices are just hurting your eyes, but we are not the target audience so our (or more like your) worries and complaints are perfectly irrelevant to the developers.

There is nothing wrong with a little girls having a teddy bear, by the way. My sister is 20 now and still collects plushies. I will agree that the perspective is weird, thus making it look like she is fondling the bear's crotch but it isn't intended to be some sexual innuendo, most likely. The artist probably didn't give it any thought in that direction. Her cuddling the teddy like you would with a plushy would have been a much better image imo but it ultimately doesn't matter.
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by Zen »

trap15 wrote:You seem like a real jackass, Zen.
Really?
And yet, I am the only one being directly attacked here (three times and counting).
An attempt at ageist shaming (i have seen a lot of that on the forum recently), being presumed and directly called a "jackass", by your good self and being indirectly named as a troll. Thats a whole lot of "hey, shut up Zen!" right there.
The question I asked is in no way offensive. I directly asked NickPalmerDegica about the marketing behind this image.

Mimeslayer, I know that it sells. Obviously it sells. Implied in my question is, to whom does it sell? To people who like pictures of a female child with a teddy bear? To the majority of shmup fans?
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by Xyga »

Argh, not again, please people stahp. TT
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by cave hermit »

Law one: As a single shmups farm thread accrues more posts, the probability of a flame war/derail approaches 1
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by qmish »

^ looks like businesswoman. Everyone is pleased now.
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by Cee »

trap15 wrote:You seem like a real jackass, Zen.
Beats seeming like a complete hipster bitch i guess.
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by trap15 »

Which is also better than seeming like a perpetual asshole.
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by neccros »

This is why I like shmups like R-Type....

It's gender neutral. LOL
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by mamboFoxtrot »

Serraxor wrote:There. Better?
I would've changed it to the "embarrassed tea" picture out of spite. I guess I really don't have a future in PR, do I?
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by qmish »

neccros wrote:This is why I like shmups like R-Type....

It's gender neutral. LOL
Funny thing that all that madness is just about some promo pic that you see in game menu or on store website. While 99% of spending time with game it's just ship, bullets, etc
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by vvv_stg »

Zen wrote:
trap15 wrote:You seem like a real jackass, Zen.
The question I asked is in no way offensive. I directly asked NickPalmerDegica about the marketing behind this image.
(emphasis added)
Zen wrote:What in the actual fuck is this image?

Why am I not surprised that no one has dignified your question with an actual answer. If you are actually wondering why the girl is on the promotional materials for the game,
Spoiler
she is one of the playable characters.
I somehow guessed that immediately after seeing the image.
Last edited by vvv_stg on Fri May 13, 2016 6:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by clippa »

I think that there's a bit of a paedophile/shmup-fan crossover, especially in Japan. The anti-social obsessive streak that leads someone to hoarde pictures of cartoon kids in their knickers can also be the same sort of obsessive, anti-social streak that would lead to them not going out and playing the same level of a game again and again in order to memorize enemy positioning.

There's a big difference between cute and creepy, it's not a fine line. Most of the art in Japanese shmups is definitely in the creepy camp. Luckily, it usually has absolutely nothing to do with the game and can be ignored entirely. Played the demo for this one and it's great fun.

I used to be quite proud when I was younger to say that I liked shoot 'em ups. People assumed you were a big boy, hardcore gamer with skills of bill-paying proportions.
Nowadays, I keep it under my hat lest everyone assumes that I'm a massive nonce :lol:
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by Mimeslayer »

clippa wrote:I think that there's a bit of a paedophile/shmup-fan crossover, especially in Japan. The anti-social obsessive streak that leads someone to hoarde pictures of cartoon kids in their knickers can also be the same sort of obsessive, anti-social streak that would lead to them not going out and playing the same level of a game again and again in order to memorize enemy positioning.

There's a big difference between cute and creepy, it's not a fine line. Most of the art in Japanese shmups is definitely in the creepy camp. Luckily, it usually has absolutely nothing to do with the game and can be ignored entirely. Played the demo for this one and it's great fun.

I used to be quite proud when I was younger to say that I liked shoot 'em ups. People assumed you were a big boy, hardcore gamer with skills of bill-paying proportions.
Nowadays, I keep it under my hat lest everyone assumes that I'm a massive nonce :lol:
Except it's not a shmup thing, it's a thing with all Japanese media, games not excluded. It also is not an explicit "pedophilia" craze as much as it is an overall sexualization thing among Japanese otaku. They will put anything in questionable clothes/situations; child, adult, even anthropomorphized objects. If you seriously have a problem with the idea of people thinking poorly of you because you play a genre from a country notorious for it's "cute/sexy" culture and where your character model is most often a tiny little spec on the overall screen, then sorry you have large security issues. And that's coming from somebody with extreme social anxiety.

It's also hard to take western criticism of "lolis ruining shmups" when they will call any non-male character a loli (see the Touhou project as the prime example) and will ignore things like the fact that you play as badass spaceships in this game, the very thing people keep crying for. All this hoopla is over the main promotional picture for the game. Nothing about the in-game experience, dialogue, art, or anything. It's about a fucking logo. And it's not even that bad of a logo compared to games like Otomedius or Deathsmiles. It's seriously people bitching and trolling for the sake of bitching and trolling.
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by Zen »

vvv_stg wrote:
Zen wrote:
trap15 wrote:You seem like a real jackass, Zen.
The question I asked is in no way offensive. I directly asked NickPalmerDegica about the marketing behind this image.
(emphasis added)
Zen wrote:What in the actual fuck is this image?

Why am I not surprised that no one has dignified your question with an actual answer. If you are actually wondering why the girl on the promotional materials for the game,
Spoiler
she is one of the playable characters.
I somehow guessed that immediately after seeing the image.
I think most readers would be able to see that my post contained two lines. One, the first line, was a rhetorical WTF, qualified with info of what I was referring to.
The second line and I quote; "Since the shmups player demographic is, in the main, male, late teens and up, care to explain the marketing behind this, NickPalmerDegica?", was a direct, non offensive question, asked in good faith, to NickPalmerDegica.
A question that, so far, has survived derailment and still has not been answered by the person that it was addressed to.

Did you really find my post so offensive, vvv_stg?
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by vvv_stg »

Zen wrote:Did you really find my post so offensive, vvv_stg?
I was not offended by it. I found it rude, though, and would not bother replying to it seriously if it were addressed to me in that tone.
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by clippa »

Mimeslayer wrote:you have large security issues. And that's coming from somebody with extreme social anxiety.
I've got that, horrible isn't it? I was only kidding with that bit, hence the :lol:
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by gs68 »

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Probably the one way I can tolerate any sort of shmups forum talk involving cutesy-girl games.
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by clippa »

That's also good for social anxiety :lol:
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Re: Degica Shmups Thread

Post by trap15 »

gs68 wrote:Probably the one way I can tolerate any sort of shmups forum talk involving cutesy-girl games.
Fuckin seriously. Everyone puts on their shitposting hat whenever there's a girl.
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