input lag: the KDL-40Z4500 and Leo Bodnar display lag test

[mikezilla2]

so i currently own that tv have been using it since 2009 whether it be games( both online and offline eg bad compney 2 etc) or films and have been looking at getting an oled atm rather perplexed about wether i should wait a few revisions or settle on one of the newer models now ( at best about 33 Ms input lag) until a few days ago i was thinking of simply waiting until a google search led me to this article

http://www.videogameperfection.com/2013 ... er-review/

and this thread http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.ph ... &start=120

now its been a few years since that thread was posted/posted in and when i first got my tv back in 09 i went looking at a few reviews mainly regarding screen rez as we were just kicking things in to full HD at that point and the white patching that sony panels seemed to have input lag was also something i was looking at or tho at the time i was more concerned with response of the display itself irc i may have based part of my decision making on this review as well as some other Cnet review

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/sony-kdl ... 124136.htm

anyway not being a huge cinemaphile but still being disappointed in some things ( the clouding you get when you up the contrast) after a few months i was pretty content with it online experiences and all,

what has me puzzled is that thread and that review from so long ago has me worried about picking up a new OLED set and noticing a huge delay mainly in the aspects of online play shumps aside( i have an old CRT for that) just wondering if any one can fill in the blanks are the readings from that first article i linked incorrect? are a few people using this tool not using it correctly ? or is the reading from that review correct ? have i been playing with an input delay of 30 or so all this time( game mode on) with out even konwing it ? the only shmup iv played on this set relly is under defeat HD ugh...

but yea i dont have a lag tester and just wondering for those of you that konw or have tested that tv and konw for sure if it is indeed 30 that makes my choice alot eaiser

thanks

[BuckoA51]

I've tested it several times and got 30ms every time. My reading would seem to be at least somewhat accurate as I can test with the DVDO in the chain and it adds pretty much as much input lag as it claims to.

30ms isn't that much, and actually pretty good for a HDTV. You wouldn't notice it per-say, that's not to say it doesn't affect your gaming of course.

[mikezilla2]

I've tested it several times and got 30ms every time. My reading would seem to be at least somewhat accurate as I can test with the DVDO in the chain and it adds pretty much as much input lag as it claims to.

30ms isn't that much, and actually pretty good for a HDTV. You wouldn't notice it per-say, that's not to say it doesn't affect your gaming of course.

meant to also link this http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/input-lag

basically i own the KDL 40Z4500 if that is infact 30 or like the above says less and the new oleds are 33 ie more less the same than all is good and i wont have to worry with regards to buying an oled

just need to confirm all this ? i believe you when you say its 30 but everything else there in that thread on here and in that review still throws me

ie getting 15 from the top is puzzling

[BuckoA51]

15 from the top was on my other set, not the KDL 40Z4500.

[mikezilla2]

okey so in other words the Z4500 is about on par with a high end oled ?

looking getting the model coming after this set assuming the input lag is about the same - my understanding is the next one should be about 33 or so

https://www.jbhifi.com.au/tv-home-enter ... tv/937839/

[gray117]

There's no guarantee on any of this. Each different model will likely have some unique properties linked to size/price. And no consumer set, at any reasonable price you'd want to pay, is 'high end' for a start.

Your best bet is either to wait for a review. Test in a store that will let you - most local stores are fairly accommodating as long as you make it obvious you're going to buy one out of a selection and they have floor models. Or buy and test yourself, and return if unsatisfied - presuming you have those consumer rights (we do in the uk).

You might find that sacrificing some input lag performance can improve your image quality without adversely effecting input lag too noticeably on your current set - is you current set able to improve the picture quality to your liking on another setting (e.g. graphics/photos/movies/sport)? ... if so have a play with the options and see if you can enable/disable tweak some settings to improve picture quality whilst keeping input lag low enough to feel right and/or see if the 'game' settings have any additional options.

[mikezilla2]

There's no guarantee on any of this. Each different model will likely have some unique properties linked to size/price. And no consumer set, at any reasonable price you'd want to pay, is 'high end' for a start.

Your best bet is either to wait for a review. Test in a store that will let you - most local stores are fairly accommodating as long as you make it obvious you're going to buy one out of a selection and they have floor models. Or buy and test yourself, and return if unsatisfied - presuming you have those consumer rights (we do in the uk).

You might find that sacrificing some input lag performance can improve your image quality without adversely effecting input lag too noticeably on your current set - is you current set able to improve the picture quality to your liking on another setting (e.g. graphics/photos/movies/sport)? ... if so have a play with the options and see if you can enable/disable tweak some settings to improve picture quality whilst keeping input lag low enough to feel right and/or see if the 'game' settings have any additional options.

oh il be waiting for reviews for sure and probbly a big price drop, as for the old tv its been a wili since iv tweaked any of the settings tho i do no motionflow mucks things up

unfortunately testing in store wont tell me what i need to konw about a live online environment

reterning can be a pain as far as " change of mind" gos but yes very much the same

pretty well sold on an oled its just a matter of time and if the input lag suits just needing clarification on my set and whats out there now thats all.

[BuckoA51]

Yeah you don't want Motionflow on for games (works nice on films though), game mode turns that all off though.

[Ed Oscuro]

30ms is roughly two frames of lag (one frame is 16 and 2/3ms) and you should be able to play singleplayer games at a high enough level with that. There is a recent Vizio that got a ~14ms input lag result, which is phenomenal for HDTVs, but it does come with a few negatives. OLED panels seem to be considerably slower in general but I bet the extra motion clarity would be pretty nice. It's often easier to compensate for lag (since most any modern game has a bit of extra delay for reaction time built-in) than blurry motion.

Overall, 2008-2009 is so long ago that most any screen you could buy today should be head and shoulders above that one.

One thing to keep in mind: Sometimes screens in the same family, possibly even the same model number, can use different panels with very different characteristics with regards to input lag (response time, technically), so don't take tests for everything when looking at a very popular model that sells a lot. Input lag tests are more reliable for sets that have a small volume, where it's more likely only one panel is used.

[BONKERS]

30ms is roughly two frames of lag (one frame is 16 and 2/3ms) and you should be able to play singleplayer games at a high enough level with that. There is a recent Vizio that got a ~14ms input lag result, which is phenomenal for HDTVs, but it does come with a few negatives. OLED panels seem to be considerably slower in general but I bet the extra motion clarity would be pretty nice. It's often easier to compensate for lag (since most any modern game has a bit of extra delay for reaction time built-in) than blurry motion.

Overall, 2008-2009 is so long ago that most any screen you could buy today should be head and shoulders above that one.

One thing to keep in mind: Sometimes screens in the same family, possibly even the same model number, can use different panels with very different characteristics with regards to input lag (response time, technically), so don't take tests for everything when looking at a very popular model that sells a lot. Input lag tests are more reliable for sets that have a small volume, where it's more likely only one panel is used.

OLED motion still isn't going to be all that great though since it still suffers the same exact core issue as LCDs, Sample and Hold. And then there is the ABL and the myriad of problems current OLEDs have.

[Xyga]

The anti-OLED sophistry campaign continues.

[mikezilla2]

its nether here nor there

what i am hunting for is a flat 4k oled(thats a given) that supports HDR ( a given) and has a a input lag ratio like the tv i have now

got this off the blu ray forum via Robert Zohn

"33.7 ms for LG's 2016 Signature Series G6. I don't know the input lag on the 2015 EF9500, but the 2016 not as fast response."

so its just a matter of waiting till G6s or like models come out at an affordable price down under 8 months or more im guessing considering they would need to be well under 4 grand