Questions that do not deserve a thread

[Xyga]

Or when there are analogue inputs included along with the others on the upscaling board (though this hasn't always worked).

Anyway neither this nor g-synced is the same as actual multisync doing both 15khz and 31khz natively.

[bobrocks95]

LCDs are fixed-pixel. There's no such thing as multisync for them, they can't change their resolution to match an input, just their refresh rate.

[Guspaz]

Multisync has to do with monitors that support varying horizontal and vertical scan frequencies. These frequencies can be varied either by changing resolution, or by changing the refresh rate. An LCD monitor that is capable of supporting multiple refresh rates is by definition an multisync monitor, even if when applied to CRTs in this community it more typically means 15/24/31 kHz.

LCDs being fixed-pixel stopped mattering once they passed the resolutions that puts them at smaller than one arc minute at the intended viewing distance. Beyond that point, they're not really any more "fixed resolution" than a CRT, since those also have a fixed maximum resolution defined by their shadow mask or aperture grille. Of course, it doesn't help that the scalers in most LCDs suck in terms of scaling quality and latency.

[Xyga]

I think you're wrong, as long as the signal gets converted it's not the same as syncing at X frequency natively.

[Fudoh]

of course it's not the same thing, but NEC has been calling their LCDs "multisync" for ages now - - so it really comes down to symantics.

[Guspaz]

Gets converted how? LCDs that support varying refresh rates are actually updating at that refresh rate. They are natively syncing at that frequency.

[Fudoh]

Gets converted how? LCDs that support varying refresh rates are actually updating at that refresh rate. They are natively syncing at that frequency.

not really. Or least hardly and not in my experience. My NEC (which say multisync) for example accept 50Hz, but internally convert that to 60Hz.

Same with G-SYNC models fed from external (non-PC) sources. In other words: no G-SYNC monitor will sync to a MVS just because it's G-SYNC.

[Guspaz]

At the very least, those monitors can probably natively sync at both 60Hz and 144 Hz without g-sync. They're not even multiples, and I've not heard any complains of stuttering motion when using 144Hz displays at 60Hz.

[Fudoh]

Yes, you're right about that. Probably other classic PC refresh rates as well along with 120Hz, but still far from what we would like to see...

[666duck]

Is there a monitor that is capable of displaying all consoles (early 80's stuff and up) well with little to no input lag? I was considering a high definition CRT, but some sources say they have no lag, like a regular crt, and some say that they do have lag. What would you guys suggest? If there isn't such a monitor I'll probably end up just getting two monitors, a CRT and something more modern.

[atheistgod1999]

Is there a monitor that is capable of displaying all consoles (early 80's stuff and up) well with little to no input lag? I was considering a high definition CRT, but some sources say they have no lag, like a regular crt, and some say that they do have lag. What would you guys suggest?

Widescreen BVMs like the D24E1WU are capable of natively displaying 240p/480i, 480p, 720p, and 1080i and have enough TVL to almost fully resolve the horizontal resolution of 1080i (at least, that's what Fudoh told me). Consumer HD CRTs are all locked at 1080i. Also, if you don't want to mod super old consoles like the Atari VCS or Intellivision for higher-quality inputs, you can simply use a VCR to demodulate the RF signal to composite and audio so you can hook it up to the BVM.

[FinalBaton]

Is there a monitor that is capable of displaying all consoles (early 80's stuff and up) well with little to no input lag? I was considering a high definition CRT, but some sources say they have no lag, like a regular crt, and some say that they do have lag. What would you guys suggest? If there isn't such a monitor I'll probably end up just getting two monitors, a CRT and something more modern.

You'll have to go the RGB monitor route for that

HD consumer CRTs will have lag with 480p sources, even thought they claim to display it "natively". The Sony sets have noticeable lag with 480p sources, and some lag with 720p ones. 1080i of course will have no lag since it is the set's native resolution. 240p sources are apparently not pretty on these sets, and have a bit of lag too. (credit to Bazookaben for this info)
There are native 480p consumer CRTs out there (EDTV), but in North America they are rare as hens teeth, plus they won't give you the versatility you're aiming for.
Maybe there are europeen CRTs that behave differentlt than that, but as far as NA brands this should pretty much be it. They are all native 1080i.

Someone already mentionned what the multisync PVMs/BVMs handle.
The NEC XM29 Plus natively syncs up to 1024x768, the XM37 Plus up to 1200x1024, and the XP29 Plus and XP37 Plus up to 1600x1200, all in progressive scan. Of course they all sync as low as 15kHz (240p/480i), and can display a ton of different resolutions in between that and their high cap. Not sure about the NEC XM29, as I can't find the manual.

I am guessing that the NEC XP29 Plus and XP37 Plus syncs at 1920x1080@60Hz in progressive scan. My XM37 Plus did with my XRGB-3, but can't do it with Blu-Ray players, oddly (I watch those in 1080i, wich still looks great). The horizontal resolution isn't quite high enough to perfectly resolve every little detail (the sets recommended res is 1024x768), but it's still awesome looking.. And 4:3 blu-rays look amazing on it.

[tacoguy64]

I need to know if my power adapter is safe to use with the playstation waka upscale converter.
My power adapter is rated at 9.5v 3A. The label on underneath the waka says 9v 5w.

[accaris]

I need to know if my power adapter is safe to use with the playstation waka upscale converter.
My power adapter is rated at 9.5v 3A. The label on underneath the waka says 9v 5w.

If the Waka says 9V 5W than it takes 550mA. So 3A is way more than enough.
However, I can't attest to using a higher voltage than what it was designed for (9.5 versus 9v) and how that could affect it. Also plug polarity should match.

[tacoguy64]

Well i have used it just to power on and to make sure it works but I don't know if having that extra .5v DC will damage the unit or not.
Polarity seems to be good they both have the same on both so no worries there.

[666duck]

I have been doing research today on using a modern television with an xrgb-3 in b1 mode because it provides almost no additional input lag. I read that you have to use a jp-21 cable with the xrgb-3 though. If I were to use a scart selector to plug in my consoles and then used a scart to jp-21 cable to plug it into the xrgb-3 would there be any additional lag? Also, does anyone know of a good brand/model for a scart selector?

[Fudoh]

Scart switches won't add lag, but they can introduce sync issues on the XRGBs.

If you don't already have the XRGB-3, get the OSSC instead.

[666duck]

Scart switches won't add lag, but they can introduce sync issues on the XRGBs.

If you don't already have the XRGB-3, get the OSSC instead.

The OSSC sounds great! Do you know when the assembled version will be released?

[Fudoh]

I know that the first batch is due in a few weeks, but it's pre-sold out. Check the OSSC thread for more details.

[tacoguy64]

How do pc crt produce scanlines even when not capable of displaying 240p?
Just curious because i never notice before but my pc crt produces some really thin and faint scanlines compared to that of a bvm. It's almost easy to miss if you dont look closely.

[Fudoh]

There's a sweetspot in terms of resolution of the CRT's mask and if you're using a resolution considerably lower than this (e.g. 480p on a high-end 1200p-capable CRT) you get the same effect (as in scanlines) as with 240p on a 480i CRT.

[tacoguy64]

Thanks Fudoh.
That is interesting.
While the scanlines on the monitor dont look anywhere near as pronounce as on a bvm they do provide something different.

[werk91]

How do I get inside the service menu of a Sony Trinitron KD28DL11U ? I'm only after a geometry adjustment ( moving the picture horizontally ) so I'm thinking the chances of messing up something are slim.

[FinalBaton]

How do I get inside the service menu of a Sony Trinitron KD28DL11U ? I'm only after a geometry adjustment ( moving the picture horizontally ) so I'm thinking the chances of messing up something are slim.

http://elektrotanya.com/sony_kd28dl11u- ... nload.html

[bobrocks95]

Are there any resources for buying an audio receiver for gaming over HDMI? Lag stats, if they do unnecessary upscaling, etc?

I would think injecting the OSD overlay alone adds a frame or two. Are older HDMI receivers that have an entirely separate OSD that blanks the input instead of using an overlay generally better in terms of lag?

[ajdesmarais]

STUPID QUESTION:

I took my PVM apart months ago and was awaiting a replacement terminal board. Now that I've finally got it, I can't remember, for the life of me, where the black and white wires on the AC terminal go. I know green is in the middle, and I assume the "N" and "L" are for neutral and live, right? Is white neutral and black live? I think? I thought I remembered the black wire going on the bottom and the white to the top, but I can't say, should have marked them.

[FinalBaton]

Are there any resources for buying an audio receiver for gaming over HDMI? Lag stats, if they do unnecessary upscaling, etc?

I would think injecting the OSD overlay alone adds a frame or two. Are older HDMI receivers that have an entirely separate OSD that blanks the input instead of using an overlay generally better in terms of lag?

Have been wondering about this too. Curious to see if some have an acceptable additional lag. Some fellow here uses is Onkyo receiver in this fashion, but I forget who it is.

But if I'm not mistaken, the receivers lag will add to that of the TV, no? just like a Framemeister's lag adds to that of the TV

[bobrocks95]

STUPID QUESTION:

I took my PVM apart months ago and was awaiting a replacement terminal board. Now that I've finally got it, I can't remember, for the life of me, where the black and white wires on the AC terminal go. I know green is in the middle, and I assume the "N" and "L" are for neutral and live, right? Is white neutral and black live? I think? I thought I remembered the black wire going on the bottom and the white to the top, but I can't say, should have marked them.

I'd look for the service manual- I was able to find google results that say black is always live and I was able to find google results that say black is always neutral so obviously that can't be trusted.

Have been wondering about this too. Curious to see if some have an acceptable additional lag. Some fellow here uses is Onkyo receiver in this fashion, but I forget who it is.

But if I'm not mistaken, the receivers lag will add to that of the TV, no? just like a Framemeister's lag adds to that of the TV

Yeah, I'm wondering about the additional lag that the receiver adds on top of the TV's existing lag. In other words, how much does it mess with an HDMI input. They're probably awful across the board for anything analog, so I just won't consider that angle.

The more I deal with HDMI the more I dislike it. I know how my TV handles a 1080p signal down to the millisecond; I'm starting to wish TOSLINK had been updated to support 7.1 LPCM so I can just connect the TV separately. Instead everything has to be run through a receiver and possibly mangled.

[CkRtech]

I guess my question to you receiver guys is - what are you trying to run/do? I have been using a receiver of some sort for retro/new gaming for years. I haven't noticed unacceptable input lag, and I also have run fairly low input laggy stuff (HD CRT RPTV and Panasonic VT plasma). I am OK at Street Fighter IV and "eeh" at Espgaluda II, but I don't think my skills there are input lag-related. These are examples given of twitchy style gaming over pure HDMI.

For retro stuff, it depends on the game being played - some consoles have been modified for or make use of digital audio output, but I run most through an analog switch and directly to the receiver. HDMI from the xrgb goes direct to TV - always. The receiver is in the chain for audio only on retro stuff.

Naturally, I imagine the brand/quality/processing of your receiver could make a difference. There are options I think you can alter to help with this, but as to if you can get it to acceptable lag levels - <shrug>

[werk91]

How do I get inside the service menu of a Sony Trinitron KD28DL11U ? I'm only after a geometry adjustment ( moving the picture horizontally ) so I'm thinking the chances of messing up something are slim.

http://elektrotanya.com/sony_kd28dl11u- ... nload.html

Thanks, did the trick!