Prelude to the Apocalypse

[Mischief Maker]

Obligatory:

[EmperorIng]

I'll admit, telling the prince of Saudi Arabia to fuck off with "daddy's money" is pretty damn funny. Prime banter from Trump.

[Opus131]

Then the whole crowd beating up a black guy at a Trump rally thing.

You mean expelling a black lives matter bully.

[Xyga]

Aren't bald eagles twice that size normally ?
Or did they take a young thinking an adult could have gutted him ?

[ED-057]

- Muslim extremism is a social cancer that will spread on its own if left alone

Like other living things, cancer requires resources to exist and spread. Where are the resources coming from? Until this is addressed, there can't be a solution. As long as the US gives theocratic-monarchy gulf states a free pass to indoctrinate their subjects with fundamentalist views and enable the flow of money and arms to extremists, no proposed fix from the US amounts to anything.

- All the powers in the region have their own agendas or biases

All powers in all regions have agendas and biases. The only thing to be done about this is to call out those who lie about what their agenda is.

- Everybody agrees that intervention can inflame a situation, but nobody is advocating just leaving IS alone

Cut off the funding and supplies.

- But leaving the fight to just local strongmen (Musharraf in Pakistan, the Assad regime in Syria) is a good way to have the issue blow up, because these groups were more interested in their own power base than in controlling terrorist groups throughout the region (Al Qaeda was left to grow in Saudi Arabia, and as noted before Russia tried to export its problem). Bashir Al-Assad basically replays the policies of his father, who was literally murdering entire towns as far back as the early '80s.

local powers would just push the problem off onto somebody else, while happily slaughtering dissidents

Murdering entire towns and slaughtering dissidents, eh? Are you suggesting that "we" care what happens to people in other countries? If so, then maybe we should allow those people to escape slaughter by coming to western countries. But will we do that? Or will the occurance of some comparatively minor violence within western countries cause everyone to lose their shit, thus promoting xenophobia and security theater to a level of importance which is higher than anything happening to people in other countries? And hence militarism, which begets even higher death tolls, will continue to be the only imagined solution to any problems in other countries?

[BryanM]

For our foreign friends who don't have a front row seat to this stuff...

One of these guys running, Carly Fiorina, straight up murdered a bunch of people with the help of the media. She's still in the race.

Once again for those with time to kill, this is a pretty good thread for understanding their worldview.

[Ed Oscuro]

Harrison Ford v Trump
Inigo Montoya wins vs. Cruz.

Good times I often despise "celebrities" getting their sound bites in but these guys were on the money.

[supergrafx77]

Well.... just watched the debates: December 16, 2015 and gotta say as a BERNIE supporter, I liked: TRUMP, TED CRUZ and RAND PAUL.
That is all.

[EmperorIng]

Rand Paul is a sensible man, who is at least principled; unfortunately, his extreme insistence on his principles kills his electability (sad world we live in!). He is right about our rights, about the need to shrink government, and all of that, but just like his father, it's not the message the people want to hear.

(Un)Surprisingly Cruz and Trump both came out well in the debate. Trump saves the crazy shit for the campaign rallies to generate free press and then acts serious in the debate to swing people to his side. It's a great tactic that saves tons of money.

I find it funny to read a prominent article comparing Trump's policies to Richard Nixon's in light of BryanM's post bemoaning Richard Nixon as "our last liberal president."

Hell, Trump even made a common-sense proposal to just cut off major terrorist centers from accessing the internet, whether it be through destroying infrastructure (or blocking websites' access by different foreign IPs). Personally I've always wondered, considering the amount of 'hacktivism' and doxxing and all that other stuff that goes on, why doesn't some of that energy go towards cyber-sabotage of online terrorist recruitment. I am sure it's an issue of time, energy, and money, but I wonder if it's feasible.

[Opus131]

Rand Paul is too weak. All the conservatives are. The reason Trump is popular is precisely that he doesn't give a rat's ass about being politically correct and doesn't bow down to anyone. We are at a point where a full grown man ended up in tears after being bullied by a bunch of twitter harpies. Does anyone understand how insane that is? Nobody really gives a shit about Trump's rhetoric. It is stuff like his stance on immigration, or moments like this:

http://dailycaller.com/2015/08/20/trump ... chor-baby/

Political correctness is now a kind of religion in the west. We are fast approaching full 1984, and a man like Trump, insensitive oaf that he may be, appears to be the only cure, especially after the way Bernie Sanders bowed down to those black lives matter trolls.

[Rob]

There seems to be many interpretations of 1984.

[Opus131]

The world of 1984 is a left-wing dystopia. There's no other interpretation, a lot of people are just in denial because they want to desperately cling to this notion only the right can be despotic and if we could only lock all the right-wingers away everything would just be wonderful and we would all hold hands together in perpetual peace and harmony.

But ultimately, it is like that Team America monologue. Everybody in the west has turned into a giant pussy, and now we need a dick to fix the problem. This is what the left doesn't get about Trump. They think whenever Trump says something offensive that is going to end his campaign, where as people like him precisely because he is an irreverent asshole.

[BryanM]

Trump is the definition of being political correct. He's a politician that's winning his race.

Nothing special or exceptional about him - he's not really any different from the others besides being interesting and exciting. Anyone else could have done the same thing as him, except politicians are craven conservative beasts who'll only mimic "what works".

They lack the self awareness, imagination or intellect to note that literally every single politician we've been offered has been doing the same fake asshole routine for the last 40 years. If it's the only thing anybody ever bothers to try, of course it'll be "what works".

I find it funny to read a prominent article comparing Trump's policies to Richard Nixon's in light of BryanM's post bemoaning Richard Nixon as "our last liberal president."

That's actually just a fun way to troll democrats :3

Nixon was a huge factor in why republicans control almost nearly the entire country currently. He had some huge help from the democrats though. A fateful year that still matters today.

The only issue that mattered in that election was Vietnam. Do we keep sending kids there against their will? The voters in the dem primary said "hell no we won't", the Party said "oh hell yes we are" and selected Hubert Humphrey as the nominee. He had received 2% of the vote in the primary.

There were riots at the convention and the party has been a broken shell of itself since.

It's in their theme song and everything.

Next I'll explain why women still wear bras, despite it being naught more than a sexual fetish object that causes cancer and breast sag.

The world of 1984 is a left-wing dystopia.

Yeah.. it's a tale about failed democracy. The curtains you decide to hang on the window don't really matter.

Famous socialist Orwell writes books about his ideology going sideways. While Ayn Rand puts out these multiple circlejerks of worlds where her ideology fixes everything.

especially after the way Bernie Sanders bowed down to those black lives matter trolls

If you're disappointed that he didn't immediately punt two black women in the vagina and lose the race in the most epic and petty manner possible, I've got a video of him screaming at some white people interrupting him in Vermont for you.

[BryanM]

If you're disappointed that he didn't immediately punt two black women in the vagina and lose the race in the most epic and petty manner possible, I've got a video of him screaming at some white people interrupting him in Vermont for you.

I also have super cute videos of him being mayor.

Mister Rogers vs Marget Thatcher. How's this even a race.... -_-

[Rob]

A large segment of Americans want this kind of thing:



If only Sanders had bopped those women over their heads with a folding chair...

people like him precisely because he is an irreverent asshole.

I like comedians for being "irreverent assholes". I want none of those people as president.

And, yeah, we do get that people relate to the offensively stupid things that he says. That is very clear.

[BryanM]

Oh yeah, he'd be the first president to have motor-boated Rudy Giuliani.

I feel like I should have already mentioned this before itt. Well, it's important enough to be on every page.

[Opus131]

I like comedians for being "irreverent assholes". I want none of those people as president.

Westerners should have thought about that before turning into spineless, groveling masochists.

[Opus131]

Trump is the definition of being political correct.

Arguing semantics is the worst type of sophistry.

Political correctness = 1984. Trump is popular precisely because whenever he commits a thought crime he just laughs and shrugs it off:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFIjdZ75xgo

This is an attitude many people resonate with, because political correctness has been running amok for far too long. Everybody is fed up with it.

[BryanM]

It is not semantics. It is objective fact, brought up to correct the victim mentality/messiah complex implied with its use. He isn't saying anything new or shocking or unacceptable.

If Trump wasn't PC, he would be using the N-word and be in single digits.

The racism he tickles is always done in the nicest Santa Claus kind of way - the Mexicans are so industrious we have to keep them out. Muslims are highly effective killing machines so we have to keep them out. The Chinese are super smart and ambitious so we have to keep them in check.

It's like being complimented by a fourth grader. He's a fucking genius. If he's serious and he wins the nom and goes up against the Hilldiggity, he could really win everything if he wanted to. The line between victory is such a small sliver % of increased white turnout and decreased black turnout.

[Ed Oscuro]

Speaking of political correctness and semantics, that black "thug" at the rally simply yelled a comment about gun control.

What happened immediately after that had nothing to do with the traditions of America or the Constitution: Supporters reportedly yelled everything from "sieg heil" to "burn him," and the casino security physically grabbed him instead of asking him to leave (which it seems he would have done).

So do tell us more of your fascinating and informative thoughts about who the "thugs" are here.

We have this thing called freedom of speech here. Even if you don't agree with his gun control message, it's protected speech, unlike calling for violence.

Anyhow, this has been a good season for exposing all the petty hatreds and greed that in this country get lost in. My question is "how many are there, really?" Interesting definition of PC, by the way, Bryan.

[Opus131]

If Trump wasn't PC, he would be using the N-word and be in single digits.

Not sure i understand what being in "single digits" is, but if you are equating being politically incorrect with being outright offensive, than that's another fallacy.

Besides, the thing with Trump isn't that he is offensive per-se, but simply that he doesn't care one way or another. The psychological hold political correctness has on the vast majority of people is way out of bounds with any alleged offence, whether we are speaking of something that actually is offensive or simply something progressives do not agree with, which is usually the case.

[EmperorIng]

Nixon was a huge factor in why republicans control almost nearly the entire country currently. He had some huge help from the democrats though. A fateful year that still matters today.

I think that despite the Watergate fuck-up, Nixon was a good president. He was at least smart enough to not trust anyone in government, lol. Signing into law environmental protection, historic preservation, Indian self-government, nuclear disarmament - it's everything a liberal could want!

It's a bit disingenuous to say "republicans control" the country. Politicians who think the federal government should make all the decisions in peoples' lives control the country. It's true bi-partisanship!

If you're disappointed that he didn't immediately punt two black women in the vagina and lose the race in the most epic and petty manner possible, I've got a video of him screaming at some white people interrupting him in Vermont for you.

Too bad, if the last debate was any indication, he has no intention of interrupting and punting Hillary off the stage (I thought a debate was to make your opponents look less qualified for the job). I would not be surprised if Hillary puts Sanders as a running mate to trick young voters into voting for their savior. #feelthebern

"America is so damn sick of hearing about your emails!"

Ha ha, good one, Bern.

The racism he tickles is always done in the nicest Santa Claus kind of way - the Mexicans are so industrious we have to keep them out. Muslims are highly effective killing machines so we have to keep them out. The Chinese are super smart and ambitious so we have to keep them in check.

I don't know if it's racist to want to end loopholes with trade deals with China. Clearly Chinese businessmen are far smarter than our government. Outside of business, the fact that for the first time in history China is building military bases outside of its territory should cause some alarm bells to ring. If the best Obama can come up with is TPP, and get pouty when people distrust the proposal, well...

So do tell us more of your fascinating and informative thoughts about who the "thugs" are here.

We have this thing called freedom of speech here. Even if you don't agree with his gun control message, it's protected speech, unlike calling for violence.

Well, like when the father of Michael Brown told everyone, after hearing the verdict, to "burn this bitch down." Isn't that exactly a call to violence?

[BulletMagnet]

Not sure i understand what being in "single digits" is

Poll numbers-wise, I believe he meant.

The psychological hold political correctness has on the vast majority of people is way out of bounds with any alleged offence, whether we are speaking of something that actually is offensive or simply something progressives do not agree with, which is usually the case.

First off, if you really believe that "rampant political correctness" is really the defining challenge to the country in this day and age, I'm not sure which planet you've been living on (wherever it is, it must have much better wages, health care, infrastructure, etc. than we do).

While we're at it, I'll go ahead and put forward the notion that nobody demands more apologies for "offensive" statements than so-called conservatives; offer anything other than effusive praise for Reagan? Point out that some rich wall street types and/or corporations have done bad things to the economy and/or environment? Note a bald-faced fallacy or contradiction in a commonly-cited religious or political platitude? Everyone from Limbaugh on down will be foaming on the mouth, demanding you get down on your knees and grovel.

[EmperorIng]

I think it goes both ways, Bullet. It's clear that political dialog has long since left the "age of civility" that we fondly cling to. E.G. cops are fascist killers, people who reject illegal immigration are racist bigots, and people labeling religious as every -phobe in the dictionary. Victim/oppressor dichotomies are defining political discourse, and identity politics, which big-time Democrats have deemed useful for demonizing Republican politicians, are finding that it is also sabotaging the left as well.
This is all galvanized by a unscrupulous media that profits off of sensationalism, polarization, and violence.

Opus didn't claim it was the "defining challenge" of this day and age, but it is symptomatic of a corrosive intellectual strain in American thought that is at its heart authoritarian leftism. He said that people are fed up with it being used as the primary tool to bash someone into subservience.

[Opus131]

First off, if you really believe that "rampant political correctness" is really the defining challenge to the country in this day and age, I'm not sure which planet you've been living on

I believe civilizations are about principles and ideas first and foremost. So yes, the sickness of the west is in our culture. Everything else follows from there, including things like politics and economics.

While we're at it, I'll go ahead and put forward the notion that nobody demands more apologies for "offensive" statements than so-called conservatives;

Absolutely. I believe the internet even came up with a perfect description for this behavior. And hence again why Trump is so popular. Because he says things conservatives ought to be saying (good or bad that they may be) and doesn't apologize for anything.

[Ed Oscuro]

Well, like when the father of Michael Brown told everyone, after hearing the verdict, to "burn this bitch down." Isn't that exactly a call to violence?

What's that got to do with anything? The dude yelled out one line against violence. Maybe you'll think if a bird shits on your shoe then you'll sprout feathers, but that's not good enough. I'm not even calling Trump to task for what his supporters are doing (though I also could point out that Trump himself did say that a protester should be "roughed up" before) here. Instead I'm talking about this specific protester, who is engaging in one of the oldest types of protected speech in making a peaceful protest. "Thug" more accurately describes the people who pulled the guy out of the room and then yelled cowardly insults after him.

What bothers me is not really so much that it happened - it goes with the territory, I think he knew what he was getting into - but that highly imaginative types like Beethoven here think that yelling one line in protest for nonviolence makes you a thug, but actually engaging in the real behaviors of a thug somehow isn't a problem. I hesitate to ask what really is supposed to be the evidence that one is a thug, because quite obviously it's not being based on any common sense definition based on behavior.

[Rob]

Everybody is fed up with it.

If only people were fed up with being overweight and undereducated.

But no, Americans want to hold up an anti-scientific view of the world as the gold standard but expect science to save their asses when they have hotdog-induced heart attacks.

So yes, the sickness of the west is in our culture.

It certainly is. This sickness is why a pampered imbecile and uninformed hothead has so much support.

[Ed Oscuro]

Speaking of the gold standard, you know who else likes that? ISIS.

[BulletMagnet]

It's clear that political dialog has long since left the "age of civility" that we fondly cling to.

The thing is, one of our major political parties has long declared that this is a positive development, has profited disproportionately from it (I'll ask yet again, if Pelosi had ever uttered anything close to McConnell's "our job is to make Obama a one-term president" statement in front of so many cameras, would she have gotten anything close to the pass he got?) and acts like it believes it.

E.G. cops are fascist killers, people who reject illegal immigration are racist bigots, and people labeling religious as every -phobe in the dictionary.

Two things: one, you have to dig pretty damn deep to find someone so dementedly lefty to match the (I assume) hyperbolic nature of those positions (i.e. supporting some manner of police reform doesn't mean you think cops are fascists), and two, feel free to name anyone the left has nominated for President who comes anywhere close to the caricatures the opposition paints of them, in terms of the policies they support. At the very least it'll be a hell of a lot harder to do than it would be within the Republican crop, even if you only limit yourself to the leaders in the polls.

This is all galvanized by a unscrupulous media that profits off of sensationalism, polarization, and violence.

Don't forget to add "corporate-owned" and "shareholder-driven" to the list, unless you believe that they have nothing to do with the rest.

I believe civilizations are about principles and ideas first and foremost. So yes, the sickness of the west is in our culture.

This being the case, how would you respond, just for starters, to what Rob mentioned above, concerning how openly anti-science and anti-intellectual the right in particular has become in recent years? They certainly haven't been "politically correct" about it either...or is someone who attempts to get his numbers right but is also willing to occasionally rephrase himself or hold his tongue for the sake of others' feelings the bigger problem, to the point that an unapologetic ignoramus like Trump deserves our support?

On that note, methinks I'll pass along the challenge offered at the bottom of this brief writeup:

I seriously want to hear anyone on the right side of the aisle defend Trump as a potential commander-in-chief after hearing this. Any conservative who still wants this guy as president has forfeited their last smidgen of credibility as anything more than a crude partisan hack.

[Ed Oscuro]

That is a really bad answer, but at least he carries it off with aplomb. I didn't watch the miserable debate, but from what I heard, Carly tried to challenge Trump on calling the Iraq War a failure that left us with "nothing," while Lindsey Graham also had his great moment saying that he misses W - you know, the guy whose leadership was rather like trying surgery on a festering carcass with a crowbar.

So, I suppose that Trump can have somebody whisper in his ear, or give him a briefing, and he'll be up to speed. But the kind of special stupidity that has Fiorina and Graham trying to defend the Bush wars is forever, I'm afraid.

I love this line though:

...nuclear is just the power, the devastation is very important to me.

So true.