GamerGate - and it's continuing aftermath.

[Skykid]

You know, NeoGAF (and a lot of other SJWs) are really upset about that Play Asia thing. It's nuts.

Links to all tantrums please!

But one massive, enormous, earth-shattering non-sequitor of a campaign that conversely creates inequality of the sexes and genuinely ruins the image of actual feminists, is not required...I don't consider the ridiculous totalitarian demands of third wave feminism to be at all realistic or even well measured

I don't follow this stuff as closely as you do, I'm sure, but yes, I do still occasionally happen upon presumptuous, megaphone'd demands that everyone must put forth an immediate, constant effort to elevate some super-specific societal niche that's "having its moment", and like most people am not inclined to respond with much more than a chuckle and a shake of the head; exactly which "movements" fall under this category is different for each individual observer, but I certainly won't deny that the self-important, howling outliers do exist.

In a microcosmic sort of way there is some relationship between the two, but the way in which we tackle corporate governments and fleeting babyishness need to be approached in completely different ways.

I haven't really 'followed' third-wave feminist ideologies much until I recently left youtube running, radio style, while I went about my daily work, and ended up on a number of anti-feminist commentaries by people like Vernaculis, that brought it to my attention. And yes, it is indeed a shockingly ignorant, selfish, and openly sexist fad and quite far-removed from actual feminism in the sense that it seemingly has no aspirations to preach anything of any intelligence.

Laci Green is a good example. An MTV appointed "feminist" with literally two brain-cells to rub together who manages to simultaneously talk baloney ("Literally everything and everyone is problematic") while inserting tear-inducing typos into the performance ("Have some manors"). Her babbling, on the face of it, is absolutely harmless, until of course you realise the reach this thing is getting. This is genuinely influencing the young and weak-minded, and there are a lot of those to go around. Soon you begin to realise Laci Green has an audience and she's actually a preacher rather than a commentator - and she's being taken seriously and winning converts.

When Obama is standing in the White House calling for equal pay between genders - despite the pay equality gap being debunked several times over - you realise that there's some genuine momentum here. What we're actually witnessing is the beginnings of a fascist anti-male movement spread via social media. It's both fascinating and horrific at the same time.

Thankfully there is a legion of actual thinkers who are willing to push back. The problem is when commercial entities decide to censor and redact content to please a particular self-appointed contingent suffering from first world problems and neckbeard virginity issues. That's not right. Creative work should really be made for oneself, or at best within the cooperation of a team. A vocal minority shouldn't really get to say what should be deducted from that creative work at the expense of everyone else.

If you want you can either watch or listen (which is what I did) to the documentary Social Justice: Cry-Cis. The kid did a decent enough job of it, he's got some smarts, if you'll excuse the agenda.

[Skykid]

I searched for that thread at Neogaf.... holy shit. Was it all just coinsidence that they all congregate there or was there a process of them over taking it?

I found the thread too:

Originally Posted by Zeth

The real loser here is the guy who did the tweet and will probably be looking for a job next week.

Yeah, this guy's definitely gonna get fired.

Are these guys totally dense? It's more likely the guy will get promoted.

[Strider77]

It was brilliant on Playasia's part, it may have been accident but I bet you they will have far more preorders for boobie volleyball now because of it.

Hell, a childish part of me even considered it myself (ordering it).

I can't believe how many are so bent out of shape over PA's tweets... yet are compiling long lists of alternatives to order boo-bay volleyball. "OMG I have to find a pro SJW/Feminist game store to order my soft core porn volley ball boo-bay game."

It's hilarious because it's so horribly horrific.

Social Justice Warriors and Christian Soldiers seem very similar, they invent and use personal perspectives to justify and generate excuses to throw tantrums and pick fights. Apparently all in the cause of some higher calling. Lay off the kool-aid guys...

Honestly their are bigger fish to fry other than this. Then again we are talking about it also. But it's like a train wreck I can't help but look at. It's scary that it is having an effect in areas that should be smart enough to dismiss these radicals... or at least it starting to seem it has the potential to.

[evil_ash_xero]

I know..the comment was genuinely "SJW nonsense" and then "Sexist? More like sexy.".

That is enough to set them off. I mean...wow. And they talk about GGers getting pissed at everything.

These people can't take any jokes, or anything towards them. No wonder they ban everyone.

[Strider77]

Sexist? More like sexy

That cracks me up even now...

[BIL]

Too sexist? I think you mean too sexy.

I'd like to think that was a Spinal Tap reference.

[AntiFritz]

All they did was use the term sjw right? Absolutely insane.

[system11]

I searched for that thread at Neogaf.... holy shit. Was it all just coinsidence that they all congregate there or was there a process of them over taking it?

It's been a process. On certain issues if you say something that might challenge the hive mind, you'll very quickly get banned.

[Drum]

you. are. dumb.

[system11]

you. are. dumb.

How about if you have something to say on a topic, try saying it rather than just trolling with insults?

That NeoGAF has a 'progressive' aligned agenda at a moderation level is not news to most people, that is their site and their right to do so. It is also certainly the case as you'll see if you actually read it on a regular basis. It's not as toxic as it was during that whole 'Gamergate' fiasco anymore.

That DOAX3 western release has potentially been affected by 'progressive' media or more specifically how their reception might colour already limited sales making the release a financial waste of time - it's an interesting point worthy of discussion. I think it's a contributing factor, only a fool would think it's the only reason, Tecmo already retracted the post.

That Play-Asia have brazenly taken this and turned it into a shit storm for their own amusement and benefit - also worthy of discussion. I actually thought the whole 'boycott' thing was a joke they were pulling, until I randomly discovered the tumblr page actually calling for it in seriousness.

If you have anything to say on these, you should try articulating it, that's how adults function.

[Mischief Maker]

I'm beginning to think the only long-term effect of gamergate is going to be an explosion in shitty game sales, both pretentious art house games and bottom-of-the-barrel T&A games.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that videogames are closer to sports than books, and if a particular sport falls out of favor, however bullshit the reason may be, it's not the same thing as a book burning.

I say this with no small amount of confidence because even the most mind-blowing story in critically acclaimed games ultimately boils down to, "No, John... you ARE the demons."

[system11]

I say this with no small amount of confidence because even the most mind-blowing story in critically acclaimed games ultimately boils down to, "No, John... you ARE the demons."

"Would you kindly?" is still my favourite. I'd avoided spoilers, I was enjoying the game, they did a good job of leaving enough clues that gave impact to the reveal without giving it away until the right moment. On a second play through it just gets reinforced as you notice how that plot element had started the moment you started the game up. I think the voice actor sold it perfectly as an out of hand mannerism.

[Squire Grooktook]

I say this with no small amount of confidence because even the most mind-blowing story in critically acclaimed games ultimately boils down to, "No, John... you ARE the demons."

I greatly enjoy certain game stories, but they can't be held to the same kind of metric as great literature. IMO There's nothing wrong with that though, and that shouldn't let one enjoy them any less.

I've come to believe that stories based on silly fantasy, whimsy, and "fun" are just as necessary as those based on whatever kind of depth you care to name.

For example, I enjoyed Odin Sphere is one of my favorite games of all time, and almost purely for the story (almost: the gameplay had its moments, and the atmosphere was great too). It was well paced, had tension, was neither too dark nor too silly, and genuinely kept me guessing to the end (rare as it's usually right at the end where things collapse into predictability in most jrpg's, if you count OS as one).

Was it as deep in its themes or characterization as [INSERT FAMOUS AUTHOR HERE]? No, it's pulp stuff. But it was fun and it enchanted me. And in the end it left me with that rare "magical" feeling when I finished it.

[BIL]

srhbutts

Ah, it's my favourite virtuous pedophile with their moral instruction of the day.

[BulletMagnet]

When Obama is standing in the White House calling for equal pay between genders - despite the pay equality gap being debunked several times over - you realise that there's some genuine momentum here.

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but on this particular issue I believe that there IS a genuine, documented pay gap but it's not as large as it's usually made out to be. If memory serves, the usual number trotted out (70-something cents for every dollar a man makes) is an actual, accurate number, but only averages every working man and woman in the country together, without accounting for hours worked and other factors; once you do that and are actually comparing the genders for the same amount and type of work, there is still a gap, but it's 90-something cents for every dollar. Basically, yes, there is still some work to be done here, but there has been definite progress in recent years on this front. Which more or less segues into...

What we're actually witnessing is the beginnings of a fascist anti-male movement spread via social media...Thankfully there is a legion of actual thinkers who are willing to push back...A vocal minority shouldn't really get to say what should be deducted from that creative work at the expense of everyone else.

Again, though, I'm really not convinced that treating this sort of thing as genuinely "fascinating and horrific" is honestly the best way to go about it - as that comic I linked put it, "Starship Sarkeesian is fueled by hate." As you yourself note, we're dealing with a very loud but very small number of 'true believers" here - everyone else who could be considered a "supporter" of such movements is assuredly not comfortable with a fair amount of the platform (do you really think most women, or progressive-minded men for that matter, are so quick to embrace "anti-male fascism"?) but decide to go along, or at least not say "whoa, hold on a minute", when they see the public (and sometimes not-so-public) faces of the supposed "opposition" screeching and flinging feces all over the place in response to it (i.e. "jeez, if they're this afraid of a handful of bloggers, maybe there really is something to it...").

If the reactionary voices are left to echo into the internet's bottomless void of apathy, then there's no way any commercial entity will feel obligated to cater to their whims. And to tie things back to the first item, if you want to keep the most shameless types from gaining prominence you'll be willing to keep one's worst impulse-driven reactions in check and say "I support closing the pay gap, but first we need to make sure the numbers are straight" as opposed to "Didn't you entitled idiots hear that your figures are BS? Get off your high horse and out of my face" - or, in this case, "I've got no problem with more diverse representation in gaming, though I don't think every single game has to try to be 'forward-thinking'", as opposed to "You'll have to rip my balls off of my cold, dead groin, you fat, brainwashed feminazi."

[Icarus]

you. are. dumb.

If you behaved like this in real life, someone would put you in your place.
But since I can't reach down the intertubes and garrotte you in your sleep, instead I'm going to permanently ban you for not only ignoring all of the previous formal warnings, but also jumping straight back into this thread with an identical drive-by insult aimed at an admin not long after your previous ban for the same thing.

If you fish for a ban, you're likely going to get it.

As you were, thread.

[Strider77]

Defeat.

[Skykid]

When Obama is standing in the White House calling for equal pay between genders - despite the pay equality gap being debunked several times over - you realise that there's some genuine momentum here.

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but on this particular issue I believe that there IS a genuine, documented pay gap but it's not as large as it's usually made out to be. If memory serves, the usual number trotted out (70-something cents for every dollar a man makes) is an actual, accurate number, but only averages every working man and woman in the country together, without accounting for hours worked and other factors; once you do that and are actually comparing the genders for the same amount and type of work, there is still a gap, but it's 90-something cents for every dollar. Basically, yes, there is still some work to be done here, but there has been definite progress in recent years on this front. Which more or less segues into...

Happy to explain:

There is a gender pay gap, it is 70 cents to the dollar. It's been debunked time and time again because of the different gender roles within the workplace and career paths taken by men and women. Women tend to occupy roles that fit into their lifestyle. Particularly, they opt for stable positions over highly competitive positions, partly because stable positions allow them a pregnancy and accompanying leave without risking future income.

Men opt for more competitive, less stable, higher risk but also higher reward work paths. This is where the discrepancy comes from: it is not actually a pay gap between genders, it is the way the genders work out their career priorities differently that makes a gap appear on paper.

There is absolutely no truth whatsoever that women are actually paid less than men in the same roles.

Again, though, I'm really not convinced that treating this sort of thing as genuinely "fascinating and horrific" is honestly the best way to go about it - as that comic I linked put it, "Starship Sarkeesian is fueled by hate." As you yourself note, we're dealing with a very loud but very small number of 'true believers" here - everyone else who could be considered a "supporter" of such movements is assuredly not comfortable with a fair amount of the platform (do you really think most women, or progressive-minded men for that matter, are so quick to embrace "anti-male fascism"?) but decide to go along, or at least not say "whoa, hold on a minute", when they see the public (and sometimes not-so-public) faces of the supposed "opposition" screeching and flinging feces all over the place in response to it (i.e. "jeez, if they're this afraid of a handful of bloggers, maybe there really is something to it...").

If the reactionary voices are left to echo into the internet's bottomless void of apathy, then there's no way any commercial entity will feel obligated to cater to their whims. And to tie things back to the first item, if you want to keep the most shameless types from gaining prominence you'll be willing to keep one's worst impulse-driven reactions in check and say "I support closing the pay gap, but first we need to make sure the numbers are straight" as opposed to "Didn't you entitled idiots hear that your figures are BS? Get off your high horse and out of my face" - or, in this case, "I've got no problem with more diverse representation in gaming, though I don't think every single game has to try to be 'forward-thinking'", as opposed to "You'll have to rip my balls off of my cold, dead groin, you fat, brainwashed feminazi."

Actually, it's a lot more widespread than you seem to know. Canada in particular now has a widespread third-wave feminist movement that regularly take to the streets. Obama's pay gap speech has been a response to the media uprising of this new feminist movement, while Emma watson, Sarkeesian and others have been addressing the UN on a topic of discrimination that barely even exists.

You're wrong to assume it's just a small minority. SJW's and third-wave feminism is now going hand in hand, doubling the size and influence of completely erroneous claims and converting similarly weak minds to the non-cause.

I would suggest you head over to youtube to see the extent of the madness revealed. You might be surprised and shocked at what you find.

And if you do happen on one of Anita Sarkeesian's conferences, I warn you: that woman writes everything down on paper and then orates in the most verbose and painfully convoluted manner imaginable in an attempt to sound intelligent. It doesn't work, and it's very hard to listen to.

[evil_ash_xero]

When it comes to the whole "vs. third wave feminism thing", the gender pay gap is not something I really dwell on. I have had some debates with feminist friends, or girls who lean in that direction. But I mainly focus on censorship, and stuff like that. That's a way bigger thing, for me personally.
If there IS a pay gap, then obviously something should be done about it.

But when I have looked into it, it does seem like it's based on what jobs women take, and how often they take off work, and things like that. I'm finding that it may indeed be a "myth", but I'm not that stubborn about it. I'm open to info on it.

The 1 in 5 women have been sexually assaulted on campus, is something that is absolutely a myth though. The report they got that from, is a complete joke. But they'll spit it out, like it's gospel.

Before the last year, I didn't really have an opinion on this kind of thing. You could have probably made m think that "anti feminist" was anti women. I really had no clue. So any kind of figures they spout, I'd like to see the data on. They stretch the truth...a lot.

You have to remember, these are the same people that act like gamers hate women. That has always been strange to me, as gamers are some of the most thirsty, pathetic, beta dudes out there. They are tripping over themselves, to have women in their group.

I mean, I have only seen about 2 women on here. But it has nothing to do with the atmosphere or anything. They're just not into these games, for whatever reasons. No big conspiracy.
I'm quite sure everyone here would have no problems, whatsoever, if women joined. But if we somehow were in the spotlight, it would be like "shmups forum only has 2 women members. this is a forum of misogyny!".
This is sort of how they look at it. If they're not here...we are keeping them from joining. Which isn't true at all.

I've seen a lot more on GameFAQs, but it's still like 10 percent or something.

I'd really have to see some proof, to see that gamers hate women, or GG is pushing "women out of tech". It looks like complete crap to me.

[Squire Grooktook]

I mean, I have only seen about 2 women on here. But it has nothing to do with the atmosphere or anything. They're just not into these games, for whatever reasons. No big conspiracy.

IIRC there are several more then that, including a friend of mine* who I talk with every now and then, they just don't advertise themselves as being female on the forum. Your point is valid though.

*I don't think she's posted here in a while though. Still plays a lot of Ibara though.

[Skykid]

Bulletmagnet and other interested parties:

Feminism vs. Truth

Gender wage gap appears at 1:37, but the whole thing is worth watching, it's only 5 minutes long.

[mamboFoxtrot]

You have to remember, these are the same people that act like gamers hate women. That has always been strange to me, as gamers are some of the most thirsty, pathetic, beta dudes out there. They are tripping over themselves, to have women in their group.

"Misogyny", at least nowadays, means more than just hatred of women, so gamers being "thirsty, pathetic, beta dudes" "tripping over themselves to have women in their group" wouldn't contradict them being "misogynists" if they're viewing women as merely things to have around to increase their perceived masculinity and status.

[Squire Grooktook]

The "things"/objectification argument is based on an almost faith based assumption that it's impossible for a man to look at a woman lustfully without conciously or subconciously asserting to himself that she's not a person. Obviously humanity is filled with assholes so there are people like that, but the way people in this debate talk about "objectification" you'd think that it's an unavoidable consequence of all sexuality.

I admit, it's one of the arguments in this debate that irritates me the most. I can accept some lady feminist telling me how she feels about things, but please don't tell me how I feel or what's going on in my head. You (speaking generally) don't know that, good sir or madame.

[mamboFoxtrot]

Yeah, unfortunately a lot of people can't be bothered to separate the symptoms from the disease, and assume anyone blowing their nose has the flu. The Hayes Code, the "murder simulator" argument, and now "looking at CG animu tits makes men see women as mere blow-up dolls" argument all make the same basic mistake.

[evil_ash_xero]

You have to remember, these are the same people that act like gamers hate women. That has always been strange to me, as gamers are some of the most thirsty, pathetic, beta dudes out there. They are tripping over themselves, to have women in their group.

"Misogyny", at least nowadays, means more than just hatred of women, so gamers being "thirsty, pathetic, beta dudes" "tripping over themselves to have women in their group" wouldn't contradict them being "misogynists" if they're viewing women as merely things to have around to increase their perceived masculinity and status.

The term seems to mean a lot of things now.

However, I still don't think there is much misogyny in games fandom. Even taking into account what the term seems to mean now.
Honestly, every type of sexism seems to be under they misogyny umbrella now. Stuff like this makes words lose power.

When I was younger, the only person I knew of that was called that, was comic book writer Dave Simm. And that was it. "Sexist" was thrown around a lot. But not the "m word". Now, you barely hear "sexist". They go straight to most extreme thing they can think of.

Don't like Thor being a woman? Misogynist.

[Mischief Maker]

Alright, if we're going beyond the machinations of gamergate and analyzing feminism itself, I'm gonna pull this thread down the rabbit hole of my own counter-cultural weirdness.

Of course men judge their wives and steady girlfriends as sex objects, and there is definitely a cultural cause of this behavior. Absolutely! But not because of scantily clad female imagery in the media.

If a man meets a woman and has a deep intellectual connection with her, but then marries another woman, that intellectual simpatico can continue uninterrupted. If a man has a female coworker and they work really well as a team, marriage to another does not interfere with that relationship. Same if another woman makes a man laugh, is fun, or any number of other non-sexual reasons a man might enjoy a woman's company. But if he dares to have sex with another woman when bound to a monogamous relationship, the glass unicorn is shattered, love instantly turns to hate, and if they were married they both will face severe economic harm. Clearly this final scenario is one a man is encouraged by society to avoid, so the seemingly obvious solution is to find a woman who turns him on SO MUCH that she will outshine the sexual attractiveness of other women for the entirety of his remaining life.

In other words, he's judging her as a sex object, because that's the only quality that matters within this system.

The real problem with "third wave feminism" is that it's incomplete. Women are trying to assert themselves as free persons, but still doing it within the slave mentality of the old patriarchal norms. "With great power comes great responsibility," right? Then logically, "With no power comes no responsibility." The silver lining of being a slave is that it's never your fault, it's always someone else's responsibility. In our sexually repressive past, women were encouraged to view all her life's problems as some man's responsibility, first her father's, then her husband's. "Nagging" is how a slave attempts to assert herself, by trying to make the responsible man in her life take the action she's powerless to do herself.

The problem with trying to empower yourself from within such a framework is that it blinds you to the non-male causes of your unhappiness. Whether it be from bad systems or cultural habits among women that reinforce subservience, but couched in terms of "women need to stick together!"

Cinderella is still beloved and adapted into movies to this day. But no matter how much pro-feminist talk you try to sprinkle into the story, the fact of the matter is the crux of her Fairy Godmother's plan is to make Cinderella as sexually attractive as possible, have her turn the prince on by dancing with him all night, then right as he's going to invite her to his bedroom have her blueball him. This will not bring out love in the prince, this brings out covetousness, and the more he desires this rare commodity called Cinderella, the higher the price he's willing to pay. Cinderella's fairy godmother's plan succeeded because she turned Cinderella into a sought-after sex object.

Before they can even talk, women in our society are raised to be sex objects, oftentimes by their own feminist mothers who fail to see the inherent sexism of the story because it's couched in terms of oppressed female characters "sticking together."

While considering my post, check out this video. It's less than two minutes and very funny!

Thoughts?

[Opus131]

The problem with third wave feminists is that what they believe is sheer, utter nonsense.

I also like how this supposed "objectification" of women is a problem feminists themselves created with the so called "sexual revolution". Back in the days of this supposed "patriarchy" women were seen as everything BUT as sexual objects. How do feminists explain this discrepancy?

[Durandal]

There's one argument concerning 'objectification of women in media' that I don't get, which is that fictional scantily-clad, well-endowed female characters are sexist because it is the (male) writer who made the character a sex object, but it is not sexist if a woman cosplays as said character, because the woman has the freedom to choose how she dresses herself, while the fictional character is made with a purpose (to supposedly attract adolescent teenage boys) and its freedom is dictated by the writer.
It is supposedly sexist because the fictional character gives off the image that this is how the perfect woman should look like, yet it is not sexist if a real woman cosplays her, probably because the real woman in question does not necessarily needs to have the perfect body type to cosplay anything, but in that case it must not be the costume, hair or design of the character that makes it sexist. So basically, you could make any character not sexist by not giving them a 'perfect' idealized-by-men body. I'd imagine making the entire Dead or Alive cast overweight would instantly alleviate many of the criticsm surrounding it.
So what is it about these perfect bodies that causes third-wave feminists to groan and cringe in unison? I think it's too easy to just say that they cannot or don't want to possibly achieve those bodies through hard work and dedication, because they are free strong women who don't want to change their bodies to appeal to men, and thus see these bodies as a mark of the conservative patriarchy, which are sexist and thus must be removed. In the end there are women who are considered beautiful by today's standards, even if they put out or not.

But all of this leaves me with another question: so what? So what if a game sells on sex appeal? Sure, it's shameless, but not necessarily something we should erect a Ministry of Culture over to keep it away from our shelves. A franchise of games with sexy women is not going to strongly influence the minds of other gamers and game developers to the point of causing more T&A to be present in all games unless it sells 10 million copies. And guess what doesn't sell 10 million copies? Games that sell on sex appeal. Because there's more to games than simulating the perfect waifu, as we already have the internet for our sleazy needs, so it's not like we need games for that. Sexy women on the cover are indeed appealing to men, but nobody is going to spend 10 hours or more on (the same) porn. Games like Senran Kagura are fun to play aside from all the fanservice, and the characters actually develop over the course of the games instead of just remaining the same bland archetypal tittymonsters. Fun gameplay, a decent-enough storyline and fanservice on top is why people keep buying Senran Kagura games. You don't have to be a misogynist to enjoy a game like Dead or Alive or Senran Kagura.

Which brings us to morals and ethics, and why supposedly sexist video game characters are considered morally objectionable in the West. Most critics towards these characters come from the USA, where gratuitous and mindless violence is overlooked while sex is decadent and unacceptable, as a result of Christian values being the most common in the USA, now having somehow swung from the conservative right to the liberal left. Shooting someone in the crotch for bonus points does not generate nearly as much outrage as a character like Bayonetta does by simply existing, which is justified by proponents because 'sexism in games is different and requires more awareness, these sexist games are morally objectionable and simply shouldn't be released here'. But I think it is unfair to judge a game as a whole for being morally objectionable for having sex appeal. The morale of the game in question could actually be about being careful who you trust, that being successful as a woman does not depend on your sex appeal, and many more. Unless the game is somehow encouraging its players to commit crimes and be worse people in general, I can hardly find a game morally repugnant. Remember, that Catcher in the Rye was banned after it supposedly inspired someone to kill John Lennon, and a danger to our society that had to be censored/removed. Yet there's no evidence to support the notion that people who play 'sexist' games commit rape crimes, become more misogynist, or become worse human beings. To what degree should morals decide what is and is not acceptable in art? Regardless of the answer, games should not be held to a different standard than other artforms like movies or literature, which can contain sexual and uncomfortable themes without causing an outrage.

Again, fanservice games are shameless, but not necessarily something we should erect a Ministry of Culture over to keep it away from our shelves. Sexually idealized characters do not necessarily set the standard for how women should look and behave, either. If anything, feminist 'slutwalks' prove otherwise.

[Mischief Maker]

I also like how this supposed "objectification" of women is a problem feminists themselves created with the so called "sexual revolution". Back in the days of this supposed "patriarchy" women were seen as everything BUT as sexual objects. How do feminists explain this discrepancy?

I would love to hear the train of logic that lead you to this conclusion.

[Opus131]

It is not a "conclusion" derived from any particular argument, logical or otherwise. It is historical fact.