Is timing out bosses legit?

CIT · Post by **CIT** » Tue Jan 31, 2006 6:01 pm

Okay, so I'm playing Xexex currently, and most of the bosses are sort of pushovers, except for the level 5 boss, where many highly unpredictable things can happen. If you try to kill him, that is.

Although I'm getting pretty good at the former method, I've also discovered a pretty safe way to just run away from him for a couple of minutes and wait for his self destruction.

So what do you think? Is timing out bosses something a respectable shmupper should be doing? Or do you consider it cheating?

Post by **Icarus** » Tue Jan 31, 2006 6:22 pm

Depends on the game and the situation. I really cannot handle Midi's last form in Ibara without a hadou, and usually I don't have one available. So I just time her out, and make it to stage3 safely ^_-

As one of the poll options states: "All's fair in love and war."

professor ganson · Post by **professor ganson** » Tue Jan 31, 2006 6:24 pm

Playing on full defaults? No continues? Then it doesn't matter how you get your score or 1cc. No rules broken, no harm done.

it290 · Post by **it290** » Tue Jan 31, 2006 6:36 pm

Timing out a boss is usually going to reflect in your score, so yeah, it's fair game. If you can get a higher score by timing out the boss than by killing them, that kinda sucks IMO. I do like the Psikyo method of having a huge explosion intended to take you out rather than just having the boss meekly run away, though.

zlk · Post by **zlk** » Tue Jan 31, 2006 6:52 pm

When playing ddp II, even if you try hard to kill some of the bosses they still time out. I also see no problems with letting the bosses time out. It is part of the game.

Zweihander · Post by **Zweihander** » Tue Jan 31, 2006 9:06 pm

Boss timeout is like using a Bomb. It's being a pussy, to some extent-- but the creators gave you bombs and made the boss time out for a reason, regardless of peer-pressure within the genre or status "titles" given to said "cowards". (fuck, i let bosses time out unless there's a time bonus. except for Chaos Field, since time bonuses are insignificant to milking potential.)

Examples of timeout harming your score:
Ikaruga's boss-kill bonus.
ESPGaluda's bosses draining slowly at your coins.
Homura's bosses timing out after 30 seconds.

Examples of strategic boss-timeout:
Psyvariar games. When you can rape the game by buzzing with bullets, why kill their source?
Chaos Field. Time Bonus? What time bonus?
R-Type... Sometimes, it's best to just let them throw a fit and walk away....

zinger · Post by **zinger** » Tue Jan 31, 2006 9:15 pm

it290 wrote:Timing out a boss is usually going to reflect in your score, so yeah, it's fair game. If you can get a higher score by timing out the boss than by killing them, that kinda sucks IMO.

Seconded. Hmm, Border Down subtracts 6.000.000 pts from stage end bonus if you time out a boss.

Sly Cherry Chunks · Post by **Sly Cherry Chunks** » Tue Jan 31, 2006 10:02 pm

The Moai boss on Gradius III is virtually impossible. Much easier to just dodge until it times out.

tizerist · Post by **tizerist** » Tue Jan 31, 2006 10:13 pm

its totally fair.
theres a certain boss in a certain thunder force game where i choose a certain weapon and blast away in the corner. he cant get me there.
i've varied the technique a bit now, but it still takes up a good chunk of my strategy to win.
is that fair? yes
is it a bit cheap? yes......
but still fair

Andi · Post by **Andi** » Tue Jan 31, 2006 11:31 pm

Zweihander wrote:except for Chaos Field, since time bonuses are insignificant to milking potential.)

This is off subject: If you don't kill a boss in Chaos Field but instead let him time out, are you still awarded the combo bonus (that you typically would receive when you kill him) when he self-destructs?

Edge · Post by **Edge** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 12:34 am

Yeah, I think every dirty trick (without real cheats) is fair.

I also use suicide as a sollution to push scores, or I think many here milk bosses if they see an oportunity for it.

I consider this as some kind of strategy... ... even if it means to play a bit cheap.

Zweihander · Post by **Zweihander** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 12:41 am

Andi wrote:
Zweihander wrote:except for Chaos Field, since time bonuses are insignificant to milking potential.)
This is off subject: If you don't kill a boss in Chaos Field but instead let him time out, are you still awarded the combo bonus (that you typically would receive when you kill him) when he self-destructs?

Of course! What's that-- BALANCE?! ...in Chaos Field?! pa-SHAW!

Randorama · Post by **Randorama** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 12:57 am

no, it's not, i've denounced you to the shmups Inquisition, in case you wonder

gameoverDude · Post by **gameoverDude** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 1:23 am

All's fair since a boss timeout is due to the game's design. Of course you generally cheat yourself out of the boss' kill value if you time it out.

In Psyvariar, you could time out the boss to be able to buzz more bullets- but with practice it should be possible to get the boss' life down to destroy it right at the last second.

Fenrir · Post by **Fenrir** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 2:41 am

Yeah, timeout is fine. Even because in most of the games timing out bosses means that you won't max your points and your final judice will be "go to your room and no dessert" so I'd time them out only if forced or uncapable to destroy them.

There was a game - I don't remember which or on which platform - that gave you 2 minutes to kill the boss (there was a timer on top of the screen) and if you didn't kill him he simply went away only to come back after a while - only STRONGER.
That was the downside of waiting too much. It's that kind of deja-vu you have with games like altered beast or sol divide, only worse.
I feel dirty when I time out bosses, while I feel extremely satisfied when I nuclearize using one or two smart bombs as icing on the cake. It makes you feel

.

Post by **BulletMagnet** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 4:56 am

It's pretty much just another case of risk versus reward...if you want the points for killing the boss, blast him and risk getting him angry. If you'd rather play it safe and live to fight another day, let him go, but miss out on the points.

Then, of course, there are games like Psyvariar, as was mentioned, which encourage you to drag boss fights out, but in most cases the above seems to be the main idea.

tizerist · Post by **tizerist** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 5:31 pm

i'm quite surprised.
i expected a few " i NEVER do that!" responses from the hardcore on here, yet everyone seems to accept it as just part of the game, which it is.
i dont know whether to applaud or spit.
i applaud.

TVG · Post by **TVG** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 7:26 pm

id kill babies if they count towards chaining, so yea, its fair.

CIT · Post by **CIT** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 7:31 pm

The vagrant wrote:id kill babies if they count towards chaining, so yea, its fair.

Play Blazing Star?

Cuz killing babies counts towards chaining in that game - literally!

landshark · Post by **landshark** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 9:20 pm

Psikyo bosses are dangerous to let time out. They usually emit a super fast radial spread that is faster than most people's reflexes.

It's what makes no-shot runs so damned difficult in their games.