Please tell me i didn't screw up...

JBC · Post by **JBC** » Tue Jan 17, 2006 9:52 pm

Being the huge FPS fan that i am i have decided to build a new desktop specifically for playing Quake 4 and Q4-Enemy Territory. Now obviously i was able to find the minimum system requirements which are -

Windows 2000/XP
2 Ghz Processor
512 MB RAM
2.8 GB HD Space
64 MB Video Card

...but i was wondering if anyone had any recomendations as to what kind of video card and such i would use to really make the game fly. I'm trying to stay at or around 600 bucks with this and still get a nice lcd monitor to go along with it...

superhitachi4 · Post by **superhitachi4** » Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:27 pm

Are you looking to buy brand new hardware? If you go the PCI-E interface route, and you're comfortable tweaking a bit, you could go with a nice Sapphire X800 GTO2. In most cases, you can unlock the 12 pipelines to 16, then proceed to overclock a little. Over all, this will give you the performance of a much more expensive card. Don't get me wrong...these aren't exactly cheap either. They run around 200 U.S. on newegg. Ultimately, a 7800GT would be the best option, but that's 300. (modern PC gaming isn't cheap if you're buying new stuff) Well worth the 300 if you don't mind spending it, and much better than the GTO2, or X850XT PE. The price/performance ratio of a 7800GT vs GTX makes the GT a much better buy at the moment. Going the AMD CPU route will save you a bit. 2GB DDR/DDR2 in dual channel would be ideal for up coming games, but 1GB in dual channel should suffice. Tight budget, but still possible.

judesalmon · Post by **judesalmon** » Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:30 pm

Yeah, I agree - you shouldn't bother making a new system with anything less than 1GB of memory now.

it290 · Post by **it290** » Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:40 pm

Keep in mind that although the X800 cards are good bang for the buck (an X800GTO is what I'm using, and I like it a lot), anything using the Doom 3 engine tends to perform better on Nvidia hardware. So if Q4 is really your main concern, you might want to opt for an Nvidia instead.

Vexorg · Post by **Vexorg** » Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:55 pm

If you've only got $600 to spend including the monitor, I'd just stick with the one you have now. To get an LCD worthwhile for gaming is going to cost you at least $300, which is half your budget right there.

My favorite site for PC hardware advice for years has been HardOCP. They tend to be oriented primarily toward the performance user/gamer with an emphasis on higher end stuff, but should still have good advice.

JBC · Post by **JBC** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 12:16 am

If you've only got $600 to spend including the monitor, I'd just stick with the one you have now. To get an LCD worthwhile for gaming is going to cost you at least $300, which is half your budget right there

lol - well, i have a source that takes care of that kind of thing.

*wink*

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 8:35 pm

somebodies involved in cri-ime... :)

JBC · Post by **JBC** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 10:16 pm

Well... i don't ask and they don't tell. I'm assuming they have some guy down at Best Buy or one of those big department stores that overstocks some orders and this and that. It seems really shady to me but hey - as long as i don't find out there ripping off any small buisnesses (which is doubtful of someone in Scottsdale).

Stormwatch · Post by **Stormwatch** » Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:23 pm

Maybe this machine...

it290 · Post by **it290** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 12:35 am

The 360 port of Quake 4 is supposed to suffer from all kinds of framerate problems and whatnot.

JBC · Post by **JBC** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 12:45 am

Yeah - that's why i am not going to trust some X-Box to give me perfect Quake and Doom...

JBC · Post by **JBC** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 6:15 am

Ok guys, here's what i got. I really hope i didn't just screw up - this machine supposedly will play Doom 3 and Quake 4 to near perfection so...

Processor - AMD Athlon 64 3500 Socket 939 Processor
Motherboard - ASUS A8V-MX Socket 939 Motherboard
Memory - 512 MB PC3200 DDR (2 x 256 MB)
Floppy - Sony 1.44 MB Black Floppy Drive
Hard Drive - Hitachi 0A30356 80 GB SATA Hard Drive
Case - In Win V523T Micro ATX Tower 350 Watt
Optical Drive - Gigabyte W1623A 16x Dual Layer DVD rewriter
Video - Microstar FX5500-TD 256 MB AGP video card

Uh... did i do good? I sure as hell hope so...

sethsez · Post by **sethsez** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 6:26 am

It isn't going to give you perfect Quake and Doom, but it'll suffice if you can deal with not having all the effects turned up. Still, it might be a better idea to wait until you can afford something better.

What's your card budget? For $300 you can get this which is a HELL of a lot better than what you have there. It'll require a beefy power source, though (beefier than what you have there... of course, getting a good power source for a MicroATX case is tricky, so you might just want to ignore this card if you're set on MicroATX).

Also, update ram.

JBC · Post by **JBC** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 6:28 am

Hmm... thanks Seth. But will it at least make it look about as good (or preferably better) than the X-Box versions?

sethsez · Post by **sethsez** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 6:31 am

Yes, it will. It won't look the best it can look, but it'll look better than Doom 3 on the Xbox (which I still feel is the better version of the game, despite being uglier).

The ram is going to be a bottleneck, though.

Edit: if by "it" you mean the card I linked, it'll run Doom 3 engine games pretty much perfectly (or at least as perfectly as any card will under $400). My above reply is assuming "it" meant your current setup.

JBC · Post by **JBC** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 6:44 am

Awesome... you have no idea how much that sets my mind at ease. I got all this for 650 bucks including labor so i think i've done pretty well. My next step is finding a badass flat panel monitor for it. For now i'm settling for just a plane ole' box monitor but i actually have a way to hook just the screen up to my laptop (which is a crummy acer but has a badass screen).

EDIT - Turns out my source couldn't hook me up with a real monitor after all...

I do like the X-Box version of the games but i still wanted it to be a little better graphically just to impress my friends when i show them what i'll be blowing them away on when Enemy Territory: Quake Wars is released...

I'll probably get the better card when the price lowers a bit... my only other concern is the fact that within a couple months i'll be moving to Mississippi out in the middle of nowhere and might have trouble finding a internet provider that can give me a fast enough connection to play QW on...

Still - i'm sure i'll manage...

superhitachi4 · Post by **superhitachi4** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 6:53 am

Congrats on the new rig, circuitface. I doubt you'll be running Quake 4, or Doom 3 at near perfection with an FX5500, and 512mb of RAM, but you should be okay on moderate settings for a while. As seth said, it should look better than Doom 3 on the Xbox. In the future though, you should really think about more RAM, and a different video card. Since you're on 2x256mb, I guess we can do our best with that, and dual channel it, assuming your board supports it (which it probably does). Ideally though, you should have at least a gig. If you're on a really tight card budget, I've seen a few 9800 pros for about 50 bucks here and there. That's still a respectable card for the cash (assuming you can snag one around that range).

Vexorg · Post by **Vexorg** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 7:03 am

circuitface wrote:Ok guys, here's what i got. I really hope i didn't just screw up - this machine supposedly will play Doom 3 and Quake 4 to near perfection so...

Processor - AMD Athlon 64 3500 Socket 939 Processor
Motherboard - ASUS A8V-MX Socket 939 Motherboard
Memory - 512 MB PC3200 DDR (2 x 256 MB)
Floppy - Sony 1.44 MB Black Floppy Drive
Hard Drive - Hitachi 0A30356 80 GB SATA Hard Drive
Case - In Win V523T Micro ATX Tower 350 Watt
Optical Drive - Gigabyte W1623A 16x Dual Layer DVD rewriter
Video - Microstar FX5500-TD 256 MB AGP video card

Uh... did i do good? I sure as hell hope so...

Not bad, for the budget you've got. I probably would have gone a bit higher on the video card (but the budget may not permit it.) Also note that if you do make significant upgrades in the future (e.g. putting in a higher-end video card or more drives) you may need to upgrade to a better (450W or better) power supply. What you have is probably sufficient for now, but could lead to issues down the road. Also plan on adding another 512MB RAM when you get the chance, since that will improve performance significantly.

JBC · Post by **JBC** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 7:10 am

Heh... the cool thing is is that i actually quit my job today for a better one. No more customer service for me, and i'll be getting paid lots more. (Heh... working for your gf's pop's buisness has its advantages). So sometime soon i can probably upgrade all that stuff anyway

Building furniture cant be as bad as being a graveyard shift gas station attendant in Phoenix, right?

sethsez · Post by **sethsez** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 7:19 am

Honestly, the one thing I'd recommend against even at your budget is the microatx case. It's SO much easier finding a good power supply for a standard atx case, and if you plan to upgrade in the future you'll need a new power supply.

Thunder Force · Post by **Thunder Force** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 7:43 am

Stormwatch wrote:Maybe this machine...

Or one of those "console-looking" Shuttle PCs

JBC · Post by **JBC** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 7:48 am

^^^ lol - he actually asked me if i wanted one of those. I paused and said, "Nah... that's why i want the plain casing. I hate it when people try to make thier tech look like something from The Jetsons..."

Vexorg · Post by **Vexorg** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 10:16 am

I actually think a Shuttle box like one of those wouldn't be a bad idea in a situation like this... The small form factor stuff really has kept up well with full size desktops, and is a lot easier to find a place for. Shuttle is a also well respected brand among PC hobbyists. I agree that finding a decent case is a pain though, since there seems to be a lot of them out there right now that look like rejects from the toy factory. Right now, I use the Antec Sonata for my desktop system. I think it looks quite nice, and it is quiet too (although mine is a bit louder than their specs, since I replaced the power supply with a higher watt one and I have a somewhat louder CPU fan.) It's probably a little more money than you'd want to spend on a $600 budget though (I think it runs about $129 last I checked, but you can find deals.)

it290 · Post by **it290** » Sat Jan 21, 2006 1:20 am

I use a Shuttle (an older one, an SN41G2) as my main gaming machine. It's nice, but after having experienced it, I wouldn't recommend it as a gaming rig for the following reasons:

a. Power supply is a bit anemic, they have a better one out now but you still might have problems with a beefy video card, two hard drives, and an optical drive in there.
b. Only certain cards will fit in the case, and forget about trying to cool your video card passively.
c. It was a lot of work to make the thing quiet.. I ended up replacing the northbridge heatsink, case fan, PSU fan, and dremelling a hole in the back of the case to make it run nice and cool and quiet at the same time.
d. You really can't replace the motherboard without buying a whole new kit on most of these. The one I have is socket A and there's no way to upgrade it to a 939 motherboard for example... I could buy a newer Shuttle mobo but they're expensive by themselves and the front panel connectors wouldn't be right.
e. Not many slots, so you can't really fit a whole lot of extra hardware in there. Hasn't really been an issue for me, as all I have in there is a video card and a sound card, but if I wanted a SATA controller for example I'd have to take the sound card out.

That said, they're still cool systems, and if you plan on doing a lot of LANing they're worth it for the portability, but generally speaking a full size ATX case is less hassle.

JBC · Post by **JBC** » Sun Jan 22, 2006 7:43 am

My mind has been blown. Now i just need to use my pc relocator stuff on it... *shuffles off*

Diabollokus · Post by **Diabollokus** » Sun Jan 22, 2006 2:04 pm

Is it cheaper to build your own high end gaming PC or just buy a premade one? heard your own built machine is much faster.

judesalmon · Post by **judesalmon** » Mon Jan 23, 2006 5:23 am

The 360 version of Quake 4 looks pretty good, but unfortunately runs like a dog, and the PC version is a lot cheaper anyway.

That set-up should run the games pretty well in high settings, but Quake 4 should be better - despite being the same engine, it seems less hungry than Doom 3, which may be down to optimisation of the engine.

gameoverDude · Post by **gameoverDude** » Mon Jan 23, 2006 6:08 am

it290 wrote:The 360 port of Quake 4 is supposed to suffer from all kinds of framerate problems and whatnot.

There are a few framerate problems, lasting for maybe a few seconds per occurrence. While this didn't kill the deal for me, I was a bit annoyed. I've finished Doom 3 on the Xbox, and have not seen any framerate jags on this- so these framerate problems that are in 360 Quake 4 should really NOT be happening. I think Raven was rushing the game for two reasons- 360 launch time and Christmas- and consequently didn't bother optimizing it correctly.

Doom 3 on Xbox is actually pretty close to the PC version save for some downgraded textures. Call of Duty 2 on the 360 turned out very well- it usually can hold close to 60 FPS.

JBC · Post by **JBC** » Mon Jan 23, 2006 7:49 am

gameoverDude wrote:Doom 3 on Xbox is actually pretty close to the PC version save for some downgraded textures.

VERY downgraded textures... i was amazed when i saw it on my pc after having played the XB version for so long...

Post by **Shatterhand** » Mon Jan 23, 2006 12:22 pm

I havent played Quake 4 or Doom 3... but my system is a lot more humble than that, and I am still to see any game that fails to play properly on it.

Maybe It won't run Quake 4 indeed.

Of course, I never had any problems in lowering detail, turning off effects and playing at a low resolution. Maybe some people can't stand doing that.