wii Virtual Console and scart/rgb

[KabuTheFox]

often times when i am looking at topics about the best possible quality for the gamecube i often see that the wii is mentioned as the best current choice for those not willing to spend $200~ on a cable (gamecube component), one thing i often see noted about the wii as well though is that it notably has bad retro gaming capabilities such as with the nes and snes.

has anyone ever tried to use rgb scart with the wii's virtual console?
i am curious if the results are any better or if they are still the same faded blurry mess that i usually see the virtual console as

[bobrocks95]

Are you talking about playing virtual console games in 480p on a flat panel, or 240p/480i on a CRT?

If you're stuck in 480i, you can play games in 240p using component cables, though I forget if it's the default or if you have to put in a button combination. That should look virtually identical to RGB, unless the Wii doesn't just blur 480p, but blurs all component signals (I don't think it does).

If you are referring to the 480p blur filter making things look bad, that means you're on a digital flat panel and 240p/480i via SCART won't look any better, unless your TV processes either exceptionally well.

As an aside, NES Virtual Console games are still darker than they should be; Nintendo's reasoning AFAIK is that it's to mimic the darker image scanlines would create, but that's worthless on a CRT and still looks bad on anything else.

[KabuTheFox]

bad clarity on my behalf i apologize.

my idea / question in mind is if were to use the wii with rgb scart through the xrgb mini (for scaling/processing) would that fix the issues that the system seems to have with retro games? or do the wii retro games look bad because thats how nintendo decided to port them?

this is the general comparision between wii and nes/snes, the wii is often shown with having faded and desaturated video compared to the actual console

wii (not sure what cables) vs nes with rgb scart

so to reitterate my question. would rgb scart on the wii fix this?

------

to answer your question though, this would be for use on an hdtv (however i am using my own video processor)
and i suppose you might have answered my question with your last line, it sounds like nintendo intentionally ported the vc games this way....which is a shame

[BONKERS]

The Wii U is a different story. You can't get 240p out of it. And yes it's true on the Wii U they use I think a Bilinear filter. Which isn't uncommon in emulation.

If you have a Wii, there are many standalone emulators which will work and look fine.

If you can get/use actual RGB then that's better because the Mini doesn't have the best Component Video upscaling.

[spmbx]

You're talking about wii but post a picture saying wiiu. Those are not the same, and nintendo should be ashamed of how bad nes emulation looks on wiiu

[KabuTheFox]

You're talking about wii but post a picture saying wiiu. Those are not the same, and nintendo should be ashamed of how bad nes emulation looks on wiiu

i actually did not even notice that to be honest since the video itself is listed as wii vs nes, regardless that still seems to be the general complaint about the vc on the wii as well is that it is just really dark and blurry. least from what i generally hear / see less im just actively not noticing the "U" (which is possible)

The Wii U is a different story. You can't get 240p out of it. And yes it's true on the Wii U they use I think a Bilinear filter. Which isn't uncommon in emulation.

If you have a Wii, there are many standalone emulators which will work and look fine.

If you can get/use actual RGB then that's better because the Mini doesn't have the best Component Video upscaling.

apologies, guess im more tired than i thought, since i did not even notice that.
still haveto wonder though if the wii vc + rgb scart would look the same (or close to) that of the actual console.

edit: upon further research and backtracking i did actually completely disregard the U's in wiiU this entire time on many videos and comparisons....the wii vc seems near perfect and i am definately considering it instead of opting out for snes and gamecube separately (though having those physical snes carts would be really neat)

not a completely wasted topic though i guess, i was considering the wiiU as well a shame it lacks the hardware for direct gamecube support and its vc is crap for some reason (tho i would assume you could just use Wii mode and use its vc instead)

[Obiwanshinobi]

I wouldn't know about Virtual Console, but Wii is perfectly capable of legit, non-filtered 240p using an RGB lead (as homebrew shows).

[blizzz]

Iirc the 240p RGB output of VC games on the Wii doesn't have the brightness an blur issues of the 480p output. But it's been a while since I last used my Wii.

[BazookaBen]

Iirc the 240p RGB output of VC games on the Wii doesn't have the brightness an blur issues of the 480p output. But it's been a while since I last used my Wii.

Most games are fine as far as I know. I only have one NES game on it though, Super Mario Bros. 2 (JP). It seems a little dark, so maybe it's only NES games.

Castlevania: Rondo of Blood (PC Engine) looks great.

I wouldn't know about Virtual Console, but Wii is perfectly capable of legit, non-filtered 240p using an RGB lead (as homebrew shows).

When I was messing around with RGB, most Virtual Console games would automatically boot in 60hz 240p even though my Wii was in PAL mode. But component looks just as good as far as I can tell, no homebrew region-switching necessary.

[Konsolkongen]

The Wii has an amazing 240p RGB picture.
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e236/ ... gluck2.jpg

Really surprising

[bobrocks95]

Does the Wii U do filtering for just NES titles, or for everything on the Virtual Console (or at least everything 240p)?

NES games on Wii look kinda bad because of the colors, but not terrible. Haven't bought any VC games on Wii U, but I wouldn't have figured they'd have added filtering...

[Konsolkongen]

Filtering is optional on SNES and GBA. It looks pretty nice when the correct aspect ratio is set.

[BONKERS]

Does the Wii U do filtering for just NES titles, or for everything on the Virtual Console (or at least everything 240p)?

NES games on Wii look kinda bad because of the colors, but not terrible. Haven't bought any VC games on Wii U, but I wouldn't have figured they'd have added filtering...

NES only. Even DS games look just fine.

I don't mind the Bilinear filter on the NES games, but the brightness can be irritating. Give us the option at least!

[FinalBaton]

Does the wii have more lag than the original consoles? since it's emulation?

[BazookaBen]

Does the wii have more lag than the original consoles? because it's emulation?

Good question. I beat Rondo of Blood on Wii VC, so if it's laggy it's not too bad. Hopefully someone with the right equipment has run a couple tests.

[FinalBaton]

Does the wii have more lag than the original consoles? because it's emulation?

Good question. I beat Rondo of Blood on Wii VC, so if it's laggy it's not too bad. Hopefully someone with the right equipment has run a couple tests.

Cool.

And also : are the games downloaded playable without a connection? meaning that if a game is pulled from the store, can I still play it if I downloaded it?

[BazookaBen]

And also : are the games downloaded playable without a connection? meaning that if a game is pulled from the store, can I still play it if I downloaded it?

Yes, offline play is fine.

The bad part is that you can't log in to a different Wii and player your games. Games are tied to individual system. So if your Wii ever dies, you lose those games forever. Unless you call Nintendo and convince them to transfer the licenses, but they probably won't do that for the Wii anymore.

[bobrocks95]

Emulation inherently has lag doesn't it? I'd imagine it's around 2 frames and unnoticeable to most people playing on a CRT in the Virtual Console's case.

[BazookaBen]

Emulation inherently has lag doesn't it?

I don't see why it has to, or at least why it has to be more than a few ms when it's done right.

[bobrocks95]

Is it all VSync related then? Some emulators have "hard sync" options and other things, do those pretty much eliminate lag? I'm not well-read on the subject.

I know the worst emulator lag I've ever noticed is in the Wii U Smash's Masterpieces- Super Mario Bros. is literally unplayable and I'd consider that a feat.

[hosser]

And also : are the games downloaded playable without a connection? meaning that if a game is pulled from the store, can I still play it if I downloaded it?

Yes, offline play is fine.

The bad part is that you can't log in to a different Wii and player your games. Games are tied to individual system. So if your Wii ever dies, you lose those games forever. Unless you call Nintendo and convince them to transfer the licenses, but they probably won't do that for the Wii anymore.

Can't you just back up your NAND and write that to a new console?

When I ran the Wii to Wii U migration tool I backed up my NAND first - then once I'd transferred everything to the Wii U (all my VC purchases etc.) I just restored the Wii's NAND and now I have the same purchases on my Wii and Wii U. Can't see why this wouldn't work with a different console if your Wii died.

[blizzz]

Emulation inherently has lag doesn't it? I'd imagine it's around 2 frames and unnoticeable to most people playing on a CRT in the Virtual Console's case.

The VC emulators are on the same level as a Framemeister in terms of input lag, so roughly 1 frame. Retroarch has a bit more lag, to the point that I can clearly feel it. Emulators like Snes9x GX have even more lag and are unenjoyable for me on my LCD TV.

[12345]

@blizzz
Wait, are you saing you would take the Wii's VC over Retroarch to play emulated games?

[blizzz]

Yes, the SNES VC emulator has less input lag as far as I can tell.

[Bancho]

This is a 240p image on retroarch NES on a PAL Wii through RGB.

[12345]

Yes, the SNES VC emulator has less input lag as far as I can tell.

Interesting. Assuming you have a PAL system, how do you boot your (NTSC?) games in 240p? Do you use a certain loader or system hack?

[blizzz]

You have to use NTSC VC titles and Triiforce to force them into PAL 480i (results in 240p) output to get RGB and 60Hz.

[KabuTheFox]

so on the wii U is it only NES games that look horribly dark and blurry?