OMG Giga Wing 2 Review

[WarCheese]

Hello all:

Hmmm... I think rather than sending him email about his review, send him a link to SuperPlay!'s Giga Wing and Giga Wing 2 1CC replay.

http://www.super-play.co.uk/index.php?c ... &gameid=53

I can just see it... At first, he'll drop his jaw and be amazed... Then, he'll doubt whether the replay is real, whether it's put together by some movie editing technique or something. Finally, he'll come to realize why we love shmups so much.

Cheers.

WarCheese

[Edge]

"Dear Randorama: it is pretty obvious that this rather stupid thread was meant to just fill a gap. While you insist on its already aknowledged inconsistency?

Do you honestly think that writing in such pointless threads will change things in the universe? You won't become more hardcore or improve your scores by "moan" around, honestly...

Case closed, i hope. "



Sorry, don't take that so serious or be offended. I just couldn't ressist to show you the way that sounds to me.

Anyway, what is a forum for when not discussing ANY matters related with shmups. If you don't like a topic then you don't have to reply to it. But let the people talk about whatever they want, that's my opinion.


Besides if any of you want to gather more experience and joy out of shmupping, I'd like to invite you to the Weekly Online Shmeet in the Highscore section.

[Kiken]

You know, there are several traits in mainstream western reviews of shmups that are easily trackable:

There is an aversion to the bullet-hell environment... and to a lesser degree, vertical scrolling shmups in general. These are often noted as being "devoid of innovation" (when in fact, the movement from solid stage walls to veritable walls of bullets seems like logical progression).

Many of these reviews will praise slower-paced, more traditionally oriented horizontal scrollers (such as Gradius, R-Type, Darius... etc etc) for staying true to their roots.

To this degree, there is an easily recognizable hypocrasy.

Now, enter the oddity that is Ikaruga. It reveiwed pretty favourably with most Western "gaming journalists" (I know Rando loves that term).. and yet it easily classifies as bullet-hell and is vertical in nature. But unlike every other example of the sub-genre, Ikaruga does 2 things differently:

Ikaruga does not hide/mask its scoring gimmick in any way (the chaining system is blatantly obvious.. unlike games from Cave, Takumi, Skonec.. etc, where the scoring techniques are often more "concealed", so to speak)

Ikaruga allows the player to permanently absorb enemy fire (which has the effect of lessening the impact of the bullet-hell environment both visually and mentally to the player).


Now enter our good friend, Mars Matrix. MM possesses another trait found laudable in the West: unlockable content. Along with R-Type Final, Gradius 5, Ikaruga and several others, MM provides a form of "instant gratification". The player is awarded with new material simply for playing, regardless of their skill-level. Simply put, this grants an instant sense of accomplishment. The entire concept of playing a game to become better at it is now viewed as archaic, and something that only fanatics/pros pursue.

[captain ahar]

While connoisseurs of these genres may try to debate which species is superior, the answer is crystal to me. In my experience, side-scrollers tend to incorporate more elements than just the enemies. Most often there are rock formations to dodge, rapidly multiplying amoebae to blast through or narrow passageways to navigate while fending off attackers. Overheads usually rely upon heavier concentrations of enemy formations, have little to no interactivity with the stages and throw huge amounts of enemy projectiles to be avoided. Looking at those criteria, its my opinion that the side-scrollers are the superior sort, a thesis that gains strength by looking at the subject of this review—Giga Wing 2.

i know its just fuel but my favorite part is this.

he uses a game he has already stated he hates as proof, concerning the quality of verts in general. someone needs to reflect a few hundred bullets up in his grill...

and he likes Einhander... loser :P

[Neo Rasa]

Now enter our good friend, Mars Matrix. MM possesses another trait found laudable in the West: unlockable content. Along with R-Type Final, Gradius 5, Ikaruga and several others, MM provides a form of "instant gratification". The player is awarded with new material simply for playing, regardless of their skill-level. Simply put, this grants an instant sense of accomplishment. The entire concept of playing a game to become better at it is now viewed as archaic, and something that only fanatics/pros pursue.

Good summary. If you want another (non-shmup) example, most western magazines gave Mortal Kombat: Deception better reviews than Dead or Alive Ultimate because the former features more unlockable content. The game was cited specifically as being "deeper" because of the higher number of unkockables. Now, DoA is no Fatal Fury Special or Virtua Fighter 4 Evolution when it comes to deep gamplay, but Deception? I love the MK games to death but anyone knows they're the most broken games ever.

[Acid King]

You know, there are several traits in mainstream western reviews of shmups that are easily trackable:

There is an aversion to the bullet-hell environment... and to a lesser degree, vertical scrolling shmups in general. These are often noted as being "devoid of innovation" (when in fact, the movement from solid stage walls to veritable walls of bullets seems like logical progression).

Many of these reviews will praise slower-paced, more traditionally oriented horizontal scrollers (such as Gradius, R-Type, Darius... etc etc) for staying true to their roots.

To this degree, there is an easily recognizable hypocrasy.

Now, enter the oddity that is Ikaruga. It reveiwed pretty favourably with most Western "gaming journalists" (I know Rando loves that term).. and yet it easily classifies as bullet-hell and is vertical in nature. But unlike every other example of the sub-genre, Ikaruga does 2 things differently:

Ikaruga does not hide/mask its scoring gimmick in any way (the chaining system is blatantly obvious.. unlike games from Cave, Takumi, Skonec.. etc, where the scoring techniques are often more "concealed", so to speak)

Ikaruga allows the player to permanently absorb enemy fire (which has the effect of lessening the impact of the bullet-hell environment both visually and mentally to the player).


Now enter our good friend, Mars Matrix. MM possesses another trait found laudable in the West: unlockable content. Along with R-Type Final, Gradius 5, Ikaruga and several others, MM provides a form of "instant gratification". The player is awarded with new material simply for playing, regardless of their skill-level. Simply put, this grants an instant sense of accomplishment. The entire concept of playing a game to become better at it is now viewed as archaic, and something that only fanatics/pros pursue.

Don't forget about Radiant Silvergun, a game that is mentioned in almost every western shooter review. There you have a few elements that break the normal mold (RPG elements, chaining enemies), which it gets praised for. It's funny that the elements that have the uber hadcorez0rz shooter crowd dismissing Ikaruga and Silvergun as "puzzle games", or just plain not shooters in the typical sense of the word, are exactly what gets them held up by western reviewers.

[Kiken]

Don't forget about Radiant Silvergun, a game that is mentioned in almost every western shooter review. There you have a few elements that break the normal mold (RPG elements, chaining enemies), which it gets praised for. It's funny that the elements that have the uber hadcorez0rz shooter crowd dismissing Ikaruga and Silvergun as "puzzle games", or just plain not shooters in the typical sense of the word, are exactly what gets them held up by western reviewers.

I was considering mentioning Radiant Silvergun but chose not to. But since you brought it up...

In regards to most mainstream Western reviews, mentioning RSG serves 2 purposes:

A: It says that the reviewer is suave or cultured because s/he imports.
B: The game is seen as something of a status symbol given its resale value and the lack of initial popularity in the west for the console upon which it resides.

Now, once again, RSG's chaining (read: scoring gimmick) is technically no different from any other contemporary shmup... it simply isn't hidden (like Ikaruga). But, most western reviews dismiss the chaining, simply mentioning that it's there if you want to mess with it. The "attraction" toward the game is based on the following:
Saturn Mode allows you to save your weapon status (this easily falls under unlockable content)
You automatically start with your entire arsenal at the beginning of the game (no power-ups=fun + innovation=funnovation... yes, I'm being sarcastic)

[Rob]

Ikaruga does not hide/mask its scoring gimmick in any way (the chaining system is blatantly obvious.. unlike games from Cave, Takumi, Skonec.. etc, where the scoring techniques are often more "concealed", so to speak)

I don't get this part. How is the chaining more in the open? Numbers above every cube, a meter in every corner, ships leveling up... What's being hid?

[Alpolio]

Yeah. That's a pretty dumb review. And I just got through reading his review of Metal Slug 3 (link) and he loved that game. And he said that he was able to beat it too, which really surprised me given his lack of attention to Giga Wings 2. But there were a few things in that review that seemed odd.

"Unfortunately, that extended completion time is due solely to the new "no continue" system that forces you to bring your "A" game every time. Past Metal Slugs let deceased players pick up right where they died, and try again as many times as necessary."

He's rating against it because SNK removed the unlimited continues? Isn't "unlimited continues" the very thing that he was complaining about in Giga Wings 2??? But now that they're gone, he thinks that they should be put back?

"Additionally, those with fingers that tire quickly should know that Metal Slug 3 doesn't have a rapid-fire option available. I generally prefer holding down a button instead of tapping like a madman, but it's do-able if you keep some ice handy afterwards."

What? The rapid firing "heavy machine gun" is a rather common powerup. But he didn't make note of it. A strange oversight from a guy who says that he beat the game.

Well... I'm starting to think that he rated Metal Slug 3 an "8/10" because it's on Xbox and Giga Wings 2 a "3/10" because it's on the Dreamcast.

[BenT]

This strikes me as a really stale topic. I think we're all aware that 90% of mainstream reviewers cannot write shmup reviews that would pass muster with hardcore shmup-fans. There's no point to writing the authors or even calling out specific bits of stupidity here. Seriously. Don't care so much. These heathens will never experience the bliss of weaving through intricate clouds of fire, and it sucks for them. That's not worth us frothing over.

Then again, it might be better than a "what's your favorite cloud in a shmup?" topic.

[superhitachi4]

I'd guess he probably credit fed the crap out of Metal Slug 3, judging by his horribly ignorant review of Giga Wing 2.

[Marc]

Although stuff like this gets my blood pressure going, I must admit I can still remember the first time I was confronted with the original Giga Wing, and genuinely beleived that there were too many bullets to actually play the game properly. Of course, time proved me wrong. Though you'd think otherwise if you saw the ineptness with which I still play the original Point is though, yes this is an ignorant review, but as (most of us) are pretty knowledgeable and competent at these games, I think we sometimes underestimate how damn difficult and frustrating and overwhelming they can initially appear to 'outsiders'.

[D]

Let's kill Brad Gallaway
I am not a fan of Gigawing 2, and he has one or two good points but let's kill him anyway.

he hurt my shmup-feelings

[Alpolio]

This strikes me as a really stale topic. I think we're all aware that 90% of mainstream reviewers cannot write shmup reviews that would pass muster with hardcore shmup-fans. There's no point to writing the authors or even calling out specific bits of stupidity here. Seriously. Don't care so much. These heathens will never experience the bliss of weaving through intricate clouds of fire, and it sucks for them. That's not worth us frothing over.

Then again, it might be better than a "what's your favorite cloud in a shmup?" topic.

That was an old review and emailing complaints about something printed in 2001 seems kind of silly. But that review is so bad that it makes IGN's shmup reviews look like Mark Twain novels. And his dissing of vertical shmups was totally uncalled for. Radiant Silvergun is a vertical shmup! So in this instance, we need to complain.

I honestly believe that the used 8-bit & 16-bit system sales are skyrocketing because we're getting fed up with our options on the new systems. And I think that if all of us shmup fans were to stand up, the media would realize that we're more numerous than GTA fans.

[Zweihander]

......Damn, the author of that review sucked my cock so hard it hurts.......... :/

[Acid King]

I honestly believe that the used 8-bit & 16-bit system sales are skyrocketing because we're getting fed up with our options on the new systems. And I think that if all of us shmup fans were to stand up, the media would realize that we're more numerous than GTA fans.

lies and propaganda

[Rastan78]

Funny to see this resurface, because I started an almost identical topic many months ago on the old forum about the exact same review. That time the reviewers from gamecritics actually came out of the woodwork to post here and defend themselves. They turned out to be alright guys and the guy who wrote the Ikaruga review is actually a bit of a shmups fan, or still was at that time anyway.

I seem to recall them saying something about how they caught an astonishing amount of flak for that particular review. I guess the thing that we have to remember is that reviews are written for the fan base of a particular web page or magazine. If you read a video game review from Maxim magazine, for example, you can expect the writer to review games as they would be seen the eyes of the typical Maxim reader, not they way they would be seen by a hardcore arcade gamer. Still a crap review though.

[captain ahar]

Now, once again, RSG's chaining (read: scoring gimmick) is technically no different from any other contemporary shmup... it simply isn't hidden (like Ikaruga). But, most western reviews dismiss the chaining, simply mentioning that it's there if you want to mess with it. The "attraction" toward the game is based on the following:
Saturn Mode allows you to save your weapon status (this easily falls under unlockable content)
You automatically start with your entire arsenal at the beginning of the game (no power-ups=fun + innovation=funnovation... yes, I'm being sarcastic)

that last bit was some of the funniest material i have read in a good long while.

[Rob]

I seem to recall them saying something about how they caught an astonishing amount of flak for that particular review.

Which is really funny since 5 people like this game.

[doctorx0079]

Yeah. That's a pretty dumb review. And I just got through reading his review of Metal Slug 3 (link) and he loved that game. And he said that he was able to beat it too, which really surprised me given his lack of attention to Giga Wings 2. But there were a few things in that review that seemed odd.

My guess is that he liked MS3 because it's like Contra, so he could understand it without reading the manual. If you try to play Giga Wing without instructions you can get stuck not knowing how to reflect bullets properly. In other words the review is totally unfair. It is like Leslie Halliwell's review of the movie Robocop where it is blatantly obvious that he walked out after 5 minutes. Not cool.

[jp]

Taken from the Gamespot Giga Wing review:

Radiant Silvergun, the de facto standard for quality shooters these days, is the exact opposite: Although that game is difficult, one still felt that the odds weren't impossible, and playing again and again would almost always result in additional progress.

Apparently they never made it past level 2. If someone thinks Giga Wing is "impossible", I'd love to see what they think of level 5 or 6 of RS.

[jp]

Taken from same review:

Why did this game come to the US? If Gigawing were priced to move, the violent lack of quality and longevity could be forgiven to an extent, but it's not. Gigawing was designed with the hardest-core shooter fans in mind, but it's this same audience that's likely to be the most disappointed.

Seriously, we should break this guy's legs.

[professor ganson]

Seriously, we should break this guy's legs.

And as I said: this had real practical significance for me. Because of this lame review I passed on this game for about a year!