Gleylancer

[ACSeraph]

Am I the only one who thinks Axelay is fucking terrible?

YES?

We have pretty similar taste in games...

Do I need to give it another chance? What's so great about it?

[Squire Grooktook]

*edit* I highly recommend playing Axelay on hard mode. It's a bit too easy there, but normal is boring. If you played on normal I can understand the "fall asleep" aspect (same for Super Aleste, in general these console shmups are NOT best on default settings).

Axelay:

Pro's:

-Fun environmental hazards (pretty much every single hori stage). They're pretty diverse and make you move around a lot, but don't feel as cheap as some of Konami and Irem's arcade bullshit (you generally have an escape route)

-First stage has some dead air here and there, but it mostly has some pretty tight environmental hazards too (rocky exploding islands, "webs", the speed up section). I actually like it a lot. Second stage's elevators and shit are also fun to maneuver around imo.

-Bosses after stage 2 are very fun.

-Stage 6 is one of the most memorable final stages I've ever played in an oldschool hori shmup. Worth the entire rest of the game IMO.

-Vertical stages might look weird at first, but once you get used to them, you see they don't actually play or control any different from any other vertical shmup.

-Vulcan laser is fun to use.

Con's:

-Doesn't get too hard until endgame. Stage 6 is the only threat of a game over for me. Changes on hard mode loop 2 though.

-A lot of useless weapons. You're best off sticking with Vulcan and Macro Missiles at all times, and swap out either of the forward shots for Wind Laser once you get it.

[To Far Away Times]

Gleylancer is pretty good. It's a bit too easy to be a great shmup, (I think I beat it on my second or third try), and never really had the desire to replay it. The music and visuals are above average. It's just not quite "easy and awesome" like Thunderforce III.

Still, it's a good game if you've played through the cream of the crop 16 bit shmups and you want more.

I'd recommend the following console shmups from that era over it:

Thunderforce III & IV
Spriggan
MUSHA
Gate of Thunder
Axelay
R-Type 3
Sagaia (Darius II on Sega Genesis)
Elemental Master

[Skykid]

Am I the only one who thinks Axelay is fucking terrible?

YES?

No.

I never though it's hori stages were bad - nice enough to play - but the 3D stages are fucking awful. Euroshmup depth perception, rubbish weaponry, monotonous layouts. Can never understand this one's hype.

[HardcoreOtaku]

Am I the only one who thinks Axelay is fucking terrible?

YES?

Although I feel Axelay is a "masterpiece" as I said in my previous post, on this game I'm willing to accept it's not for everyone. I remember back when it was released it had divided opinion in magazine reviews, either classing it as an average game or on the other hand giving it really high scores.

[Kollision]

Am I the only one who thinks Axelay is fucking terrible?

YES?

We have pretty similar taste in games...

Do I need to give it another chance? What's so great about it?

Well, excluding the fact that I grew up playing the game (nostalgia?), in my opinion Axelay just exudes finesse from start to finish.

I can understand people not being comfortable with the mode-7 bending effect of vertical stages, but honestly that's just a detail in the grand scheme of things. Horizontal levels are superior, yes, but I love how some of the efefcts are applied in the verticals. Like when the bosses phase in from the backgrounds.

And dat music, man...
How can you not be pumped up by such awesome music? In fact, Axelay's sound design as a whole is a thing of beauty.

At six stages the game is not overly long, and as people already mentioned higher difficulties and two extra loops are also there to satisfy those who want more immediate "pressure".

[Strikers1945guy]

Am I the only one who thinks Axelay is fucking terrible?

YES?

No.

I never though it's hori stages were bad - nice enough to play - but the 3D stages are fucking awful. Euroshmup depth perception, rubbish weaponry, monotonous layouts. Can never understand this one's hype.

Completely agree. Which is sad because I'm a huge SFC fan but this one seriously doesn't do it for me.

[Perikles]

*edit* I highly recommend playing Axelay on hard mode. It's a bit too easy there, but normal is boring. If you played on normal I can understand the "fall asleep" aspect (same for Super Aleste, in general these console shmups are NOT best on default settings).

Well, if you're patient enough to play multiple loops in a row you're going to experience the Hard/Very Hard difficulties anyway, so Normal is not a waste.

I personally think that Axelay is certainly a good game but it lacks a consistent solidity to be called outright great. Not a huge fan of the vertical stages or the fact that there is not a single strong weapon that continuously fires straight ahead - I lost count how many times I got squashed by one of those fly swats simply because the Macro Missiles fire at an angle. Speaking of which: the "four-strike law" is neat on paper, but it does not come into play all that often in my personal experience since most of the dangerous stuff will kill you instantly regardless (like those fly swats, or the spikes in the fourth stages, or collisions with enemies in general). There are also a few odd spots like the narrow tunnel right before the final boss: how are you supposed to get through there without dying on higher loops/difficulty settings? Those red things just won't die fast enough.

On the other hand, Axelay's stronger aspects are fabulous. The cinematic superstructure in the final stage is a one-of-a-kind experience, truly great. I'd definitely agree with Squire Grooktook that those stronger points make the rest more than worthwile. Axelay is somewhat fragmented as far as the quality is concerned, but I don't think that even the weaker stages are outright terrible, just developable.

[Gamer707b]

As most here already said, its a solid game but not 150+ dollars material. Personally theres way more games for much less. As far as Genesis goes , as mentioned TF3, TF4 and even Gaiares. Personally for me Gaiaires I feel is an under appreciated gem that doesn't get the props it should. It is a super difficult game though.

[Skykid]

Axelay is $150 dollars now?? WTF, when did that happen?

[Kollision]

Axelay is $150 dollars now?? WTF happened to the cost of SNES games in general?

There, I corrected that for ya.

[Gamer707b]

I was not referring to Axelay being 150+. I was referring to Gleylancer. Speaking of Axelay , I disagree with most and feel it is a amazing 16 bit shooter. I remember this when it came out . Too bad I was not into shooters back then. Played it last year and 3cced the game. Yes I know I suck at these kind of games. So when most of you are complaining about the lack of challenge of Axelay,I feel it gives me the perfect challenge . As far as SNES games being CRAZY prices nowadays I totally agree. Even Super Mario World ,one of the most common games , is 90+ bucks boxed. What in the world!!?? Love the SNES and Genesis, but I enjoy playing on Genesis more because its way more affordable for me.

[ProjectAKo]

Just stopping in to say that Biometal is horrible and SNES loses 10,000 points for just having it available. Lame shield mechanic forced in, terrible music in both US and JP versions, and just feels very bad to play imo.

[Squire Grooktook]

^^^I could write a few sentences about how much I like the manic pace, shield mechanic, hard mode, and jp ost, but suffice to say I don't agree with the above post

[EmperorIng]

If that's the case, Genesis loses 1,000,000 points just for having Divine Sealing and Bioship Paladin.

[ACSeraph]

Divine Sealing is so hawt tho...

[Perikles]

Just stopping in to say that Biometal is horrible and SNES loses 10,000 points for just having it available. Lame shield mechanic forced in, terrible music in both US and JP versions, and just feels very bad to play imo.

That's some terrible taste. The SFC OST is exquisite, and so is the GAM. It's just a joy to play BioMetal in an utmost aggressive manner, wiping out hordes of enemies before they even get a chance to do much of anything. If you're just using the shield defensively it might be dull, it's all about playing offensively.

Personally for me Gaiaires I feel is an under appreciated gem that doesn't get the props it should. It is a super difficult game though.

Its biggest issues are the recycled last two stages (basically just a mid-boss and a boss rush) and that awkward-incongruent style (you start one stage in space where you get sucked in by black holes only to arrive at a medieval castle - that just doesn't mesh together whatsoever) in my opinion. I also think that the difficulty is vastly overstated, you just have to know which weapons are useful since most of them are either flat-out bad or suboptimal.

[...] hard mode [...]

I know you like to point that out, but it's almost negligible in BioMetal, I tested it myself. A few of the little enemies shoot more bullets, and that's about it.

If that's the case, Genesis loses 1,000,000 points just for having Divine Sealing and Bioship Paladin.

Bio-Ship Paladin is not that bad with an autofire controller if you ask me. Certainly not great, but it's not nearly as bad as, say, Xenon 2 Megablast, Gadget Twins or Earth Defend (urgh!).

[Squire Grooktook]

[...] hard mode [...]

I know you like to point that out, but it's almost negligible in BioMetal, I tested it myself. A few of the little enemies shoot more bullets, and that's about it.

Heheh, I'll admit I didn't test normal more than once or twice. Just my knee-jerk reaction whenever someone starts saying a good console shmup sucks lol.

It's just a joy to play BioMetal in an utmost aggressive manner, wiping out hordes of enemies before they even get a chance to do much of anything. If you're just using the shield defensively it might be dull, it's all about playing offensively.

Nothing cooler than when the shield boomerang returns to you just before a cloud of bullets is about to make impact.

I'll admit the boss theme 2 is my least favorite track in the jp ost. Rest is great though.

[BIL]

How's GAM forced in, again? Biometal feels very cognisant of its shield's role to me, not merely as a defensive measure but also a means of hyper-aggressively taking down its masses of large enemies.

Anyhoo, Biometal's one of the handful of SFC shooters I'd compare with the MD's best stuff. Others being Kiki Kaikai, Scrambled Valkyrie and Super Aleste (its two suicide bullet modes only - don't think of the slow variant as merely easier btw, it throws out some unique and tricky situations). R-Type III has possibly the worst opening stage of any decent shooter but it's otherwise very competent too.

edit: oh, Darius Force is pretty awesome. There's probably more I'm forgetting!

[Pretas]

R-Type III's most damning blemish isn't the dull but passable opening stage, it's the Hell of Memorization lava pipe maze that appears in Stage 4, which must be traversed both forwards and backwards. Worse than anything in Image Fight or Rezon.

[Jeneki]

Axelay is fucking terrible

No question mark needed.

[Pretas]

Anyone who considers Axelay to be worse than at least average needs to have their STG fan membership card revoked.

[Skykid]

Anyone who considers Axelay to be worse than at least average needs to have their STG fan membership card revoked.

The same could be said of people passing judgement and then peddling an opinion on games they either don't know how to play, like Dariusburst, or have never played, like Resogun.

Axelay is admittedly average rather than calamitous, however, I agree.

[BIL]

R-Type III's most damning blemish isn't the dull but passable opening stage, it's the Hell of Memorization lava pipe maze that appears in Stage 4, which must be traversed both forwards and backwards. Worse than anything in Image Fight or Rezon.

The opening stage is certainly dull, but with its duration it's not passable at all. Five flatulently bloated minutes of programmer demo to sit through every session? AHAHAHA... wait, I own this. BAWWWWWW

HG101 loved the bit where the Gains runs into the wall, at least. I think I did too, the first five times I saw it. These days I remember Bouncing Crate Hazard more. Lava maze is a poorly done straitjacket memoriser of the worst sort, but I'd happily do it a third time if it meant a normal first stage.

Not even my impressive bounty could produce a worse opening stage in a shooter. edit: R-Type Final's stage 1.0 is disallowed, obviously!

[Squire Grooktook]

Reread that entire thread, and "Space Gran Turismo" is probably one of the best descriptors of R-Type Final I've ever read.

[BIL]

Wish they'd come up with some shaweet Space Corp license tests instead of the AI battle doohicky. ^_~

[Perikles]

Anyhoo, Biometal's one of the handful of SFC shooters I'd compare with the MD's best stuff. [...] There's probably more I'm forgetting!

I'd add the following games:

- Parodius Da! is without a doubt a great port. Unlike Gradius III, Gokujou Parodius and especially Jikkyo Oshaberi Parodius it's basically free of any slowdowns. The original difficulty was considerably lowered as was to be expected, but since there is no arcade-perfect port of this game even amidst the 32-bit era it's a great alternative the more so as it also contains another great bonus stage.

- I really like Kidou Soukou Dion. It is a Compile plagiarism so the stages tend to be somewhat long, yet they are designed around that experience/score counter and the game's fairly tough. Some superb tunes and impressive if a bit static bosses.

- Pop'n TwinBee does everything right what it sets out to do, kinda like Battle Mania Daiginjou on the MD. It's so liberating to finally have a TwinBee game where you can try to play for score without mutating into a howling dervish in the process.

I'll forever love Gradius III, I can definitely see why people are turned off by its slowdowns, though.

[Obiwanshinobi]

I'd sooner play either on a Sharp X68k emulator, but Final Zone and Granada aren't awful if you want them on carts.

Is Atomic Robo-Kid considered a good port?

Speaking of that-gen console shmups, Power Strike II for SMS (yes) warrants an honourable mention. Moreso than Musha Aleste if you ask me, but here I'm just not being crazy about having to use more than two buttons in my Compile shmups.
See, when played on a backwards-compatible emulator like Kega Fusion or GenPlus GX, alongside MD/Genny shmups, that PAL-only SMS Power Strike II comes as one of the slickest around.

[Kino]

I'd sooner play either on a Sharp X68k emulator, but Final Zone and Granada aren't awful if you want them on carts.

There's people that prefer the X68000 version of Granada? I personally couldn't get over the lack of a dedicated strafe button, or the missing blaster upgrade in stage 2 (which in the Genesis port, makes a 1cc somewhat likely.)

[Obiwanshinobi]

X68k version of Granada seemed to perform better (both systems emulated), but I can't be sure if it wasn't placebo effect. Final Zone for MD certainly appeared technically downgraded (a crude port).