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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 11:35 am 


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Just installed the new kit for original famicom, that's great. Thanks Tim.
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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 3:29 pm 


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Tim is definitely an amazing soul. I still reflect apon how amazing the NESRGB is and will continue to be.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 5:55 pm 



Joined: 23 Jan 2014
Posts: 40
leonk wrote:
Here's the "theoretical" way of doing EXP audio on USA front loader and top loader. Can someone please confirm or correct?

As per http://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/Cartridge_connector the Famicom EXP audio comes out on pin 46 of the famicom cart. You need to route that to either:

Top loader: pin 51 (EXP9)
Front loader: pin 54 (EXP6)

Pin 54 / EXP6 does not exist on Top loader, hence why pin 51 / EXP9 is used. So if you're using a 60 pin to 72 pin adapter, put a wire as above. If you're just using Everdrive or PowerPak, you'll need to modify your flash device to route from pin 51 to pin 54 for top loader (leave alone for front loader)

Inside your NES, you install a wire from under the 72 pin connector to the NESRGB. New NESRGB boards have a hole next to J5 for EXP audio input. You run the wire from either pin 51 or pin 54 towards the NESRGB. But, make sure to add a resistor between wire and hole on NESRGB. The suggested resistor is a 47k ohm resistor.

Did I get it right? :)



Thanks, I got expansion audio working out of the stock audio circuit. My only remaining questions is where exactly do I connect it to the NESRGB? I see skips explained a while back, but imgur isn't hosting the pictures anymore. Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 8:29 pm 



Joined: 22 Oct 2013
Posts: 404
jamisonia wrote:
leonk wrote:
Here's the "theoretical" way of doing EXP audio on USA front loader and top loader. Can someone please confirm or correct?

As per http://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/Cartridge_connector the Famicom EXP audio comes out on pin 46 of the famicom cart. You need to route that to either:

Top loader: pin 51 (EXP9)
Front loader: pin 54 (EXP6)

Pin 54 / EXP6 does not exist on Top loader, hence why pin 51 / EXP9 is used. So if you're using a 60 pin to 72 pin adapter, put a wire as above. If you're just using Everdrive or PowerPak, you'll need to modify your flash device to route from pin 51 to pin 54 for top loader (leave alone for front loader)

Inside your NES, you install a wire from under the 72 pin connector to the NESRGB. New NESRGB boards have a hole next to J5 for EXP audio input. You run the wire from either pin 51 or pin 54 towards the NESRGB. But, make sure to add a resistor between wire and hole on NESRGB. The suggested resistor is a 47k ohm resistor.

Did I get it right? :)



Thanks, I got expansion audio working out of the stock audio circuit. My only remaining questions is where exactly do I connect it to the NESRGB? I see skips explained a while back, but imgur isn't hosting the pictures anymore. Thanks.


There is a little hole in the middle of the area by the audio circuit (far left side by Jumper 5). You Solder a 100k resistor there then solder your wire to that. You want the resistor as close to the NESRGB mixing point as possible other wise it causes a slight noise increase. If you are using an everdrive instead of actual carts I recommend a 47k Ohm resistor since the Everdrive puts out softer expanded audio than the real carts.
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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Sat Mar 21, 2015 10:46 am 


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Here's my install, I used a 9 pin mini din with a Genesis 2/Megadrive 2 pinout (composite, RGB, Sync, and Dual Mono Audio) and mounted the S-Video Jack too. I added some custom controller ports as well as a power LED. Click on the links for higher res pics.

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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Sat Mar 21, 2015 6:24 pm 


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Hot glue, ick.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Sat Mar 21, 2015 7:03 pm 


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Posts: 146
ApolloBoy wrote:
Hot glue, ick.



Lol, yes! I didn't have any epoxy on hand and didn't want to wait to finish up the mod.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2015 5:32 pm 


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ApolloBoy wrote:
Hot glue, ick.


It's not the nicest thing in the world but once it's closed up, most people don't care.

I'm 100% on board with the 9pin MiniDin though since that's what I used too.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:25 am 



Joined: 22 Oct 2013
Posts: 404
I managed to finally try Tim's component video addon PCB for the NESRGB and I am very impressed. On my BVM and PEXHDCAP the difference between it and RGB is so minimal you can barely tell. I installed it on the side of my original Famicom and it seems to have filtered out the noise that causes the jailbars I mentioned a page or so back (they are no longer visible with using component through the adapter). Its pretty darn good. I recorded a video of it using the pexhdcap. Youtube made it look worse than it is but its still not bad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyQGZRl ... e=youtu.be
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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 2:12 pm 



Joined: 06 Oct 2012
Posts: 1076
why does your pexhdcap look so good? mine picks up some kind of interference where the color alternates it gets brighter and then not so bright over and over

no matter wich console i use.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 3:18 pm 



Joined: 22 Oct 2013
Posts: 404
mvsfan wrote:
why does your pexhdcap look so good? mine picks up some kind of interference where the color alternates it gets brighter and then not so bright over and over

no matter wich console i use.


Are you using an external converter such as the CSY2100 or one of its clones? The PEXHDCAP dislikes that thing, I have had that happen only when using one of those converters.
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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 5:42 pm 



Joined: 06 Oct 2012
Posts: 1076
Exactly. csy2100 Thanks, skips. so whats the solution? to use the rgb input instead?

im a bit unsure how to do that as vga uses HV sync and consoles use composite sync.

will that input take composite sync on one of the pins? or do i need an lm1881?


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 6:04 pm 



Joined: 22 Oct 2013
Posts: 404
mvsfan wrote:
Exactly. csy2100 Thanks, skips. so whats the solution? to use the rgb input instead?

im a bit unsure how to do that as vga uses HV sync and consoles use composite sync.

will that input take composite sync on one of the pins? or do i need an lm1881?


It will take composite sync (wire Csync to the horizontal sync pin on the HD15 port) however the easiest way to do it would be to just buy a sync strike. I ended up doing that just for ease of use and it is nice to not have to build a lm1881n circuit every time I need to test if a console or display needs one. I work on a lot of PVMs, BVMs, and other miscellaneous commercial grade CRT's and its a time saver.

Your other option is to build your own external component converter or internally mod your systems with a circuit that does not do this.
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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 6:42 am 



Joined: 22 Oct 2013
Posts: 404
So after using the PA board in the original Famicom for awhile I have decided I personally do not care for it due to how loose the 8 pin din cable sits in it (because of it not being able to sit flush with the port. I move stuff around a lot testing modwork and experimenting and after awhile the loose fit caused the port on the PA board to wear a bit. I decided to go back to using the NESRGB's audio circuit and craft a home made solution.

I went and cut the original RF/Power Board in half, leaving most the metal in tact (only removed the bit with the RF RCA port). I then soldered an SNES AV port to a piece of project board and drilled holes in it to screw it in place inside the Famicom. I used the TV game switch as the palette switch. In doing all this I found out that if the AV port is ONLY grounded to the RGB kit itself and not directly to the Famicom or Power PCB it eliminates the jailbars completely (at least my super picky brain and eyes can no longer make them out). I can even turn the PEXHDCAP to max sharpness and there is not a jailbar in sight like there was when using the official power board from Tim (the RGB port is grounded to the PA board and not directly to the kit). I guess this is why the Component video kit had no jailbars, I had it grounded to the kit and not the Famicom/PA board. I went back and tested this theory with the Component Kit and sure enough, grounding the component video jack to the Famicom PCB instead of the kit yielded the same result. Either way this works a bit better, granted I lose the controller palette switching and audio separation (not a big deal to me).

I think I personally prefer this method, it fixed the jail bar situation with the PEXHDCAP completely and I am able to do S-Video, Composite, RGB, and Component video all on the same Famicom now. The case work did not come out as clean as I liked (im not the best at cutting/filing square holes) but its not terrible. I need to go back and clean/even it up a bit more.

**EDIT** Added pics of the console

Image

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Image

Image
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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 7:05 pm 



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Location: Toronto, Canada
post pictures of the inside! :)


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 7:46 pm 



Joined: 22 Oct 2013
Posts: 404
leonk wrote:
post pictures of the inside! :)



I will be once I re-wire it. It is a complete and total mess inside right now since I am still tinkering with other things. I need to go back and see about using the extra power regulator (i thought it was the cause of the jailbars but after seeing this it is probably not) since it does run a tad hot. I am also experimenting with getting rid of the background buzz (if its even possible) and still need to trim all the wires down and make everything all pretty looking and shit. It is not to my standards yet, Ill show everyone once its 100% finished.

When I get off work today I am going to tinker with the audio before I clean and finish it up. Since the Famicom ground plane is noisy as shit and terrible I am going to try lifting pins 30 and 20 and ground them to the kit like the AV port. I then am going to try lifting pins 1 and 2 since they are grounded via a 100 ohm resistor as well as being connected to the audio circuit. I am going to ground the 100 ohm resistors to the kit as well and see if the audio buzz is coming from the Famicom PCB like the video interference was. Hopefully one of those two things clears audio up a tad because compared to the NES and AV Famicom the Famicom does noticeably have more hum than either of them. Like the jail bar issue, the PEXHDCAP seems to be sensitive to noise in the audio as well so when recording its a bit more noticeable than when actually playing it.
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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Wed Apr 01, 2015 2:42 am 



Joined: 22 Oct 2013
Posts: 404
Ok fuck cleaning it up, its my personal Famicom and it already is beat to shit from all the work and experimentation. Here is a pic of what matters.

Image

In doing a partial clean up I toyed with the audio and managed to fix the buzz in the Famicom audio. If you remove the 100 ohm resistors and lift pins one and two you can simply rewire the 100 ohm ground in the original Famicom circuit to ground to the RGB kit instead. These resistors grounding pins one and two to the Famicom PCB is is causing the noisy ass ground on the Famicom PCB to create noise in the audio. The only time you will hear buzz now is if you turn up your volume to ear drum bursting levels. There is now less buzz on my Famicom than the AV Famicom.
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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2015 7:59 pm 



Joined: 21 Dec 2013
Posts: 174
Skips wrote:
I have not seen much in the means of the Original Famicom kit here so I figured I would post my install and thoughts.

This is by far my favorite system to install the NES RGB in. The power board and port placement makes the kit a breeze to install, the only required case modification being the use of a circular file for the audio jack. The Audio sounds great and although I dislike the audio separation mods I feel including it on this board was a nice touch. The palette switching via the controller was also another great addition, especially since bumping the Famicom by flipping a physical switch could accidentally crash the game. The RGB port also uses the XRGB mini pin out so you can go directly to it if you do not wish to use a scart switch.

The only somewhat major downside that I can currently see is that you have to remove the eject lever. This however is not really a problem since it is harder to use than just pulling the cartridge straight out. The eject mechanism is a small price to pay for RGB in my opinion.

Also I had a problem with the sound at first, certain sounds were way too quiet as if the sound channels were improperly balanced (Mario 3 sounded pretty bad). I later came to find out that my power PCB was labeled wrong. I ended up having to run CPU pin 1 to the CPU Pin 2 pad and CPU pin 2 to the CPU Pin 1 pad. Once I did that it sounded perfectly. I am not sure what was up with that because the labels were in the same place as Tim's Tutorial. It is OK thought, once I figured out what was up I got it working with only a minor inconvenience (and no I did not just wire them to the wrong place, I triple checked it to make sure it was not just a brain fart).

One thing people also need to be aware of is the install instructions will not work with a GPM-02 Famicom. The kit should work but it does take a bit of a different way of doing it than what Tim shows in his instructions.

I was excited to get this kit together so its not my cleanest work but here is my install. I will be going back later to redo it and make it look good.

Image

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Image

Image

P.S. Fuck HQX


I would like to point out that no one should ever use the eject mechanism, the red slider is SUPER FRAGILE and can break after all these years of aging.
So do yourselves and your beautiful Famicom a favor and don't use it or if you absolutely HAVE to use it, be careful guys ok?

On another note..
I came to the same conclusion when installing the NES RGB in my Famicom, this was before the new installation kit and offset adapter.
I had to put it on the topside as i just couldn't get it to work on the bottom as described by Tim.
So in the same manner the eject mechanism had to go, though i didn't need to cut any plastic as i used a ribbon cable to offset the NESRGB board.

The red slider was of course put on again, just the inside mechanism was removed and stored in a safety deposit box in the bank.
:)

Yeah-yeah i know, hotglue blasphemy :roll:
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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2015 8:41 pm 


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This is my first post here so be nice.

I read every page of this thread. Very informative.

I have this board installed on my frontloader and everything is great. But I want to try something new with the audio and so far the related post here have not worked.
Normally I use the stock Mono and enable the expansion audio with a resistor between pin 40 to expansion pin 3. Works fine with my everdrive or powerpak.

Now I read a every post here related to expansion Mixed with the NESRGB improved mono. I want to try this method but I am having zero luck tapping into the expansion audio. My goal is tap both CPU pins and find isolated preamped expansion audio and mix them into the NESRGB board. The found direction (that do not work for me) in this thread are as follows:

"2.) On the regular front loader sound circuit you would connect expansion pin 40 to expansion pin 3 which would mix the Famicom expansion audio into the NES sound circuit. Do not do this because if pin 3 is connected then the Famicom expansion audio won't be present on the NESRGB sound output. Instead we will be connecting a 20K ohm resistor to pin 40 on the NES expansion port and running a wire from that to the NESRGB board. Here's a picture of expansion pin 40 http://i.imgur.com/nNixYV3.jpg.
You will run the wire around to the NESRGB board and connect it to one of the red points in this picture http://i.imgur.com/XCEwnaL.jpg?1. Don't worry if you bridge the 2 red connections. They are already connected on the PCB."

Any tips would be greatly appreciated!


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2015 10:01 pm 


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Rise from your grave, mighty NESRGB thread.

Forgive me if I asked this before, but to you twin Famicom guys - did you elect to add new ports to the back, or did you do the "incognito" mod and re-purpose the 8 pin DIN on the back? Any regrets? I think my twin Famicom is up next, and I have not decided if I want to keep it looking as stock as possible or throw caution to the wind and do separate video output, audio output, and palette switch.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2015 10:07 pm 


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Location: San Jose, CA
CkRtech wrote:
Rise from your grave, mighty NESRGB thread.

Forgive me if I asked this before, but to you twin Famicom guys - did you elect to add new ports to the back, or did you do the "incognito" mod and re-purpose the 8 pin DIN on the back? Any regrets? I think my twin Famicom is up next, and I have not decided if I want to keep it looking as stock as possible or throw caution to the wind and do separate video output, audio output, and palette switch.

I thought it was better just to use the pre-existing ports, it's a lot easier that way.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2015 1:47 pm 


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ApolloBoy wrote:
CkRtech wrote:
Rise from your grave, mighty NESRGB thread.

Forgive me if I asked this before, but to you twin Famicom guys - did you elect to add new ports to the back, or did you do the "incognito" mod and re-purpose the 8 pin DIN on the back? Any regrets? I think my twin Famicom is up next, and I have not decided if I want to keep it looking as stock as possible or throw caution to the wind and do separate video output, audio output, and palette switch.

I thought it was better just to use the pre-existing ports, it's a lot easier that way.


Exactly. If you think about it the only reason that the NESRGB kit comes with a mini8din port is because the NES doesn't have any servicable multi out port to begin with.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2015 8:35 pm 



Joined: 17 Sep 2012
Posts: 393
ApolloBoy wrote:
CkRtech wrote:
Rise from your grave, mighty NESRGB thread.

Forgive me if I asked this before, but to you twin Famicom guys - did you elect to add new ports to the back, or did you do the "incognito" mod and re-purpose the 8 pin DIN on the back? Any regrets? I think my twin Famicom is up next, and I have not decided if I want to keep it looking as stock as possible or throw caution to the wind and do separate video output, audio output, and palette switch.

I thought it was better just to use the pre-existing ports, it's a lot easier that way.


Yep, I replaced the DIN on mine too. Worth it for not having to cut into the chassis. The board the RF connector uses is otherwise useless so nothing of value is lost from the cutting on the board.

viewtopic.php?p=1030961#p1030961


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2015 8:44 pm 


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Thanks, guys. That is probably the route I will take. I'll just leave the palette switch off, bridge the pins on the NESRGB, and wire RGB to replacement DIN8 and built-in audio jack. Easy to undo should I ever want to go back to stock. I probably never would do that anyway, but never say never.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2015 9:06 pm 



Joined: 04 May 2015
Posts: 2
Hi I'm trying to use helder's wii multi av out with nesrgb and the component encoder board and was curious if the wiring looks right.
I'm assuming the gnds need to be connected on the socket.

I'm trying to get:
-mono sound split to both L/R
-composite video
-s-video
-rgb
-component ypbpr


Last edited by mushitama on Tue May 05, 2015 10:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2015 1:56 pm 


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mushitama wrote:
Hi I'm trying to use helder's wii multi av out with nesrgb and the component encoder board and was curious if the wiring looks right.
I'm assuming the gnds need to be connected on the socket.

I'm trying to get:
-mono sound split to both L/R
-composite video
-s-video
-rgb
-component ypbpr

Image


You have a few things incorrect. This is the WII port yes? From my understanding you can not have RGB,Component and Svideo installed. Points 7,9,11 have mutiple wires connected, you can not do that.
Basically you need to remove the RGB from the multiport.

Though I have been considering building a Switch or IC switch to swap between Component & RGB. That would make it possible but I don't have time for that yet.

Also you should ground the component board.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2015 10:40 pm 



Joined: 04 May 2015
Posts: 2
RetroFixes wrote:
You have a few things incorrect. This is the WII port yes? From my understanding you can not have RGB,Component and Svideo installed. Points 7,9,11 have mutiple wires connected, you can not do that.
Basically you need to remove the RGB from the multiport.

Though I have been considering building a Switch or IC switch to swap between Component & RGB. That would make it possible but I don't have time for that yet.

Also you should ground the component board.


I see. So without RGB I wouldn't need the 5v I assume; updated as such:
I also don't really understand the difference between the composite (from rgb) vs original from ppu.
Image

I believe the component board should already be grounded as it docks to the nesrgb pins like so:
Image


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2015 11:04 pm 


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V is what you want for Composite video output.

Your audio is the last section to fix. That O pad will not output audio until you tap the CPU pins and attach the A B pads. Or you can tap the original Mono from the motherboard and connect directly to the multiport. Though the first methods reports better results.


I'm trying to figure out the expansion audio tricks but so far no help offered.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2015 9:37 am 



Joined: 17 Sep 2012
Posts: 393
Does anyone have a diagram of incorporating expansion audio into the NESRGB's audio amp handy?

I was made aware of a buzzing sound in the audio of my video recordings/broadcasting and tracked it down to tapping into my Twin Famicom's audio from the RCA jack in my original install. I didn't notice while playing on my TV because I have the volume low. But when I make recordings/broadcast, it's very apparent. I opted to use the NESRGB's audio amp which pretty much removed the buzzing but in trade lost expansion audio.

Edit: Found Voultar's posts that give me exactly what I needed. I knew I saw it here before: viewtopic.php?p=1059453#p1059453


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 11:41 am 


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Location: Sweden
Hello
I have a weird issue with one of my many Front Loader NESRGB mods.
Every game I throw at it works. But when I'm try using a Everdrive I mostly get this kind of screen http://imgur.com/VgKkHjD
Once in awhile I do get the menu but I can never load any game.

I know it's not the Everdrive as it works fine on the other NES's I have laying around.
I have earlier today tried desoldering and resoldering the NESRGB and PPU.
The Everdrive works when only the PPU is socketed. But meet the same issue again when I resoldered the NESRGB.
I even tried using the whole NESRGB+PPU on a different Front-loader and it worked.

This is a bit frustrating, as I wish to sell this unit. But not comfortable selling it and there might be a defect.
Are there few front-loaders that just don't wanna work with NESRGB + Everdrives?
(sorry if this is a badly formed post, I had a better post but it got lost when I tried to preview it)


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