The Pixel Purist:

[FBX]

I thought I might write a detailed guide of my ongoing findings about how the Framemeister works on 1080p output for 1080p displays.

Here's the link to the introduction page, which has the various console page links at the end:

http://www.firebrandx.com/pixelpurist.html

More console links will be added over time as I experiment with other consoles.

[12345]

Nice writeup! Haven't checked the values yet but it's nice to see somebody making a new FAQ.
Two things about the information you provided though I found to be missing:
1. Would be nice to see what kind of output you use.
2. There was no word about games that support (anamorphic) widescreen.

[FBX]

It's a work in progress, and so more and more links will be added as I go along.

With regard to output, do you mean from the consoles? I'm pretty sure each link details the type of output from the console that is to be expected. Obviously from the Framemeister, I'm using HDMI output at 1080p.

[tacoguy64]

Thanks a lot on that genesis setting. Games are looking even better now.

[12345]

It's a work in progress, and so more and more links will be added as I go along.

With regard to output, do you mean from the consoles? I'm pretty sure each link details the type of output from the console that is to be expected. Obviously from the Framemeister, I'm using HDMI output at 1080p.

It just wasn't clear if you used DVI or HDMI.
On the A/D setting: 131 seems to work fine. If set to AUTO whites are being clipped on component, YcBCR output, Deep color disabled. Your color settings work well with this output since my set is calibrated under that color space and not RGB full.

[Josh128]

Excuse my ignorance here, but my original model Genesis does not have jailbars like you spoke about and I never even opened the case up, much less cut any traces on the mainboard...

What I did do was order a "raw boosted sync" cable from Retro Console Accessories (is she even still in business??), and apparently theres a bit of magic in that cable because the Genesis output is just incredible from it. So far Ive experienced jailbars on the NES and crosshatch on the N64, but I was able to resolve them both by using C-Sync, etc.

So whats the deal with the raw boosted sync Genesis cable? Does it contain an amp that boosts the C-sync signal out of the system or does it contain a sync stripper that strips clean sync out of the composite video signal??

[FBX]

What I did do was order a "raw boosted sync" cable from Retro Console Accessories (is she even still in business??), and apparently theres a bit of magic in that cable because the Genesis output is just incredible from it. So far Ive experienced jailbars on the NES and crosshatch on the N64, but I was able to resolve them both by using C-Sync, etc.

That's the exact same cable I have, and she just made it for me a couple weeks ago. However, the cable does not help this particular jail bar issue, and I tested it on two different NTSC Genesis "High Resolution Graphics" consoles. These are the consoles released in 1989, so it may be that you have a possible later revision. I do know the issue was eventually corrected in the CXA chip by rearranging the oscillator away from the color signals. In these original consoles, it's right next to the blue signal, which is why the jail bars show up on blue colors.

Here's a video someone did discussing the fix, although I opted to sever the trace in the middle of the board so it could be easily repaired later if I wanted to:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F5jsUZkI-js

FYI, what "boosted" Sync helps with is when the image drops out randomly, and this is due to the relatively weak Sync signal coming from the Genesis that some have complained about. It doesn't address jail bar problems at all (unless they are carried on the sync line), at least not this particular issue since it's on the blue line. Also "boosted" sync amplifies the CSync signal. No stripping is required because it's CSync and not "Sync on Composite".

Here's a video from My Life in Gaming that goes over various types of Sync:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAlrdCBjUAQ

[austin532]

For your PS2 settings are you sure Zoom size is supposed to be at it's default level of 50? The image is way too zoomed in. Maybe you meant 100? Also I assume you set your Wide Mode on your Sony TV to Full as well?

[BuckoA51]

Clean sync on the Genesis actually helps with quite a few things including the Jailbars, but it's not guaranteed to get rid of them completely.

[FBX]

For your PS2 settings are you sure Zoom size is supposed to be at it's default level of 50? The image is way too zoomed in. Maybe you meant 100? Also I assume you set your Wide Mode on your Sony TV to Full as well?

Nice catch!

I forgot that ZOOM_SIZE wasn't 100 by default, so I will fix that asap.

Ans yes, TV's zoom is turned off (full).

Clean sync on the Genesis actually helps with quite a few things including the Jailbars, but it's not guaranteed to get rid of them completely.

Again, it doesn't help with these particular jail bars at all, because they are not caused in the Sync line (I've edited my prior post to be more specific). Clean sync would, however, help with interference that shows up in Sync-on-composite style output. The youtube video I linked from My Life in Gaming gives a good example using Zelda 3.

[Fudoh]

Again, it doesn't help with these particular jail bars at all

I have a MD1 which still has pin 50 on the Video chip active, but uses the sync output along with an additional stripper IC. Almost zero jail bars. NEARLY as good as disconnecting the pin.

I agree that it shouldn't help, but it does.

[Josh128]

Mine is a Model 1 Genesis, that says "High Def Graphics" on it. The other iterations dont even have RGB out by default if I remember right. Not sure which hardware rev it is though. I bought it off Ebay a couple years ago because my original Model 2 had some issues + I wanted RGB out with no fuss.

[FBX]

Again, it doesn't help with these particular jail bars at all

I have a MD1 which still has pin 50 on the Video chip active, but uses the sync output along with an additional stripper IC. Almost zero jail bars. NEARLY as good as disconnecting the pin.

I agree that it shouldn't help, but it does.

CSync doesn't require a stripper. Only the SCART method of using Sync-on-Composite would. And as you said, it shouldn't help with these jail bars because they are caused by the oscillator interfering with the blue line. Doing some Googling, I found a thread where a guy even proved the chip was to blame by swapping the green and blue feeds going into it. Sure enough, the blue signal was now clean and the green signal became infested with jail bars. I'm suspecting there are different revisions of the original Genesis that don't have this problem, which is why some people are saying they don't have this issue on theirs.

By the way, I should point out that you need an LCD display to see these jail bars. I remember when I used to hook the Genesis up to a Wells Gardner CRT, I couldn't see any jail bars.

[Fudoh]

CSync doesn't require a stripper

it helped stabilizing the image on a XRGB-3.

[FBX]

That sounds like what sync boosting does now. It's possible the stripper was also acting as a booster, which of course the Genesis does need due to weak sync signal from what I understand.

At any rate, I started working on anamorphic modes featured in some PS2 games. Turns out the Framemeister's Zoom_H_WIDTH cannot exactly mimic 16:9 with my custom scale settings. What happens is a value setting of 1 isn't wide enough, and a value setting of zero is too wide. I found the best way to achieve the perfect 16:9 anamorphic presentation was to use the TV display's built-in "H-Stretch" zoom function combined with having the Framemeister's ZOOM_WIDTH set to a value of 41 (along with my other custom zoom scale settings). This made the anamorphic image in SSX 3 perfectly 16:9, and I got out measuring tape and physically measured it to make sure.

I also discovered another weird quirk in the Framemeister's behavior: After achieving the perfect 16:9 image as mentioned above, I noticed the image wasn't centered. It was shifted to the left and up, so I went into the VISUAL_SET menu and adjusted the H_POS and V_POS to align the image. Once it looked perfect, I went back to the ZOOM_SET to double check the values there, and suddenly the image shifted out of alignment again. So I went back to the VISUAL_SET and found that the values for V and H POS were still as I set them. I attempted to change the value of V_POS, and suddenly the Framemeister 'remembered' the alignment and corrected itself. So it would seem there's a memory check that isn't being done in the code. As such, you have to adjust ZOOM_SET values first and then adjust VISUAL_SET values second, and never go back to the ZOOM_SET menu or you'll have to do the 'reminder' trick I described.

Anyway, my centered alignment in VISUAL_SET ended up being H_POS: 58 and V_POS: 25 for SSX 3's anamorphic mode

I'll be updating the PS2 page settings with these findings for anamorphic games.

One other important tip: Turning on progressive 480p mode in SSX has to be done blind because the Framemeister's handshake takes too long. The game will revert back to 480i if you don't press X to confirm in a few seconds.

Edit:

Did some measuring and testing of how PS1 games are displayed on 4:3 TV sets. I determined the default ZOOM_WIDTH value of 50 is too skinny. The correct value should be 41 (which makes perfect sense considering how SSX 3 required the same value for allowing TV H-Stretch to exactly match 16:9).

Lastly, I determined the VISUAL_SET V_POS value for PS1 games needs to be lowered from 32 to 31, but NO lower than that.

[12345]

I like your approach on the anamorphic settings, honestly!
Just a brief question: How did you come up with Gamma: 14 all of sudden? I don't see any benefit.

Anyways looking forward for more console specific settings.

[CkRtech]

Emulated Link at Wrong Aspect Ratio

Preach it.

[Ed Oscuro]

Interesting historical romp in the OP's link, but one small note so far: S-Video was never renamed from S-VHS; Super VHS is the tape format and always has been. There's some similarities but these refer to distinct things, and always have, except when manufacturers got lazy or ambitious and called the S-Video connection (aka a new package for Y-C video) S-VHS.

[FBX]

Interesting historical romp in the OP's link, but one small note so far: S-Video was never renamed from S-VHS; Super VHS is the tape format and always has been. There's some similarities but these refer to distinct things, and always have, except when manufacturers got lazy or ambitious and called the S-Video connection (aka a new package for Y-C video) S-VHS.

I'm referring to the cable packaging, which clearly reads "SVHS". When I said "later renamed to S-Video", I was referring to how we all now address these cables universally as S-Video regardless of whatever the historical standard was. When they were new, some called them SVHS cables (like Nintendo did), and some called them S-Video. They both refer to same cable, and yes, I know about the SVHS tape format. I had one myself. The confusion is over the fact that SVHS players/recorders were the first major introduction of S-Video jacks.

Quote from Wikipedia:

It is not unusual to see the term S-VHS incorrectly used to refer to S-Video connectors (also called "Y/C connectors"), even in printed material. This may be due to S-VHS having been one of the more common consumer video products equipped with the s-video connector.

I'll go ahead and edit my page just to remove the ambiguation.

[FBX]

I like your approach on the anamorphic settings, honestly!
Just a brief question: How did you come up with Gamma: 14 all of sudden? I don't see any benefit.

Anyways looking forward for more console specific settings.

Thanks!

the new Gamma settings are there because I now recommend using the 131 A/D manual setting instead of auto. The adjustment of the Gamma seems to reduce the amount of flicker error introduced by the Framemeister's A/D conversion process.

[ApolloBoy]

Mine is a Model 1 Genesis, that says "High Def Graphics" on it. The other iterations dont even have RGB out by default if I remember right.

Not true, the only Genesis/MD variants that don't have RGB are the Wondermega M1 and M2, and some versions of the X'Eye.

[FBX]

New updates:

Added an entry on "What is AUTO_SCALER?" to the general framemeister notes page.

Added a note on the PS2 page about V_POS 31 revealing some top-line flicker in games like Suikoden. In which case, the default value of 32 will hide the top line out of sight.

[FBX]

So this next update is important for those wanting a smoother PS2 experience in anamorphic wide screen mode (which I have to admit looks stunning on SSX 3 in 480p):

http://www.firebrandx.com/ps2smoothanamorphic.html

[12345]

So this next update is important for those wanting a smoother PS2 experience in anamorphic wide screen mode (which I have to admit looks stunning on SSX 3 in 480p):

http://www.firebrandx.com/ps2smoothanamorphic.html

ZOOM_SIZE: 93 (Brings the vertical size to match 1080)
ZOOM_OVERSCAN: 100 (default)

I suppose it should be the other way round, right?
It seems to me as if the Framemeister's internal wide mode is giving more problems than horizontal stretching performed by a TV and should therefore be left untouched. A possible issue I can imagine is uneven or mode-limited stretching by the display though.
Btw, Hue should definitely be set to 46 on YcBCR.

[FBX]

So this next update is important for those wanting a smoother PS2 experience in anamorphic wide screen mode (which I have to admit looks stunning on SSX 3 in 480p):

http://www.firebrandx.com/ps2smoothanamorphic.html

ZOOM_SIZE: 93 (Brings the vertical size to match 1080)
ZOOM_OVERSCAN: 100 (default)

I suppose it should be the other way round, right?

Not this time. Everything lined up perfect in 480p.

BTW the settings for this also work well for 4:3 polygon-based games, so you'd just turn off the TV's H-stretch.

[RGB32E]

The perfect movie for the "pixel purist" this summer! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAHprLW48no

[Zapf]

everything with adam sandler is tainted though

[austin532]

I'm not really liking these new settings. It tends to make the jaggies much more obvious. Also, no big deal for widescreen PS2 games as most of them are cropped.

What do you mean exactly by turning on your tv's H-strech? Most tv's only have a 4:3, 16:9, 1:1 ratio, and a zoom setting.

[FBX]

I'm not really liking these new settings. It tends to make the jaggies much more obvious. Also, no big deal for widescreen PS2 games as most of them are cropped.

What do you mean exactly by turning on your tv's H-strech? Most tv's only have a 4:3, 16:9, 1:1 ratio, and a zoom setting.

Which new settings? My latest one on anamorphics actually smooths out the jaggies more so than my crisp 1:1 pixel settings.

With regard to H-stretch, that's what my Sony display calls it when you select from various wide-zoom functions it has in the menu. This is where the 4:3 image is stretched horizontally.

[austin532]

It seems only certain models have that option so are you able to create a work around this? Otherwise I will have to stick to 4x Scale settings.

Also just curious why a purist such as yourself never really cared for scanlines when they can help make the image look sharper? You are not really losing any part of the image compared to lets say if you enabled them for 480i/p games. Right? Or am I missing something?