Anyone know anything about martial arts?

steveovig · Post by **steveovig** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 7:17 pm

I was looking at taking Judo lessons and I was just wondering if anyone here has done anything similar. I'm mostly interested in it for self defense as I've recently realized I can't fight for shit. I'm not really looking to compete, will the training still be tough? I don't want the trainer to be really hard on me like I imagine some trainers could be.

Ganelon · Post by **Ganelon** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 7:41 pm

I've taken karate before for a couple of years. Nothing hard though. The hardest stuff I had to do at the time was triangle pushups (if I took it now, it would probably be finger pushups). Nearly all introductory martial arts classes in the US don't involve too much rigor it appears. Then again, you might be panting at the end if you aren't fit. And as a word of warning, don't go for any Chinese martial arts though or you'll be in pain (and won't learn much about self-defense anyway)...

The n00b · Post by **The n00b** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 7:47 pm

So you got your butt kicked? Is there a story behind this?

Also read some books by Henry Rollins. That will serve you well.

PaCrappa · Post by **PaCrappa** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 7:55 pm

Judo is sweet. If you want to be physically hard, you should get into that. I'd suggest going to prospective schools and watching classes. The beginners should be treated like beginners and the salty dogs should be practically killing each other with incredibly nasty looking throws. The instructor should be someone you think you'd like to learn from. Intelligent and well spoken. Ask about tournaments and how many of their guys compete. If they're in it for sport, chances are they train as hard as one could imagine.

Other than that, look at the combat sports. Wrestling is over the top gnarly in the physical conditioning and being a real hardass departments. Brazilian Jiu Jitsu (one of my hobbies) is very much like Judo except the grappling takes place on the ground instead of standing up. Both of those sports require conditioning but are somewhat more technique oriented than wrestling. I don't know much about sambo, muay thai, boxing or western kickboxing but I do know that they all train real hard. That's really the operative here; preparedness.

Anyways, good call on the judo. I got taken down three times by a judo guy at our last tournament and lost on points because of it. I've been toying with taking classes myself.

Pa

Klatrymadon · Post by **Klatrymadon** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 7:56 pm

I did Shotokan Karate (1st kyu) until I was about 15. I can't honestly remember why I lost interest (largely too impractical for a young lad?), but I'm getting major beer tits these days, so my only advice would be to keep at it.

elvis · Post by **elvis** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 8:41 pm

I did Muay Thai (the Thai version of Kickboxing) for around 7 or so years.

I started it entirely for the fitness. I had no interest in the self defense part nor ring fighting (I'm 6'3", and can't ever recall anyone every picking me for a fight

). But when I started I hadn't done any sport for some years due to back problems, and was really looking for something I could do myself. I find team sports boring (and difficult to train in alone), and wanted something a bit unique.

Muay Thai helped me enormously. It was extremely cardiovascular intensive, and I honestly believe it's added years to me life thanks to the good it did my heart. I've also been had very inflexible muscles my whole life, and that changed for the better with the training. During the height of my training I also found my general health and ability to heal from injury was incredible too. All good stuff from that sort of excercise.

Self-defense wise, I can see the benefits (again, I look pretty intimidating to most, so I've never needed to use it, thank God). But there were a few folks in the class who had stories of when they did need to fall back to the physical to get out of a situation, and how the training had helped.

The club ended up folding when the owner (Ian Jacobs, for anyone who follows international Muay Thai) went overseas to be a body guard in the Middle East. Crazy man. Anyways... from there I started training at home, but the pressures of work and family (and not having an instructor to yell at me

) mean I've sadly fallen out of training. I tried visiting a local TaeKwonDo gyms at the university that was near me at the time, but I found the particular style to be a little too passive.

As far as choice of martial art goes, I don't have any preference. So many people will tell you X is better than Y, but they all aim for different things, and comparing them is hard. You've got your "passive" martial arts that rely moreso on defense/weight-balance, like Aikido and Aiki Taijitsu. There's the grapplers like Jujitsu and Judo, and the strikers like Muay Thai, TaeKwonDo, Karate, etc. Of course all of them vary in content (there's some grappling in striking arts, striking in grappling arts, etc) and even these days I'm seeing more and more that styles are borrowing from other styles. Finding a clear-cut "traditional" martial art is less and less common, although that's a good thing in my eyes. All of them have their pros and cons, and mixing it up is a good thing to iron out weaknesses in any style.

If I were to choose a martial art for myself today, I'd be looking at Jujitsu I think. Having done a striking art for such a long time, I'd like to do something with more groundwork. Judo again is a little passive for my taste (I'm not saying it's bad - see my comments above). I've had some Jujitsu mates take me through a few basic points of the style, and I quite like what it aims to do. Mixing up a grappling art with a striking art would also be far more rounded in terms of self-defense for me.

I'm enrolling my daughter in some TaeKwonDo kiddies-classes soon, just to see if she likes it or not.

But anyways... that was a very long way of saying "go for it". Martial arts are fun, healthy, and extremely rewarding.

steveovig · Post by **steveovig** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 8:52 pm

The n00b wrote:So you got your butt kicked? Is there a story behind this?

Also read some books by Henry Rollins. That will serve you well.

Well, not really but I do have a big mouth and I act like I can fight but can't fight worth a lick. Plus, I just got into a physical altercation with my family and my uncle kinda came after me and pinned me to break up a fight and I would've liked to have thrown him down.

BTW, the cardiovascular benefits/challenges won't be a problem. I've been lifting weights since early last year along with cardio atleast twice a week. Also, for training, I don't care if it's physically exhausting or anything. I think of pro wrestling school where they not only destroy you physically but also mentally with paying dues and treating students like shit. I know I'd be a beginner but I want to make sure I receive a little respect and human decency.

Triple Lei · Post by **Triple Lei** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 9:33 pm

I took some Taekwondo classes back in grade school... the only thing I got out of that was stretching techniques. I can't recall actually learning any... er, defending.

I retired at red/black, btw.

Valgar · Post by **Valgar** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 9:41 pm

elvis wrote:I did Muay Thai (the Thai version of Kickboxing) for around 7 or so years.

I started it entirely for the fitness. I had no interest in the self defense part nor ring fighting (I'm 6'3", and can't ever recall anyone every picking me for a fight ). But when I started I hadn't done any sport for some years due to back problems, and was really looking for something I could do myself. I find team sports boring (and difficult to train in alone), and wanted something a bit unique.

Muay Thai helped me enormously. It was extremely cardiovascular intensive, and I honestly believe it's added years to me life thanks to the good it did my heart. I've also been had very inflexible muscles my whole life, and that changed for the better with the training. During the height of my training I also found my general health and ability to heal from injury was incredible too. All good stuff from that sort of excercise.

Self-defense wise, I can see the benefits (again, I look pretty intimidating to most, so I've never needed to use it, thank God). But there were a few folks in the class who had stories of when they did need to fall back to the physical to get out of a situation, and how the training had helped.

The club ended up folding when the owner (Ian Jacobs, for anyone who follows international Muay Thai) went overseas to be a body guard in the Middle East. Crazy man. Anyways... from there I started training at home, but the pressures of work and family (and not having an instructor to yell at me ) mean I've sadly fallen out of training. I tried visiting a local TaeKwonDo gyms at the university that was near me at the time, but I found the particular style to be a little too passive.

As far as choice of martial art goes, I don't have any preference. So many people will tell you X is better than Y, but they all aim for different things, and comparing them is hard. You've got your "passive" martial arts that rely moreso on defense/weight-balance, like Aikido and Aiki Taijitsu. There's the grapplers like Jujitsu and Judo, and the strikers like Muay Thai, TaeKwonDo, Karate, etc. Of course all of them vary in content (there's some grappling in striking arts, striking in grappling arts, etc) and even these days I'm seeing more and more that styles are borrowing from other styles. Finding a clear-cut "traditional" martial art is less and less common, although that's a good thing in my eyes. All of them have their pros and cons, and mixing it up is a good thing to iron out weaknesses in any style.

If I were to choose a martial art for myself today, I'd be looking at Jujitsu I think. Having done a striking art for such a long time, I'd like to do something with more groundwork. Judo again is a little passive for my taste (I'm not saying it's bad - see my comments above). I've had some Jujitsu mates take me through a few basic points of the style, and I quite like what it aims to do. Mixing up a grappling art with a striking art would also be far more rounded in terms of self-defense for me.

I'm enrolling my daughter in some TaeKwonDo kiddies-classes soon, just to see if she likes it or not.

But anyways... that was a very long way of saying "go for it". Martial arts are fun, healthy, and extremely rewarding.

That is awesome, I want to learn Muay Thai, but there are no schools here ~_~.

UnscathedFlyingObject · Fri Dec 30, 2005 9:52 pm

Not many people are able to move after you hit them low then high.

If you want to learn martial arts to hit the shizz out of people, you may as well fight dirty.

The n00b · Post by **The n00b** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 9:57 pm

steveovig wrote:
The n00b wrote:So you got your butt kicked? Is there a story behind this?

Also read some books by Henry Rollins. That will serve you well.
Well, not really but I do have a big mouth and I act like I can fight but can't fight worth a lick. Plus, I just got into a physical altercation with my family and my uncle kinda came after me and pinned me to break up a fight and I would've liked to have thrown him down.

BTW, the cardiovascular benefits/challenges won't be a problem. I've been lifting weights since early last year along with cardio atleast twice a week. Also, for training, I don't care if it's physically exhausting or anything. I think of pro wrestling school where they not only destroy you physically but also mentally with paying dues and treating students like shit. I know I'd be a beginner but I want to make sure I receive a little respect and human decency.

Fighting with your family is never a good thing. It's probably best that you just walk away from some of that stuff. Don't think of being pinned down as humiliating just think of it as your uncle saving you from doing something really regrettable. Of course every family is different. In my family, to strike a family member at a family gathering is considered really bad and grounds for being ostracized from most family functions. Seems strict for something done in the heat of the moment.

BTW those schools where you get "treated like shit" are some of the best. It puts you in the mindset that your performance earns you respect. Coaxing students and athletes only does so much.

Also I agree with the fighting dirty post. That's almost like a martial art in itself.

Guardians Knight · Post by **Guardians Knight** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 11:14 pm

judo is great if you dont mind your body getting fucked up, i did it for about 6 months and now my joints are all fucked up. I've also done Muay Thai for about 5 years and would definitly recomend it from a fitness and street fighting point of view, it is easily the most complete stand up martial art you can do.

Ayone in the Vegas area should go train with Master Toddy he is the best guy to train with, i took a two week training trip to vegas and stayed at his place, trained with his world class fighters and got a whole lot better as a result. Muay Thai def the way to go!

Ganelon · Post by **Ganelon** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 12:00 am

steveovig wrote: Well, not really but I do have a big mouth and I act like I can fight but can't fight worth a lick. Plus, I just got into a physical altercation with my family and my uncle kinda came after me and pinned me to break up a fight and I would've liked to have thrown him down.

I don't know anything about the situtation you were in but if your uncle didn't hit you, that would've been a bit irreverent to throw him from chilling you down, don't you think?

Anyway, you sound fit but just not sure what to do, so any martial art will go a long way in teaching you technique.

elvis · Post by **elvis** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 3:11 am

steveovig wrote:BTW, the cardiovascular benefits/challenges won't be a problem. I've been lifting weights since early last year along with cardio atleast twice a week.

Heh. I've taken "ultra fit" gym mates along to training, and they were stuffed within 3 minutes of light sparring.

Martial arts is totally different to any sport I've ever played. It seems to use a completely different and more all-encompassing set of muscles than normal sports, and especially weight-lifting.

steveovig wrote:I think of pro wrestling school where they not only destroy you physically but also mentally with paying dues and treating students like shit. I know I'd be a beginner but I want to make sure I receive a little respect and human decency.

I say this to everyone who does martial arts: the places that teach these rely on paying members. This isn't high school. If you feel your club isn't treating you with the respect you deserve, then leave immediately.

There are great clubs out there. I was extremely lucky to find one first go. Muay Thai is renowned for attracting stupid meat-heads who like to hurt people, and there are plenty of clubs near me that have an unwritten rule that all newcomers must bleed on their first night. This sort of thinking is archaic and brutish, and has absolutely no place in the modern world. These clubs deserve to be shut down.

Martial arts is about perfecting yourself. It's about learning how to co-ordinate your own body calmly and effectively. Violence, agression and stupid behaviour does not belong in martial arts training halls, and if you find a club that promotes this sort of neanderthal behaviour, vote with your wallet and leave. Find a place that respects you, and demands respect back, and the process will be both rewarding and fulfilling.

PaCrappa · Post by **PaCrappa** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 4:38 am

steveovig wrote:BTW, the cardiovascular benefits/challenges won't be a problem.

HAHA! Gotta admire that attitude but elvis is way right. If you haven't done it (sparred), you're just not ready. It shouldn't take you long to get up to speed though and you'll definitely have fun

Pa

landshark · Post by **landshark** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 5:55 am

PaCrappa wrote:
steveovig wrote:BTW, the cardiovascular benefits/challenges won't be a problem.
HAHA! Gotta admire that attitude but elvis is way right. If you haven't done it (sparred), you're just not ready. It shouldn't take you long to get up to speed though and you'll definitely have fun

Pa

The same goes for most sports. I've taken people with me climbing and their forearms and back are fried in minutes. But if I went and played soccer, I'd be whining about the running in a matter of minutes

Heavy bags are brutal as well (but fun!)

Post by **Shatterhand** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 6:18 am

Yes, I am not a very fit guy, I usually get tired quickly by just carrying something heavy for sometime.

But I do play soccer, and yesterday I played for 3 hours straightly (Scored 13 goals nonetheless), never got tired and my legs are just fine.

Now put me to weightlift, and even lifting the most light stuff, my arms would probably give up in less than 3 minutes..

elvis · Post by **elvis** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 7:38 am

Yes, to be fair every sport has it's particular area of fitness requirements.

Martial arts and swimming are the two notable exceptions. Both excercise far greater areas of the body than most other sports, and the other major difference is that they do so consistently. Unlike gym work, you don't target a particular area at a time and rest the others. You are CONSTANTLY excercising your entire body at the same time. This makes it far more difficult than it looks at face value, and it certainly brings a lot of newcomers to realise just how fit professional fighters have to keep.

Take for instance Muay Thai. Your stance requires you to hold your arms up for defense (shoulders/neck/upper back), tuck your chin in (neck), stand on your toes (calves, shins, quads), punch/elbow (shoulders and arms, forarms for twisting knuckles during punches and making fists, lats and hips for twisting the upper body for power), kick/knee (stomach, hips, quads, hams, as well as lats/torso for the roundhouse), take attacks to the ribs and stomach (strengthening these muscles helps take stronger hits to the torso for defense), check block with your shins (calves and even toes get a workout!), etc, etc.

I brought a friend along to sparring with me one day who was a bit of a sportsman, and wanted to try some martial arts. He laughed out loud when we told him beginners are only allowed to do 2 minute sparring. We put him in the ring, and he had to sit down after just 60 seconds! Funny stuff for a bloke who proclaimed to be so fit.

Bruce Lee and his son Brandon Lee both used Muay Thai training as their preferred method of cardio vascular fitness (using the "Thai Pad" training pads, which can easily work the entire body for both striker and trainer). And neither of those lads were slackers when it came to fitness, as anyone knows.

The downside to that is that you need a good trainer who knows how far to push you (and when to stop), and you need to be careful about eating before training. Give yourself at least a 2-3 break from food before training. If you don't, you'll find a quick buildup of lactic acid in the muscles will have you bringing your lunch up very quickly. Kicks/knees to the stomach also don't make keeping food down an easy task.

Again, I was lucky and had a FANTASTIC trainer. He always knew how far your body could go, even if you didn't. He'd take me to the point of utter exhaustion every time, and then just 10 minutes more. Never enough to hurt me, but always just enough to push me that tiny little bit out of my comfort zone. Each time he did that, my fitness went up. I went from being the new guy who couldn't last 60 seconds in the ring, to 5 years later being able to train for 3 hours non stop (which was a required minimum of fitness for some of the medium grading levels).

But just how quickly you lose that fitness with no training is amazing. I sit here now, overweight and unfit, wishing I had the time to get back to it.

The n00b · Post by **The n00b** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 4:38 pm

I agree but sparring without weight lifting/running/jumping rope on the side is a bad idea.

It should never be your sole form of excercise, not even for cardio.

elvis · Post by **elvis** » Sun Jan 01, 2006 12:48 am

The n00b wrote:I agree but sparring without weight lifting/running/jumping rope on the side is a bad idea.

It should never be your sole form of excercise, not even for cardio.

I'm not suggesting that other forms of excercise are bad. I think I haven't worded myself very well above.

I find with other excercise, you tend to break up your effort. I used to play soccer (*football* for the European readers). We'd train on te field for however many hours per week, and after training we'd do weights, rope, pushups, situps, etc. It was all very broekn up. Doing pushups allowed my legs to rest. Doing rope allowed my arms to rest, etc.

After soccer I switched to volleyball. My dad played for Australia in the Commonwealth games, and also coached the Queensland (state) team. From that he trained me pretty hard (which I didn't mind at all - I enjoy the challenge). But again, training was broken up. Leg/jump training today, spike training tomorrow, etc. After a few years of that I switched to squash as a more solo sport (team sports started to annoy me). Squash is another that's great for the cardio, but again was very leg/arm centric.

I remember my first week of martial arts quite well. I remember waking up days after training, and every single goddamn muscle in my whole body ached. I'd lie in bed on a Sunday morning, wondering exactly how many new muscles I'd discovered in just a week.

After 2-3 months of pretty solid training, my fitness caught up, and I could finally get out of bed on a Sunday morning and make myself useful.

But anyways... the point to all of that is I personally found the Martial Arts to be a better all-rounded form of excercise for me. Most of the people in my training group had a particular weakness. For me it was arms (I've got very powerful legs and stomach, but poor tricep strength). For others it was the opposite. Over the course of several months we all started to even up thanks to the overall nature of the excercise we were doing.

So yeah... here's me rambling again. I'll shut up now.

TVG · Post by **TVG** » Sun Jan 01, 2006 1:52 pm

dont listen to elvis, train hard, lift weights, train in something full contact (muay thai, judo, boxing, wrestling, or anything)

youll learn more around the "meatheads" than around aikido hippies.

elvis · Post by **elvis** » Sun Jan 01, 2006 9:38 pm

The vagrant wrote:youll learn more around the "meatheads" than around aikido hippies.

This is the kind of advice you need to ignore. Find what suits you best, and not what someone else tells you to do.

The n00b · Post by **The n00b** » Sun Jan 01, 2006 10:11 pm

elvis wrote:
The vagrant wrote:youll learn more around the "meatheads" than around aikido hippies.
This is the kind of advice you need to ignore. Find what suits you best, and not what someone else tells you to do.

It sounds like your advice is the type he needs to ignore. It reminds me of some of the long distance runners I run with. Those that completely ignore weights or some other form of cardio are usually the weakest runners.

Meatheads might not be the most knowledgable about a certain sport but they do know how to train.

elvis · Post by **elvis** » Sun Jan 01, 2006 10:40 pm

I don't recall ever saying that you shouldn't do weight training. All I said was that weight training is target-specific, and not generally as all-round as other forms of excercise.

If you need to train a particular area of your body, then by all means do weight training to target that area. As I mentioned above, my arm strength lets me down compared to my leg strength, so I do weights on my upper body to help it catch up. It's not rocket science.

It sounds to me like you've taken my posts out of context, and that's partially my fault for not wording them well. So apologies for the ambiguity.

Other than that, excercise is a personal thing, and there's no "one size fits all". Trial and error will help you find what suits your body best. I've played countless sports. I live in Australia, and people are sports-mad here. I've lost count of the different sports I've tried. All I know is that very few of them I found beneficial let alone enjoyable, whilst other people found the things I enjoy to be boring.

I guess I'm trying to say "each to their own".

Oh, and I think "meathead" has a different connotation here than it does in the US. We call general sports-mad folks sportos or jocks, and both are fairly friendly terms. "Meatheads" here are the ones who like to make you bleed a pint of blood every training session, and the term isn't friendly. And they aren't limited to martial arts either. So yeah, it all probably means something different in you neck of the woods.

TVG · Post by **TVG** » Sun Jan 01, 2006 11:39 pm

"I don't recall ever saying that you shouldn't do weight training. All I said was that weight training is target-specific, and not generally as all-round as other forms of excercise."

strenght is target specific enough, since strenght factors into fighting alot.
of course you want to have a good lifting program beneficial to the target activity, not just lifting randomly like an idiot, ex: a distance runner woundt benefit much from powerlifting. but strenght training is good (im not reffering to bodybuilding)

"Other than that, excercise is a personal thing, and there's no "one size fits all". Trial and error will help you find what suits your body best. I've played countless sports. I live in Australia, and people are sports-mad here. I've lost count of the different sports I've tried. All I know is that very few of them I found beneficial let alone enjoyable, whilst other people found the things I enjoy to be boring.

I guess I'm trying to say "each to their own"."

what im trying to say is that strenght will benefit everyone in regards to fighting, now of course you'll need to find what lifting routine suits your body best.

"Oh, and I think "meathead" has a different connotation here than it does in the US. We call general sports-mad folks sportos or jocks, and both are fairly friendly terms. "Meatheads" here are the ones who like to make you bleed a pint of blood every training session, and the term isn't friendly. And they aren't limited to martial arts either. So yeah, it all probably means something different in you neck of the woods."

well in this context:
"Martial arts is about perfecting yourself. It's about learning how to co-ordinate your own body calmly and effectively. Violence, agression and stupid behaviour does not belong in martial arts training halls, and if you find a club that promotes this sort of neanderthal behaviour, vote with your wallet and leave. Find a place that respects you, and demands respect back, and the process will be both rewarding and fulfilling."

its strange that a muay thai guy is saying this, IMO, martial arts are about fighting, the rest is a bonus. engaging is serious training tends to build some positive traits, but that varies from individual to individual and is a personal thing tho, only you are responsible for your actions, and well, acting stupid will get your ass kicked from most schools, wont it? i doubt there's a school that encourages beating random people up anywhere. i think it isnt even a problem.

maybe you meant the instructor abusing his students, that's a different thing, of course there's a line between discipline and abuse. but YOU are paying, if what you get isnt what you paid for, by all means leave.

elvis · Post by **elvis** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 2:09 am

The vagrant wrote: its strange that a muay thai guy is saying this, IMO, martial arts are about fighting, the rest is a bonus

This is where we'll have to agree to disagree. I took up martial arts for fitness, and not to learn how to fight. WIth that said, everyone I talk to about martial arts has their own reason for doing it. One guy I know even does it as an "acceptable outlet for agression" (his exact words). For him, a controlled sparring session means he doesn't lose his cool out in the real world, as he has a place for his agression to be released safely. I'm not an agressive guy by nature at all, so each to their own I guess.

The vagrant wrote:and well, acting stupid will get your ass kicked from most schools, wont it? i doubt there's a school that encourages beating random people up anywhere.

There are two Muay Thai "stables" here in Brisbane (Australia) that I know of where that sort of behaviour is encouraged, even to the point where students are invited to go out and pick fights in the city after dark, and then brag about it during training. Of course, it's never publically admitted to, and the clubs will never get shut down as there's no rock-hard proof that it happens.

So again I say, if you find yourself in a club where idiots aren't kicked out, and stupid behaviour is promoted, then leave. And yes, they most certainly do exist. Been there, done that, left in disgust.

MJR · Post by **MJR** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 1:16 pm

I hope we are not dwelling too deeply on the eternal (and boring!) arguments on which kind of style/training is best. Muay Thai is very effective as its practitioners definitely like to point out. It also seems to be pretty popular right now. But there is no such thing as 'best' style out there.

I have done 2 years of Hapkido and I can recommend it for anyone who wants to learn comprehensive, well rounded martial art. It has all the goodies; judo throws, full contact sparring, kicks, joint locks, wrestling, and even some weapon training mixed in. And enormous amount of handy tricks and techniques to get out of dangerous/threatening situations, all ranged from gentle to devastating, even lethal.

But, as if any martial art, it is usually up to your school/club/trainer and up to you whether the style you have chosen is any good to you or not. All I can do is to give my recommendation..

elvis · Post by **elvis** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 9:00 pm

MJR wrote:I hope we are not dwelling too deeply on the eternal (and boring!) arguments on which kind of style/training is best.

Absolutely not. As I've already said, there's no such thing.

MJR wrote:Muay Thai is very effective as its practitioners definitely like to point out. It also seems to be pretty popular right now.

Muay Thai is an effective *striking* art. It has major flaws when it comes to grappling, and has zero groundwork. It proves itself effective in 1-on-1 and 1-on-many "brawl" style situatoins (good for surviving a bar fight, or "street defense"). However as I found out personally (and in a friendly training situation, thank goodness) take on someone with ground experience like Brazillian JuJitsu, and you're stuffed.

Muay Thai people do like to boast about Muay Thai. I guess the same goes for any martial art and/or sport. Variety is the spice of life, and people do forget that. The best fighters I've ever come across are the ones who have trained in a variety of styles over many years, and can adapt to any situation or opponent easily. One guy I trained with was "cross-training" in about 4 different arts. No matter what you threw at him, he'd just adapt and counter. Very smart guy, and a very effective fighter.

If any of you follow these new "open rules" style tournaments that are getting more and more popular (UFC, etc) you'll notice that most of the entrants are multi-discipline. Likewise, most militaries and police these days teach soldiers and officers a mixture of things to keep their unarmed defense skills high for different situations.

MJR wrote:But there is no such thing as 'best' style out there.

Couldn't agree more.

Acid King · Post by **Acid King** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 10:05 pm

I've been thinking of taking up boxing but I don't know exactly how active I could be with it. I've had 2 back operations, including one where a few vertabrae were removed, leaving my spinal cord with nothing more than a layer of muscle to protect it. If I took a good shot to the back, god knows how fucked up I'd be.

Fighter17 · Post by **Fighter17** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 11:09 pm

The best move in fighting (well not really) is to kick somebody in the nuts and run!

JOKE!