NES Recommendations (very specific)

[BIL]

Playing Shatterhand for the first time yesterday. Gave it a few shots, played a few hours. What a game...

Is there an optimal level order? The gravity level (Metalstormish) kicks my ass very, very hard.

Any tips in particular about the game in general? Should I always aim for the "optimal" robot? Is it part of a winning strategy?

Any help greatly appreciated.

I've not delved too much into optimal routing (just got the clear for now, FC ver). But I do recommend getting to grips with the Option system first. A few pointers from Ruldra and myself here. Note that throwing the Option offscreen is totally a good idea at some of the busier points! It's better to go to work with your bare hands and keep your partner alive until you can activate POW mode.

Generally speaking, the underwater and inverse gravity stages are definitely the longer and tougher of the initial set - no surprise if they're giving you some resistance.

[evil_ash_xero]

Playing Shatterhand for the first time yesterday. Gave it a few shots, played a few hours. What a game...

I always consider this my "big surprise" when getting into NES. This was just an awesome game. And it's long too. I really like the Sunsoft stuff, but they're all kind of short games.

[BIL]

Good lord. Finally gave Abarenbou Tengu a go. It's the Famicom version of Zombie Nation, memorably described by Rob as unplayable. In this version you're not a disembodied head but a Tengu mask - an auspicious change!

Apparently the developers were big fans of Cobra Command, taking similarly godawful controls and piledriving them down yet further decrepit depths. This may look like a hori shooter, but no: it's a Giant Floating Head Simulator. "Easy" is the equivalent of Driving Assists in a racer - the GFH is merely unwieldy and irritating. "Hard" pits the unaided player against brutal inertia, the GFH lurching and skidding about at the slightest miscalculation, very likely careening into bullets and environmental hazards.

This could've very nearly worked out. It's got real style - the bizarre apocalyptic scenario gives the sense of controlling not merely a character, but a devastating force of nature. The rampant environmental destruction is satisfyingly chunky, audio is strong with grunting explosion SFX and darkly urgent BGM, and there's a general sense of being in the swirling eye of absolute 2D Gotterdammerung. It's just a shame the controls suck quite this badly. I could be talking about a few of my favourite games here, so I've not let it go just yet. It's bad, but fascinating.

[soprano1]

I'm not sure if people mentioned Monster in my Pocket yet, but it's by Konami so i figure it's good?

[nosorrow]

It's playable: good controls (double jump!... IIRC), nice graphics, but it's hardly memorable, though YMMV if you find the theme interesting.

I also have in my collection Zen: Intergalactic Ninja, another late Konami release. I'm curious as to what is the "consensus" regarding the game, as I don't believe I have ever read anything about it online. As for my thoughts, well let's just say that most of the company's veteran staffers must have been focused on SNES/PC Engine/Genesis projects during Zen's design phase. Anyways, that's what I'd like to believe. Game is all over the place.

[BIL]

Revisited a few ancient childhood acquaintances this evening, long enough to decide neither's a priority to track down but not quite willing to ditch either just yet.

Datsugoku: Prisoners of War because I was in the mood for more oldschool beltscrolling violence after Double Dragons II & III. SNK arcade port, possibly better known by its subtitle via the NES version. It feels like it involved some of the same personnel behind the excellent FC Guevara and Great Tank (and Ikari III, another sturdily built action game even if I'm not keen on its topdown fisticuffs). It has that army as-all-hell aesthetic with the same rich earthy/gunmetal palette and impressively detailed, rugged settings. Looks and sounds great and handles entirely satisfactorily. System is simplistic but not displeasingly so; neither the player nor enemies have much to work with beyond Bare Knuckle-style jab stun and straight knockdowns, respectively, but hits connect solidly and painfully. You can't afford to get beaten to the punch or outranged, making even the lowliest of scrubs rewarding to KO and creating some tense crowd encounters.

My chief criticism is the padding. Levels feel really drawn-out for this type of barely post-Spartan X action. Only seen the first three so far, but all feel like they should be half the length. It's a fairly tough game and satisfying to keep under control, but you'll notice the holding pattern all too soon. Haven't written it off just yet, but it's mostly my fondness of GI Joe army funnins and precision 2D violence talking. Only really worth a look if you're similarly afflicted.

Air Fortress hybrid hori shooter/inertia simulating spaceman sidescroller from HAL Laboratory. Great concept - approach the titular behemoths from space via serviceable shooting, then invade on foot to destroy the core deep within, Escaping To The Freedom as lights go out, lifts malfunction, the environment shudders ominously and death ticks its way down. Problem: takes so goddamn long to heat up. I was at the sixth (seventh?) Air Fortress and despite enjoying the discomforting mood of the escapes, there was precious little sense of progression. I need to check back on this one too... seems little more than a curio as is though. Definitely worth previewing if you dig Metroidy self-destruct sequences.

[BIL]

Ikari III: The Riverdance going straight to this from Datsugoku was interesting. It's as precise a transplant of its engine and overall feel from beltscrolling to top-down brawling as you could want, down to the tiniest quirks. The result isn't a strong game, unfortunately. I've come to consider Guevara, Great Tank, Datsugoku and Ikari III SNK's informal FC army game tetralogy, but while all are bursting with 80s badassity and handle smoothly, only the former two really excel as action games. The two that occur in the fifties and forties, respectively, but I digress!

The top-down brawling here looks absolutely ridiculous, and will very likely crack you up until the tetralogy's customarily arcadey difficulty knocks you flat on your ass. Approached with due care it's still not a gratifying brawler. Fighting system is threadbare with the shift from beltscrolling to eight-way topdown defusing Datsugoku's tension. The action is certainly frenetic with green uniformed dudes running, jumpkicking and punching all over the place, but it's hard to feel very threatened while wafting over them all with the invincible A+B attack. This might've been a more satisfying concept if paired to the smaller-scale tension and bone-crushing brutality of Technos beating. The perspective would portray a full mount face pounding pretty nicely, actually. As is, it just makes me want to give Datsugoku another shake. Got four stages in for a novelty vert shooter bit and called it a night.

[cicada88]

Super Sprint is pretty fun.

[BrianC]

Super Sprint is pretty fun.

It's interesting how both this and Klax had licensed releases in Japan. Tengen seems to get a bad rap due to their unlicensed status on NES, but they made some solid games. I epsecially like their versions of Tetris and Ms. Pac-Man.

[cicada88]

So I found a website from a Japanese Family Computer Otaku (http://www.ne.jp/asahi/oroti/famicom/index.html), and among other sections, he has a "Rare" game section. He ranks the games on Rarity, Price, and Content (the gameplay / graphics / sound).

He uses the term "Rare" loosely, in that it doesn't just mean that physical copies of the game are scarce, but that the game is unique in some way. It also includes bad games that are just considered super rare too.

Anyway, I wasn't very concerned about actual rarity but in his gameplay recommendations. A lot of the games I haven't heard many recommendations from Western players. Many are RPGs & Adventure games, but a cursory search revealed that several have fan translation hacks.

His ranking system from best to worst is : SSS –› SS – › S+ –› S –› A+ -› A –› B+ –› B and so on down to E

I am only going to list the games ranked A or better, check his website for more info.

SSS Contra
SSS Sweet Home

SS Hitler NO FUKKATSU (aka Bionic Commando)
SS Mother
SS GEBARA (aka Guerilla War)
SS HYAKU NO SEKAI NO MONOGATARI
SS Chaos World
SS DAI 2 JI Super Robot TAISEN

S+ NEKKETSU! SUTORII TO BASUKETTO (Kunio Basketball)
S+ HEBEREKE
S+ KUNIO KUN NO JIDAIGEKI DA YO ZENIN SHUUGOU

S AKUMAJOU DRACULA (aka Castlevania)
S Zelda NO DENSETSU (aka The Legend of Zelda)
S MAHOU NO Princess Minkii Momo
S Summer Carnival '92 - Recca

A+ NAKA YOSHI TO ISSHO
A+ AIDORU HAKKENDEN
A+ DEZAEMON
A+ GIMIKKU
A+ MOERO TWIN BEE (aka Stinger but with 3-player simultaneous)
A+ Dark Lord
A+ ROKU DE NASHI Blues
A+ Final Fantasy I + II
A+ MOMO TAROU DENSETSU GAIDEN
A+ Solomon NO KAGI 2 (Solomon's Key 2)

A FUSHIGI NO UMI NO NADIA
A Metal Slader Glory
A KYOUTO-FU TEKU SATSUJIN JIKEN
A Circus Charlie
A SANSARAA NAAGA


The site has some more cool sections (one for canceled famicom games, one for famicom hardware & accessories, KUSO Games etc.)

I'm going to start loading my Ever Drive with the ones of these I've never tried or heard of.

[BIL]

I will vouch for Guevara & Recca being two ZOMG R@REZ actually worth the pain of acquiring. ^_~ Contra, Dracula and Top Secret are must-haves too. Just make sure you're dedicated and/or hell-bent enough to not just get the NES carts where applicable, though Top Secret is genuinely far superior in FC.

I think I'm getting near the end of my FC library. Barring the occasional impulse buy there's just a couple more games I know I want. Very happy with my set to date. That's why I've been revisiting lots of almost-good-enoughs like Datsugoku and Air Fortress. This is a cool find too, there's always something you've never heard of...

[CIT]

I will vouch for Guevara & Recca being two ZOMG R@REZ actually worth the pain of acquiring. ^_~

I'd certainly add Gimmick to that. The single greatest chipsound ever made and the tough challenge level with have you coming back for more over and over.

[BIL]

Gimmick and Battle Formula are the only dead certs remaining on my wishlist, yep! I was surprised at how uncompromising the former is, I generally have trouble getting into cutesier platformers outside of arcade staples like Taito's single-screeners, but the dedication to pure sidescrolling excellence is immense. Reminds me of Little Ralph.

Speaking of pricier stuff... also spent some time on Bio Miracle Bokutte Upa tonight. I think I've worked out why I can respect and enjoy games like this without really being compelled to pick them up (see also the Kirby series)... ultimately I like 2D action where it's kill or be killed. The inflate mechanic is fun and eventually you'll be pushed hard to use it skillfully, but ultimately I prefer this sort of "constructive" action confined to a single screen with arcade tension. Stretched out over a typical sidescroller I start itching to just hack stuff down while brushing past enemy attacks.

All that to say - Upa's really good, I recommend any fan of Bubble Bobble-style action check it out.

[CIT]

I was surprised at how uncompromising the former is

Did you watch the "Diggin in the Carts" documentary?

There's a great segment on Masashi Kageyama (Gimmick's composer), and he says he was aiming to make music that kids would find enjoyable in the game. I guess he never talked with whoever designed the levels! Cuz child's play it is certainly not. Will give even the most seasoned arcade champ a run for their money.

[BrianC]

This might sound silly, but the original Kirby for gameboy is actually challenging on the extra mode. It replaces a bunch of enemies with harder versions and enemies also deal out more damage. The best part is that it can be accessed with a simple code (up, select, and A at the same time) without beating the game. Kirby's Adventure NES also has an extra mode, but that one only gives you less health and removes the ability to save.

[cicada88]

I've been getting into NSF files and playback on my computer for the first time and I have a quick question...

I know some of the hardest things to emulate are the mappers, and some of the best games used mappers for sound (Sunsoft for example).

How accurate are the playback of these as NSF files? What about games that used the FDS audio capabilities?

[BareKnuckleRoo]

I've always wanted to play the original Famicom Mother (as opposed to the NES prototype, which has a large number of changes, including much easier areas like Rosemary Mansion, Magicant Caves, Mt. Itoi or whatever it was called before). It's a shame there's never been a translation patch made for it.

[CIT]

I think I'm getting near the end of my FC library. Barring the occasional impulse buy there's just a couple more games I know I want. Very happy with my set to date.

Care to share your FC library? I'm curious as to what your list of essentials is.

[BIL]

Sure! I bolded the ones I was either set on from the start, or (re)discovered later and now consider equally essential. Italicised stuff I love too, but consider more bonus material. Typically picked those up after the bolds.

Some of the remainder were impulse pursuits, though I always take my time deciding whether something's really worth it - I still consider them worth having. There are a lot of games I like to some extent (see Datsugoku etc above), but don't feel compelled to own. I also expressly avoid "bulking up" any aspect of my gaming library (or stuff in general... I like an optimised space-to-fun ratio).

Besides Gimmick and Battle Formula, both of which I intend to take my time acquiring, I always have a few possible new wants kicking about in the test ROM folder. Max Warrior's looking pretty good and I'd like to have a third KID shooter after the excellent Recca and Burai Fighter, though that isometric perspective jars me a little. It also has truly awful music, haha - despite being a VGM lover I never mind mediocre BGM, but it's really quite bad. The dense crowds and fast-paced shooting are quality though, and it's got a neat future war aesthetic going on.

2010 Street Fighter
Abadox
Akumajou Densetsu
Akumajou Dracula
Argus no Senshi
Balloon Fight
Batman
Bucky O'Hare
Burai Fighter
Chou Wakusei Senki Metafight
Contra
Crisis Force
Double Dragon II
Double Dragon III
Dragon Fighter
Excitebike
Final Mission
Fudoh Myouou Den
Getsu Fuuma Den
Gradius II
Great Tank
Gremlins 2
Guardic Gaiden
Guevara
Gun-Dec
Gun Nac
Holy Diver
Jigoku Gokurakumaru
Little Nemo
The Lord of King
Metal Storm
Ningen Heiki: Dead Fox
Ninja Ryukenden
Ninja Ryukenden II
Ninja Ryukenden III
Raf World
Recca
Red Arremer II
Salamander
Spartan X
Splatterhouse: Wanpaku Graffiti
Sqoon
Star Soldier
Super Contra
Tokyuu Shirei Solbrain
Top Secret: Hitler no Fukkatsu
Yami no Shigotonin Kage
Zelda no Densetsu

Watched ep.2 of Diggin' In The Carts earlier tonight, brilliant. If I hadn't already gotten into the Famicom a few years back, that's the sort of love that'd have pushed me over the edge eventually. Sometimes I want to pick up Lagrange Point just to hear that FM synth in the flesh, straight from the cart.

[trap15]

Argus no Senshi

I'm so sorry ;D

Sometimes I want to pick up Lagrange Point just for its music.

I did, I just wish I knew enough Japanese to hear more than the overworld music, battle music, and game over music

[BIL]

Haha, Rygar was both cheap and in unbelievably, insanely mint condition, so I kinda talked myself into it. The boxart is so cute and I like the Ninja Gaiden player damage sound when you smack stuff. ^__^

[BrianC]

Similar reason to why I got the NES version. Just cart only, but it was in good condition and only 69 cents. It was a holdover from back when K-Mart sold used games and the price was too good to pass up.

[BIL]

Over Horizon title is missing a couple Zs. BAAAHAHAHAHA - I am saying it's a tad dull. Do you see? No for real this is kinda slow. Stages 1 through 4 amble along like R-Type minus the level design vital to that pervasive claustrophobic doom. There are distinctive gimmicks like stage 2's gates and stage 3's ice blocks, but little intensity supporting them. Something about good FC shooters, and good FC action games in general - they get going fast. Abadox, Final Mission, Burai Fighter, Salamander and Gradius II leave this standing. I was happy to see there's an "extra mode," thinking it perhaps heats things up a b- oh, it just swaps out all the sprites for a wacky chibi samurai theme. FFFF! But it does make this the better giant flying head simulator, dethroning Zombie Nation.

A lesser but persistently rankling issue is the music - it's good, catchy stuff, until you start firing and it's deflated by most of the channels cutting out. Makes me grateful for Natsume and KID's smart coding in the aforementioned shooters, ensuring you can blast away without killing the tunes.

The Option mechanics are quality, the ability to customise both their range of motion and your weapons' attributes is certainly novel, and stage 5 does finally liven things up a bit. The ability to fire both fore and aft, ala Hot-B's subsequent MD effort Koutetsu Teikoku, is cool as well (though it makes me wish there was more of a pressing need for it). Another I'm not entirely done with but not very compelled to pick up.

[BrianC]

Funny how that changing graphics code for Over Horizon was actually in Nintendo Power, despite the game not being released in the US.

[blackoak]

I had the same initial impression of Over Horizon, but never followed up with it. Curious if your opinion will change by the end.

[BIL]

Gave it a little more time tonight - it definitely starts getting its act together from around the third boss. Stage 4's flamethrowers and asteroids are still only about what I'd like from stage 2 of a shooter like this, but the next two continue to steadily improve along that trajectory. Rather than 2/3's gimmicks to leisurely interact with as they're floated past, 4/5/6 have credible environmental hazards appropriately supported by persistent flak and some chunky midbosses. It's like they abrubtly remembered this is a shooter. A couple of really good boss battles in there too, riffs on the classic BigCore that wouldn't feel out of place in Gradius V. Game overed a midboss into stage 6 feeling really satisfied with how things were developing - as usual with FC shooters will be sticking to a credit. Looking forward to re-reading your Yoshinori Satake translation after. I wonder if the Homing weapon was the direct Thunder Force II reference it feels like at max level.

In short, if you were to delete the "my first hori" deadsvilles of stages 2+3, and fix the BGM drownout issue, this would be a totally solid Konami-esque hori. Still worth seeing through but requires the caveat of a very slack opening third compared to the machine's best horis.

[cicada88]

I just played Sunsoft Batman for the first time since I was 10 years old. Wow. This game is great.

The art style is amazing for the time. The guy smoking a cigarette against the wall that attacks you as a ninja when you approach is one of my favorite aesthetic things I've seen on the Famicom since playing Recca for the first time a earlier this year.

I generally dislike Batman as a character, but I'm glad I gave this game a chance due to the hype in this thread.

[BIL]

What I find funny (and very fortunate) about the FC game is how deftly it sidesteps the 1989 movie license, for the better. The opening and ending stages tie in acceptably, but between that it's all larger than life comic book fun with monsters, robots and spikey/shocky deathmazes galore. The MD one by comparison plays it straight and just looks ridiculous now, in addition to being nowhere as strong a game in any regard (save perhaps its decent OST, which Sunsoft's FC sound master Naoki Kodaka also worked on). You could practically scrape the FC's version's grime and shadow off the screen with a trowel.

Perhaps the era's most perfect illustration of less is more: (spoilarz for BATMAN '89 ENDING)

Spoiler

[cicada88]

BTW, love the animated ventilation fans in the 2nd stage. (This is the level I'm up to)

I found this image on some Tumblr. Fan made art I presume.




I'm calling him 煙草忍者 (TABAKO NINJA) aka Cigarette Ninja


EDIT: BTW, found the original blog this was posted on (http://manalon.tumblr.com)

Seems he's the guy that did this artwork, so wanted to give credit where due

[cicada88]

Sorry for double post, meant to edit above but ended up quoting.

I wish the old Sunsoft developers would reunite and give us a new 8bit series around this character. Distribute it digitally in the vein of the Rockman 9 & 10 games.