Stuart Campbell's GOTY is Raiden III

[Shatterhand]

Actually, he is acting much like he used to act in EAB. Unless there's someone who likes to hang in webforuns saying it's Stuart Campbell. I'd say this is Stuart Campbell indeed.

[elvis]

*troll food removed*

[Shatterhand]

Please, let's not fuel that. I've already seen that before and trust me, it's no use. Nothing useful will come from this chap.

Let's just ignore him, and he will leave.

[Rev. Stuart Campbell]

Well, I think we got a big misunderstanding here. Members here generally don't Continue their game when they got game over in a shmups. We tried to complete a shmups in a single credit only.

I understand that perfectly. I say it explicitly in the DDP-DOJ piece. (Second-last paragraph: "The shmup ultra-fanboys sneer at using more than one credit to finish these games anyway, so a limited-but-incrementing credits system wouldn't upset them any.")

Just a look at the rules of the high scores section in the forum, and take a look at the results, you would know how hardcore these people are.

Oh, I don't think THAT was ever in doubt.

People here said Raiden 3 is "not very good" because its scorceing system is not interesting enough.

Bizarrely complex scoring systems are exactly what put people off modern shmups a lot of the time. I praised Raiden DX for having a wildly complex one for people who want that sort of thing, whereas Raiden 3 is much more attractive for people you're trying to interest in shmups who perhaps weren't before because modern ones are so daunting-looking.

BTW, if you like Raiden 3 you should try your hand on G.Rev new game Under Defeat, you will like it.

Thanks for the tip. Looks interesting, a little bit of Zero Gunner 2 in there. Finding an arcade with shooters involves a minimum 100-mile trip from here, but I'll keep my eyes open when I'm on my travels.

Good listening skills. Sorry I'll go slower this time.

That would assume you'd mentioned it a first time.

MUSHA, Thunder Force III, and the eye candy graphics of Treasure shmups would be better choices.

What are you, dim? We're talking about games PAL players could actually go out and buy. Ikaruga is only released here on Gamecube and is an insanely hardcore game which would make casual players cry anyway, Radiant Silvergun costs hundreds of pounds, and Thunder Force III (a) runs on the fricking Mega Drive, and (b) is utter crap and always has been.

Stuart if you have time, could you tell us how you think about Cave style bullet hell comparing to the traditional style shmups up?

I love them both. The Giga Wings are two of my favourite games (of any genre) of recent years, and they're about as bullet-hell as it gets. I've bought pretty much every shmup ever released on Dreamcast, PS2 or Xbox, and the only ones I've really disliked are Steel Dragon Ex (aka Shienryu Explosion) and Chaos Field. Bullet-hell or trad-style isn't what tends to separate shmups I like from games I don't. I don't like over-complex or gimmicky stuff, as a rule, so Psyvariar and XII Stag are near the bottom of the list (that "constantly wiggle your ship from side to side" thing is the silliest idea I've ever seen in a shooting game). And I don't much care for things that pretend to be shmups but are actually puzzle/memory games, which is why I gave up on Ikaruga pretty early.

And as I say, complex scoring generally annoys me too. The main drawback of DDP-DOJ for me so far is the fact that I can only get the chain from the start of stage 1 into the 200s about one time in ten (still haven't figured out a reliable technique for doing so that doesn't involve using the horrible slow pilot - see, it's a puzzle game, not a shmup), and since failing to do that more or less halves your score for the stage, 90% of my games get aborted and restarted within the first 30 seconds, which gets pretty boring after a while. Mental exertion is not what I'm looking for from a shmup - if I want intellectual exercise I'll play Advance Wars or something.

Criticism is fine. Idiots who didn't actually read what they're whining about, however, can fuck off.

[Rev. Stuart Campbell]

It's not that, but an index would help people who aren't looking for a game in particular, but just want to browse and read your articles for the sake of a good reading.

95% of WoS is indexed. It would indeed be good to index the other 5% too, but the benefit of that weighed against the effort it would take (much of it is rather hard to categorise) makes it a low priority - it'll happen one day, but only when I've got nothing better to do. Most WoS readers are regular visitors who see each piece as it comes up, and there's a very effective Search there for everyone else. (Which is more than Shmups can boast...)

[roker]

Stuart Campbell is my new hero

[bVork]

"The shmup ultra-fanboys sneer at using more than one credit to finish these games anyway, so a limited-but-incrementing credits system wouldn't upset them any."

Fair enough. Perhaps a better system would be incrementing credits, but also a cheat code to instantly provide unlimited ones (for practice).

Bizarrely complex scoring systems are exactly what put people off modern shmups a lot of the time. I praised Raiden DX for having a wildly complex one for people who want that sort of thing, whereas Raiden 3 is much more attractive for people you're trying to interest in shmups who perhaps weren't before because modern ones are so daunting-looking.

Unless you're talking about Radiant Silvergun, Mars Matrix, Psyvariar 2, or other games where score = weapon strength (and thus = survival), it's completely possible to completely ignore a complex scoring system and just concentrate on survival.

Take a look at Mushihimesama, for instance. Yes, you can go for chaining and all that, but I'm personally just trying to survive. You'd probably really like that game: there's an 'original' mode with a lot of fast aimed bullets, in addition to TWO modes of bullet spam. And there's also a mode that starts you off with full power and auto-bombs whenever you're supposed to get hit. It's actually great fun for both newbies and people wanting to focus on getting the score mechanics down.

karuga is only released here on Gamecube and is an insanely hardcore game which would make casual players cry anyway...

Actually, in the totally nonscientific sample space known as 'my real-life friends,' Ikaruga is the most popular shooter. It may sound odd, but I really do think normal people can enjoy hardcore shooters. Sort of like I mentioned above about ignoring scoring, you can play Ikaruga without going nuts trying to chain things. Though chaining = more score = more lives = longer survival, so I dunno...

Radiant Silvergun costs hundreds of pounds

Well, closer to seventy-five on a good day. And this is NOT a game I'd suggest to newbies. Since RS basically forces you to play for score if you want to play for survival, people who dislike chaining things will not appreciate it. I know no 'normal' gamers who enjoyed Radiant Silvergun.

Thunder Force III (a) runs on the fricking Mega Drive

Makes it cheaper and easier to get! Oh, and there's also emulation...

...and (b) is utter crap and always has been.

Criticism is fine. Idiots who didn't actually read what they're whining about, however, can fuck off.

Civility also helps.

[elvis]

(Evidently, given that this place displays that sure sign of complete wankery, a forum that you have to be "approved" to post on. Get the fuck over yourselves, eh?)

I managed to post on this board without the "approval" process. I actually believe this is just part of the forum engine that is left over, and is not actually necessary to post. I don't think it at all has anything to do with any sort of elitism, but is merely left over forum code that was never removed during the customisation process.

If the forum owner/mods could confirm/deny the above?

Either way, that's some serious aggression there.

[Randorama]

Hello viewers! It's Rev. Stuart here, posting under a pseudonym because you were too chickenshit to let me register under my own name to defend myself against your cowardly attacks.

?

It's faintly saddening that when a professional journalist with 150,000+ readers a month chooses to write such a glowingly pro-shmup feature, attempting (and not for the first time) to bring the joys of the form and one of its finer games to a much wider audience

We're all with you on this, i think, but:
[/quote]

he should find himself the surprised recipient of such an outpouring of poisonous, vitriolic abuse from the very people you might expect to be pleased. What's the matter, boys? Scared some icky normal people are going to enjoy some shmup action, come along and spoil your exclusive little clique? (Evidently, given that this place displays that sure sign of complete wankery, a forum that you have to be "approved" to post on. Get the fuck over yourselves, eh?) [/quote]

There is really no need for rude language (and provocations...), and i'm a rather a foul mouth myself, usually. Cliquisms or not, both the Raiden III and DOJ reviews are rather basic in their approach. While this is not a problem (i.e. no one expects advanced dissertations on games engines in a review, and for good reasons - among others, a review SHOULD cover the basics, here we use guides for advanced tactics), in some things you are too simplistic (bosses being the easiest part of DOJ?No.Hyper being useless?Again, no). I doubt you're particularly good at shmups, and this is not a crime, but i wouldn't take in consideration too much your opinions on the genre, it happens that i know it rather well myself.


I'm not going to hang around and argue the toss, but because I'm a nice chap, I'll take a few moments out to helpfully correct some of the sillier clangers in this thread, then there'll be a little bit of constructive chat and a cheery farewell. Here we go!

------------------------------

No, of course I'm not, you idiot. Can't you read? Tooth. Paste. Laser. Jeez, you boys really ain't the brightest, are you?

Again, please avoid insults, there's no need for that.

The piece didn't claim to be a definitive history of shmups, it was just an illustration of a point.

Well,you're still wrong, being Batsugun the first title with such a style. The fact that most of your readers don't know much of genre's history isn't an excuse to make up things, sorry.Beside that: Bullet Maze/Hell shmups do have bullets that aim at you, it's just that most enemies shoot patterns instead of single bullets. This is inherited from old games like Flying Shark: bigger enemies had spread (5 bullets spread in an angle) attacks, and usually the central bullet was aimed at you. The principle is still the same, patterns are just more elaborate.

Interesting if you throw in that he's clearly a scrub of the genre, perhaps.

No prob, "scrub" is some nerdy jargon for "basic player", or someone who's not an expert in a game. Definitely not a problem unless, like us shmups ninjas, take pride in playing for score

I shan't stay, because hey, this is your place and if you want to be all "specialist" and "hardcore" - with all the ridiculous, tedious, joyless anal hair-splitting that that usually entails - who am I to spoil your fun? I don't like cowards lying about me in public, though.

Sorry but...Aside the issues of egos ( of which i can't care less), a genre-specific site is supposed to go more in detail than a general site like yours. If you find unfun to be "anal" on shmups (or any other genre), well, i hope you'd never stumble upon Japanese material on, well, shmups. They're much more anal than any of the things you can find here. Beside that, there are people insulting you on an Nepalese forum, i heard. Do you plan to learn their language and show them how cowards they are?

I just wanted to share with others my enjoyment of a game I really love playing, and maybe do a little tiny bit to bring shmups (ones which PAL gamers will actually be able to buy) to a wider audience. I'm terribly sorry that's upset so many of you so much.

I'm happy of this, in case you wonder. And yes, i think that your life will be better after this info

I like Raiden 3 because it's an exciting and addictive game of skill for reasonably normal people. Yeah, if you're one of the autistic savants memorably described by someone else here as "Japanese ninjas", Raiden 3 probably will be a little sedate and ponderous for you.

Aside from "Japanese ninjas" being a joke gone bad (i.e. people taking seriously the said expression), the whole point behind the genre, at least in the Japanese ARCADE "world" (where you get one credit per coin,and that's it), is playing for score, something you highlight in your Raiden DX review. Some games offer a rather high challenge, in case you want the best possible score, and they do it by offering a complex scoring system and difficult levels.
You may find absurd that people spend hundreds of hours on a single title for years, in order to get a few thousand points more, but it is one of the reasons of why shmups still go around, honestly.For what i know, though, they enjoy this, though.

For everyone else it's a lot more accessible, yet still brutally challenging - not least because of the Gradius V-style incrementing credits system, rather than the infinite continues of Cave games and others. (Which get them lazily dismissed in reviews because it means you can "finish" them in 20 minutes, forcing shmups even further into the niche ghetto and reducing even more the likelihood of most of them ever being released in Western territories.)

Sorry but i have to ask you one thing: could you promote the "Arcade-like" approach? Since Raiden III, like most other shmups, is an arcade port, a "true" completion should be based on just one credit. We cunts call them 1-CC (1-Credit Clear). After all, the simplest challenge in a shmup is completing it on one credit (and Raiden III is no cakewalk, in this regard).

Me, I prefer a game where the thing that LOOKS like my ship actually IS my ship. I prefer a game where - unlike Dodonpachi Daioujou, which I've been playing for a few days now - it's ALL about skill, ie there isn't a 40% chance of survival if you just cross your fingers and charge blindly into a pack of 500 enemy bullets, because only one pixel of your "ship" is actually vulnerable.

Fine, except that Raiden III has also a reduced hitbox (but not like DOJ), and DOJ as well is ALL about skill, once you get used to the small hitbox.I do understand you fully, as i had the same opinion about "small hitbox" shmups at the beginning. If you will end up not liking DOJ even after getting the hang of it - well, we're at least in two.

(I rather like DDP-DOJ, but it's shallow eyecandy for drooling halfwits compared to R3, and it's not paining me at all to be away from it while I talk to you muppets. Giga Wing 2 does "bullet hell" ten times better in terms of applying skill.)

Eh, no, DOJ is actually an extremely complex and cerebrotic game in which you will need to throw away the play if you miss for a nano-second a chain. Raiden III is actually quite more straightforward, and surely has less longevity in this regard (the engine itself is much simpler). But yes, DOJ was thought as the "ultimate and final chapter", so it's not something i would give as a present to someone who may like a shmup but doesn't spend ages in dodging bullets.

Since i'm a polite nitpicky cunt, a suggestion: try not to be influenced by, uhm, "accessibility" when reviewing shmups, else it may sound like you want to worship a title just because it's "old skool" (or whatever). And in case you may want to drop a few more infos on the genre's history and other obscure knowledge, i'd glad to be of help.

Love and kisses,
RSC.

Keep up the good work!

R

[Rob]

Bizarrely complex scoring systems are exactly what put people off modern shmups a lot of the time.

I think they're pretty much ignored, so no. Things that put people off of modern shooters:

-They're impossible.
-They're too short.
-They're all the same.
-Unimpressive graphics.
-Poor reviews.

I think that covers 99%. In most reviews the scoring system gets less thought than the unlockables, if mentioned.

[Ghegs]

(Evidently, given that this place displays that sure sign of complete wankery, a forum that you have to be "approved" to post on. Get the fuck over yourselves, eh?)

I managed to post on this board without the "approval" process. I actually believe this is just part of the forum engine that is left over, and is not actually necessary to post. I don't think it at all has anything to do with any sort of elitism, but is merely left over forum code that was never removed during the customisation process.

If the forum owner/mods could confirm/deny the above?

The approval process was only put in a few months ago. We've been getting a lot of spam accounts recently and this is a way of fighting against them, but some still get through. Nothing elitistic about it.

[Randorama]

I'll second that. Now your opinion on shmups I would respect, and hold you to a much higher standard.

Many thanks

I'm thinking about a different way than my humble blog for presenting material, i just need to summon up the will and time...and learn to code html, i think

[Rev. Stuart Campbell]

There is really no need for rude language (and provocations...),

Then blame the person who set the tone with

Stuart Campbell is stupid.

Good thing he is talking good about a shmup, but this doesn't stop him from being a shithead.

[Rob]

Rise above.

[Rev. Stuart Campbell]

Rise above.

People get respect from me when they appear to deserve it. I learned a long time ago that civility is wasted on the uncivil. If you want to be understood by a Frenchman, speak French.

[Shatterhand]

So attack me, not everyone else in the forum. I am the one who said that, and you barely said anything to me. When I said you were stupid and a shithead, people even defended you. Now it looks like I was right, huh?

Just because ONE person attacked you, it doesn't mean you have to attack everyone else. Except by me, I think most people were very nice to you here. Even when you came in and just attacked and offended everyone, people were still nice to you. If you have a problem with what I've said, attack me, don't attack everyone else.

You've been just proving what I've said about you.

I don't think you are a shithead because your reviews (Which I have read just really a few, and they are typical reviews, not awesome, not too bad either). I don't think you are a shithead because you say Sensible Soccer is better than Kick Off - something that I agree 100%. Sensible Soccer indeed is A LOT better than Kick Off or Goal! (Though I would never disrespect Dino Dini because of that... I even said that directly to him in EAB once, and we never had like a 15 years argue because of this....)

You're a shithead just because of your attitude. It's true that you haven't posted more than 50 posts at EAB, but most of them were of the same "quality" of your 5 posts here. Basically any thread where you posted more than once HAD to be locked. It looks like it won't be different here.

Now cmon man, what the heck are you doing here? It must be annoying to have to sign up at so many webforuns just to defend yourself. I wonder how many "journalists" have to keep on doing that.

I'd like to say that if you wanted to stay and talk about shmups, you'd be welcome... we have as many as hardcore shmuppers as "normal" shmuppers and casual gamers.... but I know you are not here to talk about shmups, as you were never at EAB to talk about the Amiga... you only want to annoy people. You are really a big troll, and unless you could change your attitude (Something that I doubt it), it's hard to say you are welcome.

I really find funny how people can easily confuse "Having a strong personality" with "Being annoying to everyone"....

I won't lock this thread now, because I think it would be unfair, as you probably will want your "right to reply" , but I am sure it's going to be locked soon.

[Rev. Stuart Campbell]

So attack me, not everyone else in the forum.

I didn't see any big rush to my defence. If you sit by silently and let other people speak for you, expect to be treated as one of them. The fact that when I registered under my own name my account was deleted immediately speaks volumes.

Oh, and I don't disrespect Dino Dini because Kick Off is inferior to Sensi. I disrespect him because he's a fucking arsehole.

[benstylus]

I'd go ahead and lock the topic anyway... there's really nothing positive that will come out of it.

Stuart's already given the bulk of his responses in his first post.

To sum up:

He gets paid to write, so clearly he is always correct.
He gets 150,000 readers per month, so clearly he is always correct.
He refers to himself as "your correspondent" because he is clearly humble.
Posting negative things about stuff he writes hurts his feelings.
Everyone here is a peabrain.



Dear my correspondent -

If you want people to take you seriously as a journalist, you need to be willing to accept criticism and learn from it.

Going out of your way to sign up at a forum just to insult everyone who disagrees with you makes you appear to share many similarities with Derek Smart.

You don't want to be Derek Smart.

[SAM]

Nice to see you here again, Stuart. Thanks for your times sharing your views with us.

People here said Raiden 3 is "not very good" because its scorceing system is not interesting enough.

Bizarrely complex scoring systems are exactly what put people off modern shmups a lot of the time. I praised Raiden DX for having a wildly complex one for people who want that sort of thing, whereas Raiden 3 is much more attractive for people you're trying to interest in shmups who perhaps weren't before because modern ones are so daunting-looking.

You properly right about this. Raiden 3 at a easier difficulty settings together with its simplier scoring system would be more suitable for beginners at the time. (MushiHime Sama and Horuma is yet to be published, when Raiden 3 is out.) DDP DOJ and ESP galuda are simply not a beginner's game.

MUSHA, Thunder Force III, and the eye candy graphics of Treasure shmups would be better choices.

What are you, dim? We're talking about games PAL players could actually go out and buy. Ikaruga is only released here on Gamecube and is an insanely hardcore game which would make casual players cry anyway, Radiant Silvergun costs hundreds of pounds, and Thunder Force III (a) runs on the fricking Mega Drive, and (b) is utter crap and always has been.

Let's give Stuart a break, his job is to write review on new games. What's the point of bringing old stuff out?

Stuart if you have time, could you tell us how you think about Cave style bullet hell comparing to the traditional style shmups up?

I love them both. The Giga Wings are two of my favourite games (of any genre) of recent years, and they're about as bullet-hell as it gets. I've bought pretty much every shmup ever released on Dreamcast, PS2 or Xbox, and the only ones I've really disliked are Steel Dragon Ex (aka Shienryu Explosion) and Chaos Field. Bullet-hell or trad-style isn't what tends to separate shmups I like from games I don't. I don't like over-complex or gimmicky stuff, as a rule, so Psyvariar and XII Stag are near the bottom of the list (that "constantly wiggle your ship from side to side" thing is the silliest idea I've ever seen in a shooting game). And I don't much care for things that pretend to be shmups but are actually puzzle/memory games, which is why I gave up on Ikaruga pretty early.

And as I say, complex scoring generally annoys me too. The main drawback of DDP-DOJ for me so far is the fact that I can only get the chain from the start of stage 1 into the 200s about one time in ten (still haven't figured out a reliable technique for doing so that doesn't involve using the horrible slow pilot - see, it's a puzzle game, not a shmup), and since failing to do that more or less halves your score for the stage, 90% of my games get aborted and restarted within the first 30 seconds, which gets pretty boring after a while. Mental exertion is not what I'm looking for from a shmup - if I want intellectual exercise I'll play Advance Wars or something.

My thinking towards those "over-complex or gimmicky stuff" is to ignore them until I can handle them. That is to ignore them until I can at least get pass a couple of stages in a single credit. Then I would try to score more in those early stages while trying to get further (survive longer) in the later stages. (Some said it is good because it gives you something to do during the early stages. )

Sometimes developers tried to implement an idea that simply not working, e.g. XII Stag. But there are times they did it right: Ikaruga, DDP DOJ.

I agree with you that Radiant Silvergun & DDP DOJ are simply stuff too heavy for general gamers to enjoy:

Radiant Silvergun got a too complex weapon and scoring system and they even tiding together.

While DDP DOJ is simply too difficult to play. Cave developed this game with veteran players in mind.


These "over-complex or gimmicky stuff" does make the game into an Action Puzzle (game like Umihara Kawase Shun), which tests gamers on both skill and mind. It kinds of like a racer game in the following senses:

(1) You think about the optimum way to get though every part of the stages before you play. While in racer you plan for the optimum way to take every corner in a course.
(2) It needs skill to execute the plan.
(3) If you failed or make a mistake, during execution, you could never get back or catch up again.

Like it or not is simply a matter of personal taste. But first one would need to have a certain level of skill before he/she could take these games as an Action Puzzle.

My friend, Alan Kwan, once said, "a good game should become more and more enjoyable when you get more into it". He think Ikaruga is the best shmups ever, god know he is a puzzle game fan.

He did write some games in depth game review, but quite subjective.

http://home.netvigator.com/~tarot/Games/Games.html

You got to think of ways to get through the all those stages in Raiden 3 alive too, it just easier to figure out and got more margin for errors during execution.

[Rev. Stuart Campbell]

I'd go ahead and lock the topic anyway... there's really nothing positive that will come out of it.

Stuart's already given the bulk of his responses in his first post.

To sum up:

He gets paid to write, so clearly he is always correct.
He gets 150,000 readers per month, so clearly he is always correct.
He refers to himself as "your correspondent" because he is clearly humble.
Posting negative things about stuff he writes hurts his feelings.
Everyone here is a peabrain.



Dear my correspondent -

If you want people to take you seriously as a journalist, you need to be willing to accept criticism and learn from it.

I learn a lot from criticism. I learn that most people are idiots.

[Shatterhand]

I don't see people rushing for people hungry in Africa either.

The fact that when I registered under my own name my account was deleted immediately speaks volumes.

I am not saying this didn't really happen, but I can only understand this as a mistake of the forum server or something or just an aciddent. I can asure you no one deleted your account just because "you were Stuart Campbell".

[Shatterhand]

oh, ok, that's enough.

Thread locked.

Welcome Mr. Campbell.....

[system11]

Hello viewers! It's Rev. Stuart here, posting under a pseudonym because you were too chickenshit to let me register under my own name to defend myself against your cowardly attacks. I can't tell you all how thrilling it is to find the internet hosting yet ANOTHER forum full of bitter, whiny Kick Off fans!

Actually, given the context of the discussion I decided to delete the original registration attempt suspecting it might very well be someone here playing the fool.

(Evidently, given that this place displays that sure sign of complete wankery, a forum that you have to be "approved" to post on. Get the fuck over yourselves, eh?)

If you can get rid of the spammers and other undesirables who keep trying to sign up, we can switch approval off.

I'm not going to hang around and argue the toss, but because I'm a nice chap, I'll take a few moments out to helpfully correct some of the sillier clangers in this thread, then there'll be a little bit of constructive chat and a cheery farewell. Here we go!

*snip*

No, I think you'll find what you actually posted afterwards was a trolling expedition. As you say, "get the fuck over yourself" - we don't much care about you slating Amiga football games, no matter how much you'd like it if we did.

How much further down the spiral will you slide? Tim Rogers awaits at the bottom.