RQ: DoDonPachi Double Play

[Neptas]

(I wasn't sure if the subject was more ReQuest or Game Discusion, sorry if I mistook)

Hello there, has been a little while since my last visit here, anyway;

My last personal achievement being Ikaruga Double Played on easy, and noticing I have skillz for that kind of thing apparently, I decided to go again on that matter. First I wanted to do Ikaruga on Normal mode (cause it's badass), but I tried a bit on DoDonPachi and, well, for a first try, it went really good (well, from my own point of view). On another try, I managed to get to the 6th boss with both ships still alive, so I was actually very close to succeed on my very first try.

Here's the video of my second try:

Video on YouTube here

My aim is definitely not to score (at least for now), I'm really focusing on beating the game first using bomb, then without.

So... Here are my little questions:

What ships should I take? I took Double A-Laser, it has absolute devastating firepower and tears down bosses in seconds (not to mention the speed). I was also thinking taking one A-Laser and one C-Shot, so they could complement each other, but I fear the difference in speed might be hard to handle in tight situation (you have to handle two ships in an incredible hard game, and furthermore, they don't even have same speed and maniability, making it even worse for your little brain). Maybe A-Shot / A-Laser combo?

I checked quickly on Youtube (it's 3 AM here, I'm REALLY tired and type this with my last bit of strenght already), but I couldn't find any true video on it. Do you have any? I remember I saw some on Dai-Ou-Jou, so there must be someone who tried Double Play for DoDonPachi, right? RIGHT?

And if you have even more time, I'd also like to talk about the level strategies. I just did some quick games today, so I of course lack of practice, but from what I experienced, level 5 was a pain, and I had to bombspam quite a bit. Not talking about level 6. And actually, I'm very good at copying stuff I see, but when it comes to actually think by myself on how to clear those levels, I suck. Basically, if you can watch my video and tell me what I'm doing wrong, don't hesitate to tell me and tell me a more easier way to do it; On my video, I went totally randomly, so it might hurts your eyes if you're pro, sorry 'bout that.

And well, for bosses, except bombspamming, I still have no clue how to pass them really well. For the 4 first bosses, it just little practice, but I never managed to get through boss 5 and 6 correctly, any tips?

Honnestly, I don't expect many answers, I know Double Playing is quite an insane thing to do, but if some Pro-DoDonPachi players are watching this, I really think your experience of the game could help with this. And if you've done Double Play as well, I'd be very motivated and interested in hearing your stories / experiences.

I might come with more questions / discussions later on, but for now that's pretty much all.

I'm really grateful for any of you reading this, and thank for any future replies.

[Erppo]

As far as I know, the game won't loop in two player mode so a simple clear with lots of bombs shouldn't be very hard. I'd take a wide shot to keep the popcorn away and then some laser ship (any type works, they probably won't be shooting) to kill big things fast. Even if you don't get the final extends you should have so many bombs with two ships that you don't have to face anything difficult with a good bomb plan.

Doing it all with minimal bomb usage is probably a lot more interesting goal. I don't really expect the chaining to work with two players at all.

Since you can have the ships on top of each other, doing the bosses as "one ship" and using the usual one player methods probably makes most sense. I guess that might be hard though if you end up with two ships of different speeds...

[Chaos Phoenixma]

I'm sure the loop requirement thing could be changed if you knew how to hack the game to allow it anyway.

As for a suggestion, I'd probably go with 2x C-Shot assuming that's allowed by the game. Or if not a C-Shot/C-L. Or if that's also not allowed for some reason then a Type C and Type B. I'm guessing a ship on both the right and left side of the screen would reduce the bullet densities a lot, but I'm terrible at this game anyway and would never try this myself(I just can't control 2 things at once and the only thing I've beaten like that was Ms. Splosion's Man's mode where you control 2 by yourself, but that has checkpoints and infinite lives to mess with), so this may not be the best advice.

Of course, since I have no idea if this would work, it's possible that a ship on both the left and right would just end with you walling yourself somehow since I have no idea how the patterns would work in 2 player.

[BareKnuckleRoo]

I've tried a few different looping Cave games (DDP, Ketsui, Progear) and TASed them so both characters meet the loop requirements (NMNB) and it seems that the loop is always disabled for co-op/doubleplay. The only game where you CAN loop with 2 players is the original Donpachi, which technically has no loop requirements.

As far as ship selection goes, it's more about what you're comfortable with. C-S has great coverage but has some speed issues, B-S is also extremely wide and very powerful as all shots are directed forward, whereas both A types have a lack of spread that can make it difficult. Depending on how close together or how spread out you keep your ships will change how useful a thin shot type is, I think. It might help to play the same shot type on both, just so you can get used to both ships having the same movespeed... but then again it could be confusing having two ships with the same colour shots. I wouldn't go with an A&C pairing myself, their movement speeds are too far apart for me to be comfortable with controlling both.

[Neptas]

As far as I know, the game won't loop in two player mode so a simple clear with lots of bombs shouldn't be very hard. I'd take a wide shot to keep the popcorn away and then some laser ship (any type works, they probably won't be shooting) to kill big things fast. Even if you don't get the final extends you should have so many bombs with two ships that you don't have to face anything difficult with a good bomb plan.

Doing it all with minimal bomb usage is probably a lot more interesting goal. I don't really expect the chaining to work with two players at all.

Since you can have the ships on top of each other, doing the bosses as "one ship" and using the usual one player methods probably makes most sense. I guess that might be hard though if you end up with two ships of different speeds...

Yeah, with the 6M extend, you basically have 24x2 bombs, not counting the bonus bombs. More than enough to spam bomb any bosses :V, so no-bomb is clearly my official goal. I saw some nice chaining in the Dai-Ou-Jou Double Play, so it might still possible to have some nice chains to do in 2 players, at least just for the fun.

I thought about doing that 1-player trick for bosses, but I feel it is a bit cheating, if you see what I mean :p, I'll see how the bosses go, and I'll maybe do that if I'm having true difficulties.

I'm sure the loop requirement thing could be changed if you knew how to hack the game to allow it anyway.

As for a suggestion, I'd probably go with 2x C-Shot assuming that's allowed by the game. Or if not a C-Shot/C-L. Or if that's also not allowed for some reason then a Type C and Type B. I'm guessing a ship on both the right and left side of the screen would reduce the bullet densities a lot, but I'm terrible at this game anyway and would never try this myself(I just can't control 2 things at once and the only thing I've beaten like that was Ms. Splosion's Man's mode where you control 2 by yourself, but that has checkpoints and infinite lives to mess with), so this may not be the best advice.

Of course, since I have no idea if this would work, it's possible that a ship on both the left and right would just end with you walling yourself somehow since I have no idea how the patterns would work in 2 player.

I'm not focusing on the second loop anyway, I yet have to beat the first. I never tried C-L a single time in fact, so I might give it a Shot (get it, Shot? Ba-dam-tsum).

Having a ship on the left and the other on the right works generally very well, at least till a bigger enemy comes and protects the others. You have few shots to dodge, but nothing more. Yet, I still fail to see how the enemy handles their shot, I'm thinking they fire sometimes at the closest player, sometimes at the farther one.

You can take the same ship for both player, and I don't see anyway why it wouldn't be allow anyway.

I've tried a few different looping Cave games (DDP, Ketsui, Progear) and TASed them so both characters meet the loop requirements (NMNB) and it seems that the loop is always disabled for co-op/doubleplay. The only game where you CAN loop with 2 players is the original Donpachi, which technically has no loop requirements.

As far as ship selection goes, it's more about what you're comfortable with. C-S has great coverage but has some speed issues, B-S is also extremely wide and very powerful as all shots are directed forward, whereas both A types have a lack of spread that can make it difficult. Depending on how close together or how spread out you keep your ships will change how useful a thin shot type is, I think. It might help to play the same shot type on both, just so you can get used to both ships having the same movespeed... but then again it could be confusing having two ships with the same colour shots. I wouldn't go with an A&C pairing myself, their movement speeds are too far apart for me to be comfortable with controlling both.

The game handles a different color for the second player, Type A is yellow, B is purple and C dark green, so it's not that confusing gladly. I think that having two A-L ships compensate the lack of spread of this ship, but because I sometimes get under heavy time, I tend to keep both of them close to each other, and having two ships with little spread close to each other in a popcorn area is a bad idea.

Thanks for all your replies, I have new things to try now, hopefully I can get to level 6 on a regular basis soon enough.

EDIT: Anyone knows how to be able to push the two triggers with a X360 controller on ShmupMAME? I decided to put auto-fire for P1 on the LT, and P2 on RT, but I can't fire with both ships at the same time, because the triggers on the X360 controller are the same axis, yet on some game (like Ikaruga), it works very well. Anyone knows the trick?

EDIT 2: Cleared game today on double A-L, used a few bombs and made many stupid mistake yet, but I'm getting the hand more and more. I also tried A-L + C-S, and actually, when laser is active from the type A, the speed is very very close to the type C in shot, so it's not that bad.

[Neptas]

Just s quick up.

I'm still working on it a bit, and now I can manage to no-miss no-bomb till middle of level 5.

I only managed to pass the mass pop-corn part once with luck, and I always have to bomb at least once generally. Putting one ship to the left and one to the right makes the dodging pratically impossible as both ships will be under heavy pressure. And even if I dodge, some enemy shots aimed at P1 will go as well on P2, and vice versa.

I can pass the level 5 boss without problem though now.

For level 6, I still didn't practice much on it, but I don't feel I'll get much trouble... except for the last boss...

[Captain]

I'm sure it loops if both players fill the requirements.

The easiest one is using no bombs, If I recall correctly.

Aren't there cheats to start from loop 2 anyway?

[Chaos Phoenixma]

It doesn't. One of the requirements is 1 credit while 2 players means 2 credits were used.

[Patashu]

If you want to do two player loop 2 you have to start the second player after you reach loop 2 with just one player and go from there. At least if you're on emulator you can make a savestate there.