NESRGB board available now

[ms06fz]

2. I accidentally mounted the adapter board upside down, but that shouldn't matter, should it? Doesn't it just shift the pins?

I guess other people have already pointed this out but yes, it does matter. The adapter board doesn't carry the pins that aren't needed (which I think is just EXT0..EXT3, which are just grounded on the main board) - so if you flip the adapter around you'd lose 4 bits of the PPU address/data bus (AD1-4), looks like. I don't quite know how that causes the kind of result you saw, but there you go...

Hopefully this will sort out your problem. I guess the shot in the dark was worth it after all.

(IIRC there was also a gametech.us video in which he considered reversing the adapter board for an install, but couldn't because the adapter isn't symmetrical. Just one of many little tidbits of info on which I fed to pass time while waiting for NESRGB boards to come back in stock...)

[daskrabs]

Yeah. Looking at the traces on the adapter board, not all pins are shifted. Some are dead ends. If you flip it then you will change this.

Well, looks like I have a lot desoldering to do. Thanks guys.

[lettuce]

Yeah. Looking at the traces on the adapter board, not all pins are shifted. Some are dead ends. If you flip it then you will change this.

Well, looks like I have a lot desoldering to do. Thanks guys.

Notice you have fitted sockets to the NESRGB to fit the PPU chip into, what type of socket did you use?

[lettuce]

Regarding using the internal regulator in a front loader NES, i know you dont need to wire up the +5v pad on the NESRGB but do you need to wire the ground pad??

[darcagn]

Regarding using the internal regulator in a front loader NES, i know you dont need to wire up the +5v pad on the NESRGB but do you need to wire the ground pad??

Nope.

[daskrabs]

Yeah. Looking at the traces on the adapter board, not all pins are shifted. Some are dead ends. If you flip it then you will change this.

Well, looks like I have a lot desoldering to do. Thanks guys.

Notice you have fitted sockets to the NESRGB to fit the PPU chip into, what type of socket did you use?

I took the one that came with the kit and split it.

Looks like this is a lost cause. Gonna buy another one once they come back in stock in the US. Anyone wanna buy a parts NESRGB? If yes PM me.

[Pasky]

Don't do that, I can only imagine how many people already PM'd you to try to take advantage of you for something you can easily fix for under $10.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/5x-40-pin-1-row ... 565a228beb

http://www.ebay.com/itm/5-pcs-40-pin-60 ... 4ac8bbf05f

http://www.ebay.com/itm/8-pcs-2-54-1X40 ... 2a3cd7535f

Those should be all you need worse case scenario. You can get these even cheaper if you buy from Chinese sellers. I listed USA buyers for convenience and didn't even bother looking for the best deals.

Don't let some chumps take advantage of you, that's an easy fix.

[ms06fz]

You may have another option, if you're really having no luck removing the adapter board: That is to add wires to replace the four(?) missing traces on the board. Pins 34-37 I think. If I'm not mistaken, that should get the board working. It's not a pretty solution but I'm pretty sure it'll work.

[lettuce]

Regarding using the internal regulator in a front loader NES, i know you dont need to wire up the +5v pad on the NESRGB but do you need to wire the ground pad??

Nope.

Tar

[ms06fz]

Interestingly enough, my front-loader install (still on v1.5, my USB blaster is still in the mail) doesn't get that background glitch with Super Mario 2. I wonder why.

[Pasky]

Just because it has a 1.5 sticker on it doesn't mean it was loaded with 1.5 (mistakes happen), my first batch nesrgb apparently had some firmware different from others with the FF1 glitch I was having.

Is it possible to download it from the CPLD and then crc check it versus the 1.5 download? I'm not really sure.

Easier way to tell is just download 1.5 and try it (if it's available).

[ms06fz]

It's possible. I'm a bit curious so maybe I'll do a little digging once I get the blaster.

[leonk]

I will be shocked if it says 1.5 but 1.5 is not loaded. When these boards are made the firmware is blank. Tim puts the firmware on them in batches. If you get something different then everyone gets the wrong firmware.

[Pasky]

I will be shocked if it says 1.5 but 1.5 is not loaded. When these boards are made the firmware is blank. Tim puts the firmware on them in batches. If you get something different then everyone gets the wrong firmware.

Ya, because it's totally not possible for Tim to choose the wrong file when programming the CPLD.

[leonk]

I will be shocked if it says 1.5 but 1.5 is not loaded. When these boards are made the firmware is blank. Tim puts the firmware on them in batches. If you get something different then everyone gets the wrong firmware.

Ya, because it's totally not possible for Tim to choose the wrong file when programming the CPLD.

For all boards???

[Pasky]

Of course not, who knows how this is done though. It could be a 1.4 Board he had made, made 1.5, had it in a pile, thought he flashed it with 1.5 and put the sticker on, I mean who knows? Mistakes happen.

Fact is, several people have confirmed the issues with 1.5, including Viletim himself. More than likely, Ms0 doesn't have 1.5 flashed on it.

[ms06fz]

Well if nothing else I'll probably re-load 1.5 on the board to test this again before loading 1.7, so I'll at least get confirmation of whether it really is 1.5 exhibiting this behavior.

Given the nature of the bug and the workaround (timing sensitivity on one of the RAM control lines, worked around by adding capacitance to the line to slow down transitions) it's possible that manufacturing variations from one board to another or differences in the installation may cause the bug to not manifest. Or it could be, like some have said, that my board isn't actually running 1.5. I have no particular need to know one way or another but I am kind of curious.

[darcagn]

Given the nature of the bug and the workaround (timing sensitivity on one of the RAM control lines, worked around by adding capacitance to the line to slow down transitions) it's possible that manufacturing variations from one board to another or differences in the installation may cause the bug to not manifest.

Indeed, this is where my money is. Not a single person complained about Final Fantasy other than Pasky, my assumption there all along was that the bug existed in all of our boards but still worked since it's a timing issue.

[CkRtech]

Putting all my assumptions and guesses aside - Guys, is there a way for me to check for noise/interference in the video lines using a multimeter? Sadly, I do not own a scope (yet).

[Pasky]

Given the nature of the bug and the workaround (timing sensitivity on one of the RAM control lines, worked around by adding capacitance to the line to slow down transitions) it's possible that manufacturing variations from one board to another or differences in the installation may cause the bug to not manifest.

Indeed, this is where my money is. Not a single person complained about Final Fantasy other than Pasky, my assumption there all along was that the bug existed in all of our boards but still worked since it's a timing issue.

I don't think this is the issue, because I put that NESRGB in 3 different NES's, including 2 top loaders and a toaster and had the same problem, each with varying manufacturers for the RAM and latch chips.

But, like I said, an easy way to find out would be to just have Ms0 flash his with 1.5 and see if the bug occurs.

CkRtech:

No, you'll need a scope.

[ms06fz]

I felt like I'd rather have a palette select button rather than a palette switch, so I stuck an Arduino on the palette select lines. Unfortunately Arduino has that startup delay while it listens for bootloader instructions... So the PPU winds up without the correct palette as NESRGB doesn't kick in until the Arduino has started up...
Bleah. Guess I need to get rid of the bootloader or something.
(Also... Using a 16MHz CPU to make a pushbutton do a slide switch's work? How messed up is that? I'm not shy about throwing microcontrollers at simple jobs like that but it does seem messed up when the CPU used for such a little job is way more powerful than the main CPU of the machine I'm installing it in...)

[bobrocks95]

I felt like I'd rather have a palette select button rather than a palette switch, so I stuck an Arduino on the palette select lines. Unfortunately Arduino has that startup delay while it listens for bootloader instructions... So the PPU winds up without the correct palette as NESRGB doesn't kick in until the Arduino has started up...
Bleah. Guess I need to get rid of the bootloader or something.
(Also... Using a 16MHz CPU to make a pushbutton do a slide switch's work? How messed up is that? I'm not shy about throwing microcontrollers at simple jobs like that but it does seem messed up when the CPU used for such a little job is way more powerful than the main CPU of the machine I'm installing it in...)

Now you're playing with Power. Nintendo Power.

[Ed Oscuro]

I felt like I'd rather have a palette select button rather than a palette switch

There's three palette choices, right? Maybe something like this will do the job.

Maybe better yet, people at Candlepower forums found this part, a push switch with four states.

[Konsolkongen]

Didn't someone make a switchless palette-mod already?

If so, has he/she made the code publicly available, or perhaps even sells the ICs. That would be better as I don't have a PIC programmer

I have a customer who would really like a switchless install, so any help would be greatly appreciated.

[keropi]

^ several pages back, perhaps near the middle the switchless stuff are posted, everything to make your own PIC
but I can't remember who posted it

ok, found a video with a link to the files: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNAoUyugP7A
it is Rikard Bengtsson's work

[Konsolkongen]

Thanks! Unfortunately there are no install instructions linked in the video or the files he provides.
I'll try writing him

[ms06fz]

I felt like I'd rather have a palette select button rather than a palette switch

There's three palette choices, right? Maybe something like this will do the job.

Yeah there's all kinds of simple circuits that could do the "cycle through selections" thing. The 4017 would be a pretty natural choice too. But using a micro would let me do things like work the power LED to indicate which palette's selected, do something different when the button's held down, or save the selection and use it again on the next boot.

Normally for jobs like this I have a little PIC board I designed, but I went with the Arduino 'cause I didn't have any PICs handy to use. Unfortunately I didn't foresee this bootloader problem. It'll be easy enough to fix though.

[Pasky]

I've noticed that diagonal interference in my AV famicom vs my US top loader. On my top loader I can't see it at all. But on my Revision 1 AV famicom, it's there, clear as day through RGB and S-video.

[darcagn]

I've noticed that diagonal interference in my AV famicom vs my US top loader. On my top loader I can't see it at all. But on my Revision 1 AV famicom, it's there, clear as day through RGB and S-video.

What are you using for sync?

[Pasky]

CS#