Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

[BrianC]

I played some more GG Shinobi on 3DS. I like how the yellow ninja has the Mystic Defender/Peacock King 2 charge attack. Especially fun on the forest level. Pink Ninja's upside down ceiling crawl is good stuff too.

[BIL]

It's a shame M2 never did a Monster World/Fantasy Zone-calibre PS2 Shinobi disc with the arcade, GG and SMS titles. And the MD ones, of course, but I don't care because I have them LOLOL. Maybe even Shin Shinobi Den? It's pretty good™, honest! (all cutscenes skipper) Shame about the bargain basement digitised characters.

I played through Ninja Gaiden III yesterday with this hack... The game did glitch once. I fell at the rainy vertical area in stage 5, and before I could start making my way back up, the moving platforms disappeared.

Same thing happened to me yesterday with a vanilla NGIII (U) (!) ROM. OH WELLZ

That aside! State of the art sidescrolling ninja action. NG1's crisp simplicity is my overall favourite, but NG3 is a ferociously tough and complete development of its twitch-Dracula model, that tightrope-running combination of intensely dangerous stages, a powerfully flexible yet subtly flawed character and just enough rope to hang yourself with. It's beeyootifully produced too. (all cutscenes skipper) So much parallax and colour, and I love the furiously off-kilter, sometimes quite lovely BGM.

NTSCU is hands-down my regional pick, though it's nice also having Ryukenden III to leisurely blast through. Too bad they weren't simply complementary loops/difficulties on the same cart. >_< The stricter ammo allocation in particular makes NGIII a far more visceral affair, since you're forced to kill more stuff toe-to-toe. Luckily the normal sword's hitbox is much closer to NG1's sensible range than the overly strict NG2. The second game is always fun but I actually find it more taxing than NG3, since the smaller sword requires such concentration to connect with 100% of the time.

I do wonder if it's even possible to one-life NG3 without hanging onto the invincible firewheel all through Act VII, though. You'd have to be fucking caning it from start to finish but it seems just about doable, considering how quickly the boss rush goes down if you're aggressive enough. Hard to tell if this was a conscious decision - I'm guessing not, since even the deliberately mild NRIII does it and ironically becomes nearly as intense to no-miss as a result.

[Austin]

I do wonder if it's even possible to one-life NG3 without hanging onto the invincible firewheel all through Act VII, though. You'd have to be fucking caning it from start to finish but it seems just about doable, considering how quickly the boss rush goes down if you're aggressive enough. Hard to tell if this was a conscious decision - I'm guessing not, since even the deliberately mild NRIII does it and ironically becomes nearly as intense to no-miss as a result.

I think it's doable. Like the other two before it, it's all about having a few tricky sections memorized, and playing patiently. Thankfully the sword upgrade makes those certain sections a lot easier than they probably would be without it. I should try to make an honest effort at no-deathing the game sometime...

Funny you mention the invincible firewheel in your post as well. This is a game I've been playing since I was a kid, and I didn't find out the wheel made you invincible through spikes until I accidentally discovered it while doing a Let's Play of the Japanese version, maybe about a year ago. And to think, all this time I was doing it the hard way.. but as a result of doing so, it doesn't seem that hard to me anymore, haha.

[BIL]

I'd almost prefer to skip the firewheel - since its massive hitbox can so easily open a subweapon container and dump the contents on Ryu, I'm virtually sword-only at tighter points. I've not 1LCd either version yet, but I did firewheel to NG3's second rush boss with plenty of time to spare before getting splash-killed by a poorly herded grenade!

Would be interesting to see if it's actually possible to non-firewheel 1LC it, the time limit is brutal. NG3 is the hardest single loop sidescroller I know of on NES/FC next to Holy Diver, which is so damn hard I don't feel compelled to no-miss it any time soon.

[BrianC]

It's a shame M2 never did a Monster World/Fantasy Zone-calibre PS2 Shinobi disc with the arcade, GG and SMS titles. And the MD ones, of course, but I don't care because I have them LOLOL. Maybe even Shin Shinobi Den? It's pretty good™, honest! (all cutscenes skipper) Shame about the bargain basement digitised characters.

yeah. At least M2 did the 3DS versions of GG Shinobi and Shinobi III. I generally prefer real carts, but I'm not a fan of the GG hardware. I like having GG games that are less of a pain to play on the go. I don't prefer Shinobi III over the real cart (which I have), but I like having a well done port with nice 3D. I do have the actual cart of GG Shinobi II, though.

I wouldn't mind a M2 compilation, but Revenge of Shinobi would likely be the pink Spiderman version (the emulation of which was done by M2 for 360, PS3, and Wii). Aside from Alex Kidd in Shinobi World, I don't feel the SMS titles are that noteworthy. The Shinobi port isn't bad, but is easily trumped by the arcade version. Cyber Shinobi doesn't feel very Shinobi like at all and doesn't even seem to be that great in its own right.

[Ex_Mosquito]

I'm surprised M2 didn't do a Shinobi compilation as well. Sure, it has a couple of turkeys but it would've made an amazing package.

My recent Shinobi homage http://youtu.be/h01Sok6ATgI

[BIL]

Aye, bring on the turkeys and black sheep! It's all about the completism. I don't think I've played the Master System version of Galaxy Force II on the PS2 AGES disc for more than five minutes, but I love that it's on there. AC Shinobi is on some Digital Eclipse PS3/360 comp or another, but M2's luxurious PS2 discs would've obviously been the ideal. I remember them being quoted on gamengai that the 2500jpy price point for that line was a bit low considering all the work that went into them, haha.

Great story about your Shinobi PCB, I wonder where some of the boards I grew up with are now... I'd like to have a similarly clean and simple Supergun setup, some day. I initially wondered if that miss you mentioned the end of the run might've been the return of Cataimura.

Congratulations on that Ninja Spirit no-miss, by the way! I stalled at the infamous ninja pit helldive that gives everyone trouble, haven't gone back yet.

[BrianC]

AC Shinobi is on some Digital Eclipse PS3/360 comp or another, but M2's luxurious PS2 discs would've obviously been the ideal.

At least M2 did a good job with the Wii VC version. The only issue is the removal of the Marlyn Manroe posters and the color change of the spiderman like guys. I wouldn't be surprised if Backbone's emulation didn't hold a candle to M2s. I heard that some of their Genesis emulations have input lag and that the sound was botched big time in Space Harrier.

[Ex_Mosquito]

Heya Bil. Yeah they did seem a bit cheap. I've only played one of their complications, the monster world one, and I thought it was excellent. They really do go all out when they get to work on a classic franchise, you can tell they're passionate to the legacy of the series.

Heh yeah I was pretty lucky to stumble across the same PCB from my childhood, beats buying a random Shinobi board off eBay anyday That was my an old Supergun I made back in the late 90's, it's nothing fancy like some of the Superguns on this forum, but it works for me. Hah Cataimura, nah I couldn't blame it on her this time. I usually use my AstroCity cab for replay videos and arcade games but its in storage at the moment so I have to use the Supergun instead:( My Supergun set-up isn't ideal really, the stick is a little high for my liking and because I'm restricted with space I have to angle the monitor to get the joystick to fit on the top :/ The reason I died was because of the weird angle of the monitor in relation to the stick and I clipped down-back instead of back :/

Erm Ninja Spirit, I really don't like that game anymore. I feel a good run depends heavily on luck. Stage 6 is pretty ridiculous. It's so bloody random! Hah yeah the Ninja pit. The only way I could get my head around it was to make a map, cheap isn't the word..

[BIL]

Dedication. ^__^

The pit is pretty ridiculous, indeed. I realised it was a last minute coin grab from Irem and put the game on the back burner, some months back. The poison gas cave's not much fun either - stage 6 is a way better finale than 7, actually focusing on the lunar gravity ninja combat that makes the game stand out. I love everything up to the end of stage 6, though, as cruel as the game can be. Ninja sidescrollers are a favourite thing of mine, and NS's intensity and morbid tone give it a uniquely nightmarish atmosphere.

Their Holy Diver (FC) isn't as difficult overall, but it has a similarly nasty random element. The penultimate area puts you at the mercy of indestructible, RNG-crazed roaming enemies in a sniper turret-infested room distinctly lacking a floor. I'm not entirely sure if it's possible to survive the worst case scenario there. Metal Storm (FC)'s hard as hell loop seems fairly stable by comparison to those two, more like an on-foot R-Type with punishingly tight but generally routine stage design.

[trap15]

Their Holy Diver (FC) isn't as difficult overall

There's a game harder than Holy Diver?... That has to be the most hellish thing ever

[BIL]

Well, more consistently harrowing at least. Holy Diver's a mercurial beast. As we know the stage and enemy designs are bone-crushingly tough (even ignoring the glitchy controls - what the fuck Irem ಠ_ಠ). But it's generally happy to let you set your own pace, farm some HP/MP maxouts and get your bearings. NS just rains a shitstorm of lethal, infinitely respawning enemies that can all take you out in one hit, plus the occasional really nasty bruiser. Both the wide-open and claustrophobic environments make the onslaught very hard to stave off. And then it breaks out a lengthy, blatant rote memoriser before the final boss that'll make you curse Irem harder than even the cruellest of HD's bullshit. >_>

I find NS's relentless terror the more intimidating game, but all three (including Metal Storm's loop) are suitable for sidescrolling action enthusiasts who truly wish to glimpse hell!

[Ed Oscuro]

I have way more trouble with HD than I do with Ninja Spirit, at least on default settings of NS. Beat the game on a PC-GT once, too.

[trap15]

Hey BIL, you have any experience/etc with 8 Eye's? Been watching feasel speedrun it recently and it looks pretty neat, but I'm curious how it is from a 'casual' standpoint.

[BIL]

I've actually been wondering about that one myself - watched a bit of the current SDA run a few months back. It has some cool ideas with subweapons and the birdie familiar, and I really like the BGM and overall vibe. Couldn't quite tell if it was a sound action game before I moved on, though. Investigations required!

[Obiwanshinobi]

Not sidescrolling, but it's ancient and has got separate buttons for attack and jump (Famicom version looks so crude I can only suspect he kicks, at least on early screens), so it feels like maybe paleo-Monster World, or proto-Castlevania to me. Super Arabian is a game I believe people interested in the history of platforming action should sample. I don't know how it differs from the original Arabian (1983), but my guess would be: compromised graphics (sure look so), refined gameplay.

[Ed Oscuro]

I would also like to get clued-in on 8 EYES. Tried it and promptly got stuffed in the first areas. It has some promise, but ack!

[Austin]

I'm curious how it is from a 'casual' standpoint.

Definitely not one for the casuals. 8-Eyes can be pretty tough. Needs a lot of patience and memorization. I've never completed it personally, was only able to make it through a few stages.

[trap15]

Sorry, casual was probably the wrong word (I've been trying to clear Holy Diver; if that's casual... )

I meant more like, not as a speedrun heh. I can appreciate a hard game though, and this sounds good. I should find a cart

[BIL]

Not liking 8 Eye's* too much atm. Spent a few hours on it today, cleared some stages, not much satisfaction. Hard for sure, but dubiously so. Combat is simply awkward rather than calculatedly restricting, and stage design is basic, bereft of tricky footing or traps and reliant on attrition. Middling Dracula knockoff, in other words - not awful but outclassed. Charming music, and I like the elegant visual motif, but for harder action of this sort Castlevania III is vastly superior.

Being able to carry multiple subweapons is interesting, but using them with [any direction that's not L or R] plus [jump] is an awful idea. You're constantly moving the d-pad around while hitting jump in this kind of game, and ammo isn't plentiful. Birdie familiar is a potentially great mechanic but the inability to control his horizontal movement creates tedium - would be a lot better if you could have him double back for repeat strikes, instead of wafting over to the screen edge before returning.

Worth at least booting up for Thinking Rabbit's sweet logo.



Also resurrected my intermittent Quest For Good Mark III Games That Aren't Kenseiden and put some time on Shinobi. Good grief. Awful port - the AC version's fluidity and precision is almost totally gone. Execute a crouching melee attack while a projectile is passing overhead and get clobbered by bad hitbox goodness; behold the choppy tier switch, and fight the instinct to immediately shut off your machine. The original content is only mildly interesting, yet utterly botched anyway. Hostages grant bonuses now, including a situationally useful grenade projectile, but since there's no telling which hostages hold what items, you won't know whether you're about to get a much-needed life restore or a much-unwanted weapon change. Unless you memorise the entire game. Aww yeee!

I could see this having been a welcome and even beloved home port at release, but there's no reason to bother with it now.

*questionable apostrophe removed for overseas release ^_~

[GSK]

The best part about 8 Eyes is how your dude sits down for a cup of tea with every boss he defeats.

[Obiwanshinobi]

I don't know whether most of you consider it on topic, but I just played some Hello Kitty World on Nestopia. It's Balloon Kid reskinned; largely unnecessary rehash, but the gameplay seems ported well. Nothing terribly wrong with the sound and the playfield seems of the same size as it was on Game Boy. Other than Hello Kitty sprite looking iconic, I can't say much good about the rest of graphical differences. Most things look more "cartoony" now, whereas Balloon Kid had a mildly bio-horrific flavour, not unlike Sqoon (not the only similarity between BK and Irem auto-scrollers, but enough said).
Gone is the story where the girl rescues the guy (any other games than BK and Rhapsody: A Musical Adventure sharing the trait?), as is the melancholic opening; instead, Hello Kitty chases after a teddy bear. Gone is the score-attacking journey, but 2 player mode can be chosen now.
Last but not least, I found accessing the first (?) "Balloon Fight" door inside sperm whale (where two vertically moving platforms need to be utilised) trickier than on the GB, so maybe not all gameplay is that well ported at the end of the day. More obviously, the slowdown differs, but don't expect Hello Kitty World to run remarkably smoother overall. I still am not sure if background this lo-res can scroll this slowly any more fluidly at 60 Hz.

What all of you really need to know is that GBA SP allows you to play the original Balloon Kid without cutting any corners. The only thing of relevance Hello Kitty World brings to the table is co-op, however, ommitting vs and Balloon Trip at that.

[BrianC]

Not liking 8 Eye's*
*questionable apostrophe removed for overseas release ^_~

Apparently, only on the box art, not in game, telling from videos of the US NES version (has Licensed from Nintendo on the title screen). I watched a video that played the game on very hard mode using a password and it looks extremely cheap with fast enemies that look impossible to avoid.

[BIL]

The best part about 8 Eyes is how your dude sits down for a cup of tea with every boss he defeats.

Most definitely. Skeleton menservants. It's a classy joint! Well, aside from the occasional "Jesus in his tighty whities" enemy type.

[Ex_Mosquito]

Not strictly all Platform games, but 7 out of the 15 are I need to mix it up a bit I think.

http://youtu.be/sDdIoBtFREI

[soprano1]

Not strictly all Platform games, but 7 out of the 15 are I need to mix it up a bit I think.

http://youtu.be/sDdIoBtFREI

Impressive. Kudos to you.

[BIL]

Not strictly all Platform games, but 7 out of the 15 are I need to mix it up a bit I think.

http://youtu.be/sDdIoBtFREI

You've got one serious coinop resume Mr. Mosquito! And some very good taste in VGM too, loved watching Daimakaimura turbo-beasted to "Black Rain," and those Valken, Elemental Master and Ganbare Goemon tunes!

[Ex_Mosquito]

Cheers Soprano1 / BIL

Well spotted on the music, BIL! I'm impressed Yeah, arcade games have always been my fav genre of games growing up. Punishing and rewarding games that are quick to complete. They're especially suited to adult lifestyle. Modern 3D cinematic games bore the hell out of me and demand way too much time. Unfortunately my cab has been in storage for the last 8months but I should be getting it back in the next few weeks, I can't wait

[Koa Zo]

It's a shame M2 never did a Monster World/Fantasy Zone-calibre PS2 Shinobi disc with the arcade, GG and SMS titles.

I'm pretty sure Golden Axe Collection was to be Vol.34, and Shinobi Collection was to be Vol.35

[BIL]

Crumbs! :[

Although, I guess there'd always be something left to wish for. Sega's super scaler and 3D racing back catalogues alone deserved their own dedicated lines. I know I'm not the only one who bought Sega Rally 2006 expressly for M2's port of the original arcade game on its bonus disc.

I've been alternating Ninja Ryukenden II and Metal Storm's scary [w e l c o m e_t o_s p e c i a l_r o u n d] loop this week. I never regarded the former as a particularly memorisation-heavy game for survival, but it does play quite interestingly when you know how to hang on to particular subweapons for certain sections. They're absolutely everywhere and very easy to accidentally pick up if you just kamikaze through like I do, you see. The only part of the game I'd make a point of equipping and keeping a certain weapon for was 5-1's spikey labyrinth, where the invincible firewheel is the logical choice for the lack of wriggle room and aggressively chakram-chucking chibi Bomberheads. There are a lot of places that heavily favour one subweapon over the others, though, where I'd usually just wing it with whatever was at hand and maybe a few bumps here and there. Such a satisfying game to play at high speed.

Besides Ryukenden III (all items visible) and Vampire Killer (fatty candles = subweapons), did any other Smack The Item Box game give visual cues? I guess it's part of the fun in The Super Shinobis, Solbrain and others with hazardous "blow up in yer face" items.