NESRGB board available now

[leonk]

Looks good.

My only suggestion to you is remove the 220uF caps off the NESRGB pcb for RG and B and short the pads. 220 caps are in the cable not the pcb in commercial solutions.

Apart from that I'd leave as is. Too many people nitpick here for unknown reasons. Your wires are clean and you seem to be skilled with a solder iron given the consistent solder points. Good job.

[Zer0-2k11]

Looks good.

My only suggestion to you is remove the 220uF caps off the NESRGB pcb for RG and B and short the pads. 220 caps are in the cable not the pcb in commercial solutions.

Apart from that I'd leave as is. Too many people nitpick here for unknown reasons. Your wires are clean and you seem to be skilled with a solder iron given the consistent solder points. Good job.

I agree. it does look really well done.

[mvsfan]

i was wondering are there going to be any more firmware updates past 1.4 or is the 1.4 version pretty much final?

[sazyario]

Ok have been using a massive roll of solder that my father gave me about 10 years ago and he had it himself sometime as well so god know how old it was, this stuff was truly awesome and easy to work but has now run out. I have gotten some basic 60/40 solder and its absolutely bollocks, i have notice that all solder these days is lead-free...and thats where the problem lies!?

What is the best type of solder to get for work on retro system etc??

I bought 60/40 leaded solder from RatShaxk. I agree, lead free solder sucks. I bought a 1lb roll of it and threw it away.

Looks good.

My only suggestion to you is remove the 220uF caps off the NESRGB pcb for RG and B and short the pads. 220 caps are in the cable not the pcb in commercial solutions.

Apart from that I'd leave as is. Too many people nitpick here for unknown reasons. Your wires are clean and you seem to be skilled with a solder iron given the consistent solder points. Good job.

Thank you for the compliment. I'll look into removing the caps. Although I did not notice any video quality difference between my top loader using Tim's cable, and the unit I finished for sale using a retro console accesories console. That is why I didn't take the caps off.

I agree. it does look really well done.

Thank you for the compliment

Hopefully I can get a couple of people wanting me to do mod work them. I need recoup the cost of purchasing a hakko 808 now lol. I have one guy on NintendoAge taking me up on 1 of my 2 free mod service in trade for a review on my service. Hopefully whoever buys my completed unit will also write a review.

i was wondering are there going to be any more firmware updates past 1.4 or is the 1.4 version pretty much final?

I wouldn't be surprised if there is a 1.5 for fixing the last couple of incompatible titles. But I wouldn't expect one after that as Tim has mentioned an entirely redesigned board.

[lettuce]

Ok have been using a massive roll of solder that my father gave me about 10 years ago and he had it himself sometime as well so god know how old it was, this stuff was truly awesome and easy to work but has now run out. I have gotten some basic 60/40 solder and its absolutely bollocks, i have notice that all solder these days is lead-free...and thats where the problem lies!?

What is the best type of solder to get for work on retro system etc??

Good electronic supply stores will still stock 60/40 solder. I buy mine by the 1/4 lb.

Yeah i have some 60/40 solder but it just seems really hard to work with compared to this accent stuff my father gave me

[ApolloBoy]

Too many people nitpick here for unknown reasons.

LOL, I "nitpick" just to save people trouble and make doing mods easier.

[leonk]

Ok have been using a massive roll of solder that my father gave me about 10 years ago and he had it himself sometime as well so god know how old it was, this stuff was truly awesome and easy to work but has now run out. I have gotten some basic 60/40 solder and its absolutely bollocks, i have notice that all solder these days is lead-free...and thats where the problem lies!?

What is the best type of solder to get for work on retro system etc??

Good electronic supply stores will still stock 60/40 solder. I buy mine by the 1/4 lb.

Yeah i have some 60/40 solder but it just seems really hard to work with compared to this accent stuff my father gave me

I personally prefer newer solder, if you got the right stuff. I use 60/40 no clean flux core solder. This stuff did not exist in the past. Older solder has much more corrosive flux (or no flux!) that smokes too much / bad for your lungs.

[Ed Oscuro]

Dave Jones (of EEVblog) says that 63/37 (slightly more expensive) has one melting point, rather than a range as with 60/40, making things potentially easier. "Outstanding wettability and tinning" is what Wiki says. Apparently both types work fine in practice.

[leonk]

Dave Jones (of EEVblog) says that 63/37 (slightly more expensive) has one melting point, rather than a range as with 60/40, making things potentially easier. "Outstanding wettability and tinning" is what Wiki says. Apparently both types work fine in practice.

Lead to Tin percentages is only 1/3 the story. Other important things to consider are: percentage and type of flux (1%, 2%, no clean, water soluable?) as well as diameter of the wire (I use 0.3mm for SMD and 22 guage/0.032" for through hole in 99% of projects)

The soldering iron/station is also SUPER important, and selecting the right tips. I'm a huge fan of Hakko and have one of their older pro stations. I have the tips on for hours and they last forever. I sometimes need to re-tin them, but that's standard practice.

[Ed Oscuro]

Yes, I take it as a given that you will be using some kind of multi-core (i.e., five-core) solder, of a fine pitch (why spend a lot of time heating up thicker wires and dribbling larger amounts of solder than you need?), and flux type is probably...well I dunno about that one, other than being careful of fumes if rosin is used. Organic water-soluble fluxes seem to be the way to go there.

Interesting document here (Lawrence Berkley National Laboratory):
http://www.lbl.gov/ehs/ih/pdf/safeSolderingFinal.pdf

Perhaps this, also, but I haven't looked at it yet:
http://www.superiorflux.com/superior_30 ... _flux.html
I would try to get something that matches the flux type used in, say, your flux-pen applicator or whatever is used to add more flux while hand-soldering.

[sazyario]

Yes, I take it as a given that you will be using some kind of multi-core (i.e., five-core) solder, of a fine pitch (why spend a lot of time heating up thicker wires and dribbling larger amounts of solder than you need?), and flux type is probably...well I dunno about that one, other than being careful of fumes if rosin is used. Organic water-soluble fluxes seem to be the way to go there.

Interesting document here (Lawrence Berkley National Laboratory):
http://www.lbl.gov/ehs/ih/pdf/safeSolderingFinal.pdf

Perhaps this, also, but I haven't looked at it yet:
http://www.superiorflux.com/superior_30 ... _flux.html
I would try to get something that matches the flux type used in, say, your flux-pen applicator or whatever is used to add more flux while hand-soldering.

How would I identify water soluble flux in solder?

[mrkotfw]

Can you guys offer some critique?
I feel like this is very presentable for purchase.
This is also how I plan on modding customer consoles.

Where did you get the those wires and jumpers?

[Ed Oscuro]

How would I identify water soluble flux in solder?

By reading the manufacturer's label on the coil, or reading their website / the product's datasheet.

If your product is really old, it's probably got a rosin core (or possibly no flux at all).

[sazyario]

Can you guys offer some critique?
I feel like this is very presentable for purchase.
This is also how I plan on modding customer consoles.

Where did you get the those wires and jumpers?

Look for 90 degree header pins and female female jumper cable

[bryan_c]

Ugh, I damaged the NESRGB audio circuit. Advice appreciated.

Everything was working fine. RGB out looked great, audio was good, although I only noticed a slight improvement over my frontloader's stock RCA out; perhaps my ears or my sound setup are lacking.

I added expansion audio as per this post (connecting a 47k resistor from expansion pin 9 to the point on the NESRGB between two surface mount components) as I figured I already had the 47k resistor from expansion pins 3-9 from a previous mod, so why not try just moving it over to the NESRGB? Got it working, and it sounded good - added a bit of buzzing, but still sounded better and less buzz than the stock RCA out.

But the expansion audio was just a bit too loud. No problem I thought, just up the resistor value. So I did, but when I tested it out, the NESRGB audio out was missing the triangle and noise channel (and presumably DPCM, but I didn't test enough to find out). Uh oh. The Audio A and B connections on the NESRGB had continuity to CPU pins 1 and 2 respectively. Maybe I loosened one of the two components I soldered to? So I remove the expansion audio connection, and it looks like this:



Scary-looking brownish gunk had accumulated. Something burnt? Flux? Was solid by the time I found it... (What are those two components labled 300 and 123 anyway? Resistors?)

So I naively scraped off as much of the gunk as I could with a toothpick (thinking I wouldn't scratch the board up too badly that way, compared with say an exacto knife) and tried to bridge solder from one side to the other, hoping that the far ends were still connected where they should be. In trying to do so I detached one of the components:



Some tweaser work later I had it back in approximately the right spot, but it looks really bad:



Was a bit afraid to turn it back on again at that point, but did anyway, and found no change - graphics look great, audio from NESRGB missing triangle & noise, audio from stock RCA out fine.

Clearly I have no business working anywhere near surface mount components. Is this salvageable at all? Should I be trying to replace these parts? With someone else's help, that is; I don't know if I should try again... Or would I be better off leaving them alone or removing them entirely? Getting the audio circuit fixed would be ideal, but at this point I mostly want to not do damage to anything else...

[mvsfan]

on the chip resistor labeled 123 - i dont see any solder on the one side of it it looks like you dont have it attached to that pad. i believe thats your problem. also - i dont know why everyone is reccomending this spot to connect expansion sound to. Ive been piping mine from pin 9 of the expansion port through a resistor to the O pad on the audio circuit. It works fine and is easier to solder to. Then i just run a wire from the O pad to an audio jack on the back of the nes.

[bryan_c]

on the chip resistor labeled 123 - i dont see any solder on the one side of it it looks like you dont have it attached to that pad. i believe thats your problem.

It also looks like I might have lifted part of that pad? From the second picture the left pad looks smaller than the right pad...

also - i dont know why everyone is reccomending this spot to connect expansion sound to. Ive been piping mine from pin 9 of the expansion port through a resistor to the O pad on the audio circuit. It works fine and is easier to solder to. Then i just run a wire from the O pad to an audio jack on the back of the nes.

I was (perhaps falsely) under the impression that the PowerPak or other things assuming 47k from expansion pins 3-9 would be too quiet with this approach. If true, in retrospect, I would have had an easier time building a separate amplifier on perfboard than trying to hook into the NESRGB's amp.

[ApolloBoy]

Don't mean to pile on the problems, but I just got through installing an NESRGB on an AV Fami and I'm only getting a gray screen no matter the game. I've tried reflowing the pins on the cart connector and PPU socket pins, and reseating the PPU on the NESRGB, but nothing works. Anyone experience this before?

[lettuce]

Don't mean to pile on the problems, but I just got through installing an NESRGB on an AV Fami and I'm only getting a gray screen no matter the game. I've tried reflowing the pins on the cart connector and PPU socket pins, and reseating the PPU on the NESRGB, but nothing works. Anyone experience this before?

Do you get a display through the composite video connection, if no pads are shorted on the palette select?

[ApolloBoy]

Don't mean to pile on the problems, but I just got through installing an NESRGB on an AV Fami and I'm only getting a gray screen no matter the game. I've tried reflowing the pins on the cart connector and PPU socket pins, and reseating the PPU on the NESRGB, but nothing works. Anyone experience this before?

Do you get a display through the composite video connection, if no pads are shorted on the palette select?

I have a palette selected as I've hardwired the ground and "Natural" pads (I'm using an ON-OFF-ON switch for palette selection) so that's not the issue. If there were no pads selected I'd just get a black screen, not gray. The shade of gray even changes if I move the palette switch so I know the NESRGB is working just fine.

[Skips]

Don't mean to pile on the problems, but I just got through installing an NESRGB on an AV Fami and I'm only getting a gray screen no matter the game. I've tried reflowing the pins on the cart connector and PPU socket pins, and reseating the PPU on the NESRGB, but nothing works. Anyone experience this before?

Do you get a display through the composite video connection, if no pads are shorted on the palette select?

I have a palette selected as I've hardwired the ground and "Natural" pads (I'm using an ON-OFF-ON switch for palette selection) so that's not the issue. If there were no pads selected I'd just get a black screen, not gray. The shade of gray even changes if I move the palette switch so I know the NESRGB is working just fine.

I have seen this four times. The first time was on Phonedorks install, the adapter PCB came faulty (some of the traces were not fully connected). The second time it was on a friend's kit which was bad. The third time was on his second install, he needed to add more solder/reflow the PPU Socket pins on the Famicom PCB itself. The fourth time was on one of my installs, I needed to add more solder to the PPU pins on the RGB kit.

If adding more solder and re-flowing the joints listed above does not work try disconnecting the palette switch and see if the NES still works in stock mode. If it still does not work in stock mode its time to break out the multimeter to see which pins are not making contact with the Famicom PCB. This is all assuming the Famicom was fully working in stock mode after you socketed the PPU but before installing it in the kit.

[Pasky]

Don't mean to pile on the problems, but I just got through installing an NESRGB on an AV Fami and I'm only getting a gray screen no matter the game. I've tried reflowing the pins on the cart connector and PPU socket pins, and reseating the PPU on the NESRGB, but nothing works. Anyone experience this before?

You usually get a solid color screen (could also be blue or green sometimes) when a bus is not connected properly. Check and make sure all PPU pins are connected to where they need to be. Most likely a bus from the PPU to CPU (or RAM, etc...) is not connected.

Basically check continuity of the 40 Pins and make sure they're going where they're supposed to be.

[ApolloBoy]

Got it figured out, the PPU is dead. Not sure how considering I desoldered it carefully...

[eightbitminiboss]

I'm willing to subscribe it was just the PPU's time. It lived the good life, but will live on no longer.

[ApolloBoy]

I'm not sure how considering I desoldered it using my desoldering station like all the other NESRGB installs I've done. In any case, I managed to find a TA-02N clone PPU in my parts bin and it's working pretty well so far.

[sazyario]

I'm not sure how considering I desoldered it using my desoldering station like all the other NESRGB installs I've done. In any case, I managed to find a TA-02N clone PPU in my parts bin and it's working pretty well so far.

Clone PPU?
I'm interested in more information on this.

[ApolloBoy]

I'm not sure how considering I desoldered it using my desoldering station like all the other NESRGB installs I've done. In any case, I managed to find a TA-02N clone PPU in my parts bin and it's working pretty well so far.

Clone PPU?
I'm interested in more information on this.

A lot of the older Famiclones used discrete components as opposed to a NOAC. The TA-02N is actually pretty close to the original PPU, the only real difference I noticed was a slightly different color palette (which doesn't matter with the NESRGB).

[leonk]

I assume the clone PPU is pin compatible??

[TheRetromancer]

I'm not sure how considering I desoldered it using my desoldering station like all the other NESRGB installs I've done. In any case, I managed to find a TA-02N clone PPU in my parts bin and it's working pretty well so far.

Clone PPU?
I'm interested in more information on this.

A lot of the older Famiclones used discrete components as opposed to a NOAC. The TA-02N is actually pretty close to the original PPU, the only real difference I noticed was a slightly different color palette (which doesn't matter with the NESRGB).

I tend to maintain a healthy skepticism of clone consoles, particularly the NES clones. You allude to it being fine save for a slightly different palette - what about problem games like Castlevania III, Battletoads, or Rad Racer II? Do they work?

[ApolloBoy]

I assume the clone PPU is pin compatible??

Yep, I didn't have to do anything to the NESRGB or PPU.

I tend to maintain a healthy skepticism of clone consoles, particularly the NES clones. You allude to it being fine save for a slightly different palette - what about problem games like Castlevania III, Battletoads, or Rad Racer II? Do they work?

Everything I've thrown at it has worked, Battletoads and Castlevania III work great, and I also tried a slew of Famicom carts with special mappers including Akumajou Densetsu, Lagrange Point, Gradius II and Hoshi no Kirby and those worked fine as well.