Shmups that people find hard but you don't, and vice versa

gs68 · Post by **gs68** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 1:15 am

What are some shmups that people say are OMFG IMPOSSIBLE but you can 1CC in your sleep, and what are some other ones that everyone else seems to be better than you at?

For example, people keep talking about how hard Ikaruga is. Well, the basics are not that hard to learn (especially since the polarity system reduces the number of projectiles you have to dodge). I only lost maybe 0-1 lives on Chapter 1 Easy on my first try. On the other hand, I refuse to dedicate time to learning to chain every nook and cranny of the game. It just doesn't seem plausible to me. (But then again I thought the same way about DDR about 3 1/2 years ago, now I can clear plenty of 7- and 8-foot level songs.)

Now on the flip side, Darius Gaiden seems pretty easy to a lot of people. But I've played it several times on MAME and more often not, I'm using a continue by the end of the second stage, as well as whoring the bomb button. And from there I disgrace shmuppers by credit-feeding my way to the end. Is my ship moving too fast for me? Or are there too many bullets and not a small enough hitbox on my ship? Also I hate how your main weapon resets every time you die.

TWITCHDOCTOR · Post by **TWITCHDOCTOR** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 1:34 am

One simple thread created an avalanche of "run off" threads...

Which shmup is the hardest?
Which shmup is the hardest for you?
Which shmup has the best intro?
Which shmup has the best ending?
Which shmup has made you cry?
Which shmup is better on the Saturn?
Which shmup... ... ... ...?

See what I mean here. Lets try and keep "slightly related topics in the same thread, ok? (All these posts have all started within the last day or so.)
Otherwise the first page of threads will be 10 feet thick...or otherwise known as what Mode7 refered to as "clutter-fucked".

Darkcomet72 · Post by **Darkcomet72** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 1:36 am

Ikaruga is incredibly easy if you're not going for chains.

Now..... the first Gradius, I find insanely hard. I haven't gotten past level 3, ever...

tehkao · Post by **tehkao** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 1:37 am

I dunno, I guess I must really suck or something but I haven't been able to beat any modern "manic" shmups. I can't even beat Raiden 1.

Once I see all those bullets coming at me I just accept my fate and surrender.

I also never got past stage 3 of Lifeforce.

alpha5099 · Post by **alpha5099** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 6:30 am

The two Salamander games seem to fit into both categories.

Lots of people say Salamander is tough as nails, and while I can't beat it, it never seemed to be that difficult.

On the other hand, lots of people complain that Salamander 2 is a cakewalk. If I remember correctly, the reviewer in the Xenofiles says he beat it on his first try. And yet I've always found it more challenging than the original. Up until today, I always got completely destroyed at the very beginning of Level 3. Granted, today I made some huge headway, made it all the way to the fifth boss.

Lots of people have said Game Tengoku was one of the easier games they've played, but it's reasonably challenging for me.

Anarchos · Post by **Anarchos** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 3:12 pm

Ikaruga? Incredibly easy? Which world are you from?
Trust me, for the average player it's very very hard. I've played the game for over 40 hours and it still seems impossible to me. And my friends? They suck even more than I!

No shmup is easy, that's the way it is. And if there is indeed an easy shmup, everyone thinks it's easy. The rest of the guys claiming that dodonpachi and Ikaruga are easy, they be mad! Mad I'm tellin' ya!

Tomtom · Post by **Tomtom** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 3:20 pm

I've never really understood why Ikaruga is said to be so easy. I guess it was maybe because it was my first real 1CC, but it took me many months to beat it. Maybe it was just because I always tried to chain everything.

FRO · Post by **FRO** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 3:49 pm

I find that a lot of people label Thunderforce 4 as really hard. Yes, if you play it on Hard or Manic than I would say it gets pretty hairy, but if you play on Normal it isn't any more challenging than many other side-scrollers on the Genesis/Megadrive. As a matter of fact, I find Gaiares to be more challenging overall.

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 4:20 pm

i cannot find a groove in Gradius Galaxies. also, i have never had major problems with Game Tengoku (i have been hearing several complaints lately about its difficulty).

a big one is Harmful Park. BulletMagnet (who never stops talking about his lack of skills) is posted 3 of 5 on the high-score table (with game set to normal). i am just stuggling through this game trying to survive (with some good combos for good measure).

TWITCHDOCTOR · Post by **TWITCHDOCTOR** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 9:03 pm

FRO wrote:I find that a lot of people label Thunderforce 4 as really hard. Yes, if you play it on Hard or Manic than I would say it gets pretty hairy, but if you play on Normal it isn't any more challenging than many other side-scrollers on the Genesis/Megadrive. As a matter of fact, I find Gaiares to be more challenging overall.

Gaiares isn't really even that tough when you think about it.
Its slow paced, so you can see whats happening...or about to.
You can get shields, Plus, you have the "TOZ" to block bullets and steal enemy weapons.
I place it somewhere in between Gradius and R-Type...like in the middle somewhere. (difficulty wise)

I've heard some say that Gunbird is easy, well its a little tough for me. Now, I haven't put lots of hours trying to master it yet, but I do play it enough (casually). Maybe I just played Strikers 1945 more, or at least "clicked" with it more. I find it to be easier that Gunbird.
Then again, I'm just a sucker for WWII themed shmups.

ccovell · Post by **ccovell** » Fri Feb 25, 2005 1:39 am

Most reviews of Lords of Thunder for the Duo have said that it's rock-hard. OK, so the first time I played it, I died quickly and thought it was difficult, but just the second time I played it, I got pretty far. Now I can finish it (er... on normal difficulty...) and only get hit once or twice in the whole game.

Perhaps it comes down to memorization, but I've played other shooters many times and I still get shot down too often.

jslithy · Post by **jslithy** » Fri Feb 25, 2005 1:54 am

I've heard a lot of people say that Zanac is tough, but once you know which weapons to get, it's way too easy. Most people who get to the final stage have dozens of lives built up.

iatneH · Post by **iatneH** » Fri Feb 25, 2005 5:40 am

^^^ I agree about Zanac... once I pick up weapon #7 (I think it's 7... the constant beam-like thing that you can shoot about 30 degrees to either side), nothing can stop me (until I lose that first life)

On the other hand, I simply cannot comprehend how people can get past the Stage 2 boss in Gradius V, let alone single credit several loops... should I use Laser instead??

BUHA · Post by **BUHA** » Fri Feb 25, 2005 7:47 am

THE LASER IS YOUR FRIEND

visuatrox · Post by **visuatrox** » Fri Feb 25, 2005 5:38 pm

Disposable Hero, could 1cc on hardest difficulty without too much trouble

Post by **BulletMagnet** » Fri Feb 25, 2005 5:55 pm

captain ahar wrote:BulletMagnet (who never stops talking about his lack of skills) is posted 3 of 5 on the high-score table (with game set to normal). i am just stuggling through this game trying to survive (with some good combos for good measure).

I've finally done it: I have become the unofficial "low bar" of shmups.com!

"BulletMagnet has a higher score than you? Wow, you DO need practice!"

Forget the Glossary, forget the Commandments: THIS is my crowning achievement during my tenure at this site!

FRO · Post by **FRO** » Fri Feb 25, 2005 9:08 pm

TWITCHDOCTOR wrote: Gaiares isn't really even that tough when you think about it.
Its slow paced, so you can see whats happening...or about to.
You can get shields, Plus, you have the "TOZ" to block bullets and steal enemy weapons.
I place it somewhere in between Gradius and R-Type...like in the middle somewhere. (difficulty wise)

I guess I should have worded that a little differently. Most folks say Gaiares is a medium-hard shmup. I have great difficulty w/ the game after about the 3rd or 4th level - I simply have trouble overcoming the levels, especially in situations where I die and lose my weaponry. The level where all those spinning things come in from both top and bottom (forgive me, I can't remember which level it is) is the worst - when I die there I might as well hit Reset and start over, becase I rarely make it out of that part alive w/o weapons.

iatneH · Post by **iatneH** » Fri Feb 25, 2005 11:08 pm

Haha, BulletMagnet... all in good fun :)

I just bought Gradius V today, US version (I've been playing a pirated JP copy up until now, interestingly, it's was on a DVD, when I thought official JP and US copies were on CD) and I still get my ass handed to me by the stage 2 boss, 2nd form. Is there any way to get rid of those arms??

Post by **BulletMagnet** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 1:35 am

Heh, of course: I really am pretty awful, I'll take notoriety any way I can get it.

TWITCHDOCTOR · Post by **TWITCHDOCTOR** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 1:58 am

iatneH wrote:Haha, BulletMagnet... all in good fun

I just bought Gradius V today, US version (I've been playing a pirated JP copy up until now, interestingly, it's was on a DVD, when I thought official JP and US copies were on CD) and I still get my ass handed to me by the stage 2 boss, 2nd form. Is there any way to get rid of those arms??

Yes, the "arms" have a "core" just like the other parts.
Stage 3 boss will be a problem if you dodn't have the correct setup.

iatneH · Post by **iatneH** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 2:11 am

Thanks for the tips, I managed to get past the second form.. and I noticed those cores on the arms for the third form, but for some reason I didn't try to destroy them :(
I guess I really ought to try that :D

Post by **Shatterhand** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 2:53 am

Just regarding Zanac.

If you are talking about the NES or the EX version , use weapon 5. Trust me, it's a hell lot better than weapon 7

(If you full power it up, you will see what I mean

)

What's funny about most Compile shmups (Mainly Aleste , Aleste 2 and the Zanac games) it's that most people who are NOT used to shmups, but do play videogames, usually find them to bee very hard, I've seen people get smoked in less than 1 minute in Aleste 2 SEVERAL times. They can't even get to the 1st midboss of level 1 ! And those are guys who are USED to play games, but they just don't play shmups that much.

Those guys can get like in a 1-3 or 1-4 in Strikers 1945 II, just as an example.

sikraiken · Post by **sikraiken** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 2:59 am

No game is hard. We just make it out to be that way, and the only thing that is actually hard is the way we approach them. People need to stop complaining about "difficult" games and start putting times towards them.

Neon · Post by **Neon** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 3:01 am

No game is hard. We just make it out to be that way, and the only thing that is actually hard is the way we approach them. People need to stop complaining about "difficult" games and start putting times towards them.

alpha5099 · Post by **alpha5099** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 6:30 am

FRO wrote:I find that a lot of people label Thunderforce 4 as really hard. Yes, if you play it on Hard or Manic than I would say it gets pretty hairy, but if you play on Normal it isn't any more challenging than many other side-scrollers on the Genesis/Megadrive. As a matter of fact, I find Gaiares to be more challenging overall.

I think the thing about TFIV is comparing it with TFIII and TFV. Thunder Force III and V are both pretty easy. Thus, IV seems really tough because it's not a push over.

Vexorg · Post by **Vexorg** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 7:26 am

I'd probably put Batrider and Battle Bakraid into this category, albeit on opposite sides of the spectrum. I've heard a lot of people say that they don't find Batrider all that difficult but I can't even make it through the second stage. On the other hand, some people seem to think that Bakraid is a really tough one, but it's the one shmup that I'm closest to a 1CC on, and I just don't think it's nearly as tough on normal course as Batrider is. Battle Garegga isn't generally subject to such disagreements. I think everyone here would agree that it's a nasty little sucker.

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 5:15 pm

iatneH wrote:Haha, BulletMagnet... all in good fun
...and I still get my ass handed to me by the stage 2 boss, 2nd form. Is there any way to get rid of those arms??

i clear these bosses all the time, but for some reason i cannot picture the ones you speak of. any help?

by the way BulletMagnet, that is not what i meant. i just mean that after someone spends quite a bit of time talking about how terrible they are, only to out-clip you by a fair margin, i feel sort of inadequate. can't help it, man. psychology is a bitch!

LoneSage · Post by **LoneSage** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 8:02 pm

I find the PS2 version of Gradius III to be pretty normal in terms of difficulty. I can't understand how so many people talk about how insanely difficult it is...if I took the time I could probably get near to 1CC'ing it.

Post by **BulletMagnet** » Sun Feb 27, 2005 4:26 am

Aw nuts, there goes my notoriety then.

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Sun Feb 27, 2005 8:24 pm

sorry man didn't mean to disappoint