shmups.system11.org

Shmups Forum
 
* FAQ    * Search
 * Register  * Login 
It is currently Wed Oct 16, 2019 12:10 pm View unanswered posts
View active topics



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Article: Intro to JPN Scorekeeping for Arcade STG, by Plasmo
PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2019 8:46 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 05 Mar 2018
Posts: 378
Hey everyone,

Plasmo wrote this awesome article about Japanese scorekeeping history and score verification! The article is called:

Introduction to Scorekeeping for Japanese Arcade Games
and Why World Record Videos are not Mandatory

Image


http://electricunderground.io/guest-article-introduction-to-scorekeeping-for-japanese-arcade-games/
_________________
https://soundcloud.com/user-306325657
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0Fwhz ... 4yC3Isd4Lg


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Article: Intro to JPN Scorekeeping for Arcade STG, by Pl
PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2019 9:52 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 10 Apr 2019
Posts: 86
For me personally, it's not about a lack of belief in whether they achieved a certain score. I'm sure most of these scores are legit. The problem is this genre has a lot of potential to be collaborative, and to deny the public to see these top tier strategies might be compared to a scientist discovering the cure for cancer and then not telling anyone about it. I don't quite buy into the idea of strict copyright laws in Japan, either. If that were the case, why do you have Japanese streamers on Twitch?


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Article: Intro to JPN Scorekeeping for Arcade STG, by Pl
PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2019 10:15 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 19 Feb 2008
Posts: 2749
Location: ND, USA
The copyright thing might be partially speculative and partially historical - the existence and acceptance of platforms like twitch probably eases a lot of concern that some people might have had.

Great read. I was tickled to see that’s RS got a mention. Aside from the sheer quantity of work, one reason I’ve kept RS shmups only is the disparate expectations of different competitive scenes.
_________________
Restart Syndrome::
Shmup leaderboards and pic/replay hosting! | My score history on RS


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Article: Intro to JPN Scorekeeping for Arcade STG, by Pl
PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2019 11:00 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 05 Mar 2018
Posts: 378
blossom wrote:
For me personally, it's not about a lack of belief in whether they achieved a certain score. I'm sure most of these scores are legit. The problem is this genre has a lot of potential to be collaborative, and to deny the public to see these top tier strategies might be compared to a scientist discovering the cure for cancer and then not telling anyone about it. I don't quite buy into the idea of strict copyright laws in Japan, either. If that were the case, why do you have Japanese streamers on Twitch?


I definitely see where you are coming from Blossom, I also like the idea of more openness with public video sharing, for the sake of a more informed player base and ability to learn. The good news is that, overall, I think that is the direction we are going. In DDP, for example, we are getting more 700 mill vids being shared (which I've found really useful, actually) and I hope this trend will continue.

I know that the topic of the Japanese players not sharing their videos is a really contentious topic, especially in today's standards of practice (where hiding strats really isn't a thing common anymore, I even remember people keeping certain secrets in fighting games back in the day). But what I really like about Plasmo's article is that he does try to explain the mindset of why players haven't shared video replays publicly, that isn't them trying to directly spite western players or anything like that.

So yeah, a super interesting topic. Also, from what Araska reported, the copyright issue point that Plasmo writes about does seem like a legit concern. In my interview with Araska, I wondered if JHA would be open to the idea of including links to videos in their official scores list, and here is what Araksa said:

"I think it is not a good idea. In fact, JHA is just a non-profit organization, but they are inheriting some kind of authority/fame from Gamest and Arcadia. If they want to keep this position, they have to keep strict legal requirements.
I think that uploading game replay videos is mostly harmless in the recent social situation. But, strictly speaking, it contains copyright infringement and asking for permission for each old game is impossible, so they won’t touch such a thing."
_________________
https://soundcloud.com/user-306325657
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0Fwhz ... 4yC3Isd4Lg


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Article: Intro to JPN Scorekeeping for Arcade STG, by Pl
PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2019 11:24 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 05 Jan 2018
Posts: 401
Nitpick here, but I'm pretty sure the マイコン in マイコンBASICマガジン is meant to be "Micom", which is short for "Microcomputer", not "MyCom". Dempa Publishing actually has a subsidiary company that is still around today called Micomsoft, who are the ones that sell those Framemeisters.

I've discovered an archive of Micom BASIC back issues around year ago. It's such a fascinating magazine, not just because of its high score keeping.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Article: Intro to JPN Scorekeeping for Arcade STG, by Pl
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 7:55 am 


User avatar

Joined: 26 Jan 2005
Posts: 3333
Location: In a storm
Jonny2x4 wrote:
Nitpick here, but I'm pretty sure the マイコン in マイコンBASICマガジン is meant to be "Micom", which is short for "Microcomputer", not "MyCom".


No nitpicking here at all, highly essential question in my opinion!

You are completely right that マイコン in the beginning of the magazine most definitely stood short for "microcomputer" (the term "personal computer" didn't exist yet). However, this has changed over time and even the editioral then described it as an abbreviation of "My Computer". The wikipedia site romanizes it as "Mycom BASIC Magazine".

Bottom line: the don't even know themself.
_________________
I like chocolate milk

My highscores | Twitter


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Article: Intro to JPN Scorekeeping for Arcade STG, by Pl
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 8:18 am 


User avatar

Joined: 13 Dec 2014
Posts: 3448
Location: Ringing the bells of fortune
Jonny2x4 wrote:
Nitpick here, but I'm pretty sure the マイコン in マイコンBASICマガジン is meant to be "Micom", which is short for "Microcomputer", not "MyCom". Dempa Publishing actually has a subsidiary company that is still around today called Micomsoft, who are the ones that sell those Framemeisters.

I've discovered an archive of Micom BASIC back issues around year ago. It's such a fascinating magazine, not just because of its high score keeping.

Not related to this topic, but I heard of Micom BASIC Magazine from a video Yuzo Koshiro recently posted talking about it. Seems to be a very interesting magazine.
_________________
Image
NTSC-J: You know STGs are in trouble when you have threads on how to introduce them to a wider audience and get more people playing followed by threads on how to get its hardcore fan base to play them, too.
1CCs | Twitch | YouTube


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Article: Intro to JPN Scorekeeping for Arcade STG, by Pl
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 10:26 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 14 Aug 2019
Posts: 28
Location: BW, Germany
This was a great and very informative read, thanks a ton for compiling this! :)


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Article: Intro to JPN Scorekeeping for Arcade STG, by Pl
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2019 12:27 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 16 Jul 2007
Posts: 374
I think one of the reasons such a system was put in place in Japan (simple verification process that relied on the player and controller good faith), and that it works well, could be because it is Japan.
I don't know if people in Japan are generally more honest, but at least the Japanese are known to generally be very "disciplined" (sorry if it is cliche). At the very least, they seem very organized about these sort of things ? Just to give an example, I think they had (still have ?) a global nation-wide ranking system for school students ratings - I forgot how it is called.

That was an interesting read, thank you.

EDIT: typo


Last edited by Keade on Wed Oct 02, 2019 9:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Article: Intro to JPN Scorekeeping for Arcade STG, by Pl
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2019 1:42 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 25 Jan 2005
Posts: 1909
Location: Nebraska, USA
Very good article, Plasmo! I've been aware of JHA for a while, most notably, by following your tweets about Japanese high scores in games, as they break previous records. However, I didn't have that level of detail, certainly, and it makes a lot of sense how they verify scores, and in terms of eligibility, even if the "arcade only" approach is quite limiting.
_________________
"Playing a shmup with an analog stick is like trying to fill out the New York Times crossword with a can of spray paint." - Topher Cantler
YouTube | Twitter | Tumblr | Shoot the Core-cast Shmup Podcast


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Ice Beam and 6 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Space Pilot 3K template by Jakob Persson
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group