Who still uses Computer Music? -GM/GS/XG...

[SuperDeadite]

Korg NS5R. It also has a black twin called NX5R, which is exactly the same but came with a real Yamaha XG daughter-board installed.

[ldeveraux]

That would depend on what hardware you have. For modern PC use you will need some kind of MIDI interface that supports your OS, and the cables needed to hook everything together.

With an 88 you can play just about any MIDI written for GM or GS.

I got my SC-88 in today and it sounds beautiful! Playing games like Sam and Max and Day of the Tentacle CD versions have no speech audio though? Unless I'm missing something in the SCUMMVM setup?

[SuperDeadite]

Not sure on your setup, but sfx/voices come from your pc while music comes from module. You will need to mix both outputs. This can be done by feeding 88's output to pc input, or pc output to 88's input. This can be a little tricky if you are say using HDMI since that is digital audio while 88 is analog only without mods.

[ldeveraux]

Not sure on your setup, but sfx/voices come from your pc while music comes from module. You will need to mix both outputs. This can be done by feeding 88's output to pc input, or pc output to 88's input. This can be a little tricky if you are say using HDMI since that is digital audio while 88 is analog only without mods.

Yeah I figured that out immediately after posting! Not too much trouble, I just assumed that the digitized voices would pass through the SC-88. Not a big deal at all!

[SCARTicus]

SuperDeadite's Youtube channel should be mentioned. He posted a couple of links to videos, but he's got all sorts of good stuff up there relevant to this discussion.

I am going to try my best to muster the will to make some recordings tonight. I don't make videos, though. I will be uploading uncompressed stereo WAV format audio. Sam&Max and Day of the Tentacle will be first. They are my favorites. I recently found out how to get DOSBOX talking to real MIDI hardware, so I plan on doing some recordings of non SCUMM DOS games, too. I want requests for that!

On a related note, I have a dual SID 8580 powered desktop synthesizer. I used to have an OSX application that would blast it with C64 sound files, and they would render on the SIDs. I lost the application in an OS update, and I cannot for the life of me find it again. If anyone knows the name of this software or something that will do the same job, please let me know. I'd love to make some real SID renderings again.

[SuperDeadite]

Thanks, I like to pickup random things when I can, and mess around with them.
Speaking of which, not MIDI, but I've building up my MSX sound cart collection for VGMPlay.
Here's my first comparison:
https://youtu.be/7nNpPO4DL28

[FinalBaton]

Didnt I see a product on 8-Bit guy's channel, made by Texelec, that allows playing sounds from a variety of computers/consoles/arcades via VGM files? I think it was a piece of software, that was used in conjunction with a new card that has an OPL 3, a YM2151, and some PSG and others on it. is it the VGMPlay I see mentionned?

btw Superdeadite just saw your vid, pretty cool. the 2151 is a great asset for the MSX.

[donluca]

I am going to try my best to muster the will to make some recordings tonight. I don't make videos, though. I will be uploading uncompressed stereo WAV format audio. Sam&Max and Day of the Tentacle will be first. They are my favorites. I recently found out how to get DOSBOX talking to real MIDI hardware, so I plan on doing some recordings of non SCUMM DOS games, too. I want requests for that!

What recording equipment are you using?

We (the 16-bit audiophile project) might be interested.

[FinalBaton]

Ok I found the card I was talking about. It has two PSG chips and a Yamaha YM2151

SAAYM card by Texelec


What's particularly interesting is the YM2151 support by VGM player software SBVGM. You can now playback Sharp X68000 and arcade OSTs via hardware on pc.

------------------------------

Also, for SID chiptunes, the SSI-2001 card should provide a way to play them on a pc via the OSP2001 software. There's even a SID chip clone called SwimSID Ultimate that you can use, if you can't source a real SID chip.

[SCARTicus]

I am going to try my best to muster the will to make some recordings tonight. I don't make videos, though. I will be uploading uncompressed stereo WAV format audio. Sam&Max and Day of the Tentacle will be first. They are my favorites. I recently found out how to get DOSBOX talking to real MIDI hardware, so I plan on doing some recordings of non SCUMM DOS games, too. I want requests for that!

What recording equipment are you using?

We (the 16-bit audiophile project) might be interested.

I'm doing this at home, so it will just be going into my Scarlett interface to ProTools for tracking. I'm not going to mix the tracks, just record and bounce a stereo WAV. I can record it at 24bit if you want, but we're really not working with the sort of dynamics that could take advantage of that so I was planning on just making Redbook files.

Ok I found the card I was talking about. It has two PSG chips and a Yamaha YM2151

SAAYM card by Texelec


What's particularly interesting is the YM2151 support by VGM player software SBVGM. You can now playback Sharp X68000 and arcade OSTs via hardware on pc.

------------------------------

Also, for SID chiptunes, the SSI-2001 card should provide a way to play them on a pc via the OSP2001 software. There's even a SID chip clone called SwimSID Ultimate that you can use, if you can't source a real SID chip.

I have real SIDs in a SammichSID, I'm just looking for a piece of software that made things very easy. Honestly, SwinSID sounds okay, but it is super weak-sauce compared to a real SID. The emulations don't come anywhere near doing justice to the analog filters present on real SIDs. Analog filters give a very distinct sound, and in this use case, superior sound. There is a reason that you can still buy a wide variety of analog synthesizers on SweetWater today, and that reason is the filters. It is also the main reason for the vast variety of analog synthesizers, as different analog filter circuits impart each synthesizer with unique characters. And MS-20 filter sounds distinct and will never sound like a Moog-style filter. A Moog filter sounds nothing like a SEM filter. A Polivoks filter is nothing like a Juno's filter. And both SIDs have unique, analog filters with unique characters. Digital and virtual synthesizers offer vastly more voices and features, are easier to operate, and integrate better in modern DAWs, and serious electronic artists STILL shell out for the analogs. There is no replacement for tone and quality.

[donluca]

I'm doing this at home, so it will just be going into my Scarlett interface to ProTools for tracking. I'm not going to mix the tracks, just record and bounce a stereo WAV. I can record it at 24bit if you want, but we're really not working with the sort of dynamics that could take advantage of that so I was planning on just making Redbook files.

Our goal is archiving with the best quality and accuracy as possible and we set our standard recording rate at 96Khz 24-bit, your setup sounds good enough to me, I'll drop you a PM tomorrow. We all do this in our free time so we'd be grateful for whatever contribution you'd like to make to the project, even if it's a single soundtrack, no pressure

[SCARTicus]

Well, I'll wait for your PM so that I can make sure that this recording complies with your project's standard. The first batch will be all SC-880, but I ordered an OPL3 SoundBlaster that I am confident I can get working in the DOSBOX, so I will be able to make good FM renderings soon.

[SuperDeadite]

MSX is the king of vgm. So many different sound carts available, it's insane. OPL4, OPM, OPNA, OPNB, dual PSG, C64 SID, and more. MSX VGMplay can combine chips as well, like OPNA and OPNB gives you OPNB-B support, (Ninja Warriors, Darius).

My above video uses OPM, Turbo-R PCM, and PSG to simulate OPN2. You can improve it by adding a cart with real chip to replace PSG. Though, I'm sure a real OPN2 cart will come someday anyway.

Sadly while there are lots of ways to use ym2151 now, they are all missing the Oki ADPCM, so most x68k musics aren't complete and sound weird.

[SuperDeadite]

Well, I'll wait for your PM so that I can make sure that this recording complies with your project's standard. The first batch will be all SC-880, but I ordered an OPL3 SoundBlaster that I am confident I can get working in the DOSBOX, so I will be able to make good FM renderings soon.

Does your PC have a parallel port (lpt)? If so consider serdashop. He's got OPL2, OPL3, CMS, Tandy (pc jr.) boards. Just plug into your parallel port, and run a TSR to get DOS games using them.

[Guspaz]

If you're running dosbox, isn't OPL3 emulation pretty much perfect with something like Nuked? I would think hardware OPL3 only makes sense for actual retro computers.

[SuperDeadite]

Couldn't resist. Here's some Irem vgms being played on MSX with SFG-05 (OPM) cartridge.
https://youtu.be/Ko0tnyclL8M

[FinalBaton]

I have real SIDs in a SammichSID, I'm just looking for a piece of software that made things very easy. Honestly, SwinSID sounds okay, but it is super weak-sauce compared to a real SID. The emulations don't come anywhere near doing justice to the analog filters present on real SIDs. Analog filters give a very distinct sound, and in this use case, superior sound. There is a reason that you can still buy a wide variety of analog synthesizers on SweetWater today, and that reason is the filters. It is also the main reason for the vast variety of analog synthesizers, as different analog filter circuits impart each synthesizer with unique characters. And MS-20 filter sounds distinct and will never sound like a Moog-style filter. A Moog filter sounds nothing like a SEM filter. A Polivoks filter is nothing like a Juno's filter. And both SIDs have unique, analog filters with unique characters. Digital and virtual synthesizers offer vastly more voices and features, are easier to operate, and integrate better in modern DAWs, and serious electronic artists STILL shell out for the analogs. There is no replacement for tone and quality.

But you can use real SID chips on the SSI-2001...

and then use OSP2001 to play back files.

[ldeveraux]

My SC-88 volume is really low in the mix if I splice it in via an AV to stereo cable. I had to really crank it up in ScummVM (I have it exiting my PC through a MIO USB to MIDI) because the other non-MIDI sounds were really drowning it out. Is there something I'm missing?

[mimey]

I have a DB60XG installed on my Vortex II. Does a decent job with GM and the occasional XG track.

I also set it up on my computer in the afternoon. I haven’t set up Calculator Music for many years.

[SCARTicus]

If you're running dosbox, isn't OPL3 emulation pretty much perfect with something like Nuked? I would think hardware OPL3 only makes sense for actual retro computers.

No.

Does your PC have a parallel port (lpt)? If so consider serdashop. He's got OPL2, OPL3, CMS, Tandy (pc jr.) boards. Just plug into your parallel port, and run a TSR to get DOS games using them.

The Serdashop stuff has been on my radar for a while now, but I like to use more modern hardware and as such, I do not currently have an LPT port. I could install one on a PCI card, but I would prefer to just get a PCI soundcard at that point. It does seem to be good stuff from what I can tell. I also got a good deal on the card, and it has one of the most desirable DACs for an OPL3 card. I'm not going to get too deep in to SoundBlaster territory. I've got a good SID device, a good GM/GS device, and now I'll have a decent Yamaha FM XG and SoundBlaster compatible device. That's as far as I need to go. If I'm not careful, I go overboard on things. I am very interested in what you were saying about MSX. I didn't realize that it had such a rich variety of sound rendering options. Very cool!.

My SC-88 volume is really low in the mix if I splice it in via an AV to stereo cable. I had to really crank it up in ScummVM (I have it exiting my PC through a MIO USB to MIDI) because the other non-MIDI sounds were really drowning it out. Is there something I'm missing?

There are a few things that might cause this issue. It could be a bad cable. Check that first. Is the volume on your SC-88 low when connected directly to amplified speakers?

You are using old hardware, and sometimes it does not work 100% correctly as it ages. Components age, capacitors leak... So it could be that the preamplifier on your SC-88 is not operating properly anymore, or it could be a preamp in your soundcard that is at fault. Try connecting a CD player to your soundcard's stereo line input and see if the output is still low.

Are you sure that you are plugged in to a line-level input? Is the output noisy?

[Guspaz]

If you're running dosbox, isn't OPL3 emulation pretty much perfect with something like Nuked? I would think hardware OPL3 only makes sense for actual retro computers.

No.

Yes. I can't tell the difference between recordings from Nuked and an actual YMF262. I don't see why you'd go through the trouble of attaching an OPL3 chip to a modern computer running dosbox when it's not going to sound any different. The stock dosbox OPL3 emulation, though, not so great. It's another story if you're using actual retro hardware, then it makes sense to use a hardware chip, but if you're emulating the x86, what's the point of using something other than a pretty much perfectly emulated OPL3?

[SuperDeadite]

With the right hardware, you can actually have DOSBOX output data through serial and then use an MSX as the soundcard. Lol.
https://youtu.be/rWjLvkrWKUU

[SuperDeadite]

Shipping from Korea is a mess right now due to Covid, but finally got my MSX OPNB sound cart in.
https://youtu.be/RqqCN6SRyR4