Learning Japanese

[broken harbour]

I have a trip to Tokyo planned, it's a couple years away, in the meantime I figured I'd like to learn enough Japanese to get by.

For those of you that are english speakers first, but learned Japanese, any tips as far as what to use? Rosetta Stone? Online Course? Classroom? I don't have a ton of free time, so I'd prefer to use something I can do at home when I can jam it into my already crowded schedule.

Also, my current level of Japanese speaking/reading ability is.... zero, nothing.... absolutely no ability at all.

[options]

I'm still in the process of learning myself, but http://www.japanesepod101.com has been a good resource, although I haven't used it much recently.

the podcasts are free, but you get more features if you pay to subscribe (being able to print out lesson dialogue in romanji and kana, for example). be careful tho, cuz they will automatically renew your subscription if you aren't paying attention. that rubbed me the wrong way, so I stick to the free stuff now. however, the newer lessons I've downloaded haven't been as good as the older ones. either way tho, they're good for listening to during a commute n' stuff.

[CStarFlare]

http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.ph ... t=Japanese

Probably will be useful.

[broken harbour]

Duh, I guess I could have used search.

[BubbaMc]

Pimsleur Japanese.

[Edmond Dantes]

I remember there used to be this really awesome, freeware console-style RPG where the battle system was essentially flashcards--you attacked by typing the right kana/kanji.

I learned to read kana just from that game alone. I think it was called "Slime Forest Adventure."

[RaidenViper]

I highly recommend the Genki books. Learn Hiragana and Katakana asap. This is a great site for practice Hiragana, Katakana and Kanji. Good luck

[mastermx]

Sometimes the methods aren't as important as the perseverance. Put enough time into something, and results would be had. When it comes to language acquisition the state of mind of the learner is paramount to his/her success.

[lilmanjs]

I've recently started watching Irashai on the 360 PBS app, and it seems to be helping quite a lot on learning. Though this is probably an app for use in the USA only, but the show has 138 episodes and doesn't seem to focus on just speaking, at least through 4 of the 138 episodes. Though this is a show from 1996. Still the host does mention already several times that Japanese is easier to speak than English.

[Eno]

Mandatory Nama Sensei.
Can't help you much since I have no interest in speaking and travel-related usage, but here's some stuff:
- What I used to learn kana and first kanji. Not sure how useful knowing how to write will be to you, but I think it's nice to know the rules of thumb and how to write basic stuff.
- Small lessons with videos. Admitedly never watched more than two, not my cup of tea, might be more useful for someone interested in conversational stuff.

[Skykid]

Still the host does mention already several times that Japanese is easier to speak than English.

Man that is total bullshit.

[endoKarb]

This is what I'd suggest:

- First of all, listen to Japanese all the fucking time while you are doing other stuff. music, animu, movies, whatever. Since you are actually traveling there, this should be twice as important.
- Then, get a hold of Rosetta Stone, Pimsleur, and a bunch of japanese learning podcast.
- Throw that shit into the garbage and wash your hands (while listening to japanese).
- Start working on some actual Japanese. English-Japanese parallel sentences are a great starting point. I can hook you up with some good resources if you are interested.
- Analyze each sentence carefully with the help of a dictionary, paying attention to how each concept is expressed in Japanese. A simple grammar might be helpful too.
- Use an SRS application like Anki to help not forget the stuff you learn.
- (this whole activity can take less than 20 min)
- Listen to more Japanese.

this site has a bunch of useful ideas: http://www.antimoon.com/ just replace "english" with "japanese"

Those are probably suggestion target more at people trying to learn Japanese at an high level, so that might not interest you.
Learning just enough Japanese to get by though can be tricky. For exemple it's pretty easy to learn a couple of sentences to use when asking for directions, but you'll have to know a lot more than that to understand all the possible answers.

just my two cents.
gabatte ne, チャンピオん.

[Lord Satori]

animu

*anime

[lilmanjs]

Still the host does mention already several times that Japanese is easier to speak than English.

Man that is total bullshit.

Seriously? I guess I'll find out as I watch the show. but so far it doesn't seem so mindboggeling as English sometimes can be.

[trap15]

animu

*anime

**amune

[Lord Satori]

animu

*anime

**amune

***floccinaucinihilipilification

[Skykid]

Still the host does mention already several times that Japanese is easier to speak than English.

Man that is total bullshit.

Seriously? I guess I'll find out as I watch the show. but so far it doesn't seem so mindboggeling as English sometimes can be.

It's obscenely more complex, and that's not even mentioning that Japanese has many different forms of speech depending on who you're talking to: younger or older people, Japanese natives or foreigners, and in business situations, to name a few.

I spent the weekend with a guy who has lived in Japan for fourteen years, he told me it's not even worth bothering to try learning the language, despite being fluent.

Not that I would anyway, I don't see any productive reason to learn Japanese. It ain't 1995 anymore.

[Lord Satori]

I plan to learn Japanese eventually (next semester, if there aren't any conflicting classes). I could see it being useful because I plan to work for a company who's head branch is in Japan, and knowing Japanese would certainly be a plus.

[Skykid]

I plan to learn Japanese eventually (next semester, if there aren't any conflicting classes). I could see it being useful because I plan to work for a company who's head branch is in Japan, and knowing Japanese would certainly be a plus.

You "plan" to work for a company? As in you already have a position lined up, or you're just setting a goal?

If you will be working in Japan for good money, knowing the language is more than a plus. If you're working as an English teacher, I wouldn't even bother past the very basics.

Otherwise it's mostly beneficial for hentai spanking and visual novels. Or you could be a tour guide. There's always that.

[Bananamatic]

I don't see any productive reason to learn Japanese. It ain't 1995 anymore.

No one's translating those Super Robot Wars games you know

though I guess if you just want to learn to read and understand text, it's way easier than learning to speak it as well

[Edmond Dantes]

Not that I would anyway, I don't see any productive reason to learn Japanese. It ain't 1995 anymore.

Can I ask what was special about 1995?

[Skykid]

Not that I would anyway, I don't see any productive reason to learn Japanese. It ain't 1995 anymore.

Can I ask what was special about 1995?

Japan.

[Eaglet]

From my experience the best way to learn how to communicate in basic japanese is just to get to where people speak exclusively japanese, go out and get drunk and speak to strangers every night.
Nomucation!

edit: this basic idea is true for every country and language in the world.
Except for where religious fanatics have prohibited the use of glorious alcohol.

[pestro87]

Basically what endoKarb said. Doing translations also helps. Also, study hard and never stop.

[endoKarb]

From my experience the best way to learn how to communicate in basic japanese is just to get to where people speak exclusively japanese, go out and get drunk and speak to strangers every night.
Nomucation!

Picture of a typical supermarket foreign-langauge learning department.

[Eaglet]

This is more like it.

[GaijinPunch]

An excerpt from a conversation in the park yesterday:
"If you don't understand the culture, you will never understand the language". This is basically impossible w/o having some Japanese friends. The more high maintenance the better!

[broken harbour]

Year-and-a-half necrobump.

So I spent the weekend with Canadian friends who've lived in Japan for almost 3 years, who paid a visit back home.

This trip is on, happening approx. 1 year from now.


So... because I like taking on overwhelming things, I want to commit, I want to learn the language either way. I realize this will take years and years. Maybe if we like Tokyo I'll go there on a work visa for a year or something, a goal like that will help me commit. The benefits my wife has at her work will actually pay for language lessons thru an accredited university or college... tho I'm not sure that's the best way to approach it.


Lots of good advise from earlier posts, thanks, time to actually go through all those links and suggestions now.

[Rob]

language lessons thru an accredited university or college... tho I'm not sure that's the best way to approach it.

I say self-study is best for languages. There are an endless amount of resources on-line, and I'm guessing that even university courses will baby you and waste your time.

The only way to get a natural feel for grammar, a good ear and good speaking ability is with a huge amount of immersion and repetition.

So you better start quick.

[broken harbour]

^ I tend to agree, I spent years in French immersion in elementary and junior high and retained nearly nothing 20 years later, probably because French is a stupid language anyways.

While we learn, The wife and I are pretty much cutting ourselves off from English media in favor of Japanese, trying to simulate the immersion that say.. a child would experience living in Japan. Not sure if it'll work but... it's fun anyways.

Started the first online course from YesJapan, the first half is free so we figured we'd give it shot, made it up to the part about counting numbers and then fell asleep. Trying to do this while working full time, etc... is going to be quite the challenge.