Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Anything from run & guns to modern RPGs, what else do you play?
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mikehaggar
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by mikehaggar »

Sima Tuna wrote:
Yeah, that's confusing as hell and very much in keeping with the series' penchant for obscure systems players won't understand. But I'm glad that at least the game isn't lying to you when the dragon flashes red in phase 1. It DOES do something, and that's important because it means the feedback the game gives is consistent. Red flashing on hit = damage of some kind.
Haha, yes, at least it does SOMETHING, but the fact that it keeps flashing even after the 1000hp damage is done is super misleading.
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Klatrymadon »

Execution Grounds is in the bag, after an unusually small number of attempts - maybe 10-15! (I skipped the score screen without checking and couldn't find a way of reviewing the details.) The kamaitachis become a lot easier to deal with once you realise that - of course! - Arthur can run back faster than he can go forward here, which vastly reduces the need for risky jumps (the less said about attempts to duck them the better). I thought the sections with the cages and the waterfall would take me a long time to get down, but I slipped through both of them without issue once I'd had a run or two to see everything. Not even the surprise Bigger Pig at the end could piss on my chips! Killed Shielder on the second attempt, too, the putz.

I'm only three completed Legend levels into my journey, but I can see why the handful of evangelists for the game are in love with it - I'm already fully convinced that this is one of the best games ever, let alone the best in its series or genre. And it does want to be enjoyed. The sheer audacity of the thing - the insistence on maintaining the most unreasonable expectations of the player at all times - is shocking at first, but I've never felt that the game was in any way mean-spirited or punishing. Like any action game worth its salt, it's constantly teaching, constantly shaping you into a better player. The 'randomness', far from wasting that learning, keeps it fresh and exercises it, and the 'low-stakes' structure I nitpicked about earlier is key to keeping the game inviting, and hugely accelerates the speed of your improvement. There's a generosity to the game that's ignored in all of the "hardest game ever" boilerplate - GNGR may only ever be appreciated by a few, but it wants everybody to understand and experience the joys of meeting its outrageous challenges.

Appreciate the info on the dragon, Pablo! That changes my whole approach - I don't want to throw the odd dagger just for the hell of it, but stay right on top of him as much as possible in that first phase, pummelling his noggin until he can't think about phase three.
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BIL
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by BIL »

Lander wrote:
BIL wrote:Ohshi - the normal Arremer chilling under the chandelier, too. Blimey, good job I learned how to fight that one straight.
This threw me really hard on my first few grotto attempts in loop 1... Twins, this early?!

I'm not entirely sure how, but my beeline-right-dont-wake-shady-climb-ladder stealth strat somehow avoided spawning the regular one entirely on loop 1, getting through to the lava elevator section more or less for free.
With the occasional statistical anomaly waiting at the top to keep me in my place, of course :mrgreen:
Sir Ilpalazzo wrote:You can reliably avoid that one. When you reach the branching path just before him, where you choose whether to go left (and up) or right, go left, jumping up onto the first platform that makes up the cliff-climbing route, then double back and go right. This will consistently cause the arremer to appear on the left rather than the right, allowing you to avoid him every time.
Oh nice. :o I didn't even realise he could appear on either pedestal. My usual route was to take the cliffs, clearing out the Jester and his supports with a bomb, then fighting Chandelier Bro (always chilling at the left pedestal) up top. I only just realised, hunting down this last HellHole, that he'll be on the rightmost pedestal blocking your way, if you head straight up the ladder. At first, I assumed I was being careless and waking him via stray fire to the left, somehow.

Really cool stage design... reminds me of the path split in Zone 1B's classic piggus n' roots hillside, only tighter, so there's more crossover between their respective enemies.

I really need to gaffer-tape a note to my monitor, reading "THIS IS LOOP 2, ASSHOLE" :lol: I keep forgetting. I wonder if that explains these two Arremers (but seemingly no others) getting an HP bump. L3 Thunder will leave 'em with Just A Couple More Shots™, but Arries being what they are, that can be a little or a lot.
Nahar wrote:Does anyone know if a forum similar to this one exists for this kind of games? Ninja Gaiden style side scrollers, Metal Slug style run and gun, etc.
Hmm, not sure... I do know there's ScrollBoss, for beltscrollers. I can't recall if their forum is active, but it's a wonderful site. Full of that web1.0 hobbyist charm, much like our shmups.com front page. GamingHell.co.uk is great, too - again, I don't know if they've a forum, but there's tons of content that'd be welcome here.

MAME Action Replay / MARP forums tend to have good in-depth discussion on arcade action games, too. Slow posting rate, but tons of knowledge on offer. Took a peep just now, and learned Sunsoft's single-screener Kanagaroo is busted in MAME. I'll have to pick up the ACA version, been sleeping on it too long. :cool:
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Klatrymadon
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Klatrymadon »

BTW, thanks so much for the accessibility tip, BIL! I managed to enter exactly the opposite of the setup I wanted at first, but now I'm having a lot more fun on the stick. :D
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BIL
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by BIL »

You are most welcome! That feature has dodged many a non-reconfigurable bullet for me. :mrgreen:

EDIT: Aww sheeeit. :cool: My ghetto-ass USB stick wasn't working with my PS4, a while back. It is now! Musta been one of them thar system software updates. So I backed up my GNGR save data, and took down the last boss. As I feared, if you do that, while missing the one Demon Orb I am? WELCOME TO LOOP 3 BITCH! I've had enough of Loop 2, tbh, the Shadow Loop is overall equal/easier imo. :lol:

So yeah, hold back until ready! I'm chasing the last remaining HellHole, having restored my data.
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Nahar
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Nahar »

BIL wrote:
Hmm, not sure... I do know there's ScrollBoss, for beltscrollers. I can't recall if their forum is active, but it's a wonderful site. Full of that web1.0 hobbyist charm, much like our shmups.com front page. GamingHell.co.uk is great, too - again, I don't know if they've a forum, but there's tons of content that'd be welcome here.

MAME Action Replay / MARP forums tend to have good in-depth discussion on arcade action games, too. Slow posting rate, but tons of knowledge on offer. Took a peep just now, and learned Sunsoft's single-screener Kanagaroo is busted in MAME. I'll have to pick up the ACA version, been sleeping on it too long. :cool:
Thank you, man!
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by XoPachi »

I need that stupid elongated sound effect from GunStar Heroes that plays when something is doing a large motion. Like GoldenSilver's containment silo rising up, Bird Force dropping to the bottom of the screen, or Bravoo Man's stupid flying attack.
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by BareKnuckleRoo »

It's B5 in the sound test. B9 is a similar stretchy sound used when Green's Soldier Force stretches his arm.
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Stevens »

Hahaha. Haven't played it in years, but I read your posts and I hear it in my head.
You're sure to be in a fine haze about now, but don't think too hard about all of this. Just go out and kill a few beasts. It's for your own good. You know, it's just what hunters do! You'll get used to it.
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mikehaggar
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by mikehaggar »

BIL wrote:
So yeah, hold back until ready! I'm chasing the last remaining HellHole, having restored my data.
You were wise to back your data up! Let me help you out a little here as there might be something else you are missing.

Do you remember if the last hellhole you completed gave you the demon orb in the chest as a reward?
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BIL
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by BIL »

Cheers mike! I've been burned by the very FromSofts that GNGR's extended game remind me so much of, so I figured I better rubber up before testing my hypotheses. :mrgreen:

tbh, I've not seen a Demon Orb from them in what feels like forever (currently midway through week #4, having spent #3 hoovering up HellHoles at steady clip). I know I'm supposed to have 17, and counting them up after killing ol' hoss, it looks like I'm short one:

Spoiler
Image


I'm guessing that's the last HellHole in Shadow Zone 5/Citadel, which is proving elusive. I'll get there eventually, I'm sure. Image

EDIT: AOOOHHH YEAAAAAA BOYEEEEEE Image Found the bastard. That "satAM eating cereal and playing videogames in your drawers" energy won out. :cool:

I had a hunch, from the (beautifully drawn) map screen, of a certain locus... but it seems you need to find each and every hidden chest, Bee, and Magician in the runup? I know I've cast Treasure Eye on that spot before, and found nothing. At any rate, goddamn. Feels good man. :3

Those map screens are so charming. Good enough to frame! Emblematic of the handmade care GNGR exudes on all levels.

EDIT2: Aaand got my first Astaroth and Big Hoss one-shots, albeit helped tremendously by Armormend's gold-on-tap. Astaroth is the deadlier of the two, imo; the final phase has a speedkill-imperative pressure I don't notice in his superior. He's also just harder to land hits on, in general. Early days yet, ofc!

As with the aforementioned FromSofts, something I've really enjoyed in this treasure-hunting phase, is the imperative to continue getting better; exploring every nook and cranny of these deadly stages will be a nightmare slog, if you're relying on sheer brute force. Always Be Learning, that's what I was told. Image

EDIT3: And down in one goes Last Homie, too! Gold Doppy Daggers don't play. :shock: After my promising first volley, he eventually caught me by surprise - twice in rapid succession! But Silver & Gold paid teh mortal toll, and I was able to recover - nailing him with a soldier's last resort, The Ol' Spicy Punji. Image Image

I am most satisfied. Even the ending was lovely. What better, indeed, than to sit around chilling in your drawers? Image

Endgame spoilers:
Spoiler
So cool, how the TLB is that monstrous face seen in Dai's intro, but nowhere in Dai itself. Perfectly emblematic of GNGR's raison d'etre: returning to the AC duo, while building upon them.

Quite a treat unlocked for getting the True End, too. :o Got a bit of that Chou couture going on Image Should make testing out weapon & magic strats a breeze!

Image
I will have to write a proper review, but for now, suffice to say:

Spoiler
Image


Cheers again, Sumez & Ebbo & Tuna, and mike! I'm glad I didn't sleep on this any longer. A heartening exception to the rule of their not making games like this anymore. A little of this quality goes a long way!
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Sima Tuna »

Always awesome to see somebody really loving a game!

Unrelated, but I came so close to a 1cc in Final Vendetta Hard Mode. I got the Easy 1ccs for all three characters pretty handily. Easy mode is very easy and they shower you in lives. Apparently the even lower "casual" difficulty was patched in by the devs... But Easy is already so easy that I'm not sure why an even easier mode was needed.

Anyway, I got to the final boss of Hard Mode and was all primed for the clear. But goddammit, I was not expecting respawning minions. The minion kept hassling me while I was trying to loop the boss, and thus I died. :lol:

Duke is my favorite character. Claire is cool too. All the characters are awesome actually. This is definitely a game where I started out playing it, thinking the game was good but not great. But the more time I put in, the more it gives back. Movesets are deep, movement is extremely satisfying/fast, each enemy has a defined role and the game throws up challenging gauntlets. It's not as feature-complete or polished as a title like Fight 'n' Rage, but Final Vendetta is on the right trend. Like Fight 'n' Rage, it meaningfully builds on Final Fight and SoR2's systems. I think it would be fair to call the gameplay an upgrade from those titles. Which is high praise. If Final Vendetta had a bigger budget (or a Final Vendetta 2 were made,) I'd feel comfortable stating it is just better than SoR4. SoR4 has a few elements of combat I do not like (mainly hyper armor) and those are not present in Final Vendetta. Bosses do have i-frames but they are extremely specific about when those are active. For the most part, the entire game is honest beat em up play. Manage the screen, manage your position, use your resources appropriately etc. Every character has their own "thing" that stands them apart. Duke is the punchman and can set up extremely long punch chains/juggles. Claire has speed and a lot of other tech I haven't unlocked yet. Miller has the highest-damage throw game and a ridiculous elbow infinite that allows him to kill any enemy that has touched the floor. Including many bosses. His elbow game stands him apart from many other beat em up grapplers, since he isn't only about the throws.

Final Vendetta is one of those games that has me thinking about playing it when I'm not playing it. I was initially somewhat disappointed on my first play. "Oh, this game is kinda short huh." "These sprites are pretty mediocre." Nah, fam. It lacks the flash but packs the substance. Final Vendetta is built for replays. And the length of a run is really nice, too. I never run SoR4 because the game is way too fucking long. So I end up quitting out of arcade mode after a stage or two. Survival is too long too. Fight 'n' Rage is too long imo, but the entire game is so good I give it a pass. But Final Vendetta's length is right. I checked a 1cc video to confirm the length against my memory and it's around 38 minutes. Perfect. In that 30-45 range is right where a brawler should hit. 20 would be a little on the short side. 55+ is too much.

My only "complaint" about Final Vendetta is it's a bit of a shame the devs couldn't add more "flash" to the game before its launch. Y'know, so the fuckin' normies would buy it. I only bought it because of a sale + word of mouth here. If it had that Shredder's Revenge pixel game then maybe some friggin' game journos would have rated it higher. :lol:
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Klatrymadon »

Congrats, BIL! A mammoth achievement, to be sure.

Played Hellfire Hamlet for about an hour, getting really good at most of it but messing up a lot during the part with the darting swarms of flies. Eventually I slipped through unscathed, then managed to get the Red Arremer all the way down and off the screen like in the good ol' days, and touched the checkpoint banner before he could get back up. Now I have this stupid feeling that the checkpoint wasn't 'earned' and kinda want to restart the level! I figure I still have at least three loops to go and plenty of chances to fight them, though, so that would be pretty stupid, right?

Fuck it, I'm doing it!
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BIL
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by BIL »

Ta bud! Honestly it was more bloody-mindedness than anything. :mrgreen: Though, having said that, it would be a disservice to Fujiwara and co to ignore their sublime balance of Soulsy character-building and... actually, the imperative to master the environment and its vile denizens, regardless of your gear, is pretty Soulsy, too! But of course, that's just the collective history of first-class Japanese action game design, something the man himself played a foundational role in. :cool:

I too had a bit of that Legend-seeking spirit, early on; but I have to confess, it was beaten out of me by Zone 3 and Zone 4's respective escalations, before Shadow Zone 1A finally put me in Yngwie "FUCKIN FURY" mode - I think this clip (Shadow Zone 4) illustrates. :lol: Absolute cutthroat knock-down/drag-out ruthlessness from player and designers alike - I don't give a fuck! They started it! Imma give em a war they won't believe! Image (while nomming on cheetos in curiously Miyazakiesque temperament Image)

I've no regrets - the 1CC, or even 1LC, or even 1LC True End (goddamn :shock:) remains - a legendary stoly, told by fireside! Such is the transcendent beauty of GNGR - hit it with everything at your disposal, nuke it to the foundations; the thoroughbred arcade challenge remains. Image
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by mikehaggar »

BIL wrote: Cheers again, Sumez & Ebbo & Tuna, and mike! I'm glad I didn't sleep on this any longer. A heartening exception to the rule of their not making games like this anymore. A little of this quality goes a long way!
Dude, congratulations! I remember how good it felt when I finally did it for the first time. The absolute grueling insanity, you feel like you have the patience of a God and a little bit crazy for sticking with it long enough to clear this monolith of a game.

What stage took you the longest to clear? I’m curious to know now that you’ve become very familiar with the regular and shadow loops. I’m curious to know about how long that stage took you, and also curious to know how many hours this entire ordeal took you. Mine took very long (About 70 hours?)


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BIL
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by BIL »

Thanks mike! I have to say, while Zone 3/Grotto and Zone 4/Labyrinth's stage mechanics were fearsome at first, they rapidly began to make sense. The one stage that made me go "Yeah, doing this later" was Shadow Zone 1A/Graveyard. It seemed painfully unforgiving at first glance; between the darkness, and its mixups of air/ground enemies, plus those relentless Roots and Shadow Clippers.

Stuck with it for a couple hours, having knocked over Zone 5 the same night, then called it quits; I distinctly recall starting and finishing every other stage in an evening apiece, typically 3~5hrs. Next day I decided to try 1B/Execution Ground, which I found entirely reasonable. Made me realise Shadow was as much about "different" - sinister and warped - as it was flat-out brutality (speaking of, loved the subtle flanger distortion on its BGM). I found several later Shadow stages equal to, or even slightly easier than their Loop 1 counterparts, and definitely easier than many of Loop 2's.

So while I don't know if Shadow Zone 1A technically took me the most time - I think that might actually have been Zone 1A! - it's definitely the one that stayed incomplete the longest; I only finally cleared it after reaching Shadow Zone 5, having not even seen its second half until then (that Fennec & Shadow Burrito onslaught in the woods, pretty brisk Image).

As I mused a page or so back, I get the feeling Shadow Graveyard is meant as a terror offensive; a truly ominous introduction to the Shadow Realm. Nothing a little practice and tactical hypreaggression can't fix, ofc. :cool: (it's so, sooo cool how they balanced it so the Dark hazard and Shadow Arremers are "on loan" from Loop 1's Grotto; that's truly bravura action game authorship. "Yeah, let's give 'em a break in Shadow Zone 3-1, we're already giving 'em hell in 1-1" :mrgreen:)

From beginner's perspective, I'd also mention a very similar process with Legend Zone 1A. I did stick with it to the end, but it was a rough welcome, with that Giant Piranha ambush demanding particularly careful observation and execution. While I enjoyed clearing it, I was left a bit exhausted, thinking "God damn - that was just stage 1?!" I was skeptical of how, and where, they'd find yet tougher challenges; I was still dreading a fall into IWBTG/Kaizo nonsense, at this point.

Also, I was still building vital hand/eye memory and experience. That eventually granted an absolute trust in the controls and collision, freeing up vital braintime for those meticulous stage/enemy designs. I'd actually sampled 1B/Execution Ground, beforehand, and found its SKELETON MURDERER assault harrowing. Coming back, having learned GNGR wasn't merely competent with its 2D brethren, but flat-out as tight or even tighter than them (!), I was bunnyshredding through Skele-kuns without pause, just like old times. Image

(man - I knew this game had to at least play good, after all the diehards here gave it their blessing; but I wasn't expecting it to go toe-to-toe with the 2D games on personality, as well! :shock: I love SKELETON MURDERER, he's aces :cool:)

Image

I was naturally unaware of the remaining stages' consistent good sense; something that makes me regard GNGR's defining quality as not sheer difficulty (though it is most assuredly balls-to-the-wall hard), but rather, its intelligence in achieving that. This is an arcade thoroughbred that knows where to give a little slack, in the service of a mean smack later. Image These stages are all tough, and Zones 3 and 4 decidedly steepen the curve, but they're never merely about punishment for its own sake. Lots of creativity, and well-judged amenity; this without even considering the steadily-growing Magic and Skill arsenal.

Legend simply dispenses with preamble, starting at ~50% intensity, rather than heating up from a cold zero. Looking back, it seems obvious; the original trilogy have notably tough opening stages, compared to even other AC games (with Chou, of course, being a console title!).
Last edited by BIL on Wed Apr 12, 2023 11:36 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Ebbo »

Managed to clear Resurrection´s first loop without any magic. Surprisingly more doable than I initially thought and shows that despite of everything the game throws at you, there is always room for improvement and consistency can be achieved. Shoutout to Sir Ilpalazzo for the tip regarding Red Arremer's spawn position in Zone 3, I was always dreading what seemed a complete coin flip.

I also finally stumbled upon Black Chest/Hell Hole in Zone 3, so I decided to brace myself for some intense action sleuthing in loop 2 and go for the true ending (with magic, there are limits to my sanity/patience). Eventually I had to look up that one rogue Black Chest with orb in it in Shadow Zone 4. Most of the chests can be stumbled upon pretty organically if you keep either jumping or falling from suspicious ledges, but this one eluded me - what a devilish hiding spot, Arthur pretty much has to tip toe that giant ohmu acid pit to trigger that secret. Besides that Shadow Zone 4 was ultimately easier than vanilla one, I'll take zombies over skeleton murderers any time during that second half autoscroller bit :P

Hades bit the dust on my first try, pointblank golden crossbow is no joke damage wise!
Spoiler
I was pretty floored by the unlockable armors - an actual reward for all those grueling challenges in this day and age. Cast armor certainly makes it easier to hunt down those missing umbral bees. Made me kinda wish for an armor, that would replicate Super Ghouls 'n Ghosts' moveset... I just want that delicious double jump arc back!
mikehaggar wrote: What stage took you the longest to clear?
As BIL said, the magnitude of Zone 1A's culture shock cannot be overstated. That piranha trap in particular feels like utter nonsense until you come in terms with their particular spawn order and slight delay upon activation. One of the few required Red Arremer encounters and some deviously placed logs near each checkpoint put a nice bow on an experience, that will leave anyone scarred. But if you manage conquer this trial of fire, I think you're more than ready for everything else.
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BIL
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by BIL »

Superbly done. :cool: WRT magic, I get the feeling they designed GNGR iteratively, in layers. A hard core of Makaimura (no magic), then Dai (some magic), then Goku (lots of magic). As with the 1LC/1CC/etc, it's up to the player which experience they want. Going without magic is brutal, but it's always feasible. Not a conspicuously handicapped run, ala no-Options Gradius; just an electively hardcore one.
Ebbo wrote:a nice bow on an experience, that will leave anyone scarred. But if you manage conquer this trial of fire, I think you're more than ready for everything else.
Excellent point! I'd not considered it that way. :o It's true - after clearing Zone 1A with a starter Arthur, nothing will break you. Got that Armour of Faith on! SHOES OF PEACE, STOMPIN ON THE ENEMY! Image :mrgreen: I wonder if that was their intention.
Spoiler
I was pretty floored by the unlockable armors - an actual reward for all those grueling challenges in this day and age. Cast armor certainly makes it easier to hunt down those missing umbral bees. Made me kinda wish for an armor, that would replicate Super Ghouls 'n Ghosts' moveset... I just want that delicious double jump arc back!
I would so love to see a GNGR2, or even just DLC, that incorporated a bit more of Chou. While I strongly prefer Dai's pacing, I always thought Chou had the coolest environment design; a sense that Arthur is as much at risk of being swallowed up by his surroundings, as he is falling in battle with demons. Even so, I like that you can feel Chou's stage-upending presence in things like Zone 1B's brutal earthquakes, Zone 2A's erupting icicles (and equally violent building collapse), and Zone 4-2's rather terrifying interpretation of biohorror ala The Ghoul's Stomach. Just needed a tsunami or two. Image
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Sumez »

Man this thread assploded with GNG Resurrection glamour.
I've had an unwilling hiatus from this forum for a few weeks while focusing on other things, and come back really sad to miss several of you live-tweeting your experiences with what is literally the best action game released the past few decades. My bigger regret is not taking part in this collective analysis back when I plaed the game a few years ago.

I'll respond to some of the things said in here in waves as I slowly trodge my way through the posts. But I'm sure a lot of what I have to say has already been covered by others, or the same posters in later revelations.
BIL wrote:Wonderful to see others enjoying this too! Makes me feel slightly less lame for sitting out at release.
I was really close to sitting it out - I didn't have much hope for the game, and generally I pretty much never buy digital releases (seems doing it this time was a sound choice though, as a delicious physical box is still completely MIA). But I ended up buying the game only a couple of days after release, when djmikehaggar and Necronopticous chipped in on Discord to let me know this was the absolute real deal (and what a deal it was!).
Lander wrote: On other mechanics, I'm really appreciating the weapon slot skill at this point in the game as well.
Gone are the aw fack moments where the question is one of certain death now by enemy, or many probable deaths later by holy water pickup.
And - in an uncharacteristic fit of kindness - it even prioritizes so your equipped weapon is always the one that gets kept :o
This skill is too good. I've mentioned it before, probably in this thread too, that it alone lifts the typical troll nature of pretty much all Makaimura weapons retroactively into something really useful. Even in Dai, most other weapons have some kind of cool ability that would make them really useful if you weren't stuck with them for all the parts where they suck. It's almost like that game was intended to have this ability.

Going in with dagger+crossbow and gold armor makes Arthur into an incredible powerhouse able to cover all angles. It's the closest I've ever felt to actually feeling genuinely "OP" in this otherwise punishing game.
BIL wrote:I finally realised this wasn't the first loop at all. It's the second; you can never go back. Shadow Loop is its own nightmarish echelon altogether
Hah! Look forward to being stuck in second loop shadow stage 3 when going for its hell hole :3 (though I imagine you've already been there at this point)
That stage is truly something else.
Lander wrote:Finally clawed my way kicking and screaming to the halfway checkpoint in Shadow Graveyard. And you can bet I treated That Platform with a downright scientific degree of rigor after the church!
Jesus wept. It feels like the dev team removed all ethical constraints, r-r-re-examined their concept of fairness, and drew dark new conclusions :shock:
The Shadow stages are definitely much more wonky and occasionally straight up unfair compared to the initial loop. They aren't as polished, but I still enjoy them. It feels like the designers had so many ideas that they decided to keep the most pristine, balanced and well rounded layout for the initial loop and then dumped all the "b-sides" into the shadow loop. Those b-sides are still brilliant though.
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BIL
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by BIL »

Better late than never, that's what I always say. :mrgreen: (having just finished raving about Vanquish in the polygonal action thread Image)

EDIT: haha. Revisiting Zone 1A on a fresh file, actually being able to take in the scene, I'm reminded it kinda does have a tsunami - or at least a flash flood, with the midpoint graveyard disgorging a torrent of foul water to reveal its accursed gravestones.

What a difference a little under a month makes. :cool: First time I was all "Holy fuck, Scoob! ZOMBIES ARE COMIN OUTTA THE GOD DAMN WALLZ" Now it's like "Mhm, yep, what's good zombies. Whoops! Sorry I had to stab you in the face bro, can't have you landing on me."

...I'd headcanoned it so the zombies' matching outfit was literally a uniform; that's what became of the kingdom's regular army. Their being literal Redshirts, even better! And also, I thought "nice as a ragtag rotting horde would've been, it's better to have an instantly-readable design."

But only now do I really appreciate the range of zombie coifs on display. I'd noticed the poor bastards in varying stages of MPB (looks like they went down the whole Norwood scale :shock:), but somehow missed the dude rocking a mohawk, straight outta Return of the Living Dead. :lol: The things you can appreciate when you're no longer fighting for every step, just every several hundred yards!

Also nice coming back well aware of the zombies' wonderfully-articulated mechanics. I wouldn't have batted an eyebrow if they simply blundered into you, the way average runner enemies do. Instead they actually have a convincingly feral lunge, that can be juked away from. Times like this I remember Fujiwara is the ultimate Biohazard OG via Sweet Home.

Graveyard Rugby Pickup w/SKELETON PITCH INVADER :shock:
Spoiler
Image
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Air Master Burst
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Air Master Burst »

You fuckers making me want to sink the next month of my life into GNGR when I got that 1CC quota to fill.

I promise I'll get to it someday, I adore the series (outside of SGNG, which I never quite got on with).
King's Field IV is the best Souls game.
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Sumez
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Sumez »

Vanguard wrote:The stages and bosses feel a good bit harder than SFC Kiki Kaikai, but Reshrined is way, way more generous with resources, so I'm not sure which is the harder 1CC. A 1LC should be a good, approachable challenge in Reshrined, at least.
It's hard to compare the games because the OG is a lot more frantic and generally rewards rushing through without killing anything you don't have to - and I'm also not nearly as experienced with it.
But I got a Hard Mode 1LC incredibly fast in Reshrined. I'm not the best person to compare, but I'd consider the 1CC clearly easier, and 1LC even more so for Reshrined.
You get a lot of leeway for mistakes before actually losing a life, and if you're going for scoring it quickly ends up coming down to keeping your barrier shield for the score bonus you get when you pick up an additional one (the barrier can take 2 hits, but it needs to be undamaged for the bonus).

Here's a 1LC video I recorded intending to make a guide for the game (commentary in the subtitles), making it the only time I bothered doing that stupid St1 coin farming:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CxxhbAO87E
And I recorded a Hard mode 1LC (NMNB) two days later:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHKUMT8ZhdI
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Sumez »

BIL wrote:YSo I backed up my GNGR save data, and took down the last boss. As I feared, if you do that, while missing the one Demon Orb I am? WELCOME TO LOOP 3 BITCH! I've had enough of Loop 2, tbh, the Shadow Loop is overall equal/easier imo. :lol:

So yeah, hold back until ready! I'm chasing the last remaining HellHole, having restored my data.
Aw man, I can't believe you did that! I was looking forward to you experiencing what is easily the most agonizing single challenge I had to go through in the game :D
But at the same time also the most rewarding victory.

Sima Tuna wrote:My only "complaint" about Final Vendetta is it's a bit of a shame the devs couldn't add more "flash" to the game before its launch. Y'know, so the fuckin' normies would buy it. I only bought it because of a sale + word of mouth here. If it had that Shredder's Revenge pixel game then maybe some friggin' game journos would have rated it higher. :lol:
Yeah, I really want to play Final Vendetta, but nothing about it is especially appealing just from how it looks. It's trying to be a generic beat'em up, which is admirable, but it looks the part a little too well. Streets of Rage 2 is the most genericest of beat'em ups, and it still looks really appealing.
I'm hoping they'll take the Neo Geo release as a chance to add some new pizazz, but it sounds unlikely.
At least the soundtrack is a goddamn banger!
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BIL
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by BIL »

Sumez wrote:
BIL wrote:YSo I backed up my GNGR save data, and took down the last boss. As I feared, if you do that, while missing the one Demon Orb I am? WELCOME TO LOOP 3 BITCH! I've had enough of Loop 2, tbh, the Shadow Loop is overall equal/easier imo. :lol:

So yeah, hold back until ready! I'm chasing the last remaining HellHole, having restored my data.
Aw man, I can't believe you did that! I was looking forward to you experiencing what is easily the most agonizing single challenge I had to go through in the game :D
But at the same time also the most rewarding victory.
I did kinda cheese it, now I look back. :mrgreen: I just didn't have the time for a second consecutive week of treasure hunting, unfortunately - I'd probably have stuck with it, if I was in full Living The Dream aka school's out for summer mode. :cool:

An Eternal Dream, A Memory of Heaven ~ Super Arrange Ver.mp3
Spoiler
taptaptaptaptaptaptaptaptap"FUCK."
"Aren't you picking my mom up from church?"
"BITCH SHOULDA LEARNED TO DRIVE"
"What?!"
"I meant the controller!"


I figure I can atone with a 1LC at some point down the road. ;3
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Sumez »

You deserve to try shadow stage 3 on skull mode though. I was really surprised that they straight up added new mechanics on loop difficulties, rather than just beefing up spawn mechanics and enemy HP.

Worst part is I had to go through that gauntlet several times in succession because I had to not only reach the hell hole, but also complete it.
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Sumez »

I can't believe no one mentioned it yet(?), but the classic Jaleco gem Psychic 5 is getting a new (first ever) port with a bunch of extra stuff like a hori mode, etc. which could be interesting to try.

https://city-connection.co.jp/psychic5/

Image

It's made by the same people who did the recent Snow Bros. port - I thought that one looked good, even though I wasn't a fan of the remade graphics. The style seems like a somewhat better fit for Psychic 5 I think.
Did anyone play that, and are able to report how it handles? I'm thinking in terms of input lag, arcade-style options etc. of course.
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BIL
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by BIL »

I've learned to temper my enthusiasm with non-M2/Hamster stuff, unfortunately. 3: I'd snap up a quality home release of Psychic 5 without question; it's one of those games everyone in my circle loves, but I'm yet to even see. I like keeping a few of those around, like little-known gem and recent ACA addition The New Zealand Story. ;3

Speaking of great games in untested hands, did you see that Demon Front is getting a Switch release? (cheers Marc for the heads-up!)
Sumez wrote:You deserve to try shadow stage 3 on skull mode though. I was really surprised that they straight up added new mechanics on loop difficulties, rather than just beefing up spawn mechanics and enemy HP.
Oh rad, I just realised even the Congraturation ending puts you at the start of Loop 3. :o I'll give it a go tonight, thanks! Was messing about yesterday with a new file, just took down 1A+1B; amazed at how badly I was missing those extra weapon slots, moreso than any magic. Both the situational options, and their insuring against The Ol' Spicy Crockpot!™ OTOH, Gold Armour is way, wayyy easier to hold onto, when you've got the basic chassis and chest locations down. :cool:
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Steven »

As I am sure everyone already knows,

M2 HORROR STORY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am super excited for this release. It's worth it just for the amazing Tomizawa-bushi music, but then you also get 2 versions of a really cool game to go with it. It's probably the best game in the new Toaplan collection and I am going to play the shit out of it.
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by BIL »

Ah, balls, I completely forgot to mention that! Now there's a Buy With Confidence release. :cool: Good timing, with ACA Jigoku Meguri's recent arrival. Although, tbh, Wardner would've worked just as well on that front, had it swapped places with Horror Story. Late 80s/early 90s JP action/platformers seemed to have a thing for mildly superdeformed horror aesthetics; see also Compile's very nice MD Ghostbusters, with its endearingly fugly Bill Murray, Dan Aykroyd and Harold Ramis.
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Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

Post by Steven »

Horror Story completely surprised me when I played it for the first time, especially the soundtrack and that it actually has built-in autofire, which is super rare for Toaplan. Why is it that the obscure games that Tomizawa did the music for have such good music? I don't know, but I am really looking forward to this release now.

I was hoping that it would be Dash Yarou so we can brainwash the whole world into playing Dash Yarou, but my second choice, motivated purely out of my own selfishness since I already have the Dash Yarou PCB, was this because this game is awesome and I don't have the PCB, which is on the expensive side for a non-shooting Toaplan game, provided you can actually find one, as they are not very common. They are not super rare (Get Star and Enma Daiou are the super rare ones), but they are not especially easy to find. There is one on Tops right now, but that place overprices and I am hoping to find a cheaper one elsewhere.
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