SNES/Famicon PCB Revisions and RGB Video

[wyatt8740]

And !! its a SNS-CPU-APU-01 !! Not a 1 CHIP..

APU was the revision just before the 1CHIP, and the last revision to not have top line issues like the 1CHIP series. My NTSC APU revision has terrible diagonal jail bars, so I don't use it.

So do all 1CHIP versions face this top line issue ? Even if they are on the Snes/sfc 1 ? I heard only the SNES/SFc 2 had some glitches but not the SNES 1 version 1 CHIP... Does anyone know for sure ...

All 1chips have minor glitches on a few games, yes.
They don't have the diagonal lines, to clarify - that's specific to the APU model AFAICT.
I only have a 1CHIP-02 but I'm very happy with it since I don't own any of those games. This looks fantastic on my PVM-20L5 and my panasonic BT-H1390YN monitors.
http://i.imgur.com/VqdVwPL.jpg

[Chocograph]

I'm writing this in the middle of installing my rgb amp. I think you'll be surprised as I was...I found static image noise worse with the amp. Maybe because it's more pronounced? I actually decided to remove it and I immediately noticed an improvement. The almost invisible vertical bar was completely gone with the amp but the overall static noise was worse. The image was a little bit darker with the amp (no resistors). I honestly can't say I see much of an image quality improvement. Stock 1-chip looks identical to me.

[RGB0b]

It's possible there's something wrong with your SNES. When you first mentioned "image noise" on the previous page, that's the first thing I thought of.

Also, are you using csync, or composite-video-as-sync? Finally, what RGB cable are you using? Maybe we can figure this out...

[Chocograph]

Luma https://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/gam ... d-for-sale I highly doubt there's something wrong with my SNES. I can take a picture without noise filtering on my tv tomorrow. You can only see this noise on dark blue/purple backgrounds and very faint on green. It's got to be voltage / current interference because installing the two capacitors helped greatly and almost completely removed the vertical bar like I wrote before. It's worth noting the board is very clean. No corrosion. Actually it looks like new.

[CkRtech]

Luma? Are you on a PAL system?

[Chocograph]

Yes. The link I posted is a PAL rgb cable. I'm norwegian.

[RGB0b]

If you have time, it would be great if you posted pictures. Also, could you please list the equipment you're using? I'd really love to figure out where this noise is coming from and how to fix it.

[Chocograph]

I'm testing right now with a few different cables. The luma cable for my rgb modded PAL N64 from retro console accessories on ebay gives a cleaner picture with a little less noise. I tried my best taking pictures with my ipad from different angles but I couldn't get a good picture at all. You don't see it. Sorry.

[nissling]

Just got my Super Famicom. It's the first revision (four rubber feet) and after trying it on my BVM-20F1, I think it looks darn good. Not as sharp as the Mega Drive but very strong and vibrant colors. Much better than what I remember from my PAL Snes. I'm using composite video as sync currently. What do you guys think? Only have one functional game atm and it's mostly dark but I'll probably get an SD2Snes soon.

[BONKERS]

Looks sexy to me

[Xan]

Yeah, like I said, the SHVC-CPU-01 looks great on a CRT and is easy to identify and find. A while ago I actually tested my RGB-02 on a consumer set again and the interference patterns that are visible on PVMs weren't really noticeable there, although the loss in sharpness was still very apparent.

On a PVM or BVM a 1CHIP would probably still net a noticeably sharper picture than even the CPU-01, though it does come at the price of reduced game compatibility, and frankly the CPU-01 setup feels just cooler with the daughterboard for audio.

[Chocograph]

"Reduced game compatibility" - You can play most games without issues. Hardly a tradeoff if you ask me.

[FBX]

"Reduced game compatibility" - You can play most games without issues. Hardly a tradeoff if you ask me.

In fact, the only confirmed game-breaking issue is the Super Turrican glitch.

[Chocograph]

The official snes adaptor I bought on ebay did the trick and cleaned up the image even more. Anyone noticed a difference after changing out all the capacitors, like from one of those kits you can buy? Is there any point as long as the SNES works like a charm?

[Smashbro29]

I think I once read about a way to get 1-chip like quality on an older SNES by modding but I can't seem to find it.

[BuckoA51]

Supposedly there are quite a few games that glitch on the 1-chip, see http://www.racketboy.com/forum/viewtopi ... 52&t=46303

[nissling]

Got my SD2Snes today and have tried some more games on my SHVC-CPU-01. Lovely results! I'm going to take some captures soon. Any game requests?

[kruderand]

I just bought a SNES on ebay, with a S/N right on the edge. Took a chance since the price was right. Anyone want to guess if it's a 1 chip - 01?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/121852378433

*crossing fingers*

[mvsfan]

308 isnt right on the edge. they start at UN301. But for a while, it seems that nintendo was still using up APU boards that they had in stock.

From about 301 to 305 it can be either a 1-chip or an APU depending on what they had on hand i guess.

[kruderand]

That is great to hear! I was going off that old google spreadsheet. glad to know it's almost a guaranteed 1chip! I ordered the bits to open the case to verify, and placed my retro gaming cables order. I wish I could afford to get a framemeister, I'm settling for a SCART->HDMI converter. Can't wait to hook it all up and see how it looks!

[mvsfan]

The scart to Hdmi converters are far from ideal. most of them look like crap.

your best option besides the framemeister is probably the GBS8200.

also theres a guy working on custom firmware for it to hopefully address the flaws it has.

I also like the scart to component converter, CSY2100 but it only works if your tv supports 240P over component.

[panzeroceania]

Terminology RGB refers to RGBs in 480i. You can get VGA from the Cube, but it doesn't look any better than 480p component. Why should it ? Just because the sync signal is differently implemented ?

Correct me if I am wrong here, but earlier in this thread you said it would be possible to mod a GC D-Terminal cable to switch between both RGBs (15khz RGB) and RGBHV (31khz VGA). If that case, would not RGBs (480i) and RGBHV (480p) both utilize not only full color range (0-255) color but full chroma sampling as well (4:4:4)? This compared to 480p component which would be 16-235 and 4:2:2. With that in mind, you are saying there would be no improvement in the picture quality between the two?

The reason RGBHV doesn't look better than YPbPr on a GameCube is because the gamecube's video card only works in 4:2:2 . Doing a RGBHV mod won't hurt, but you can't get past the limitations of the video card.

I suspect this is true of many consumer video cards to this day. Hopefully most commercial video cards don't cut corners.

[BONKERS]

Terminology RGB refers to RGBs in 480i. You can get VGA from the Cube, but it doesn't look any better than 480p component. Why should it ? Just because the sync signal is differently implemented ?

Correct me if I am wrong here, but earlier in this thread you said it would be possible to mod a GC D-Terminal cable to switch between both RGBs (15khz RGB) and RGBHV (31khz VGA). If that case, would not RGBs (480i) and RGBHV (480p) both utilize not only full color range (0-255) color but full chroma sampling as well (4:4:4)? This compared to 480p component which would be 16-235 and 4:2:2. With that in mind, you are saying there would be no improvement in the picture quality between the two?

The reason RGBHV doesn't look better than YPbPr on a GameCube is because the gamecube's video card only works in 4:2:2 . Doing a RGBHV mod won't hurt, but you can't get past the limitations of the video card.

I suspect this is true of many consumer video cards to this day. Hopefully most commercial video cards don't cut corners.

Any modern recent GPU with HDMI 2.0 at least can do 4:4:4 @2160p60

[panzeroceania]

There is a difference between the max a spec supports vs actual products, corners are often cut

[BONKERS]

There is a difference between the max a spec supports vs actual products, corners are often cut

Sure, but i've yet to hear of a mid range recent GPU that had HDMI 2.0 that couldn't hit 4k60 4:4:4.
Heck, you don't even need that to do game rendering at resolutions higher than that at 60+FPS with full chroma.

[ZellSF]

Anyone has tested Final Fantasy Mystic Quest on a 1CHIP? I think battle animations are broken, but I read it could be because I'm running it from a SD2SNES (the game apparently uses SRAM as work RAM, which sounds like it could screw something like that up).

Or alternatively, anyone can test it on a non-1CHIP with a SD2SNES?

"Reduced game compatibility" - You can play most games without issues. Hardly a tradeoff if you ask me.

In fact, the only confirmed game-breaking issue is the Super Turrican glitch.

But that's also one of the best games on the system

I can't actually find any vertical bar on my 1CHIP SNES and it's not a 03 so I have csync without modding. Really happy with it, would be perfect if not for Super Turrican.

[CkRtech]

but I read it could be because I'm running it from a SD2SNES

Sadly, there are a lot of posts about 1CHIP incompatibilities that are based upon using flashcarts instead of the real thing.

What animation glitches are you seeing during battle? I think I have a copy of Mystic Quest around here somewhere.

[ZellSF]

but I read it could be because I'm running it from a SD2SNES

Sadly, there are a lot of posts about 1CHIP incompatibilities that are based upon using flashcarts instead of the real thing.

What animation glitches are you seeing during battle? I think I have a copy of Mystic Quest around here somewhere.

The entire screens glitches out (when it's supposed to just brighten). Trust me, if you see it, you'll know.

[CkRtech]

Seems fine on my 1Chip 01 and 02.

[Seraphic]

So basically, when it comes to the SNES and the 1Chip reversions, from best to worst quality would be?:

#1 SNES-Mini
#2 1Chip-03
#3 1Chip-02
#4 1Chip-01