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 Post subject: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 4:50 am 


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Joined: 15 Feb 2012
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So, after taking a bit of a break from the shmups to play some other stuff, I came back and spent some time with Mushihimesama's original mode (on the side from my main shmup, which is still DOJBL).

I'm getting slaughtered by the bullet speed in this game. Frequently, there's some tight pattern coming my way, and I can't tell whether I need to say still to go between the bullets, or if I need to tap to get out of the way. Examples of the stuff that gives me trouble are the first pattern of the stage 2 midboss, and the little green bugs in stage 3 that shoot the aimed line and the aimed semi-circle.

Any tips on quickly reading how I need to move on this sort of stuff? Should I be watching "up" the screen and trying to interpolate the angle, or should I be watching near my ship and trying to "reaction tap" when something comes close?


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 Post subject: Re: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 3:49 pm 


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For me, watching "up" has always worked better when dealing with fast bullets. You'll develop a sense of where your character is at any given point in time, so it should never really be necessary to actually look at it. Trying to squeeze your hitbox through a fast pattern (like you'd do with a slow one) would need lightning-fast reflexes anyway, and I'm sure Mushi's original mode is not only aimed at the minority of players who actually have these.


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 Post subject: Re: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 12:02 pm 


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Look middle/up the screen, and have a look on your character once a while to keep a clear track of your hitbox.

Concerning Mushi's Original (and others of course, but especially this one), don't you ever look the bullets, look THE SPACES BETWEEN THEM. Indeed, those bullets are real fast so looking at them and then finding a way to go would be too long. So, just look for a way to go through the patterns.

Besides, one must confess that there's a lot of learning by heart in Original...

BTW, have you seen that : http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=41899


Last edited by Hydeux on Mon Sep 17, 2012 5:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 1:04 pm 


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It's really something you just have to play repeatedly to get accustomed to. I know when I first tried DDP in MAME I was still a Touhou fag and the bullet speeds there were raping me to the point where I uninstalled it a few minutes later.

A few years later and I was seriously getting into Cave's stuff. Playing Futari a lot and suddenly I can read faster patterns, even in BL when hitting the stage counter max. It's one of those things you probably have to get yourself used to by simply subjecting yourself to it until it clicks.
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 Post subject: Re: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 1:14 pm 


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Location: On an alternate dimension... filled with bullets and moon runes...
Another tip: try to destroy quickly everything that comes on screen. Learn where the enemies will come and act accordingly. Depending on which shot tipe you are using you should stay higher or lower on the screen. The game gets pretty hectic if you let enemies and bullets acumulate so try to not let that happen.

As allways, I recomend S-Shot because you can tap and dodge quickly and you rape every enemy that is in front of you when you concentrate your lasers. Use Spread formation to get some side protection and you should do fine in no time on original mode.


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 Post subject: Re: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 5:33 pm 


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BareknuckleRoo got a point : play something faster ! Such as Futari BL practice mode with everyting stuck on 99999999999999.
Or Futari 1.01 Original...

EDIT : another way to train for Mushihimesama's Original would be to play on an iOS device (provided you got one) on HELL difficulty. Same patterns but game is slower, got Auto-Bomb, so it's a perfect method to learn the patterns. It worked fine for me.


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 Post subject: Re: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:39 pm 


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I 1cc'd Mushihimesama Original this past weekend. You can do it too! Here's my advice for those fast tracking bullets and general tips:

I like to separate bullet patterns into two different types of situations:

Popcorn Enemies/weaker enemies w/fast tracking bullets:
1. Use large sweeping from left to right movements in a "smiley face/curve" motion to kill the popcorn enemies as soon as they appear on the screen with Auto Shot (C shot). They shoot out a lot of fast tracking bullets and your "smiley face" or even a figure eight movement will break up bullets and make it easier to dodge since the face tracking bullets are being pulled in wider angles. If there is a steady stream of fast bullets, tap dodge by gently nudging your stick/tapping keyboard key/pressing the directional pad in small movements. I like to tap in time with the music to keep rhythm. Also by sweeping and tapping you herd bullets. For instance I will move Reco in a curve to the left in a smooth motion, then quickly cut to the right within the space that curving to left had created.

Tough enemies which spit out slower, denser bullet patterns:
2. Kill the tough enemies with hard laser (A shot), but don't stay in the same place holding A shot. Tap dodge so you skew the bullets that are tracking you but at the same time, you'll be negotiating the predetermined bullet layer. Don't use the large sweeping movements (at first, until you are comfortable with the bullet pattern layer) within these tight patterns or else you'll hit one of the bullets. You'll notice that each tough enemy has a specific pattern to the patterns, make mental notes of how to move in response to each enemy's pattern and the sequence.

As you watch a bullet pattern, pay attention to the safe "rays." Hydeux makes a great point about not looking at the bullets themselves, but at the SPACES between the bullets. Check out the picture here:
Image

I've drawn green lines to where you should imagine lines connecting the bullets. This helps you envision safe space and the rate you need to move Reco in between the green lines. It is much easier to envision patterns this way, instead of paying attention to each bullet.

More tips:
Stay at the bottom of the screen at first. Time your left and right movements by getting into the rhythm of where the enemies come out in waves. You should be thinking "okay, now I'm going here. Now here, now I sweep here, etc."

Watch your replays. Pay attention to where popcorn enemies come out and what side of the screen (kill those first). Pay attention to the large enemies' bullet patterns and their sequence. Practice a safe dodging scheme for each of these patterns.


Mushihimesama really grew on me and I hope this advice will help you get better at it too.

Cheers,
-the F-man
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 Post subject: Re: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 2:37 pm 


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Glad I'm not the only one who got caught off guard by Mushi's bullet speed. I heard it was a really easy clear, so I loaded it up the other day thinking I'd breeze through it... and game overed on stage 3 thanks to getting screwed hard by boss/midboss patterns. >.> Mindset is half the battle, apparently.
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 Post subject: Re: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 2:43 pm 


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Location: On an alternate dimension... filled with bullets and moon runes...
CaptainRansom wrote:
Glad I'm not the only one who got caught off guard by Mushi's bullet speed. I heard it was a really easy clear, so I loaded it up the other day thinking I'd breeze through it... and game overed on stage 3 thanks to getting screwed hard by boss/midboss patterns. >.> Mindset is half the battle, apparently.


once you get used to the speed, original mode is really easy...


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 Post subject: Re: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 4:50 pm 


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Anyway you should not bother too much with patterns dodging : just bomb as much as you can.
You can have 4 bombs in the levels and 6 lives (3 lives at the beginning, two extends, one 1-up) with 3 bombs each.
So you got 22 bombs and 5 misses (27 ways to avoid trouble !*) before the actual Game Over.

Really : use all of your bombs, even in the levels "to clear your way", and against bosses be sure to throw them directly on the bastards to maximize damage !



* : :shock: Am I right on this ?!? Sounds weird to have so many bombs !


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 Post subject: Re: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 5:58 pm 


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Location: On an alternate dimension... filled with bullets and moon runes...
Main problem with Mushi is that the bullets are so fast that most of the times you die from a bullet you never saw (except on the bosses and mid-bosses).

The popcorn enemies in stage 5 even shoot you horizontally in the lowest part of the screen...

so sometimes you are bound to die with bombs on stock...


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 Post subject: Re: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 6:46 pm 


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O. Van Bruce wrote:
The popcorn enemies in stage 5 even shoot you horizontally in the lowest part of the screen...
so sometimes you are bound to die with bombs on stock...

true.


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 Post subject: Re: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 9:12 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2012
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The bullet speed is really fast in this game but the bullet patterns aren't very dense. It's been mentioned already, but immediately begin looking at the gaps in the bullets rather than the bullets themselves. You also don't have to look at your ship all that much. Look up towards the middle and upper half of the screen frequently and use your shot/laser to determine where you are.
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 Post subject: Re: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2012 9:04 pm 



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The thing about Mushi Original is that nothing (apart from a couple of exceptions) is random, everything comes at you the exact same way everytime. The key is to already know what's about to come next, and you'll only get that by practicing and familiarising yourself with the stages. I suggest using the training mode to develop a route through each stage which works for you, then stick to it as rigidly as possible until it becomes second nature. Tap dodging is your friend since almost everything in this mode is aimed. You should also allocate bombs to any specific parts which consistently give you trouble.
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 Post subject: Re: [RQ]Dealing with fast bullets (Mushihimesama Original)
PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2012 2:33 am 


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Are you playing on a pcb or one of the ports? If you are on a port, spend some time with the arrange mode. I learned mushi mostly by playing the ps2 arrange mode. It's so much easier that i was able to really hammer out a nice route through all 5 stages. Switching over to original i got the 1cc in no time using my arrange mode routes.


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