Counterfeit Ginga Fukei Densetsu Sapphire Warning

Ceph · Post by **Ceph** » Fri Jul 29, 2005 2:40 pm

A warning to all fellow shmuppers:
Lots of Ginga Fukei Densetsu Sapphire counterfeits
have recently surfaced on ebay, for instance these:

5220310408
8206634022
5220671658
8208005654
8207914356

I feel sorry for those who were tricked into shelling out hundreds of bucks for fakes.

For comparison, here you can see the front cover of a legit copy: 8205524846
One easy way to identify a counterfeit is the color of the girl's vest (her name is Sapphire, by the way). The real color of Sapphire's vest is purple-ish, while in the counterfeit it looks blue.

Since the counterfeits are all the same, it seems likely they were all produced by the same people at the same time. Most likely they were made in Hong Kong around mid-2002.

Tomtom · Post by **Tomtom** » Fri Jul 29, 2005 2:53 pm

Yeah, I saw one of these yesterday and it raised my eyebrows. $60 for a normally $300 game? Quite suspicious.

Ceph · Post by **Ceph** » Fri Jul 29, 2005 4:50 pm

The people who spent 60 USD may consider themselves lucky for not having wasted even more. Still, a pirated CD is worth nothing. If the christian god existed, surely he'd make the dicks of those counterfeiters shrivel and fall off

Nemo · Post by **Nemo** » Fri Jul 29, 2005 5:00 pm

I bought one of these "fake sapphires" for $60 before I knew it was a bootleg, but the seller made it apparent it was an "alternate version" so I wasn't terribly disappointed. I was more disappointed in the game, which I think is horribly overrated and not worth the $350 it goes for, the people paying this are the ones truly getting ripped off.

Jon · Post by **Jon** » Fri Jul 29, 2005 5:31 pm

Nemo wrote:I bought one of these "fake sapphires" for $60 before I knew it was a bootleg, but the seller made it apparent it was an "alternate version" so I wasn't terribly disappointed. I was more disappointed in the game, which I think is horribly overrated and not worth the $350 it goes for, the people paying this are the ones truly getting ripped off.

Thats just it. So much work went into some of these bootlegs that if they were just up front about it I wouldn't have a problem shelling out around twenty or so dollars for a copy. Nothing more though.

DC906270 · Post by **DC906270** » Fri Jul 29, 2005 5:57 pm

If you can find an authentic copy of sapphire for $350 you are getting something of a "bargain" (relatively speaking!!!). I paid around twice that for my copy, t'was sealed though. It is kind of awful the way as soon as you peel the shrink wrap from a sealed game, about 40% of the value will fall off

For people who diss this game, you should bear in mind -

IT IS STILL ONLY A PCE SHMUP - There is a limit to how "amazing" it can possibly be. Sapphire is actually a very solid shooter - i think it ranks in top 3 PCE shmups easily. Although those who expect something to rival modern 32/64 bit shmups will be disappointed. The price tag is something only avid/hardcore pce fans/collectors will pay. If you just want to check it out, then a "bootleg" will probably suffice.

DC906270 · Post by **DC906270** » Fri Jul 29, 2005 5:58 pm

It is also wierd how a game that is supposedly so rare, that there are so many "sealed" copies still around. Does anybody know how many copies were actually produced??

Ceph · Post by **Ceph** » Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:01 pm

Well, no video game is worth $350 just for its gameplay (though I don't think Sapphire is a bad game, either). It's Sapphire's rarity which makes it the most expensive home system game (aside from Darius Alpha, which isn't really a full game). When demand exceeds availability, prices go up. In the case of Sapphire, I think it's safe to assume that demand greatly exceeds the number of copies made. Hence it's our own fault the price is so high

BTW, exactly how many copies were made? Does anyone know?

Ceph · Post by **Ceph** » Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:21 pm

DC906270: I am beginning to suspect that some unscrupulous people are re-sealing near mint/mint copies of very expensive games. After all, if you can duplicate Sapphire including CD, booklet, reg card, spine, case and shrink-wrap, what should keep you from using your equipment to reseal real copies of Sapphire, or any other rare game for that matter? I paid 300 something dollars for my mint copy of Sapphire, and I'm glad I didn't even try to find a sealed one- because I'd never open it.

DC906270 · Post by **DC906270** » Fri Jul 29, 2005 8:23 pm

Yes, it is better to find a used copy as long as it is mint

Nemo · Post by **Nemo** » Fri Jul 29, 2005 9:44 pm

Jon wrote:Thats just it. So much work went into some of these bootlegs that if they were just up front about it I wouldn't have a problem shelling out around twenty or so dollars for a copy. Nothing more though.

I don't know about $20, it's a not a CDR in a blank case, unless you really know what to look for you can't even tell the difference between it and the original. The ironic thing is that some day, these "bootlegs" will become a collector item in themselves due to the fact they are limited in number.

IT IS STILL ONLY A PCE SHMUP - There is a limit to how "amazing" it can possibly be. Sapphire is actually a very solid shooter - i think it ranks in top 3 PCE shmups easily. Although those who expect something to rival modern 32/64 bit shmups will be disappointed. The price tag is something only avid/hardcore pce fans/collectors will pay. If you just want to check it out, then a "bootleg" will probably suffice.

See I disagree, Sapphire to me isn't a solid shooter at all, it's actually a quite flawed one technically. The only it has going for it is the "wow" aspects. And this is my opinion again, but paying $300+ for a CD isn't hardcore, it's dumb.

Ceph · Post by **Ceph** » Fri Jul 29, 2005 10:03 pm

If you want something rare that many people want then you either pay the price or you won't get it. Simple. I don't see any real difference between paying hundreds of dollars for a pcb, or for instance a Neo Geo cartridge or in this case, a CD. Since what you get for your money is the same in each case: A game you can play. And as far as longevity is concerned - in the long run, a CD will probably outlast any cart/pcb.

Also put into consideration that in case you decide you don't want a game like Sapphire anymore you can easily sell it and get back your investment, or even make a slight profit.

Nemo · Post by **Nemo** » Fri Jul 29, 2005 10:21 pm

Ceph wrote:If you want something rare that many people want then you either pay the price or you won't get it. Simple. I don't see any real difference between paying hundreds of dollars for a pcb, or for instance a Neo Geo cartridge or in this case, a CD. Since what you get for your money is the same in each case: A game you can play. And as far as longevity is concerned - in the long run, a CD will probably outlast any cart/pcb.

And that's my point, I would be perfectly content in never playing the game again, so my advice to others is if you're on the fence, don't pay the price. And the total package probably cost $5 to originally put together, originally retailed for around $50, and people are going to pay $300 based soley on hype? At least with a PCB, they are expensive to make and generally sell for a lot less than what they originally were sold for. And I'm sorry but a CD will not outlast a PCB or cart, CDs are the cheapest medium period, and a random occurance of butter fingers or other mishap can cause you to completely lose your investment.

I own expensive CD games, but nothing even over $150, I guess everyone has their own personal limit, but quite frankly, I realize now paying even over $100 is pretty stupid.

Zigfried the Trizealot · Sat Jul 30, 2005 1:26 am

I bought Sapphire for around 320, and it was about four months before I could play it. That was probably good, because I was able to play it without feeling the immediate "price sting" (like when I first played Genny Strider, which I hated at first because it cost so much).

Anyways. For the memories Sapphire gave me -- and the irreplaceably cool music -- I have no problem with having paid so much. It doesn't rule in the same way as, say, ESPgaluda... but really, what does? Sapphire's got a unique style and charm that just can't be found in other games. If I were tight on money, then sure, it'd be a bad purchase -- but if fond memories are more important, then it's a wise purchase.

Of course, I ended up trading it away for a bunch of cool stuff later on.

//Zig

roushimsx · Post by **roushimsx** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 1:48 am

I guess I'm fortunate in that I never had to drop the insane amount of $$ on the game thanks to rampant 8bit console piracy and well developed console emulators. Loved the music, but I never really got into the gameplay and prerendered sprites just don't do it for me like they do for other people, i guess

(for instance, I find Prehistoric Isle and Blazing Star ungodly ugly)

But god DAMN was that a fucking rockin' awesome soundtrack.

Nemo · Post by **Nemo** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 2:14 am

Zigfried the Trizealot wrote:Anyways. For the memories Sapphire gave me -- and the irreplaceably cool music -- I have no problem with having paid so much. It doesn't rule in the same way as, say, ESPgaluda... but really, what does? Sapphire's got a unique style and charm that just can't be found in other games. If I were tight on money, then sure, it'd be a bad purchase -- but if fond memories are more important, then it's a wise purchase//Zig

I agree about the music, it's sensational, the disc spends way more time in my CD player than it does in my Duo.

Stormwatch · Post by **Stormwatch** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 4:15 am

It seems Wikipedia does not have an entry on Sapphire. Will someone CLICK HERE and write one?

DC906270 · Post by **DC906270** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 8:53 am

paying $300+ for a CD isn't hardcore, it's dumb.

Have you never spent $300 + in your life?? What would you consider is worth $300?? What one man's "worth" might be another mans "dumb"!!!!

Specineff · Post by **Specineff** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 9:07 am

Ceph wrote:The people who spent 60 USD may consider themselves lucky for not having wasted even more. Still, a pirated CD is worth nothing. If the christian god existed, surely he'd make the dicks of those counterfeiters shrivel and fall off

He exists, and he's merciful even towards software pirates. That's why there are authorities and human powers in charge of enforcing those laws.

Ceph · Post by **Ceph** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 11:42 am

Stormwatch wrote:It seems Wikipedia does not have an entry on Sapphire. Will someone CLICK HERE and write one?

I would. But...

No-one seems to know any facts. Was the game really only sold at a game show or wasn't it? Different people claim different things. How many copies were made? More than 1000? Less than 2000?

For instance, we know that around 800-1000 copies of Darius Alpha exist. For comparison, there are somewhere between 20'000 and 50,000 copies of Radiant Silvergun- and people consider it rare.

Zigfried the Trizealot · Sat Jul 30, 2005 3:58 pm

It was sold in normal retail channels and there are definitely more than 1000.

//Zig

Nemo · Post by **Nemo** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 8:25 pm

DC906270 wrote:
paying $300+ for a CD isn't hardcore, it's dumb.

Have you never spent $300 + in your life?? What would you consider is worth $300?? What one man's "worth" might be another mans "dumb"!!!!

I touched on this earlier, but a lot of gaming things are worth spending $300 on, mainly hardware and PCBs, basically anything that is genuinely worth that amount and isn't priced because of hype. There are plenty of rare games out there and Sapphire isn't the rarest. Paying so much for something so easy to produce, replicate, and damage is "dumb" IMO.

visuatrox · Post by **visuatrox** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 9:18 pm

Well atleast bootlegs have one good purpose, as they fill up some of the demand they tend to drive down prices on the genuine copies.

jp · Post by jp » Sat Jul 30, 2005 9:19 pm

visuatrox wrote:Well atleast bootlegs have one good purpose, as they fill up some of the demand they tend to drive down prices on the genuine copies.

Yeah, which completely fucked me over as my copy recently went for $300.

If I could get my hands on whoever is spreading this fucking bootlegs...

visuatrox · Post by **visuatrox** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 9:28 pm

jp wrote:
visuatrox wrote:Well atleast bootlegs have one good purpose, as they fill up some of the demand they tend to drive down prices on the genuine copies.
Yeah, which completely fucked me over as my copy recently went for $300.

If I could get my hands on whoever is spreading this fucking bootlegs...

A real collector would not pay anything for a bootleg. The problem is just that people don't know how to tell the difference. I mean these bootlegs are so well made, it would be almost impossible to know the difference without having the genuine one to compare with. I guess eventually people will get informed, and then the auction prices would go back to normal.

DC906270 · Post by **DC906270** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 9:56 pm

I touched on this earlier, but a lot of gaming things are worth spending $300 on, mainly hardware and PCBs,

I wouldn't consider buying a PCB, as you can play most on MAME, plus PCB's have limited life span. Also, i consider console games to have better gameplay than the arcade versions, as they are not solely preoccupied with swallowing your coins. they tend to be fairer, and more skill orientated. how many people spend $75 on a brand new domestic PS2 game, which then subsequently they sell on for $10? a few of these and you have wasted well over $300. i don't waste much money on other things, but pce games and other collectable games from that era of gaming is one of my vices. i agree that sapphire as a game is probably not worth the money, but as ceph has stated, it is the price you must pay to experience it.

ResOGlas · Post by **ResOGlas** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 9:56 pm

You guys sure these are actually bootlegs and not just sunfaded? Bootlegging a rare game to these high quality standards is way too much money to spend if you're going to flood the market. Have any of you guys ever been to Japan before? They have waaaayyy more sunfaded games than not, and it's not an uncommon sight to see a purple cover become blue. My conclusion, someone found some old sunfaded stock. I mean, with all these rumors going around there is always a chance that they could be bootlegs....but it's most likely just a case of paranoia instead.

Post by **Ghegs** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 10:04 pm

ResOGlas wrote:You guys sure these are actually bootlegs and not just sunfaded? Bootlegging a rare game to these high quality standards is way too much money to spend if you're going to flood the market. Have any of you guys ever been to Japan before? They have waaaayyy more sunfaded games than not, and it's not an uncommon sight to see a purple cover become blue. My conclusion, someone found some old sunfaded stock. I mean, with all these rumors going around there is always a chance that they could be bootlegs....but it's most likely just a case of paranoia instead.

It's not the first time Sapphire bootlegs have surfaced. Link.

gs68 · Post by **gs68** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 10:14 pm

Ceph wrote:If the christian god existed, surely he'd make the dicks of those counterfeiters shrivel and fall off

Hooray for ignorance and intolerance of other people's religions.

[/sarc]

*is Catholic*

visuatrox · Post by **visuatrox** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 10:15 pm

Well I guess it would be possible they are sunfaded, or that they have been misprinted. From past experiences though looking at the numbers/ID on the data side of the CD can give a pretty good hint on whether it is a bootleg or not (that part seems to be difficult to replicate or overlooked by most bootleggers, even though the ID text may be the same the font often is not identical)