The Sega Mega Drive/Genesis Thread (NEW)!!!

[drauch]

Aye, I'll give the ol' Beast a proper chance, then. Been watching playthroughs of stuff at work(bad employee) and I can see how it may get a tit repetitive, but that graveyard beginning and baddies are enough to whet my appetite. And that kick. Oooo, buddy.

MWIV is probably my favorite, but I'm also a big softy for cutesy playformers that play nice. It's a good contrast to the rest of my fiction indulgence that's all debauchery and violence.

And yeah, Sonic... Was just having this conversation not too long ago with a buddy. His hangup was he didn't play them much in youth, and since Sonic's big gimmick is SPEED he just tried to speed through everything, since ya know, that's what that hedgehog dude is supposed to do. Except he really doesn't most of the time, which was already mentioned. It's a pretty poor design flaw, yeah, especially when most of the speed sections you don't really have much control (tunnels, hoops, etc.), but I'd still say I enjoy them. But at the same time when I think about it I have no real desire to ever play them before something else on the console, despite the fairly fond memories. So hmm, yeah. Are the GBA titles any better?

[Sumez]

The GBA titles are terrible.

Honestly, if you can't like S3&K, you can't like any Sonic game.

[TransatlanticFoe]

Altered Beast might be a bit more tolerable if it weren't re-released at every opportunity. It's always there as though it's a classic, but it was basically a graphical tech demo with some funny voice samples. But yeah, at least it isn't Last Battle I guess.

Sonic 2 is pretty great, but turn off Tails or get a human 2P because the CPU royally screws the bonus stages for you. Sonic 1 is too slow and Sonic 3 onwards start to get too big. TBH I think I like the first two 8 bit Sonics better than the MD titles.

[FinalBaton]

Honestly, if you can't like S3&K, you can't like any Sonic game.

aight I'll give 3&K a go!

[BryanM]

All this Sonic talk, there was this video recently by a dev about how they compressed a prerendered movie intro to fit on Sonic 3d.

the MD Sonics as riveting speed 'em ups

Honestly the overall impression of Sonic 1 in my memory is him sitting on a slow moving box in act 2 tapping his foot.

Memorable high lights of the series overall are the pinball levels and drowning underwater horribly.

See how Sonic connects to Ecco the Dolphin? It's all one big interconnected dark universe.

[BrianC]

I don't agree with Sumez's sentiment towards easy games. I found Monster World IV quite enjoyable, despite it not being a hard game. I also enjoyed the early Sonic games quite a bit and found Marble Garden to be one of the better levels, mainly because of the obstacles and how the level is not about going fast.

[Mero]

When you loop Altered Beast the next loop is on the next difficulty, and stays that way unless you change it back to normal in the hidden menu. The health you start the next loop with is whatever you started stage 5 with, so it can either give you health or take it away from you..

[Stevens]

I do like to fire up Gain Ground on the rare occasion. What are people's thoughts on it?

[BIL]

Great and totally unique topdown action/strategy game, with a methodical pressure I've never seen elsewhere. Especially riveting when a valued fighter is captured, and you've got one last chance to rescue them before they're lost forever. Compared to the arcade version, I actually like the MD port's smaller playfields... it ups the pace a tick, without sacrificing the game's inherently calculating nature. I plan to get it soon. Mentally I tend to associate it with Herzog Zwei and Crack Down - even though they play little alike, they're all ambitiously original topdown action/strategies, with attractively compact aesthetics and strong multiplayer elements.

I particularly dig the port's Hard mode - at first it might seem a misnomer, with it giving you every character from the outset, including stone cold killers like MUD PUPPY and my boy THE PROFESSOR... then you realise there are absolutely no prisoners to rescue, and a dead character is never coming back. Punishing!

The PS2 polygonal remake was sadly from before M2 whipped AGES 2500 into shape with Space Harrier II Complete Collection, but it's actually still pretty enjoyable - worth taking a chance on, especially as it's still dead cheap even brand new. SSH's new soundtrack is absolutely killer, too.

[FinalBaton]

I love Gain Grounds on the Genesis.

I packs a tremendous one-two punch : it's both methodical and extremely "pick up and play"

Good stuff. Another quality product by Renovation.

[Deadliar]

I like how the long range caveman archer guy is the best character for the whole game. He makes everyone else so redundant its not even funny.

Soldier guy? Haha no. Magic Knight? Weak! Robocop?! Fucking pansy. Yall need caveman archer.

[BrianC]

I love Gain Grounds on the Genesis.

I packs a tremendous one-two punch : it's both methodical and extremely "pick up and play"

Good stuff. Another quality product by Renovation.

Renovation was the US publisher, not the developer (Sanritsu programmed the Genesis/MD version). It seems the publishing decision was made before the JP version's release since it has the Renovation copyright when played on a US system.

[Sumez]

I don't agree with Sumez's sentiment towards easy games.

I don't have a (major) problem with easy games. I was the one defending the Sonic games, in which you are practically unable to lose.

MW4's problem isn't so much that it's easy, but how a lot of the areas/enemies don't even feel like actual video game challenges, as much as they are just tedious hurdles. It's not horrible - it has its charm, but I don't think I'd ever find the patience to pick it up again.

[null1024]

Honestly the overall impression of Sonic 1 in my memory is him sitting on a slow moving box in act 2 tapping his foot.

fun fact: apart from one block in act 3, you can just run full tilt through those sections and not bother waiting [and not take damage]. Blew my mind when I first saw someone do it.
The slow elevators in Spring Yard, which is otherwise a fairly quickly paced stage piss me off to no end the more I play Sonic 1 though, particularly after getting crushed out of sheer impatience.

I'm glad that all the later Genesis Sonic games provide ways to skip past all of the slow, waiting sections [like the CPZ2 rising water in S2 -- you can use the S-bend before as a ramp to completely skip it, and you never have to touch water in Aquatic Ruin].

So hmm, yeah. Are the GBA titles any better?

Advance 1 is a fairly solid game with mediocre music and boring, if effective visuals. Probably the best designed of the lot, but it's basically "let's remake Sonic 2 with the weak second half cut out". The absolute last two stages in the game are kind of jank, but that's it.
Advance 2 looks and sounds loads better, but it's got somewhat automatic rollercoaster stage design that then flings you over pits without warning near the end of most acts. Has every right to be a great Sonic game [the R-trick system is ideal and provides for the player to regain directional control while being flung through the air around at top speed], except it's not. I like the game, but saying it's a well designed game is a lie. Bosses suck, although Sonic can cheese them [spam Sonic's double tap air dash to get really close, hit it a bunch, you can beat the first boss in under 10 seconds fairly easily], and then Cream can Cheese them [literally just press b repeatedly when remotely close to have Cheese fuck 'em up].
Advance 3 has a bunch of good ideas [the tag system is really cool and there's a BUNCH of little details and shit about it that most people aren't going to notice], and has excellent graphics and sound [easily my favorite soundtrack of the lot, very PSG heavy stuff], but somewhat wonky handling and really terrible stage design. It's more of an actual platformer than Advance 2, but it's full of bottomless pits and crushers in awful spots and there's not a good sense of flow at all. Stages take the worst aspects of Advance 1 and 2 and mix them together. It's worth a shot to experience it, but you can tell that anyone who knew what stage design was at either Dimps or Sonic Team left at this point.
none of the true last bosses are worth playing in the Advance games and you don't unlock Super Sonic for regular play so there's no point in playing the awful special stages in each game

[Sumez]

Sonic Advance 1 and 2 had stage design? :3

[ryu]

I found none of the Nintendo handheld Sonic games to be particularly offensive. Always liked that they were straightforward games without any weird settings and stories at the time when 3D Sonic had to save the president and all that.
Like how did those car chase stages happen in Adventure 2? Nothing in the handheld games comes even close to being that bad.

[Sumez]

Nothing in Adventure 2 isn't horribly broken. Don't even drag that mess into this

[TransatlanticFoe]

I do like to fire up Gain Ground on the rare occasion. What are people's thoughts on it?

Totally unique and a load of fun. It's a shame it never saw a sequel with a bit better balance in the characters, as a lot of them are pretty worthless or restrictive variations on better ones. Love how they're either left or right handed, letting you get one over enemies behind cover if you use them correctly.

Hard mode. Awwww yeah. Another quality MD arrange mode to file alongside Mercs original mode. While it takes out the fun of building a small army, getting no backup strengthens the strategy aspect of the game.

The SMS version is worth a look if you like the MD, as it has a lot of unique levels and cuts out a lot of the duplicate characters - so you just get the important ones.

I watched a video of the PC Engine version - who decided to have a zoomed in playfield so you get scrolling?! Way to ruin the whole point of the game. Cracking soundtrack as per standard for the PC Engine though.

[GSK]

AB and GA were also by Makoto Uchida, who later did Dynamite Deka - that's why Chicken Legs appear in both (little bastards), and you can cosplay as Beast/Axe characters in the arrange mode of M2's superlative-as-usual PS2 Deka.

PS2 Dynamite Deka wasn't an M2 joint, Uchida's team at Sega Shanghai did it themselves.

They also did a quasi-remake of Deka 2 named Dynamite Deka EX: ASIAN DYNAMITE which reskins the game to look vaguely Asian and replaces the powerup system with goofy character transformations: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gL3uyK70FEs

[drauch]

I really dig the pc-engine version of Gain Ground. Yeah, I get not liking the zoom-in, but it plays a bit faster. Plus I'm that sicko that sacrifices gameplay for cracking tunes!

[Sumez]

I have no idea what's going on in Gain Ground. Kind of surprised that people like it, but also intrigued.

[Blinge]

Haha this^

Honestly, if you can't like S3&K, you can't like any Sonic game.

Okay so 1/2 were my childhood jam and I never really had time to sit down with 3& knuckles & knuckles until recent years, which was playing on the ps3 megadrive collection on a large potentially laggy flatscreen.
Is &knuckles considered better than Sonic 3? It seemed way better to me, and I never bothered playing as knuckles(&knuckles)

Confession/shame time. I felt like playing a bit of Sanic 1 the other day so whacked the emu on and died 4 times trying to get the hidden 1-up on GreenHill Act 2.
Then turned it off.
I'm good at videogum

[drauch]

Gain Ground: KILL EM ALL and GET TO THA CHOPPA (end).

[FinalBaton]

Blinge, hello.

Haven't interacted with you in awhile. I know you post in the Foruhm Softeuhwaeru thread, but I don't post in that one.

[Sumez]

Okay so 1/2 were my childhood jam and I never really had time to sit down with 3& knuckles & knuckles until recent years, which was playing on the ps3 megadrive collection on a large potentially laggy flatscreen.
Is &knuckles considered better than Sonic 3? It seemed way better to me, and I never bothered playing as knuckles(&knuckles)

3&Knuckles just feels like how the game should be. It's a big adventure which takes you across a lot of colorful areas, and it's the only way to fight the actual end boss. The reason I say 3&K though, is that they are essentially the same game, I don't see any reason to split them up into two. I believe it was only released like that for business purposes.

If you had to compare S3 with S&K separately, I thin they would come out extremely evenly. I can't even remember which stages are from which part of the game at this point.

[Blinge]

Bruh.. I thought they were separate games!
Dunno how the combined play works with emulators then.

Hey Mr. Baton
Yes it's been a while, I haven't been on the shmup ting or hardcore side scrollers for a while.
Just RPGs and selling my soul to bloodborne.

You're okay
When the revolution comes you'll be spared.

[soprano1]

Dunno how the combined play works with emulators then.

Well, there are separate rom dumps, but some emulators allow you to do the connection similar to the real thing.

[Herr Schatten]

Monster World IV definitely looks the deal, but it's boring to play. Slow pace, easy challenges, annoying backtracking. It's like a low-tier WayForward game.
Dragon's Trap is a much better game.

While I agree that MWIV is largely devoid of any real challenge, I still like it a lot, simply because it's so relaxing to play. Interacting with the pet/sidekick is fun, too. Plus it's one of the most beautiful MD games ever. I never really thought there was a lot of backtracking, in fact I find the game almost too linear and straightforward, especially compared to its two predecesors.

Truth be told, Monster World III is probably the better game, but I always found that one's art a little too generic and functional, with no memorable standout scenes. I also think that accessing new areas through equipment is a large step back compared to the cool character transformations in Dragon's Trap. Last but not least I can't wrap my head around why they messed up an otherwise perfectly balanced difficulty ramp by having it suddenly go through the roof upon reaching the final boss. I can't remember another last boss in an MD game that's suddenly as ridiculously tough except maybe the one from MD Phelios.

Dragon's Trap is a stellar game, but it's clearly a little more than the Master System hardware could handle, which results in some really repetitive level design. The exploring is fun, the actual platforming and fighting, not so much.

is MW4 playable in japanese? or is the text necessary for the progression of the game?

There's a spot where you have to answer a couple of questions from a Sphinx in order to progress. At that point you either know japanese or do what I did back in the day and write down all the questions and answers until you answer them correctly by pure trial and error.

[MintyTheCat]

I have no idea what's going on in Gain Ground. Kind of surprised that people like it, but also intrigued.

It rules!!! Highly addictive game that scales nicely. A friend of mine always starts swearing on the later levels in two-player mode. Gets a fair amount of play time in my house.

[M.Knight]

I really dig the pc-engine version of Gain Ground. Yeah, I get not liking the zoom-in, but it plays a bit faster. Plus I'm that sicko that sacrifices gameplay for cracking tunes!

I haven't had any experience with the game proper, but if you like its Stage 1 theme, I suggest you check out Project X Zone's arrangement of that track.