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 Post subject: GD: Dodonpachi Daifukkatsu Black Label - Scoring/basics?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2011 4:42 am 



Joined: 02 Feb 2011
Posts: 51
Does anyone happen to know of a quick guide for the basics of this mode, and the scoring? I can't even seem to get a full hyper gauge before the oil tanks anymore!


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 Post subject: Re: RQ: Dodonpachi Daifukkatsu Black Label - Scoring/basics?
PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 12:30 am 


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Location: England
I'll share what I've figured out so far, though I think it's hardly comprehensive. It'd be good to write it down, at any rate.

Your Ship

  • If you use an autobomb ship, hypers and bombs work the same way as in DFK WL; you have a bomb stock and a hyper bar, and a miniature bomb will be used if you get hit. You cannot store hypers in this mode. This mode is not recommended for scoring.

  • If you don't use autobomb, your bomb stock is replaced with a B/H item. Every time you bomb or hyper, one item is removed from your stock; every time you collect a bomb or fill the hyper gauge, one is added (and the hyper bar is reset if you got it that way). This mode is recommended for scoring!

  • Bomb and Power styles have first loop patterns/rank (though Power may be slightly harder in spots?), while Strong styles have Tsuujou patterns, including suicide bullets. I don't think rank resets to 0 between stages in Strong style either, though I could be mistaken; if it's the same as Tsuujou, it halves between stages.

Rank, Hypers and Other Stuff

  • If you use shot and laser at the same time, the rank bar at the top starts rising. If you stop using both, it will stop, and start decreasing after a short while. It has 4 distinct modes - low, about half full, in the red, and maxed, and at each of these the amount of bullets increases. This is imperative for scoring well, but makes survival harder. Also, your hypers will charge faster the higher your rank is.

  • Rank rises at normal speed if you use a Bomb ship or a Power ship in Normal mode. Rank rises at double speed if you're using a Power ship in Boost mode, or a Strong ship.

  • Bees can be collected while gold, flashing or green. When they're gold, they cancel all on-screen bullets into small stars; when flashing, they cancel into larger, more valuable stars, and fill up your hyper meter slightly. When green, they fill up the hyper meter without cancelling bullets. Ideally, you'll always collect bees as they flash.

  • You can end hypers prematurely by pressing the hyper button again. In return, hyper invincibilities and hyper length in general are shorter than in DFK WL. When a hyper ends, half a bar's worth is removed from your rank. If you cancel a hyper during the warning screen before a boss, you do not lose any rank.

  • I'm not 100% sure on reaching Ura with Bomb or Strong, but these are the conditions that have worked for me:
    • Don't let any silos get run over (the same silos as in DFK).
    • Make sure the rank is maxed ASAP, ideally before the first tank, and that it stays maxed until the midboss spawns.
    • Make sure you collect all three bees, the first two of which must be flashing.

  • If you die on an Ura midboss, I think you get kicked out for the next stage onwards. They're very tough requirements, don't worry if it takes a while to get them to show up.

  • If you use Power style, you are forced into Ura midbosses for stage 1.

Scoring

  • Your main sources of points are stars (preferably large) and shooting bosses while at high rank. The amount of points you get from either of these is affected by your chain value, displayed in the top left.

  • Your chain value increases for shooting enemies, and decreases if the hits meter starts going down; if the chain breaks, it goes back to 0. Generally, small enemies increase it by a pretty insignificant amount, while big enemies like the really wide Stage 4 ships can increase it by millions at a time.

  • You can make enemies add more points to your chain value by using the hit multipliers; I'm not sure, but I think this works with the same values as regular DFK. This means x2 value at 500 hits, x3 at 1k, x4 at 3k, x5 at 5k, x6 at 7k, and it maxes at x7 value at 10k hits. I'm 90% sure that this multiplier only kicks in when the rank is red. I think there may also be a bonus applied when the rank is maxed, though I'm less sure about this.

  • You don't gain any hits for cancelling bullets with hypers; you can only get hits by shooting enemies, or from bullets cancelled by other means, like grabbing bees, or destroying enemies who cancel their own bullets. Many enemies will self-cancel if you destroy them with shot + laser at the same time, so do this a lot. Aside from this, more bullets means more hits gained, so try to keep the rank as high as possible by using S+L often. It's also worth waiting for a bee to flash as a screen fills up with bullets before grabbing it, turning the whole screen into huge stars and raking in the points and hits.

  • There appear to be three ways you can break your chain:
    • Using any kind of bomb.
    • Dying while a hyper is active.
    • Letting the chain meter empty while a hyper is active.
    Therefore, if you use an Autobomb OFF ship, you should never use bombs until the EX stage, unless you've already broken your chain. If you use an Autobomb ON ship, you can save your chain after autobomb by using a hyper during the autobomb.

  • Once there are a lot of bullets on screen and you have a high chain value, you can use a hyper to cancel a lot of bullets into stars; try to keep enemies alive so there are more to cancel. However, half a bar gets removed from your rank meter after a hyper ends, so be careful not to end one at a bad moment when valuable enemies will appear. Cancelling bullets at a boss or midboss with a hyper does not yield any stars.

  • When at a boss, try to hit them as little as possible until your rank is at least red, unless you've broken your chain. At red rank, you start getting huge points for hitting the boss with S+L, and the points come even faster if the rank is maxed. If you destroy a boss at max rank with S+L, they release larger stars, which are extremely valuable - you can often get almost half your stage's score from the boss fight alone. You can milk bosses for extra points by shooting invincible parts (e.g. using an enemy laser to block your own laser, shooting at the mini robots on the third boss, shooting at the red balls or satellites on the fourth boss).
    • Be warned that if you try to milk, you will start to encounter some special, extra vicious patterns on some bosses, notably the first and third (and maybe others?). The attacks seem to come in at different points depending on the ship you use - the third boss' final phase gets nasty on the third cycle for A-Bomb, but on the second for A-Power, presumably because of the power difference. For this reason, it's easiest to encounter them with Power ships in Normal mode.

That's about all I've got so far, hopefully you find it helpful. If any of you guys have anything extra to add, please do! I think I'm probably missing a few things.
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Last edited by Sapz on Fri Feb 25, 2011 1:17 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: RQ: Dodonpachi Daifukkatsu Black Label - Scoring/basics?
PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 3:28 am 


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Randomity:

- Green bees (and flashing bees) still refill your hyper gauge, as in DFK 1.5, making them pretty useful at times (especially on stage 1 to get to Ura).

- You can apparently cancel a hyper for "free" (no rank decrease) at the very end of the stage, during the boss warning message.

- You still get hits from cancelling certain lasers, in particular the ones shot on stage 1 with Strong by the three big tanks (it's easy to get into the thousands there, and I'm sure there are other similar situations, again like in 1.5).

- I'm not 100% sure how you gain more bomb/hyper slots with Bomb and Strong... at one point I thought I'd actually gained one after getting the x2 multiplier bonus, but I'm not positive it was the case (I'm also not sure if the Maximum bonus is still worthless).

- Bombing always breaks your chain apparently, but dying on a stage is fine unless you have a currently active hyper, and it's also possible to break your chain while you have a hyper going. As far as I know, you can't really break your chain on a boss though.


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 Post subject: Re: RQ: Dodonpachi Daifukkatsu Black Label - Scoring/basics?
PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:12 am 



Joined: 02 Feb 2011
Posts: 51
More random:

- It seems like you can milk bosses a bit by tapping in and out of the A+C shot mode to keep rank maxed, but prolonging the fight. The idea is to increase your multiplier while extending the boss' life. I'm not sure about the most efficient way to do this though, I should probably check out some videos. If you're playing on Power, keeping your shot in Normal mode seems to be very helpful here as well.

- On Power Mode, Ship B is a scoring machine, very likely outshining the others by a huge margin. Once your multiplier is high, you can enter hyper and move to the corner of the screen. If you keep holding the direction of the corner, your options will direct your vulcan fire diagonally over your ship. This essentially creates a bullet absorbing shield, and causes you to not kill anything on the screen. The result is tons of enemies shooting very dense streams of bullets at your ship. It seems best to use this in sections where you know there will be lots of popcorns.


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 Post subject: Re: RQ: Dodonpachi Daifukkatsu Black Label - Scoring/basics?
PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:45 pm 


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Nice info!

A few more tidbits:

  • Power in Boost and Strong ships gain rank at double the speed compared to Bomb and Power in Normal ships.
  • In (some/all?) boss fights with Power ships, if the fight goes on long enough (usually meaning you've used Normal rather than Boost to attack the boss, for more hits and points), attacks become far more difficult - notable ones I've found are the Stage 1 boss' pink spread attack becoming more vicious, and the Stage 3 boss' streaming attack in the final phase throwing solid walls of pink rather than having gaps between the waves.
  • In Autobomb ON mode, using a hyper just as your autobomb can keep your chain from breaking.

Will update my original post shortly.

EDIT: It appears that bosses have vicious timeout phases in styles other than Power - I encountered the third boss' final phase timeout attack with Bomb on its third cycle, as opposed to its second with Power. I guess it's done this way because of the differences in attack power. Presumably this happens with Strong too? Editing the info post to account for this.
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 Post subject: Re: RQ: Dodonpachi Daifukkatsu Black Label - Scoring/basics?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:58 pm 


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I can say with more confidence now that the maximum x2 bonus is the only way to get extra slots as Bomb/Strong, and it makes me wonder that suiciding once or twice before the boss to get an extra slot might be worthwhile (it's a Yagawa game after all!)... I wish there was any near-WR level scoring replay available, but it could make sense I think given how many points you get from cancelling bullets, especially on the later stages, and the scarcity of hypers otherwise.


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 Post subject: Re: RQ: Dodonpachi Daifukkatsu Black Label - Scoring/basics?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 10:26 pm 


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I'd think suiciding at the very beginning of the stage would be better than before a boss. Losing a chunk of your hit counter before a boss will hurt your post-boss red gauge bonus, not to mention you might have to bomb/hyper during the battle (therefor reducing your stock to use in scoring the subsequent stage).
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 Post subject: Re: RQ: Dodonpachi Daifukkatsu Black Label - Scoring/basics?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 11:15 pm 


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That obviously makes sense if you've been struggling a lot against the boss, but I was only talking of suiciding to gain an extra hyper slot for future stages if you're completely out of hypers (it shouldn't happen on stage 2, but stage 3 is something else). I don't believe it's optimal for perfect scoring (though it might be given that it's harder to load up the hyper again for bullet milking this time), but it might make sense for survival if you'd rather have extra hypers on all your subsequent lives, and definitely with autobomb types.

Have I been dreaming or is it possible to get more than 25% hyper back sometimes? I've been playing Novice too so that might be a confounding factor, but I can swear I occasionally get about 50% back on the gauge :?:


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 Post subject: Re: RQ: Dodonpachi Daifukkatsu Black Label - Scoring/basics?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 3:19 am 


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So I went home and downloaded all the top replays I could find for every ship/type. In particular, I noticed that all the B's actually SKIP some of the bees in the level in favor to absorb stars from popcorn enemies. You think bee's are only important to a certain point?

Also damn, I noticed some shmup members high up on the ranks there. Namely Van of Artic 99 and Shalashaka up in the top 20. Damn good job. Wish I could download the replays but Cave was dumb and seperated them for 1.5 and BL Retail.
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 Post subject: Re: RQ: Dodonpachi Daifukkatsu Black Label - Scoring/basics?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 7:22 pm 


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For BL, what's the difference between Boost and Normal for Power mode while in Hyper? I seem to recall in 1.5 (it's been a long time since I even touched 1.5) that Normal Hyper added bullets to chain, while Boost Hyper refilled your Hyper meter. Since bullets don't add to the chain at all in BL, is it better to just use Boost when hypering?
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 Post subject: Re: RQ: Dodonpachi Daifukkatsu Black Label - Scoring/basics?
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2012 2:27 pm 



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Yeah, I don't think there's any use to the Normal hyper shot in BL. Normal mode in whole is somewhat useless in that game except for milking the bosses. Other than that, the only uses for it are speed boosting and getting more hyper charge out from stuff since the laser doesn't kill them so quickly. I can't really remember now but you might also get charge a bit faster with the Normal laser from bosses.
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 Post subject: Re: GD: Dodonpachi Daifukkatsu Black Label - Scoring/basics?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:59 pm 


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What are the requirements to get to route 2 in fifth stage?
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