Website that sells Dreamcast VGA Box & RGB SCART integrated.

[Rock Man]

I was curious as to what website sells such beastly lead connections for two of Dreamcast's most powerful signals or if it's even possible via solderless modifacation (In that case I would do it myself). I find the prospect of being able to switch between SCART straight off the Composite H and V sync and VGA intruiging. Basically I'm looking for a Sega DC VGA BOX with RGB SCART mod for switching between the two video inputs on the fly.

Ofcourse I'll have to get my Coosis box to recognize the RGB SCART signal too since the DC RGB leads I've used keep getting rejected. Consider this a project for potential future investment.

[Endymion]

As far as I know, what you describe does not exist. However, you should know that with a VGA box, you can add a switch to cut a line which will change the output from RGB at 31KHz (otherwise known as VGA) into RGB at 15KHz--the same signal that is used for SCART RGB. By adding this switch to any Dreamcast VGA box, you can then get the functionality that you desire.

All you need to do is cut line 6 and add the switch there. When the switch is closed, you will get VGA, when the switch is open you will get 15KHz RGB. A VGA box to do this with can be had for $20 or less on ebay.

[Rock Man]

I'm not too familar with adding switches... I wonder if there is a video tutorial for that. In anycase I would likely pay someone for their modified box provided it outputs in VGA and RGB 15Hz, the one you described.

[Strider77]

It's REALLY easy to do... took me about 20 min.

[headlesshobbs]

If you were to use 15hz wouldn't it still tell you to switch off games that don't support VGA?

[Rock Man]

If you were to use 15hz wouldn't it still tell you to switch off games that don't support VGA?

I would like to know about this too.

[Endymion]

I'm not too familar with adding switches... I wonder if there is a video tutorial for that. In anycase I would likely pay someone for their modified box provided it outputs in VGA and RGB 15Hz, the one you described.

I'd like to say that you are saying that you would pay someone to do something that is the equivalent of, oh I don't know, attaching a trailer to a truck post. Seriously. It is that simple. If you looked at a diagram that says A in one spot, and B in the other, do you think that you could connect A with B? If not, then, why not? Installing a switch is the simplest electronic modification that you could possibly dream of performing. If you can't do this, then you should honestly end any technical aspirations at all. If you can do it--and you can, provided you do not have Down syndrome or some other similar mental impediment (no offence to those with Down syndrome)--then you will find that this is the first of many, many successful and actually ambitious projects with the games that you now call a hobby. In short, this is so easy to do that you SHOULDN'T pay anyone to do this for you.

The circuit works. All that a switch involves is making the circuit not work, in a way that it can be switched back on again. It really is as simple as that. The wire you will be dealing with is soldered through a hole in the circuit board. All you have to do is heat up that solder and pull the wire out, once the solder melts it will slide out effortlessly. Then you just heat it again and tie it to one end of the switch. Get a spool of wire of any gauge that will fit in the VGA Box and solder it to the same hole you just removed the other wire from, then get a snip and cut the wire from the spool, solder the other end to the empty side of the switch AND YOU ARE DONE. Please don't tell me that sounds difficult? If that's so tough, you could always turn the VGA Box into a 15KHz-only box by just removing wire number 6 from the board and never reattaching it, at that point it will only give low resolution RGB.

If it sounds like I am getting on your case here, well I am, but only for your betterment. I know that you think you can't do this. I also know for a fact that you absolutely can.

If you were to use 15hz wouldn't it still tell you to switch off games that don't support VGA?

No. When you switch it to 15KHz RGB, you get 15KHz RGB. If a game does not support VGA that has no bearing on whether or not it supports 15KHz RGB. Some games support both 15KHz and 31KHz, some games support 15KHz and not 31, some support 31 and not 15. I don't have Vampire Chronicle but I spotted rockman's other thread where he mentioned that game supported neither. I think that's rare, and from the googling I have done there are a lot of inconsistent reports on this. In fact, the first and most involved discussion I found showed that it supported VGA and not 15KHz RGB, contrary to Rockman's findings.

[Rock Man]

I'm not too familar with adding switches... I wonder if there is a video tutorial for that. In anycase I would likely pay someone for their modified box provided it outputs in VGA and RGB 15Hz, the one you described.

I'd like to say that you are saying that you would pay someone to do something that is the equivalent of, oh I don't know, attaching a trailer to a truck post. Seriously. It is that simple. If you looked at a diagram that says A in one spot, and B in the other, do you think that you could connect A with B? If not, then, why not? Installing a switch is the simplest electronic modification that you could possibly dream of performing. If you can't do this, then you should honestly end any technical aspirations at all. If you can do it--and you can, provided you do not have Down syndrome or some other similar mental impediment (no offence to those with Down syndrome)--then you will find that this is the first of many, many successful and actually ambitious projects with the games that you now call a hobby. In short, this is so easy to do that you SHOULDN'T pay anyone to do this for you.

The circuit works. All that a switch involves is making the circuit not work, in a way that it can be switched back on again. It really is as simple as that. The wire you will be dealing with is soldered through a hole in the circuit board. All you have to do is heat up that solder and pull the wire out, once the solder melts it will slide out effortlessly. Then you just heat it again and tie it to one end of the switch. Get a spool of wire of any gauge that will fit in the VGA Box and solder it to the same hole you just removed the other wire from, then get a snip and cut the wire from the spool, solder the other end to the empty side of the switch AND YOU ARE DONE. Please don't tell me that sounds difficult? If that's so tough, you could always turn the VGA Box into a 15KHz-only box by just removing wire number 6 from the board and never reattaching it, at that point it will only give low resolution RGB.

If it sounds like I am getting on your case here, well I am, but only for your betterment. I know that you think you can't do this. I also know for a fact that you absolutely can.

If you were to use 15hz wouldn't it still tell you to switch off games that don't support VGA?

No. When you switch it to 15KHz RGB, you get 15KHz RGB. If a game does not support VGA that has no bearing on whether or not it supports 15KHz RGB. Some games support both 15KHz and 31KHz, some games support 15KHz and not 31, some support 31 and not 15. I don't have Vampire Chronicle but I spotted rockman's other thread where he mentioned that game supported neither. I think that's rare, and from the googling I have done there are a lot of inconsistent reports on this. In fact, the first and most involved discussion I found showed that it supported VGA and not 15KHz RGB, contrary to Rockman's findings.

I should have known that for every forum board there'd be atleast one smart aleck. If you were trying to help you could have done so without making such smug condescending remarks. Being conceited, flapping your gums about what I should know. News flash, not everyone here is familiar with adding/modifying components to devices. You're exaggerating the simplicity of the job, ofcourse it's simple for you because you're experienced at it. The average person would have no idea about this junk. Me personally I'm not interested in modding switch boxes because there are too many variables. I'm sure these "switch" parts you're talking about can be bought online or at an electronic store. I just don't want to have to go through the extra leg work, plus being inexperienced at soldering and all I don't want to chance ****ing up my box. It's more convieniant for me to A.) Have someone else do it. B.) Forget about it and focus my interests elsewhere. With the way things were going I was considering just forgetting about the whole thing. Since there's no easier way, honestly I'm having enough trouble getting certain apps to work in Windows 7 so I really don't need this crap right now.

Look, I understand what you're trying to do. But the way you went about it was completely arrogant and disrespectful. I'm already pissed off enough about my OS not taking these applications, having to return an item I bought online, and a family member being in trouble. I want to respect you the same way I do most other people on this forum because you came to my aid... but you're making it difficult for me when all you do is insult my posts.

Also, this is irrelevant but when I received word Vampire Chronicles was incompatible I did experiment with it. I couldn't come up with any viable results if others had better luck then fine. You spoke of conflicting reports so atleast I'm not the only one who encountered this problem. The way you put it you made it seem as though I experienced this problem on my own when that's clearly not the case. Proving it doesn't work isn't important to me. But if I get a working copy... I'll confirm it. just incase some people maybe wondering I do own a legit copy.

[Endymion]

I should have known that for every forum board there'd be atleast one smart aleck. If you were trying to help you could have done so without making such smug condescending remarks. Being conceited, flapping your gums about what I should know. News flash, not everyone here is familiar with adding/modifying components to devices.

Everybody has to start somewhere.

You're exaggerating the simplicity of the job, ofcourse it's simple for you because you're experienced at it.

I'm not exaggerating the simplicity of the job. It's simple to make an RGB cable. It's even simpler to make a switch. Doing this, you'll need to cut into the plastic of the case. Believe me when I say that doing that part is actually more difficult than any of the soldering involved here. (And even cutting the hole is easy!) I'm not what I consider an experienced modder. I really only mod for one reason: to get functionality. Once I get that I go back to what I'd rather do in the first place: play the games.

Look, I understand what you're trying to do. But the way you went about it was completely arrogant and disrespectful.

I'm exhalting you. You can do it! You haven't even tried. You've got all the help you need between here, sites like gamesx, and google, and nobody but you can troubleshoot your own equipment better than you can, because you have it there. Don't get discouraged. It really is no more complex than connect-the-dots. If your classic games and equipment are important to you isn't this something that you would want to learn to keep them usable over a long period of time? Getting started by installing a switch is the perfect way to start learning!

I want to respect you the same way I do most other people on this forum because you came to my aid... but you're making it difficult for me when all you do is insult my posts.

I've not insulted you or your posts. Take a good look at what it is you want to do, then take the torch. I'm telling you that you can do this. I'm telling you that you're the best person to do it. And I'm telling you that it will only be a stepping stone to greater things if you only put your foot forward.

[SGGG2]

Here's the mod http://forum.arcadeotaku.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=1870

[zakk]

There actually is a VGA box that has this as a 'hidden' feature; I don't remember the brand name but it's the large-ish one in a black case.

There's a switch on the side of it for switching between VGA and composite/svideo; the switch has "CD-R" next to it, and the switch is labeled PC on the left and TV on the right.

It's a three position switch, though. The middle is 15khz RGB.

[headlesshobbs]

Ok I have another question about this. Suppose I picked up a SCART to YUV transcoder, and I have a tv with component input, if I were to run it with a VGA to SCART adapter, will I still be able to draw native res RGB this way? I ask this because there's been some questions from others over how to get component video from dreamcast and I figured this is an easier way of doing it, plus I'm not so certain if YUV transcoders can handle 240p without blasting it up to 480i.

If this solution does work, suppose this solution can apply to PC games as well?

[Fudoh]

VGA is just a type of connection. If you have 15khz RGB signal, then a Scart RGB to YUV transcoder can work with it. You have to make sure though that you're using composite sync and not seperate H/V sync lines. This is likely a problem when using a modded DC VGA box. Transcoders don't change 240p to 480i.

[RGB32E]

I was curious as to what website sells such beastly lead connections for two of Dreamcast's most powerful signals or if it's even possible via solderless modifacation (In that case I would do it myself). I find the prospect of being able to switch between SCART straight off the Composite H and V sync and VGA intruiging. Basically I'm looking for a Sega DC VGA BOX with RGB SCART mod for switching between the two video inputs on the fly.

Ofcourse I'll have to get my Coosis box to recognize the RGB SCART signal too since the DC RGB leads I've used keep getting rejected. Consider this a project for potential future investment.

PM me with specifics. I can provide a solution for you.

[headlesshobbs]

VGA is just a type of connection. If you have 15khz RGB signal, then a Scart RGB to YUV transcoder can work with it. You have to make sure though that you're using composite sync and not seperate H/V sync lines. This is likely a problem when using a modded DC VGA box. Transcoders don't change 240p to 480i.

Interesting. I could imagine Last Chaos would be perfect by this method then if the sync were to work.

Request: I'm curious, if anyone runs this idea would you be willing to submit a pic? Also aside the point, I really need to see how Marvel vs Capcom 2 looks compared to VGA (slightly off subject lol)

[RGB32E]

Also aside the point, I really need to see how Marvel vs Capcom 2 looks compared to VGA (slightly off subject lol)

MvC2 should run at 31kHz, not 15kHz. Many arcade machines run MvC2 at 15kHz though (Naomi with interface can output both).... Interlace flicker (480i) always seems to be less of an issue with RGB - less artifacts to destract the eyes!

[headlesshobbs]

Also aside the point, I really need to see how Marvel vs Capcom 2 looks compared to VGA (slightly off subject lol)

MvC2 should run at 31kHz, not 15kHz. Many arcade machines run MvC2 at 15kHz though (Naomi with interface can output both).... Interlace flicker (480i) always seems to be less of an issue with RGB - less artifacts to destract the eyes!

I've seen the NAOMI running on it's 15kHz setting before and it's actually got some kind of "fake" low-res setting very much like the type of de-interlacer Fudah uses. I'm doubtful that the Dreamcast could even do such a thing (even though 3rd strike had an option for it), but it's way better then having HD pixels scraping out your eye sockets.

[Endymion]

I'll take some photos tonight.

Edit: Yeah, pretty well identical but for being 15KHz. I'm not sure if it's even worth posting comparisons or not, characters are still pixelated. I tried using the boot codes for 240p that work in Street Fighter 3 but it doesn't seem to have any effect.

[headlesshobbs]

Edit: Yeah, pretty well identical but for being 15KHz. I'm not sure if it's even worth posting comparisons or not, characters are still pixelated. I tried using the boot codes for 240p that work in Street Fighter 3 but it doesn't seem to have any effect.

Did the image turn out to be anything like this? http://scanlines.hazard-city.de/sf3_dc_ ... ed_181.jpg or was it all chunky like regular VGA?

Now I believe Start+L-trigger is the code you want for non-interlaced. If it's not reading through the VGA, then I think there's something more then just the 15kHz switch and figure you will need to use a scart cable directly if it's still accepted from there.

[Endymion]

Nothing at all like that.

Nothing.

At all.

Like that.

I can post the pics anyway if you are really interested. Everything remains blocky, and only with the characters. As with before the backgrounds are perfect and clear. In fact, the whole image is just a little less distinct for being interlaced instead of progressive, so even though things are ultra defined in VGA with the chunkiness, it still looks better via that mode. Because the background images are perfect in both modes it should be obvious that the way this game renders the animated figures is the issue here. They were just done at a lower resolution than the rest of the screen with a mind that for the televisions everyone was using it would never matter. This doesn't seem like something that adding scanlines to would fix properly either.

I tried the boot codes that work for Street Fighter 3 multiple times. They do not work in this game. I repeat, they do not work in this game. The same codes gave absolutely no effect, whereas in Street Fighter 3 the difference is very noticeable, so as far as I can tell, there is no 240p coming from MVC2 by way of the Dreamcast itself. To be more clear:

Now I believe Start+L-trigger is the code you want for non-interlaced. If it's not reading through the VGA, then I think there's something more then just the 15kHz switch and figure you will need to use a scart cable directly if it's still accepted from there.

First, it's not Start+L-trigger. It's Start+L, this is supposed to activate 240p. But it just doesn't work in this game. Neither does holding Start+L-trigger for that matter. My VGA Box is modded with a switch. When you flip it you are getting the same exact signal that you would from SCART, so there is no sense in testing this with SCART after this anyway. Besides, if you worked with SCART then you would have to swap cables or go through the pain in the ass of making a switch for both signals. Isn't it better to just use the VGA Box and instantly have both?

[headlesshobbs]

It certainly would have been better but unfortunately, nobody who manufactures VGA devices ever considered support for both. Anyway I appreciate you for trying to check this.

I just find this strange, VGA -AND- scart not working for 240p, yet somehow there's games that run it through s-video... We may have to go back on what was said earlier on other games which do support the format cause someone here managed to get Bangi-O running on a cab already.

[Fudoh]

cause someone here managed to get Bangi-O running on a cab already

Bangai-oh runs in 240p through 15khz RGB Scart. No VGA support on the other hand.

It's really hit and miss with many of the original low-res games. There's hardly any good reason why certain games don't support certain signals. While it 31khz VGA costs more processing power on 3D Games (double the resolution per field/frame), it's just bollocks that a game such as Gigawing (japanese version) runs through S-Video, runs through VGA, but does not run through RGB Scart.

SF3 has been converted very nicely by Capcom. Standard 480p support via VGA, standard 480i support through RGB Scart and even low-res 240p by cheatcode. Unfortunately not all publishers had so much sympathy with us gamers.

[RGB32E]

Both Bangai-o and 3rd Strike in 240p mode both look excellent when fed via RGB to an XRGB-3 in B0 at 1080p.

However, I don't think the Dreamcast outputs 384x224 resolution for 3rd Strike (3S) in 240p... so not quite arcade perfect - but close!

[Endymion]

It certainly would have been better but unfortunately, nobody who manufactures VGA devices ever considered support for both. Anyway I appreciate you for trying to check this.

Why does that matter when all you need to do is add the switch?

I just find this strange, VGA -AND- scart not working for 240p,

The reason that it does not work in MVC2 is this: MVC2 was not coded to support it. They used low resolution for the characters, and not on everything else (the backgrounds). So adding 240p would not have fixed the problem in an ideal way to start with.

yet somehow there's games that run it through s-video...

When I was looking at this last night, just for the shit'n giggle of it I plugged up the S-Video as well. It only looked marginally passable for the characters, and the codes did not work either. So I can only gather that, again, you are speaking of Street Fighter 3's support for noninterlaced fields--even if not 240p, that's what it does. You don't need to have any special signal type to do a noninterlaced broadcast, and indeed, Street Fighter 3 will do this on S-Video as well.

We may have to go back on what was said earlier on other games which do support the format cause someone here managed to get Bangi-O running on a cab already.

Bangai-Oh works perfectly in 240p. I've played it that way many times. Just trip the switch to 15KHz and there it is. You just need to remember that MVC2 was a special case as the characters were done in low res... there's really nothing we can do about that. The scanline outputs that you could add from various boxes would of course have some effect, but I'd reckon it would still look weirder than you would want it... it's probably more worth your time to just use another version of the game or emulate it if it bothers you much.

[Ex-Cyber]

There's hardly any good reason why certain games don't support certain signals. While it 31khz VGA costs more processing power on 3D Games (double the resolution per field/frame), it's just bollocks that a game such as Gigawing (japanese version) runs through S-Video, runs through VGA, but does not run through RGB Scart.

IIRC there's even a linedoubler function in the DC's RAMDAC, so you don't even need to feed it a 640x480 framebuffer if that would screw up your rendering time or your VRAM management. I suppose that there might be some catch/limitation to using it, but my guess would be that for most games that don't support VGA, the developers just didn't think it was worth the trouble of coding+testing it.

[Fudoh]

but my guess would be that for most games that don't support VGA, the developers just didn't think it was worth the trouble of coding+testing it.

likely, but the Capcom coders responsible for going from "everything works" SFIII to "no RGB, nor VGA" Vampire Chronicles should be shot on the spot!

[PC Engine Fan X!]

cause someone here managed to get Bangi-O running on a cab already

Bangai-oh runs in 240p through 15khz RGB Scart. No VGA support on the other hand.

It's really hit and miss with many of the original low-res games. There's hardly any good reason why certain games don't support certain signals. While it 31khz VGA costs more processing power on 3D Games (double the resolution per field/frame), it's just bollocks that a game such as Gigawing (japanese version) runs through S-Video, runs through VGA, but does not run through RGB Scart.

SF3 has been converted very nicely by Capcom. Standard 480p support via VGA, standard 480i support through RGB Scart and even low-res 240p by cheatcode. Unfortunately not all publishers had so much sympathy with us gamers.

Both U.S. versions of DC Gigawing & DC gigawing 2 do have support for both JPN RGB & Euro Scart output. The U.S. region DC GW-2 port looks stunning using viletim's Scart to Jamma adapter on a true low-res arcade 15kHz monitor setup with either Scart cable setup (even though it's being displayed in 480i format at best).

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[Fudoh]

Not that it helps anyone, but today I had my DC up and running and Vampire Chronicle (the unpatched original) runs absolutely fine through VGA. Just wanted to clarify this once and for all... Still silly that it doesn't support RGB, but at least that's kinda common among japanese releases.

[GaijinPunch]

RGB Hospice used to make and sell a device.
The only downside is you had to use his VGA cable (which I didn't buy before he quit selling products).

[akumajo]

Reviving this topic

Anyone is selling a modded VGA Box for 15/31KHz output or any other alternative ?