Sin & Punishment 2

[linko9]

That's actually the pattern I was talking about; I guess I mis-remembered which pattern was the last in the room. Anyway, the pattern you (and I) are talking about looks like this, right?

o............ooo
.........x........o
...................
..................o
..................o

Each o is a laser. I shoot the two bottom ones, and then I usually stay off to the right and take out the four in the top right with the sword, but if you position yourself perfectly, about where that x is, you should be able to take out all five of the top lasers with your sword. I usually don't try, because if you're a little bit to the left of where you should be, you'll get hit by the right-most laser.

[guigui]

Ok, you and I are talking about the same pattern now ! I have the same trouble than you with it. Maybe shooting the diagonally-opposed ones (numbered 1 and 2), placing yourself a the X and getting rid of the rest with the sword is easier :

2..............sss
..................s
..............X....
..................s
..................1

[mumu]

It seems I will never know why this in the OT forum. Moving it into the main forum should be top priority! It might even add another sale or two

[Skykid]

It seems I will never know why this in the OT forum. Moving it into the main forum should be top priority! It might even add another sale or two

Because technically it's more a run and gun than a traditional shmup.

[Ebbo]

I finally managed to 1CC this beast on Normal with Isa. Final score 363 millions. I'm pretty satisfied although there is a lot room for improvement, especially at Stage 7 - the boss rush always tears me apart. Maybe I'll start practicing with Achi too...

They simply won't make games like this nowadays...

[Skykid]

I finally managed to 1CC this beast on Normal with Isa. Final score 363 millions. I'm pretty satisfied although there is a lot room for improvement, especially at Stage 7 - the boss rush always tears me apart. Maybe I'll start practicing with Achi too...

They simply won't make games like this nowadays...

Massive props, massive jealousy. Well done.

[mumu]

Because technically it's more a run and gun than a traditional shmup.

I really doubt fans of the genre can afford to discuss technicalities which so few games being released now

[Zeether]

So should I get this? From what the posters here say the US version seems to be much more challenging and some of the videos I've seen of it confirm it...although one video had some guy failing to realize not all the enemy shots could be deflected by the sword and he kept losing health.

Did they put life up items in the game? The original game had some but they were few and far between.

[Ebbo]

So should I get this?

Yes.

From what the posters here say the US version seems to be much more challenging and some of the videos I've seen of it confirm it...although one video had some guy failing to realize not all the enemy shots could be deflected by the sword and he kept losing health.

From what I've gathered, US and PAL versions have some slight chances in levels and enemy placements but overall the challenge is equivalent to japanese version - expect for one boss fight during one of the later levels. It's still doable, just requires a different strategy.

Did they put life up items in the game? The original game had some but they were few and far between.

All levels have life kits, mostly you'll get one after boss fight.

[Zeether]

Cool. I may pick it up when I can.

[louisg]

Anyone have any tips for the st3 boss? I try to swing the sword when she glows, but sometimes it connects and sometimes it doesn't.. it takes a while to swing, so is there a way to time it consistently or is it supposed to be kind of random?

[Ebbo]

I prefer aggressive play style against her. Just fly next to her when she is about to attack with her sword and counter the attack with your own. Try also juggling her against the energywall since that will stun her and give you chance for easy extra hits. Eventually she will push you away to gain some distance. When she starts using her projectiles stay away from her and keep shooting and dodging. When she shifts back using her melee attacks just keep attacking aggresively and she will go down pretty easily.

[Puddleglum]

Hi all, I just joined the forum here so I could post in this thread. This seems to be the only place there's any interesting discussion going on about S&P2. The game is really excellent! I wanted to say thanks to MMM and others who have provided helpful pointers on getting high scores. I haven't cracked the top page on any of the international boards, but I have got some scores I'm happy with and on easy I'm in the top page on stages 0 and 1 on the "local" leaderboard with handle PUDLGLUM. (Scores are 18.2 K and 27.8 K respectively)

Anybody know how the local, regional, and international divisions are done? I can't tell if "local" means some local area in the US, or ALL of the US. For regional there is no clue what it means, maybe North America? (the overall list of scores and users looks very similar local for me) International is I assume all countries, but does it include players on the Japanese version of the game? Or only players using the same build/version of the game? (Reading this thread, it sounds like Japan got one version, and the rest of the world got a slightly different version, but with changes that affect scoring potential).

Either way, the leaderboards are great, I love the motivation to push for higher scores. I've already logged 17 hours on the game and I haven't gone past level 4 yet, mostly just playing 0 and 1 for high scores. I swear if Link's Crossbow Training had leaderboards who knows how much I would have played that game, I've got 31 hours on it as it is.

Well, that's all I got, great game, great thread, thanks all!

p.s. LOVE the Snapper Keeper boss!

[Skykid]

I finally got over my stubborn goal of on holding out for a 1cc when I realised that the length of the game and the complexity of its content would mean holing myself up and not going out for a month and living on a diet of S&P2 and nothing else.

As that's not a real option in my adult life I decided to play the 'action adventure' way and battle through to the end with retries.

My ego isn't bruised, it was a tough chestnut to crack and a fantastic afternoon spent cracking it. It is a stupendously brilliant game from start to finish and probably my favourite Treasure game ever alongside Gradius V.

S&P2 is pure modern gaming love, done 100% the right way.

[guigui]

Hi all, I just joined the forum here so I could post in this thread. This seems to be the only place there's any interesting discussion going on about S&P2. The game is really excellent! I wanted to say thanks to MMM and others who have provided helpful pointers on getting high scores. I haven't cracked the top page on any of the international boards, but I have got some scores I'm happy with and on easy I'm in the top page on stages 0 and 1 on the "local" leaderboard with handle PUDLGLUM. (Scores are 18.2 K and 27.8 K respectively)

Hey Puddleglum, welcome to the forum and in the SP2 leaderboard. Those are nice starting scores you have here on easy setting, keep going.

Anybody know how the local, regional, and international divisions are done? I can't tell if "local" means some local area in the US, or ALL of the US. For regional there is no clue what it means, maybe North America? (the overall list of scores and users looks very similar local for me) International is I assume all countries, but does it include players on the Japanese version of the game? Or only players using the same build/version of the game? (Reading this thread, it sounds like Japan got one version, and the rest of the world got a slightly different version, but with changes that affect scoring potential).

I dont know about "local" or "Regional" if you live in the US. Obviously, "Europe & America" means you get to see the score of all of us that play the "western" version of the game, ie not the japanese version that came out at on october 2009. This jap version has a separate leaderboard only available through it (as far as I know, MMM holds the first place with ISA/NORMAL with a score over 550 millions, woooooh !)

I love Snapper/Tortoise Keeper too, there are so many ways to take him down ! My favourite boss is Armon Ritter, maybe third form, I love how it reminds me of Ecco : The Tides of Times bonus stages

[Puddleglum]

Hey Puddleglum, welcome to the forum and in the SP2 leaderboard. Those are nice starting scores you have here on easy setting, keep going.

Thanks! After some more work I've cracked the top 8 international on Easy and Hard for Stage 0.

Stage 1 really has me stumped though. On normal my high score I think is like ~ 29.7 million, which is something like 15th place. A perfect run based on how I'm playing the leve now could maybe get me to ~31 million. But I see 35, 37, 40 million, no idea where those points are coming from. I also see kill counts of nearly 800, whereas I am ending around 600, it makes me think there is some boss milking opportunity I am missing, because I don't feel like I'm leaving that many kills on the table through the normal portions of the level. I usually get only 8-9 of the medals but that's not a major concern b/c at most that's a difference of .6 million.

At the moment I'm milking the first airship, killing as many soldiers as possible, knocking the bombs into he flying tadpoles, and getting the "at the buzzer bonus". The rest of the bosses I'm more or less killing quickly, as the additional kills on the Phoenix Keeper and the guy that rides the truck seemed to come only at a trickle and not be worth all the time bonus you give up. Maybe I'm missing something there though. They guy before the Snapper Keeper I just kill as quickly as possible.

The Snapper Keeper itself, I am knocking down with his spikes, then knocking down with the falling bombs, shooting while he breaths fire, then after deflecting each swipe and his bite a charge shot will finish him off. I've been meaning to do the math on that though, I'm basically keeping him alive to get that last medal and the coins for countering him, but I'm suspicious that even there it might not be worth burning the clock time, since if done right I can have him ready to go down early in the firebreathing sequence. On a good run I will get to him with ~19.5 million and end with ~29 million including all the final bonuses.

If anyone has advice I'd love to hear it!

[linko9]

Make sure you watch those NicoNico videos that MrMonkeyMan posted. Hard mode, but pretty much the same strategies apply for normal.

[Puddleglum]

Make sure you watch those NicoNico videos that MrMonkeyMan posted. Hard mode, but pretty much the same strategies apply for normal.

Ha! I told myself I wouldn't watch them until I was stumped on how to push my score higher, and then I forgot about them completely. Thanks for the reminder. Also, wow, another name I recognize from the leaderboards, this place is quite the S&P2 hang out. (I assume you're LINK09)

EDIT: Had a look at the Stage 1 video. Didn't look super different from what I was doing, other than the 1st section were I was really slacking, and that big pile of boxes you can knock missles into after the 1st boss, never noticed those. I'm still not sure how 40 mil is possible on normal, the guy was getting a ton of his points from reflecting the additional missles fired by the soldires on hard, who only fire 1 missile each on normal. Anyways, we'll see if I can't at least break 30 mil tonight.

[guigui]

I also just cant score more 29 millions on stage 1. I did pretty much gave up on that one and focused on the whole run. Got 330 millions the ther day which gave me quite a good place for a moment...

[Puddleglum]

Well I finally topped 34 mil on Stage 1 Normal, which caused me to break out in song and dance in the living room, and predictably elicited strange looks from the wife. Also just noticed the weird trick to get the missile-launching soldiers to shoot more than one missile. I had originally assumed it was just a difference between Normal and Hard in the video.

[MrMonkeyMan]

That extra missile trick is really hard to pull off. The end of the stage 0 video I posted a while back is completely nuts. I pretty much gave up on the trick except for a few spots in stage 1 where you have plenty of time to aim the first missile after shooting the guy.

It's extra annoying when you accidentally score a head shot and kill the guy even though you used the lock shot.

[Ebbo]

Glad to hear I'm not the only one having hard time with that missile trick. Fortunately the payoff isn't that huge in the end when you're going for the overall score so I usually just ignore it.

Made a new personal record today: 379 millions. However, I died during the Deco fistfight once again. I could have easily got anything between 410-430 millions if I only had reached the stage 7...

[guigui]

Damned, there IS a missile shot trick. When will this game stop ?

[Puddleglum]

MrMonkeyMan & others who can do the "extra missle" trick - do you have the melee mapped to a separate button such as "-"? I find it's hard to shoot the soldiers without killing them, since with the default controls you can't just tap B for a quick shot. For fun I tried mapping melee to "-" but it was completely disorienting, somehow changing one button completely threw off my muscle memory and instincts in the game, and I couldn't play at all.

[MrMonkeyMan]

I have melee set to C and jump moved to the dpad. It makes it much easier to hit projectiles, and control the number of bullets I fire at once. The remote doesn't shake when you're tapping C either so it doesn't screw with your aim. I highly recommend you make the switch.

[Octopod]

Just picked up this game today and played two credits on easy. Got killed by the sword girl both times. Great game, I already like it better than the first, and that's saying something. Unfortunately it is the first game I've ever played where it feels like being left handed is a disadvantage; I'll either have to suck it up and deal with my less than optimal aiming, or learn to use the analog stick in my right hand, which seems impossible to me (I tried this for a while in Metroid Prime 3, but could never get the hang of it). The game also gave my right hand terrible cramps, which I'll hopefully adjust to (strangely no other Wii game has done this to me).

I am having these exact same problems.

[linko9]

Don't worry, I got used to it pretty soon. I still can't move the reticule back and forth as fast as I'd like, but I definitely adjusted to it after a while.

[Ebbo]

Now here is a shameless plug/bump if there ever was one:

Stage 1 (Isa/Normal)
Score: 37,672,572

Pretty decent run. If you're interested to see more in the future, I subtly suggest subscribing just so that I don't have to go gravedigging everytime for this thread

[Lance Boyle]

Some thoughts having played it a couple hours:

1. Sticking to the one-credit rule feels ridiculous on a game THIS LONG, and on top of that you have to replay the (very bland) tutorial level every. single. run.

2. The scoring system is a whole bunch of numbers, gauges, and bars which essentially add up to "shoot as much as possible, as fast as possible, without getting hit". UI overkill.

3. I prefer S&P64's menu MUCH MUCH more, and I like how in THAT game they devised a clever hologram tutorial level that you didn't have to replay every single time if you were sticking to the one-credit rule.

4. I liked being confined to the ground in S&P 1 because jumping over machine-gun spray and the various other on-rails platforming challenges provide a much more tactile challenge than "press evade button in this direction, press evade button in that direction". I've only gotten to near the end of Stage 2, so I'm not sure if that changes.

5. Stages feel extremely slow compared to S&P1 - there are many parts where there is little threat and it feels like a colossal shooting gallery.

6. The water tunnel level with the same soldiers sliding in in the same formation wave after wave after wave kinda sucks.

7. This game strains my right arm holding the Wiimote steady in midair for prolonged amounts of time.

8. This game takes itself far too seriously and the cutscenes are not nearly as hilarious as S&P64; they are, however, just as bad.

i think that's about all for now. I just don't get any kind of adrenaline rush in a game where the primary dodging function is, literally, an "evade" button as opposed to manually moving my character the fuck out of the way. I have no idea where the hitbox is either, and the 3D depth of field makes it hard to telegraph attacks coming at you.

[Rob]

1. Sticking to the one-credit rule feels ridiculous on a game THIS LONG,

Probably because it is ridiculous.