really bad shmups

Tony Gradius · Post by **Tony Gradius** » Thu Mar 03, 2005 7:38 pm

Herr Schatten wrote: Is it true that you have to solve a short text adventure after beating all the shmup levels?

Never played Sarcophaser seriously, so I can`t tell you, sorry. Just liked to see a game in the C64 "Nemesis/Gradius" vein for the Amiga in those days, when arcadepower at home was still a dream and I really liked the typical Soundtracker beat of the title melody.

gameoverDude · Post by **gameoverDude** » Fri Mar 04, 2005 6:19 am

Blue Lander wrote:I thought the Neo Geo version was pretty good. I hear the Playstation port is horrid, but I don't know why. I've never played it.

There's also ports to the Genesis, X68000, and FM Towns. I have no idea if any of those are okay or not.

The PS port is atrocious due to lowered frame rates (wait til you reach the 3rd boss and this makes it unplayable). To rub salt in the wounds, Visual Concepts took out the original music- I really missed the Neo-Geo Stage 2 BGM! Those bastards.

umi · Post by **umi** » Fri Mar 04, 2005 9:38 am

Enough Insector-X-bashing already :( Sure, the genesis sprites were changed from the jap ones, but the game still kicked ass, and the new sprites weren't all that bad, just a lot less... playful. I had a ball with my megadrive copy. I had one chance to beat that game, and that's when I made it up to the last boss. However, I didn't notice his big-ass laser warning signs and got wiped out... all the signs were there, but I didn't notice. Hee hee. Then I couldn't make it back to him with my remaining lives, and haven't played it since. As an aside, I thought the bosses were total push-overs in that game, easy patterns to dodge, the levels were more of a challenge. Not a terribly difficult game though.

theevilfunkster · Post by **theevilfunkster** » Fri Mar 04, 2005 12:02 pm

no, i just played insector-x and it is indeed very crap, sorry

Fost · Post by **Fost** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 1:54 pm

Neon wrote:http://www.classicgaming.com/shmups/rev ... index.html

terrible, awful, bad, laughable, think I'd rather have goatse as my wallpaper than play this crap again.

Sigh, we'll have to try harder next time

I have to admit though, I was quite surprised by the shmups.com review myself, we pretty much always expected Starscape would not appeal to hardcore shmuppers, since it isn't in any way a hardcore shmup.

Anyway, for my money, I would have to say the original Iridion. I know a lot of people defend it for being one of the few gba shmups, and I know it can be picked up for next to nothing, but I have to list it as one of the few games that I've ever played that provided zero enjoyment whatsoever.

jp · Post by jp » Sat Mar 05, 2005 2:26 pm

Thunder Force wrote: I haven't seen anyone defend Planet Joker yet though!

Because if someone did I would show up at their house and MAKE THEM 1CC it. Because if someone has any form of like for that game at all, it will fly straight out the window once they see the last 2 levels and encounter the impossible final boss (seriously, you guys bitch about isometric views and Raystorm's view... until you see the camera during the final boss of Planet Joker, you can't say SHIT about bad camera angles in shmups!

)

Neon · Post by **Neon** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 6:46 am

Sigh, we'll have to try harder next time Wink

I have to admit though, I was quite surprised by the shmups.com review myself, we pretty much always expected Starscape would not appeal to hardcore shmuppers, since it isn't in any way a hardcore shmup.

The problem with your game is not so much that it's crap as that the shmups.com reviewer classified it as a shmup. I'd say it's more of an action-rpg really, all the 'collect this' made me frustrated, I just quit playing. It's certainly well made for a homebrew game, but all the veritable begging to buy it on your website turned me off as well...like the Trizeal site says, "The quality of his work should be told by his hand, not his mouth."

Thunder Force · Post by **Thunder Force** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 8:59 am

Neon wrote:"The quality of his work should be told by his hand, not his mouth."

When you are this successful with your game, you are allowed to gloat.

Welcome to the forum BTW, Fost!

Nice to see another respected developer taking part in discussions here. Did you really work on N20: Nitrous Oxide?

Fost · Post by **Fost** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 10:41 am

Just to respond to Neon - In an odd way, I agree with you (although the goatse comment was a bit harsh

) I did hang around on the shmups forum of old, but I never even attempted to mention Starscape - not even in an 'announcement' type post. Firstly, I don't like to blatantly bang our drum, especially at a forum that has given me so much, but also because I never saw Starscape as a hardcore shmup that people here might be interested in. Anyway - I'm just saying, I understand your point of view, and actually quite enjoy criticism - so you are cool by me. Not sure what you mean by'veritable begging' though - we have buy buttons on the website and in the game - we are at the end of the day, attempting to make money...

The cool thing (for us) about Starscape, was that there were only a couple of reviews that didn't totally love it. Out of those, one was essentially a hardcore shmup player, who said the game would be been fantastic if we removed all the ship building/story/navigation/research elements from the game. If you suggested this on our forum, people would go crazy!

The shmups.com review (I think it was Justin who did it?) really surprised me that it was so positive (for this site). I thought it was well written though - it did point out many hardcore shmuppers might not like it.

Thunder Force wrote:Welcome to the forum BTW, Fost!

Thanks - I was on the old forum a bit - although I was more of a lurker - I never seem to have much useful information here that others would not be far better qualified to respond to.

Thunder Force wrote:Did you really work on N20: Nitrous Oxide?

Yeah - it was the second game I ever worked on, although I can't take much credit for it if it was any good - Tony Crowther was the only programmer working on the actual game mechanics - it was essentially his pet project born out of a rivalry with Jeff Minter to create the ultimate Tempest game. A fantastic lead artist called Ira Hill did much of the artwork, and I did most of the weapon effects and about 75% of the tunnels then a handful of enemies. I think the Crystal Method Soundtrack was the best part of it.

Odd thing was - everyone involved with it's creation suffered from nightmares where they were trapped in an endless tunnel and couldn't get out

Anyway, I seem to have hijacked this thread... sorry

Thunder Force · Post by **Thunder Force** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 1:52 pm

Fost wrote:
Thunder Force wrote:Did you really work on N20: Nitrous Oxide?
Yeah - it was the second game I ever worked on, although I can't take much credit for it if it was any good - Tony Crowther was the only programmer working on the actual game mechanics - it was essentially his pet project born out of a rivalry with Jeff Minter to create the ultimate Tempest game. A fantastic lead artist called Ira Hill did much of the artwork, and I did most of the weapon effects and about 75% of the tunnels then a handful of enemies. I think the Crystal Method Soundtrack was the best part of it.

I enjoy that shooter so much I bought and own 2 copies of it. (no joke)

Fost wrote:Odd thing was - everyone involved with it's creation suffered from nightmares where they were trapped in an endless tunnel and couldn't get out

Now I'm afraid to sleep tonight.

hometoast · Post by **hometoast** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 3:18 pm

Deep Blue for TG-16. There might be worse out there... but wasting money on something this crapy sticks with you for a long time.

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 6:17 pm

i suck with the on-topic. looked into N20:

i want to try it.

Fost · Post by **Fost** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 6:28 pm

Anytime I ever talked to anyone about N2O, they always told me they had played it whilst on E and it was an amazing experience.

Our US publishers wanted to change the name, because (apperently) Nitrous Oxide is used as a recreational drug in the States.

Then they told us they wanted to change the little coins you pick up into white discs with the letter 'E' on them - for e-commerce.

Marc · Post by **Marc** » Sat Mar 12, 2005 10:05 am

Delta on C64. Seriously, this got good reviews at the time, and I even sat down and 1CC'd the thing.... can't imagine how or why now, it's so slow, cheap and damn sucky that it makes my blood boil. Not aged well at all.

There's an R-Type clone called Rezon on Mame that's pretty rank.

And the constant flood of SEUCK games on C64, most of which played exactly the same.

Also Last Duel (I think?), the coin-op with the ship and car like an overhead Silkworm. SUCK.

My vote would go to Heavy Unit though. Bear in mind I have only played the PCE version, but IMO this is the sort badly-dated, nigh on unplayable pap that game the over-saturated shooter genre a bad name during the late '80's/early '90's. Utter bilge. And Transbot on SMS sucked balls as well.

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Sat Mar 12, 2005 7:32 pm

hahaha look at the logo for Rezon:

Skyline · Post by **Skyline** » Sat Mar 12, 2005 11:29 pm

Most of the shmups churned out by Seta and Dooyong sucked ass, including Arbalester. People who have said that Trizeal was boring should play that sack of shit.

MadSteelDarkness · Post by **MadSteelDarkness** » Sun Mar 13, 2005 5:58 am

Fost wrote:Anytime I ever talked to anyone about N2O, they always told me they had played it whilst on E and it was an amazing experience.

Our US publishers wanted to change the name, because (apperently) Nitrous Oxide is used as a recreational drug in the States.

Then they told us they wanted to change the little coins you pick up into white discs with the letter 'E' on them - for e-commerce.

N2O is one of my faves. I candy flipped whilst playing that one a time or three way back when. I'm a bit too old for that type of thing these days. Ah, well...

Damn, but do I miss the nineties!

Ahhh....Good times.

But back on topic: Rock On for the PCE. Pheeuw...stinky!

worm · Post by **worm** » Sun Mar 13, 2005 7:37 am

I'm trusting no one posted this, if so sorry.

There are no bad SHMUPS just SHMUPS you're bad at. ^__________^

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:11 pm

just got my copy of Curse. it's not fantastic or anything, but i like it. my main problems with it are power ups are tightly packed if you autofire, since some of the weapons are useless, this creates problems. also, things get hard to see (enemies, bullets, whatever).

i can only get to stage 3, but i'm still gonna play through it to see the last boss.

oh and Axelay is awful, but not the worst. i am also amazed at how much worse Thunder Spirits is than Thunderforce III.

overdrive · Post by **overdrive** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:40 pm

A ton of bad ones were made during those glory days of the TG-16, Genesis and SNES, as well as back on the NES, Master System, etc.

For a few I'm familiar with that have been mentioned and a couple of others.....

1. Alpha Mission (NES) — yeah, it's a port, but it's just horrible. Slow, ugly, looping.....I've never been able to find anything nice about this one.

2. BioMetal (SNES) — not good, but not really fodder for a list like this. It was really pretty in areas and with the shield-thingie you had to strategically recharge, you had to think a little.

3. Heavy Unit and Saint Dragon (TG-16) AND Insector X (Gen) — All had one thing in common. I thought I'd like the game after first stages that showed a fair amount of atmosphere and creativity. Then, the rest of all three were pure crap that made me miserable.

4. Toilet Kids (TG-16) — What a whacked out game.....kinda in the so bad, it's cool class.

5. XDR (Gen) — another rancid one. Just not much to like about it....

I know there's a couple more I'm thinking up, but they just aren't popping into my mind right now....

adam76 · Post by **adam76** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:05 pm

captain ahar wrote: i am also amazed at how much worse Thunder Spirits is than Thunderforce III.

Totally agree! I remember playing the arcade of Thunderforce AC when at the time, Thunderforce 3 was my fave game ever-i was distraught! It was so long ago i can't remember what it was exactly that upset me so, although i seem to recall that the sound wasn't much cop!

Specineff · Post by **Specineff** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:41 pm

I know it's not a shmup, but last night I fired MAME up and loaded Dogosouken/Victory Road. I can't believe SNK made an effort to make this such a sucky game. Little rocks block your path until you blast them one by one, IMPOSSIBLE bosses after the worm and the ugly face from hell ("Yeah, let's make a boss that follows you when you retreat to the bottom of the screen, and goes up when you try to charge! American man yank hair out of skull! Devious plan much fulfillment of satisfaction bring!"), and limited firepower that can't reach longer than a spat piece of snot. All the while the legions of enemies intent on killing you and raping your corpse.

Ralf and Clark don't deserve such treatment after the great Ikari Warriors. (Dogosouken is the second in the series)

overdrive · Post by **overdrive** » Sat Apr 02, 2005 6:06 am

I'm playing Curse (Gen) right now and while it's nothing spectacular, I wouldn't put it in the "worst ever" category. It's not in the XDR/Insector X/Heavy Unit category, at least.

To me, it's just another meh shooter that glutted the scene back in those days to help ensure 2-D shooters would eventually go out of style. Not the best of it's time, but not the worst. A hair below mediocre, in all likelihood.

IlMrm · Post by **IlMrm** » Sat Apr 02, 2005 7:33 am

Not a shmup, but Smash TV is crazy.

MovingTarget · Post by **MovingTarget** » Sat Apr 02, 2005 11:58 am

how far can ou get with one credit? I cant even complete the first level

Its some propa fun though

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Sat Apr 02, 2005 6:17 pm

just curious. i see lot's of people labeling Curse as an R-type clone. why? it doesn't feel remotely like that to me.

Stormwatch · Post by **Stormwatch** » Sat Apr 02, 2005 6:19 pm

IlMrm wrote:Not a shmup, but Smash TV is crazy.

And it's a GREAT game.

MovingTarget · Post by **MovingTarget** » Sat Apr 02, 2005 6:22 pm

On The midway arcade treasures disc for the ps2, one of the creators said he was able to 1cc the entire game. How is that possible!!!

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Sat Apr 02, 2005 6:25 pm

Stormwatch wrote:
IlMrm wrote:Not a shmup, but Smash TV is crazy.
And it's a GREAT game.

frickin is. its the only reason i hold onto my Midway collection (too bad the control sucks compared to the real thing).

CL@$$!C · Post by **CL@$$!C** » Sun Apr 03, 2005 1:47 am

Star Soldier for the N64 is pretty damn shitty.

Whoever said to pick it for the hell of playing a shmup on N64 is right though. I can honestly say it's the best shmup i ever played on the N64 (and the worst, and the only

).

I would call it bad, but not god awful. I really oughta go play it, as it's been so long...