So why exactly does Cave not want to port anymore?

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 9:56 am

sfried wrote: It's supports progressive scan. And there are ways to mod a progressive scan cable and turn it into a RGB cable just as some people have done on the GameCube.

It's not a 240p signal though.

Twiddle · Post by **Twiddle** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:54 am

Wii does not support NTSC interlaced component output. I have no idea why, considering the GC supported interlaced component output.

Ceph · Post by **Ceph** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:09 pm

What, NTSC Wiis don't faeture RGB? WTF, Nintendo.

That's even more stupid than Sony not including the Emotion Engine chip in Euro-PS3s.

So since PAL Wiis can display both 50 and 60hz, the ideal way would be to wait until some kind of import adapter is developed and then get a PAL Wii.

Kron · Post by **Kron** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:14 pm

The PAL Wii typically supports 50hz and 60hz for the main disc based software but from what I've seen from my friends PAL Wii's Virtual Console titles its all limited to 50hz only.

Ceph · Post by **Ceph** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:18 pm

No 60hz for VC games? Yet another stupid decision by Nintendo. But who needs Virtual Console when you can play the games on their original hardware?

Really, I couldn't care less for VC; if and when I buy a Wii I'll most definitely never spend a single cent on VC games.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:56 pm

It's a complete fuck job. You can get Wii games in 60hz RGB, but looks like VC is either 60hz S-Video interlaced, 480p, or 50hz RGB in the PAL regions. It's like they got together and said, "Okay... how can we REALLY fuck this shit up?"

Nintendo get's my new, patented "take another hit, dude" picture that I simply found on a google search.

Gorecki · Post by **Gorecki** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:56 pm

Well there's not really a whole lot you can do with a Wii if you ignore the VC. Even Wii Sports got old fast.

angrycoder · Post by **angrycoder** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 1:26 pm

I really don't think its any kind of elitist attitude on Cave's part that they are not eager to port their games. Its not like doing a port is interesting work for their developers. I mean you are basically just trying to redo something you've already done in a different way with a whole new set of problems.

Given the choice between redoing a project they already worked on, or doing something brand new, I can guarantee you 99% percent of developers would choose to work on something new.

If there were bundles of money in it for Cave, that would be a compelling reason for them to do a port as well. Most likely, they will make just as much money by creating a new PCB game rather than doing a port. If that wasn't the case, we would be seeing more ports from them.

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 5:21 pm

TWE wrote:
dave4shmups wrote: Only if you happen to own a JP-Wii, otherwise you're better off just buying the oldschool hardware. You can get a PC Engine on www.japangamestock.com for a ridiculously low price. SNK games are coming to the Wii VC in the US, but most of it will probably their VS brawlers. It still ticks me off that Nintendo saw fit to region lock the VC.
Japanese Wiis are actually cheaper than the USA ones on ebay. You can get a brand new JP Wii for less than $250 usually. And then you get to enjoy all the JP VC games as well (lots of old school shmups).

That's what I'm going to buy anyway. I have no use for a US Wii.

Wow, I would've thought it would be more expensive, like the JP-PS2! I don't have much use for the US Wii either, except for a few games like the upcoming Dragon Quest Swords. (It would be nice if it was region-free like the PS3, though) AFIK, you can download MSX ANDMSX2 games on the JP-Wii, although I don't know if there's any Compile stuff on there yet.

Danny · Post by **Danny** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 8:22 pm

GaijinPunch wrote:
We're talking out of our behinds?

Read the post about not being able to sell old ass games on current hardware. It is the truth. The only way the masses would buy such games in numbers is through something like Xbox Live Arcade...

Eh? is'nt Xbox LIVE! the same thing as the downloadable service on the PS3? (well not quite but you know what I mean. It's digital distribution and all that) Seriously companies have been releasing there older games on the PS3's PSX download service for a fraction of the price of what they were orginaly released for in the shops of Japan. For expample R-Type Delta can be brought for at 525 yen, that's US$4.33 and you are honestly telling me that would not sale in Japan because it's old?

People don't mind old PSX games being aviable for download as long as it's priced reasonably and CAVE would make money on it as they would just technicaly releasing the game again in Japan and if they did price it like R-Type Delta more people would be willing to try out there games I mean it's either that game or a hamburger? I'd say that's good value for money even if I did not think the game was all that hot...

I don't know why CAVE won't capitlise on there old work. I mean there is a chance for them to make extra money out of it with minimal effort yet they won't for some daft reason and I guess that annoys me because they make great games I'd just wish they would empoly more business sense (I really need to think of better ways to say that...) but meh what do I know I don't run an video game studio do I?...

Battlesmurf · Post by **Battlesmurf** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 9:04 pm

Someone mentioned $550 SHIPPED from Fujita? Shit- I just paid $650 + shipped from ECL (with poster) but I think they overcharged me a bit, too (credit card showed 670..) so I dunno. Game is great- and ECL usually is, too- but jeez.

EOJ · Post by **EOJ** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 10:26 pm

Sorry battlesmurf, my error. It's $550 + shipping. The shipping (EMS) runs $30 or so, so it's about $580 shipped. Still about $100 cheaper than ECL when all is said and done.

Battlesmurf · Post by **Battlesmurf** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 7:48 am

It's all gravy

I guess I'll keep fujita in mind next time. Thanks for the heads up~

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 7:58 am

For expample R-Type Delta can be brought for at 525 yen, that's US$4.33

1: The above statement basically proves the argument.

Even so....

2: Reread the 3-4 parts of this thread where it says Cave doesn't own the rights to their games.

I don't know why CAVE won't capitlise on there old work.

Yeah, well, I'm sure there's a fantastic reason.

Gwyrgyn Blood · Post by **Gwyrgyn Blood** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 5:45 pm

TWE wrote:Sorry battlesmurf, my error. It's $550 + shipping. The shipping (EMS) runs $30 or so, so it's about $580 shipped. Still about $100 cheaper than ECL when all is said and done.

There's also around a 30$ charge if you pay through Paypal, which bumps it up to around $603 total.

EOJ · Post by **EOJ** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 9:54 pm

Paypal with Fujita?? Last I checked they only accepted IMOs and bank transfers. Have you ordered from them using paypal recently?

rtw · Post by **rtw** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 9:59 pm

TWE wrote:Paypal with Fujita?? Last I checked they only accepted IMOs and bank transfers. Have you ordered from them using paypal recently?

They do PayPal but charge a small fee.

rtw

Veracity · Post by **Veracity** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 10:01 pm

GaijinPunch wrote:Cave games will not run perfectly on a PC, so you can bet they would never dream of porting to one

Eh? Considering modern arcade hardware has lagged far behind ordinary consumer PCs, never mind expensive dedicated gaming rigs, for an age, I don't see how such a port would be impossible. Unless you're just talking identical resolution fetishism, or something - that could be an issue for a lot of PC hardware, but it's usually applicable to console ports, too. I imagine most people who'd want ports understand what they're buying in that respect, if they care at all - no-one's disputing the pretty obvious point that buying the arcade hardware is the only way to guarantee exact fidelity. That's not to say it'd be easy (different architecture, need to reproduce hardware-induced slowdowns, and all that), and certainly not to say there'd be enough folks queueing up to buy the result to make it worth bothering.

As has been repeatedly noted here and elsewhere, the question really ought to be 'why don't the games get ports?', more than 'why doesn't Cave port them?'. They've never self-published, so I would assume the decision to devote resources to a port rests more in the hands of their various publishers. Claims that elitism has any relevance are kind of bewildering - publishers are generally fairly keen on revenue, so you can bet the ports would be materializing if anyone thought there was good cash to be made from them. Have Cave actually made statements supporting this alleged disdain for the console market, or is it just speculation by people grumpy about wanting to play their newer games, but unwilling to spring for arcade hardware? My vague understanding is that the shooter genre has been on life support in Japan for a good while (do correct this if it's a misunderstanding). There still exists enough of an arcade market for a small company to do well out of, which is more than can be said for anywhere else in the world, but such a tiny niche won't necessarily support the tens or hundreds of thousands of sales you'd want out of a typically-priced console release before calling it a success.

Fighter17 · Post by **Fighter17** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 10:16 pm

And not all Toaplan shooters were ported onto the consoles......

PC Engine Fan X! · Post by **PC Engine Fan X!** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 11:32 pm

Fighter17 wrote:And not all Toaplan shooters were ported onto the consoles......

Tis true and thus remain as arcade PCBs exclusively..... ^_~

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

Zweihander · Post by **Zweihander** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 1:20 am

Shit, and to think I've been holding a torch for an ESPgaluda II port for more than a year now...

Fuck you, Cave. Fuck you in your hairless, flaccid assholes.

eretsua · Post by **eretsua** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 6:37 am

rtw wrote:
TWE wrote:Paypal with Fujita?? Last I checked they only accepted IMOs and bank transfers. Have you ordered from them using paypal recently?
They do PayPal but charge a small fee.

think fujita only accepts paypal for small payments.

Ed Oscuro · Post by **Ed Oscuro** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 7:07 am

Twiddle wrote:Wii does not support NTSC interlaced component output. I have no idea why, considering the GC supported interlaced component output.

The GC supported component for a while. After some date they cut it from new GCs, so we saw this coming a while back.

Ceph wrote:What, NTSC Wiis don't faeture RGB? WTF, Nintendo.

That's even more stupid than Sony not including the Emotion Engine chip in Euro-PS3s.

Feature used by ten people > feature nearly everybody uses? I don't see it.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 1:06 pm

Unless you're just talking identical resolution fetishism, or something - that could be an issue for a lot of PC hardware, but it's usually applicable to console ports, too.

Yeah, well, call it waht you will. I'm glad there are still at least some people that care about quality. And as for them being applicable to the consoles... only this generation. PS2 was very capable of of displaying arcade resolutions (GC & Xbox weren't though, but both were definitely not the console of choice to port an arcade game too).

so you can bet the ports would be materializing if anyone thought there was good cash to be made from them.

That's what my "fantastic reason" comment above was referring to.

Have Cave actually made statements supporting this alleged disdain for the console market,

No, but they have made it very clear in both their actions, and statements in their financial docs they publish that they are all about the aracdes.

Feature used by ten people > feature nearly everybody uses? I don't see it.

NTSC is not only America. Besides, why the fuck take the time to put something into one hardware and take it out of another. It's cheaper to have the same thing across the board.

roker · Post by **roker** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 5:34 pm

GaijinPunch wrote:Penis Man.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 1:31 am

Good old Malibu is a lot of things... penis man is probably one of them.

Zeether · Post by **Zeether** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 2:05 am

What about that Ketsui Pocket-DOOM thingy for DS?

Battlesmurf · Post by **Battlesmurf** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 4:33 am

Fuck you, Cave. Fuck you in your hairless, flaccid assholes.

I laughed at this...but what is a flaccid asshole? (lol..don't answer this...).

On the topic at hand: I would pay out the ass (a flaccid one, even) for a Ketsui, Dangun, DDP2,DDPDOJ, Mushi, Muchi, etc etc "Collector's Edition"- maybe even 2 games per volume...Cave has such a wonderful backlog of games it's not even funny! I would almost think that even with slow sales, they have enough games that there's money to be had.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 6:02 am

I think we're much more likely to get some type of "classics" collection (emulated) much further down the line than we are to get somewhat accurate ports in the forseeable future.

Pirate1019 · Post by **Pirate1019** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 6:28 am

Battlesmurf wrote:I would almost think that even with slow sales, they have enough games that there's money to be had.

But if there's money to be had, it's probably not as much money as is to be had from a new arcade release, and that is the problem.

shmups.system11.org

So why exactly does Cave not want to port anymore?

FUJITA?