Crimzon Clover: World Ignition Announced at Stunfest

[jepjepjep]

I had that ghost input problem too when I didn't plug in my controller. With only the keyboard, it has a mind of its own.

[Dave_K.]

So I need to have a joystick plugged in to play it via the keyboard?

[Patashu]

Have you tried inspecting to see if the computer thinks anything is being pressed whenever Crimzon Clover WORLD IGNITION is displaying ghost input problems?

For example, Stepmania has under options a 'Test Input' screen, and on this screen it lists all input that Stepmania is aware of your computer is receiving.
If something actually shows up there, it's not CCWI's fault - maybe you should call an exorcist.

[rtw]

My PC just made the bare minimum requirements with Pentium "D" 2.8ghz, so I created a steam account just to buy/play this game.

Which OS are you running ?

[Dave_K.]

Have you tried inspecting to see if the computer thinks anything is being pressed whenever Crimzon Clover WORLD IGNITION is displaying ghost input problems?

I did try starting notepad in a window and see if any keyboard inputs came across...nothing. Seems to be CCWI's problem with ghosting.

Which OS are you running ?

Windows XP

[rtw]

Windows XP

In control panel there is the "Game Controller" widget, does your device appear correctly there ?

[Dave_K.]

The device I use is a USB keyboard (and a JPAC which also acts like a USB keyboard). There are no game controllers installed/connected.

I just tried out the original Crimzon Clover webtrial free download, and it plays perfectly fine. Menu's are not bouncing around with ghost inputs. Also the game plays in 4:3 just fine, while the steam port puts extra stuff on the left/right sides of the screen to fill out 16:9 aspect screens. This really sucks there is no 4:3 mode (or 3:4 vertical) for the steam port. I could probably overscan the picture or put it in a window like emphatic did to play in a cab.

[cools]

It doesn't run as well in a cab as the original does for a few minor reasons, question is how can we get them fixed?

[Dave_K.]

^I think just asking for a 4:3 display mode, and fixing the keyboard as only input menu bug should do it for cab use.

So, I tried plugging in a PS2-to-USB controller, and the ghosting stopped, but the game no longer accepted keyboard input...only joystick controls. I also did notice that the ghosting seems to only be restricted to menu inputs, as after the game is started I don't see this ship flying around on its own...so this is good sign that the game should be playable once started.

This bug should be reproducible by anyone running Windows XP.
1. do not plug in any game controllers
2. start game in full screen or window mode, and press "A" key (which is the start button). Menu should start skipping around randomly in the up direction.
3. if you started the game in full screen mode, press "Control + Escape" while in the menu, and you will hear the game sounds in the background like someone is holding down the up arrow key in the menu.

[cools]

It doesnt work in yoko at low res either, I'd like that fixed as well.

[Tim James]

I genuinely feel for PC developers. Need to go dumpster diving to find a 640x480 monitor to test with in 2014.

[Bonus!]

It doesnt work in yoko at low res either, I'd like that fixed as well.

It's not supposed to, given it's high resolution.

[emphatic]

Scaling it to the current desktop resolution or add a command line option to specify any resolution other than the native one for fullscreen would fix many issues, I think.

[TransatlanticFoe]

Has anyone gotten this to run with an XBOX 360 HORI Fighting Stick EX2 ?

The "Game Controller" widget recognizes it correctly and shows all buttons...

I think the EX2's stick registers as the d-pad on a 360, so will do the same on a PC (i.e. hat switches). Crimzon Clover requires the joystick for movement, not the hat. I don't think you can switch it - there are some 360 games which just use the analogue stick for movement, so the EX2 doesn't work.

I suspect you'll need to use a keymapper to get it working (though the original Crimzon Clover wasn't friendly with my 360 pad using a keymapper) or use a different controller.

[Dave_K.]

I genuinely feel for PC developers. Need to go dumpster diving to find a 640x480 monitor to test with in 2014.

In other words, you see the value of developing on consoles with fixed devices/resources?

[Kuroonehalf]

I'm 6 hours into this (having played +2-3 hours on the old PC version) and so far I'm a tad disappointed. My main gripe with the game is that it's just so samey. Perhaps I'm spoiled with having sunk a few good months into Hellsinker a while ago but I'm quickly finding myself bored with this game and I've barely started playing.

Although there's 4 ships, they control exactly the same. They all shoot the same, all their lock-on attacks are the same, all their bombs are the same, and their break attacks are the same. Even the Boost and Time Attack modes, with their somewhat different attack patterns in enemies and bosses, aren't distinct enough to feel fresh. The mechanics in and of themselves are extremely simple and the only strategy involved asides from shooting and dodging is deciding when to break.

The soundtrack is also a bit on the poor side. Aside from the Crimzon Heart tracks, there's none that has really stood out to me so far.

But there are stuff I like. Their bullet shapes/colors are good and with nice variety, and that coupled with some interesting attacks makes for great visuals. The sound effects are also fairly good - I'm usually really picky about those but I enjoy how they did them here. And the attack patterns are pretty competent. Not many that stand out but they're okay.

ps: Is there an extra stage past 5 on arcade+ modes? I haven't quite beaten that yet.

[Cagar]

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[Squire Grooktook]

Samey is the last word I'd use to describe the game. I feel like every moment of the game feels different and unique due to the constant interplay of dodging vs breaking.

As for the ships, they actually do play quite a bit differently from eachother IMO. Maybe not quite as uniquely as something like Hellsinker or Dimahoo, but much more than a Cave game or something like that.

The mechanics being simple is a good thing. I very much love how intuitive and flexible the scoring system is.

[Zaarock]

Even the Boost and Time Attack modes, with their somewhat different attack patterns in enemies and bosses, aren't distinct enough to feel fresh. The mechanics in and of themselves are extremely simple and the only strategy involved asides from shooting and dodging is deciding when to break.

Try playing for score? The game might seem simple on surface level but even if you don't have a bunch of weapon systems it takes a lot of technique to pull off scoring routes and managing multipliers in this game. If that still feels 'extremely' simple then IDK. Ironically the main scoring system in hellsinker is a lot simpler (basically get as many hits in as you can with weak attacks on enemies to increase their values, and graze some stuff)

Just for survival there's certainly a lot of strategy involved in pointblanking and lock-on usage. Not to mention rank management on Arcade Boost and bullet cancels on Unlimited..

Type-II certainly shoots differently from the others and Type-III has a unique lock-on laser (it can hit enemies collaterally)

[jepjepjep]

Funnily, in my opinion, requiring strategy in a shooting game is a bad thing.
Shooting and dodging it is, I even wish that there was no worrying about when to break. Just break when ready. (i'm making a game like this pretty much, for real)

Isn't that pretty much Arcade Boost mode? Enter break mode automatically and stay as long as you can survive.

[Squire Grooktook]

Also I do feel that boost mode patterns feel quite a bit different than original, and require a bit different dodging style, especially the farther you get into it.

I mean, it's a danmaku game, it's not trying to be a new-fangled sub-genre that's as different from other bullet hell shooters as they were from the large hitbox games that preceded them, but holy heck is it a damn good game.

[Cee]

Although there's 4 ships, they control exactly the same.

No they don't.

[Cagar]

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[jepjepjep]

Just need a slower PC .

[Kuroonehalf]

The mechanics in and of themselves are extremely simple and the only strategy involved asides from shooting and dodging is deciding when to break..

Funnily, in my opinion, requiring strategy in a shooting game is a bad thing.
Shooting and dodging it is, I even wish that there was no worrying about when to break. Just break when ready. (i'm making a game like this pretty much, for real)

The thing with lack of strategy is that you inevitably just shut your brain off and go into autopilot. I personally don't find that very fun or stimulating (and honestly am a bit surprised that I seem to be in the minority here). I like to figure out complex systems and then the feeling of mastery I get out of putting them into effective use. It's why I love Hellsinker, Dustforce and fighting games so much. But to each their own. I'm just happy there's more shmups coming out and getting some exposure, even though this is technically not a new game.

Although there's 4 ships, they control exactly the same.

No they don't.

I assume you're referring to stuff like ship type 3's increased movement speed. But does that really make a palpable impact on the way you play? I find that with me it really doesn't, that I end up approaching attacks the exact same way as with the other ships, breaking at exactly the same spots and going through the same motions. Same for what Zaarock mentions of type 2, that has the tracking dolls. I feel like it's such an insignificant difference. :\

Try playing for score?

For now I am just trying to 1cc arcade mode. :p
But what specific things does it entail?

[Squire Grooktook]

The thing with lack of strategy is that you inevitably just shut your brain off and go into autopilot. I personally don't find that very fun or stimulating (and honestly am a bit surprised that I seem to be in the minority here). I like to figure out complex systems and then the feeling of mastery I get out of putting them into effective use.

Try playing for score?

For now I am just trying to 1cc arcade mode. :p
But what specific things does it entail?

Soooooo

You're complaining that it feels too simple/not strategic, and that there's no complexity or depth to master. But you don't even know how the scoring works/what it entails? *scoring: aka the main source of depth, mastery, complexity, and replay value in most shmups

That would be like me playing Garregga or Ibara without knowing about rank or medal chaining or anything and being like WOW WHAT A DUMB SIMPLE GAME WHAT'S ALL THE FUSS ABOUT???

Scoring is brilliant by the way. You might change your mind about the game once you learn the subtleties of it. Rest assured, break mode is something you don't just do on autopilot (it's something you have to plan, think ahead for, and execute precisely if you want to get the most out of it). And the game does have a LOT of strategy.


*edit* also

Although there's 4 ships, they control exactly the same.

No they don't.

I assume you're referring to stuff like ship type 3's increased movement speed. But does that really make a palpable impact on the way you play? I find that with me it really doesn't, that I end up approaching attacks the exact same way as with the other ships, breaking at exactly the same spots and going through the same motions. Same for what Zaarock mentions of type 2, that has the tracking dolls. I feel like it's such an insignificant difference. :\

The differences in ships are like the differences in ships in a Cave game or what have you. It's subtle, but you'll need different routes and different strats for dealing with things and scoring based on ship speed, shot type, etc.

That's pretty much the way it works in most shmups. Stuff like Hellsinker where every character/ship feels like a different game mode is nice, but it's not exactly common or standard for the genre.

[Tim James]

I do vaguely feel like Simple mode was a good palette cleanser. The new modes are so breaktacular that it sort of dulls my senses after a while.

[Bananamatic]

type III literally cant dodge shit at the high speeds, especially on unlimited

[Kuroonehalf]

You're complaining that it feels too simple/not strategic, and that there's no complexity or depth to master. But you don't even know how the scoring works/what it entails?

Going for score is always going to require more strategy, in any shmup, I don't think it's a very fair argument. :\
I also don't know the intricacies of playing for score in Hellsinker, but that's because playing for survival is already so filled with strategy that I didn't feel the need to go deeper. At least not yet. :p
Playing for survival in CC really doesn't have much more complexity to it aside from the breaking thing. Unless I'm somehow missing something.

Scoring is brilliant by the way. You might change your mind about the game once you learn the subtleties of it. Rest assured, break mode is something you don't just do on autopilot.

No-death bonuses and the star pickups are the most obvious way to build score I know, but both requiring no strategy. I assume the actual strategy comes from the Break Rate counter or the number bellow the break bar. Am I close? I'm not sure how exactly you affect those though.

[Cagar]

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