Dodonpachi Daifukkatsu [Cave 2008]

[sven666]

25mins per loop sounds ok to me.. part of being a great player is the ability to play concistently aswell as scoring high.

it is a learning curve i find essential to the genre even, if a game for some reason was impossible to be concistently good at why would anyone practice it?

[MX7]

Just one thing: The sub boss on stage 3 that drops the 1up has the most beautiful bullet pattern I have ever seen

[Udderdude]

Some people might consider that a good thing -_^ Especially Cave, who will get shloads of quarters from the Japanese fanatics. Or 100 yen coins as the case may be, whatever it is new arcades normally go per run.

That's exactly the reason why I think they're still doing this shit. If you look at it this way, it is not much different of a trap than World of Warcraft is. The game is built to make you keep playing because you are addicted, even though what you are doing is stupid. Now the part that is stupid in a STG like DDP or DFK is not nearly the whole game like World of Warcraft, but it is the part that keeps you from memorizing the later stages properly for ages, and the part that forces you to play the stages you already master in every run, wasting 15 min of my time per run in DDP for example.

Actually, Cave only sees money when they sell the arcade board. The arcade operators would actually see less money, since that 15 minutes an expert is "Going through the motions" and playing the memorized noob levels, is 15 minutes another player could have been on the machine and inserted another 100yen. Faster games means more money.

[MX7]

Some people might consider that a good thing -_^ Especially Cave, who will get shloads of quarters from the Japanese fanatics. Or 100 yen coins as the case may be, whatever it is new arcades normally go per run.

That's exactly the reason why I think they're still doing this shit. If you look at it this way, it is not much different of a trap than World of Warcraft is. The game is built to make you keep playing because you are addicted, even though what you are doing is stupid. Now the part that is stupid in a STG like DDP or DFK is not nearly the whole game like World of Warcraft, but it is the part that keeps you from memorizing the later stages properly for ages, and the part that forces you to play the stages you already master in every run, wasting 15 min of my time per run in DDP for example.

Actually, Cave only sees money when they sell the arcade board. The arcade operators would actually see less money, since that 15 minutes an expert is "Going through the motions" and playing the memorized noob levels, is 15 minutes another player could have been on the machine and inserted another 100yen. Faster games means more money.

I think the days of arcade games trying to rob you of your credit as soon as possible are long gone. These days the strategy seems to be a carrot and stick scenario. There's always something tantalisingly out of reach, so you keep playing just a bit more... only to discover a new goal.

Of course, you're right, someone's going to be sitting on that stool a lot longer, and not just shoveling in coins. However, the great player showing off his or her skills is like an advert for the game, far more enticing than any attract screen. Go to any decent arcade and you'll see crowds forming around players. Cave realize this, hence the fact they release superplays, and arcades realize this, hence the fact they sometimes record runs. It helps increase the idea of comunity, the hype for the game, and consequently, more coins get shoved into the machine.

And what do you do if there's a never ending crowd around the new Cave game you want to play? You go off and put your money in something else to pass the time, innit. I know for a fact that when someone's playing on a cab I want a go on, I'll play another one rather than just walking out of the arcade. After all, I and anyone else who has gone in has gone in specificly to play games. Ahhhh! Suddenly the arcade has not just swiped one coin off you, it's swiped several!

[mulletgeezer]

I played quite a few credits on this on Thursday... It's nice. I think the theme is really weak but as always the game play is satifying and the bullet patterns are great. The first loop is rather easy - at least one dude had cleared in in the HEY within two hours of the arcade opening, of course he may have played it extensively at the location test. Also I noticed the third stage 1up is really easy to get this time, I accidentally triggered a bomb and it still appeared.

Good game but from what I played it's a long way behind Mushi Futari.

[Frederik]

That's exactly the reason why I think they're still doing this shit. If you look at it this way, it is not much different of a trap than World of Warcraft is.

Oh come on, that comparison is pretty weak. While you can get addicted to WoW on a psychological level and fuck up your live good and proper, I have yet to hear from anyone who got addicted to a shmup.

Both games can be very good timesinks, but in a shmup it takes this much time because improving the quality of your abilities can be very hard. WoW, on the other hand, is just pure grinding, leveling up, mining gold or what other shit people do in this "game". Your character levels up so that YOU don´t have to actually get better.

Besides, the impression I am getting is that many people really crave to get back to WoW even if they know they shouldn´t spend as much time on it, whereas it takes dedication and self-discipline to actually sit down every day and get better at a shmup - and self-discipline is pretty much the opposite of addiction. Shmups are a test of willpower and dedication; WoW is making numbers go up and ringing the gratification bell in your brain on a very primitive level. (As you can tell, I DESPISE the concept of "leveling up".)

[P_HAT]

I played quite a few credits on this on Thursday... It's nice. I think the theme is really weak but as always the game play is satifying and the bullet patterns are great. The first loop is rather easy - at least one dude had cleared in in the HEY within two hours of the arcade opening, of course he may have played it extensively at the location test. Also I noticed the third stage 1up is really easy to get this time, I accidentally triggered a bomb and it still appeared.

Good game but from what I played it's a long way behind Mushi Futari.

Thx for mini review Mulletgeezer.
Did you heard any opinion about game from jp players?
they like new style?

[Ruldra]

Question to mulletgeezer or whoever played this game:

- With the power-type ship, what's the differences in using the 'boosted' mode and 'non-boosted' mode, aside from the powered-up shot?
- Does boost mode also works in hyper mode?

[mulletgeezer]

I didn't talk to any of them about it but it seems to be well received as there were plenty of players that were getting in as many credits as possible. Also nobody was playing Death Smiles any more which had been popular in almost every arcade i'd been in right up until DDPDFK was released.

[mulletgeezer]

Question to mulletgeezer or whoever played this game:

- With the power-type ship, what's the differences in using the 'boosted' mode and 'non-boosted' mode, aside from the powered-up shot?
- Does boost mode also works in hyper mode?

I saw lots of dudes play this game but only one of them chose power type, bomb type gives the same number of bombs as DDP (ie rising to 6 per ship) so it's a major reason for the relative ease of the game. I couldn't see any other effect of Boost mode apart from the power increase but I'd guess there will be something in the game that allows for larger scores with this ship to make up for the loss of 30+ bombs (and MAX bomb bonus) available with the other ship.

[Gwyrgyn Blood]

Boost mode lets you reflect the larger lasers without Hyper, for one. That's all I know, but there's probably more since that wouldn't really be worth very many more points.

[PROMETHEUS]

That's exactly the reason why I think they're still doing this shit. If you look at it this way, it is not much different of a trap than World of Warcraft is.

Oh come on, that comparison is pretty weak. While you can get addicted to WoW on a psychological level and fuck up your live good and proper, I have yet to hear from anyone who got addicted to a shmup.

Both games can be very good timesinks, but in a shmup it takes this much time because improving the quality of your abilities can be very hard. WoW, on the other hand, is just pure grinding, leveling up, mining gold or what other shit people do in this "game". Your character levels up so that YOU don´t have to actually get better.

Besides, the impression I am getting is that many people really crave to get back to WoW even if they know they shouldn´t spend as much time on it, whereas it takes dedication and self-discipline to actually sit down every day and get better at a shmup - and self-discipline is pretty much the opposite of addiction. Shmups are a test of willpower and dedication; WoW is making numbers go up and ringing the gratification bell in your brain on a very primitive level. (As you can tell, I DESPISE the concept of "leveling up".)

of course I'm not saying it plays on addiction on the same degree as WoW does, but to some extent like I explained there are still some stupid actions comparable to grinding that the game forces you to do and part of why you are going to accept doing that shit is because you are addicted. I don't feel I'm addicted to DDP but when you start having your eyes on a certain goal, the game makes sure you won't reach it unless everything you do in your final run is perfect, PLUS it forces you to play easy things every time you try, before things get any serious. It wastes your time, relying on your addiction + motivation for a score for you to accept wasting that time.

Now, maybe some people work with motivation only even among the best, but I kind of doubt that. They did state in their interviews they were addicted, I think.

[Frederik]

of course I'm not saying it plays on addiction on the same degree as WoW does, but to some extent like I explained there are still some stupid actions comparable to grinding that the game forces you to do and part of why you are going to accept doing that shit is because you are addicted. I don't feel I'm addicted to DDP but when you start having your eyes on a certain goal, the game makes sure you won't reach it unless everything you do in your final run is perfect, PLUS it forces you to play easy things every time you try, before things get any serious. It wastes your time, relying on your addiction + motivation for a score for you to accept wasting that time.

Now, maybe some people work with motivation only even among the best, but I kind of doubt that. They did state in their interviews they were addicted, I think.

Ah, okay, now I know what you mean.

[orange]

i'm all for difficulty choices

[Arvandor]

wasting 15 min of my time per run in DDP for example.

It's not a waste of time so long as you're having fun =) The trick is to not see the first 5 stages of the first loop as a waste of time before you get to practice. Enjoy the first loop for what it is once you've gotten that good. Perty explosions and a warmup for the second loop ^_^

It's all about mindset. The more you embitter yourself towards the first loop, the more you're going to hate it every time you're forced to play through it on a complete run.

[GaijinPunch]

Try to play dodonpachi for score through loop 2 and I think you will see how this is hard to understand.

To each their own, obviously.

Boost mode lets you reflect the larger lasers without Hyper, for one. That's all I know, but there's probably more since that wouldn't really be worth very many more points.

A shitty trade off for no bombs. Power Mode is for the pro, and nothing less.

[PROMETHEUS]

It's not a waste of time so long as you're having fun =) The trick is to not see the first 5 stages of the first loop as a waste of time before you get to practice. Enjoy the first loop for what it is once you've gotten that good. Perty explosions and a warmup for the second loop ^_^

It's all about mindset. The more you embitter yourself towards the first loop, the more you're going to hate it every time you're forced to play through it on a complete run.

If you can do that when having mastered loop 1 and trying to get far into loop 2 without miss or bomb, call me. Personally I'm just bored when I play the first 4 stages.

[Molloy]

Somebody upload the video again. It's down.

I like games with short levels and loop times. Gradius V was wonderful but playing the easy levels over and over eventually drove me absolutely insane. R-Type Final drove me nuts as well.

[Dave_K.]

the atmosphere of the game certainly is a change for the worse

in doj everything looks and attacks viciously

this is more like mushidonpachi

Couldn't agree more. Its quite apparent IKD did not have his heart into this one (nor Namiki). Sucks that he was forced to make it. I think this will only lead to Ketsui gaining in value once again as being the last great militaristic Cave shmup with excellent soundtrack.

[orange]

i know exactly what you mean

the whole thing looks like it feels like a half-effort

sure it's obviously going to be a fun game, but i don't think anything will top DOJ or Garegga for me and it's frustrating that there's no market for a game like either of them

[Dave_K.]

sure it's obviously going to be a fun game

Yeah, for all the eye candy and and purple dildo lasers, I'm sure it will be fun and a definite buy once the initial value comes down, just not what I was hoping/expecting from the DDP series.

[orange]

i'm waiting for garegga 2 :3

[Plasmo]

Already released as Ibara.

[orange]

ibara is not nearly as charming as garegga to me :<

[Necronopticous]

Garegga would be more charming if it didn't have such confusing hitboxes and bulky player sprites.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

ibara is not nearly as charming as garegga to me :<

And your wait for a true bonafide Garegga 2 PCB sequel from the likes of Raizing/8ing will be a long time coming...that is, if they ever get back to making such an arcade shmup PCB title in the first place.

We already know the answer and it ain't gonna happen anytime soon. And thus, it is just wishful thinking that such a Garegga II PCB will materialize out of thin air. Perhaps in an alternate dimension, does it exist -- just not the one we currently live in now...^_~

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[clp]

ibara is not nearly as charming as garegga to me :<

i agree garegga is a one off i cant recall another soundtrack that consistently good either , most of mars matrix i enjoyed though.

[GaijinPunch]

Its quite apparent IKD did not have his heart into this one

I think it's quite apparent he did. He's not the graphics designer. The game system is a fun offshoot of DOJ.

[Arvandor]

If you can do that when having mastered loop 1 and trying to get far into loop 2 without miss or bomb, call me. Personally I'm just bored when I play the first 4 stages.

Once I master the first loop I'll surely keep venting and ranting in that thread of mine, so you'll know if the boredom gets to me or not =) Mastery of the first loop shouldn't be too far off though, I think.

[ReKleSS]

What does that voice say when the hyper is ready? It sounds like "yoi ha yoroshii desuka", but I can't make much sense of that.