Jeff Minter's Space Giraffe

roker · Post by **roker** » Sat Aug 25, 2007 5:37 pm

besides using the right analog stick to sway your shots, if you enter a level with 3 or more lives, it'll save your score for that level the next time you play

that way you can pick up where you left off and not half to play from first level to accumulate a high score

SuperGrafx · Post by **SuperGrafx** » Mon Aug 27, 2007 5:32 pm

I'm stuck on level 38. I must have attempted to clear this level at least 30 times with no improvement.

Damn those small, tight level designs! The wide open levels are way more fun since you at least have a fair chance of picking up on some immediate threats.

MJR · Post by **MJR** » Mon Aug 27, 2007 5:47 pm

I played the game just few hours ago. I must say that I do understand some of the comments here, as the game was certainly trippy and chaotic. But I loved it because of it.
And despite the apparent madness, it was possible to get used to it.

ubersaurus · Post by **ubersaurus** » Mon Aug 27, 2007 8:55 pm

My only problem is I get distracted while bulling enemies, and keep forgetting to look out for bullets

but I am getting the hang of the system, and the game is more fun for it.

bcass · Post by **bcass** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 2:24 pm

Disappointing not to see more discussion of this brilliant game on a shmups forum. This is the best Western developed shmup I've played in a long long time. In fact, it's one of *the* best shmups I've ever played. Highly intricate play mechanics, and beautiful graphics. A steep learning curve, yes, but since when did that put shmup fans off?

KNTain · Post by **KNTain** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 2:56 pm

I'm just waiting for the damn patch. That jump exploit is really bad.

szycag · Post by **szycag** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 6:50 pm

The thread doesn't really stick out since the topic name was never changed to Space Giraffe... maybe with that change it would get more attention.

I like this game's ability to make me feel quite ill, I can appreciate the surreal qualities of it, but playing the demo I just lose my concentration way too easily and can't master even the basic techniques.

I'll have to play it more when I get a chance to examine the demo in the comfort of my bedroom instead of on my friends blurry TV...

ubersaurus · Post by **ubersaurus** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 9:37 pm

KNTain wrote:I'm just waiting for the damn patch. That jump exploit is really bad.

What exploit is this?

KNTain · Post by **KNTain** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 11:55 pm

If you hold the jump button to use a pod, you extend the zone and float around until you fall back onto the rim. That's fine.

What isn't fine is that the zone stays extended well after the landing, as long as you keep holding the button.

Veracity · Post by **Veracity** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 11:55 pm

bcass wrote:Disappointing not to see more discussion of this brilliant game on a shmups forum. This is the best Western developed shmup I've played in a long long time. In fact, it's one of *the* best shmups I've ever played. Highly intricate play mechanics, and beautiful graphics. A steep learning curve, yes, but since when did that put shmup fans off?

Well, it isn't a shmup, for one thing. I assume its presence in the on-topic forum is borne with such fortitude because it is borderline, because some people have a lot of affection for the hirsute eccentric recluse, and because even those who don't will probably grudgingly acknowledge admiration for how long he's managed to hold out doing...what he does. Has anyone else lasted so long? Perhaps Miyamoto, and I think Gollop is still a fringe developer of some kind; drawing a blank, otherwise. Garriott working at a Korean MMO grind factory doesn't count.

A lot of people who might otherwise be trying it probably don't have a 360. I know I'll hold out for a Windows version before considering it. Like the sound of the updated mechanics (yes, 'updated' - yet to be swayed by any of the 'but it's not Tempest' schtick), but not 'buy a new console to try it' kind of like, especially when I have a good chance of falling into the 'sod off, too confusing' camp.

Minter should get a knighthood for the optional high score as grindfest innovation, at least. Would admittedly be less need for it were he not so resolutely old-school in the '100 slightly different levels' sense, but it's an idea I'm pleased to see someone try for whatever reason.

ubersaurus · Post by **ubersaurus** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 3:42 am

I don't see how Tempest 2000, which is in the database mind you, can be a shmup but this can't.

Veracity · Post by **Veracity** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 10:42 pm

ubersaurus wrote:I don't see how Tempest 2000, which is in the database mind you, can be a shmup but this can't.

But it's not Tempest! Probably shouldn't have mentioned this lest I spawn another periodic table interlude and invoke the ire of elvis. I thought there was a faction favoring the blanket disqualification of tube shooters just for being tube shooters, but don't know whether that was adopted; probably only Torus Trooper would be affected (since it arguably does have 2-axis movement), in any case. Regardless, Tempest and Space Giraffe have only one axis of player avatar movement => not shmups, any more than Space Invaders or Galaxian; jumping is too limited and situational to qualify as freedom along a second axis. Maybe I've misinterpreted the forum's local definition, or maybe Tempest 2K has some discretionary exception made for it, in which case it probably extends to Space Giraffe despite Minter's strenuous denial of lineage.

This is just a matter of arbitrary moderator fiat for local convenience - it's not a slight against the game, just that what's considered on-topic has to be defined somewhere, and as far as I'd understood current policy Tempest derivatives are out. What will account for some disinterest is that the convenience definition reflects the somewhat narrow preference of a large part of the site's membership for ~30 to 60-minute forced scrollers alternating popcorn and boss sequences across five to ten or so largely deterministic stages. Plenty probably aren't even interested enough to find out whether they think all the wilful obfuscation the game indulges in is any fun to deal with because of that. I'm interested because of the unconventional score saving it implements, but probably wouldn't be, otherwise, because of the length; I think Minter said his own first successful straight stage 1-100 run was a three-hour session.

ubersaurus · Post by **ubersaurus** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 7:18 pm

Veracity wrote:
ubersaurus wrote:I don't see how Tempest 2000, which is in the database mind you, can be a shmup but this can't.
But it's not Tempest! Probably shouldn't have mentioned this lest I spawn another periodic table interlude and invoke the ire of elvis. I thought there was a faction favoring the blanket disqualification of tube shooters just for being tube shooters, but don't know whether that was adopted; probably only Torus Trooper would be affected (since it arguably does have 2-axis movement), in any case. Regardless, Tempest and Space Giraffe have only one axis of player avatar movement => not shmups, any more than Space Invaders or Galaxian; jumping is too limited and situational to qualify as freedom along a second axis. Maybe I've misinterpreted the forum's local definition, or maybe Tempest 2K has some discretionary exception made for it, in which case it probably extends to Space Giraffe despite Minter's strenuous denial of lineage.

This is just a matter of arbitrary moderator fiat for local convenience - it's not a slight against the game, just that what's considered on-topic has to be defined somewhere, and as far as I'd understood current policy Tempest derivatives are out. What will account for some disinterest is that the convenience definition reflects the somewhat narrow preference of a large part of the site's membership for ~30 to 60-minute forced scrollers alternating popcorn and boss sequences across five to ten or so largely deterministic stages. Plenty probably aren't even interested enough to find out whether they think all the wilful obfuscation the game indulges in is any fun to deal with because of that. I'm interested because of the unconventional score saving it implements, but probably wouldn't be, otherwise, because of the length; I think Minter said his own first successful straight stage 1-100 run was a three-hour session.

I'm not sure I get what you're saying;Tempest 2000 should be exempted for some reason, but other tube shooters shouldn't be counted? I have to say that's kind of silly. Consider that most of the people on this site have little experience with old shooters of the tube, free range, or one axis of movement variety. For that matter, most people just don't care about them... I remember bringing my Atari to the last shmupmeet around here and barely anyone knew of games like Turmoil, Empire Strikes Back, or Communist Mutants From Outer Space. But that doesn't automatically mean they aren't shooters just because they lack boss fights and bombs. I mean, you're still shooting things, you aren't run n' gunning, and you're still seeking that delicious high score.

I'd say if Tempest 2000 is in the xenocide files, then automatically all other tube shooters should be included. I'm sorry, but someone saying that Space Invaders, or Galaxian, or Galaga aren't shooters because you can't move forward or backwards just doesn't add up...as they're in there too

But I think this is getting off topic, so I guess we can agree to disagree and get back to the matter at hand: Space Giraffe kicking ass. Unless you can't see what you're doing.

Thunder Force · Post by **Thunder Force** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 1:43 am

szycag wrote:The thread doesn't really stick out since the topic name was never changed to Space Giraffe... maybe with that change it would get more attention.

I've now changed the thread title.

Ok, when I first picked up and started playing Space Giraffe last week I was a little disappointed. Basically I did the same thing everyone else first does, and tried to play it like Tempest (obviously, because it looks like Tempest).

After reading around a bit about the gameplay mechanics and realizing this is more like "anti-Tempest" than Tempest, I started playing it properly (i.e. letting as many enemies reach the near end of the web as possible). I've now played through about fifteen stages so far and am really in love with the game.

It's daring and inventive, although I'm hesitant to put it above Tempest 2K just yet, between the two of them this is certainly the more original and carefully thought out game. I particularly like the fact that the game throws deliberate visual distractions in your way as a gameplay element, forcing you to rely on your sense of hearing of sfx, whenever your visual cortex is being temporarily blasted by lights. Good stuff, and at the budget price this is a steal. Bring on the PC port!

roker · Post by **roker** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 8:18 am

Thunder Force wrote:
szycag wrote:The thread doesn't really stick out since the topic name was never changed to Space Giraffe... maybe with that change it would get more attention.
I've now changed the thread title.

Ok, when I first picked up and started playing Space Giraffe last week I was a little disappointed. Basically I did the same thing everyone else first does, and tried to play it like Tempest (obviously, because it looks like Tempest).

After reading around a bit about the gameplay mechanics and realizing this is more like "anti-Tempest" than Tempest, I started playing it properly (i.e. letting as many enemies reach the near end of the web as possible). I've now played through about fifteen stages so far and am really in love with the game.

It's daring and inventive, although I'm hesitant to put it above Tempest 2K just yet, between the two of them this is certainly the more original and carefully thought out game. I particularly like the fact that the game throws deliberate visual distractions in your way as a gameplay element, forcing you to rely on your sense of hearing of sfx, whenever your visual cortex is being temporarily blasted by lights. Good stuff, and at the budget price this is a steal. Bring on the PC port!

wow

I didn't think anyone here would like it

I love it.

it's an 8, but a hard 8 and an enjoyable experience

my buddy reviewed it

y'all should check it out:

http://radicalwaste.com/spamblog/?p=26

jp · Post by jp » Sat Sep 22, 2007 1:25 pm

People that appreciate Space Giraffe's genius + 1!

Picked it up last night. At first I had no idea what was going on and tried playing it like Tempest. I even tried the tutorial and STILL had no clue how to play the game. But at some point it all just "clicked" and now I'm enjoying the hell out of it.

Afterbirth · Post by **Afterbirth** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 10:35 pm

Jeff's a kinda god - he is the orignator of truly hardcore game really as anyone with a C64 will testify (revenge of the Mutant camels anyone?).

Yeah....its a rip off of the 26' Empire Strikes back, but its a massively sprite infested rip off.

bcass · Post by **bcass** » Mon Sep 24, 2007 1:26 am

I was reading an interview with one of my heroes of the 8/16-bit era recently on some C64 website. It was an interview with Graftgolds Steve Turner. When asked about who he highly regarded he namechecked Jeff Minter, because Jeff was one of the first to perfect arcade-style scrolling on the 8-bit Commodore machines. Now, as far as I'm concerned, Steve Turner and fellow Graftgold co-hort Andrew Braybrook are Gods of original game design, so it was a real eye-opener to see one of them holding Minter so highly. Not that I don't have high regard for Llamasoft, but I was a relative late-comer to their software and had little idea about the early influence.

It's easy to look at Mutant Camels and think it's a direct rip-off of the Empire Strikes Back VCS game, but when you delve a little deeper into the other releases you'll find genuinely inventive ideas and re-imaginings of existing formulas. Pretty much what Space Giraffe is.

Afterbirth · Post by **Afterbirth** » Mon Sep 24, 2007 10:31 am

Yeah i agree (Jeff said himself it was P. Brothers ESB that first appealed to him) but hell, JM did some hardcore games on the Vic20 as well.
The thing thats really funny is that Jeff just created millions of sprites based on everyday british icons (and farm based stuff) - similar to what offbeat Japanese companies like Konami did with Parodius.
I'd certainly receommend people grab some 8-bit emus and hunt for the roms to get an idea of what Jeffs Games were like back then.

Veracity · Post by **Veracity** » Mon Sep 24, 2007 6:55 pm

ubersaurus wrote:I'm not sure I get what you're saying;Tempest 2000 should be exempted for some reason, but other tube shooters shouldn't be counted?

Sort of, not exactly, but in any case I was just (attempted) neutrally parroting what I understand to be 'officially' on topic (irrespective of xenocide files, which I think has covered run and guns at least at some point); on actually checking recent-ish discussion of the matter I think I was mistaken about the 2-axis requirement, anyway (it's the alleged 'proto-shmup' distinction I had in mind). Honestly, genre hair-splitting makes my teeth itch and is, as you say, way off topic.

The whole 'not being able to see what you're doing' aspect does seem like it's going to be the deciding factor for damn near everyone. It's unfortunate people who do tune in to it will all but inevitably hurl accusations of excessive inflexibility at those who don't, but some degree of evangelical zeal is a bit inevitable when faced with something that deviates wilfully from established convention. I do acknowledge that it's, at least in principle, a fairly logical continuation of the basic grid idea, which never did serve all that much purpose beyond inflicting confusion. Whether I'll find it overkill I look forward to discovering - roll on Windows port, since I'm still not getting a 360 yet, though the latest raft of XBLA announcements is pushing it closer to purchasability than its generational siblings. If I'm tempted to bitch that I can't see anything, I'll try to bear in mind the desire to throw pointed implements instilled in me by 'what the hell do you mean, I'm not supposed to shoot stuff?' responses to Psyvariar.

BrianC · Post by **BrianC** » Tue Sep 25, 2007 1:18 am

Afterbirth wrote:Yeah i agree (Jeff said himself it was P. Brothers ESB that first appealed to him) but hell, JM did some hardcore games on the Vic20 as well.
The thing thats really funny is that Jeff just created millions of sprites based on everyday british icons (and farm based stuff) - similar to what offbeat Japanese companies like Konami did with Parodius.
I'd certainly receommend people grab some 8-bit emus and hunt for the roms to get an idea of what Jeffs Games were like back then.

Is it ok if I link them? Jeff Minter released his older 8-bit games to the public.

bcass · Post by **bcass** » Tue Sep 25, 2007 1:25 am

It's OK yes. He gave permission to freely distribute all old Llamasoft games years ago:

http://www.medwaypvb.com/llamadloads.htm

For me, the most interesting ones are Sheep in Space, Ancipital, and Iridis Alpha. You need to read the manuals before playing.

For later (non-free games) the best are T2K, T3K, and GridRunner++ (which you can still buy from the Llamasoft website).

Afterbirth · Post by **Afterbirth** » Tue Sep 25, 2007 4:56 pm

After playing them grab RotMC2 for the c64 and grab the Vice Emu..

MJR · Post by **MJR** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 2:03 pm

The PC version is now out!

they've added another mode, which is less psychedelic. I agree that it is easier to play, but it is not quite as dazzling visually. Still, the 360 version is included intact as the 'acid mix'

here's a copypaste from llamasoft's announcement

You can download a demo of the game here:

http://www.llamasoft.co.uk/downloads/SpaceGiraffe.exe

You can purchase it from the Llamasoft store here:

http://www.llamasoft.co.uk/shop

And there are more details about this version right here:

http://www.llamasoft.co.uk/frontpage.php

antares · Post by **antares** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 2:25 pm

Who cares about the PC version? Jeff should have worked on Gridrunner ++ instead.

Sadly there are no news to be found about the development of Gridrunner but while surfing through his page I found this very interesting information:

Microsoft today confirmed the 2009 availability for the Xbox 360 version of Space Invaders Extreme, a game previously released for Nintendo DS and PSP. This version features revamped graphics with new visualizers exclusive to the Xbox 360 created by Jeff Minter (Llamasoft), upbeat electronic tracks perfectly synched to gameplay and two multiplayer modes (VS and Co-op). Check the fact sheet for details and the first batch of screenshots from our gallery.

bcass · Post by **bcass** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 2:32 pm

The new PC version will be of considerable interest to those people who found the heavy psychedelic graphics in the original tough going. It has a new mode where the graphics have been toned-down considerably. It looks really nice actually. Also, the new GridRunner is called GridRunner+++ not ++. It is practically finished and is also due for release soon.

MJR · Post by **MJR** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 2:34 pm

antares wrote:Who cares about the PC version? Jeff should have worked on Gridrunner ++ instead.

I care, considerably, since I don't own Xbox 360.

mr_m0nks · Post by **mr_m0nks** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 2:41 pm

antares wrote:Who cares about the PC version? Jeff should have worked on Gridrunner ++ instead.

Sadly there are no news to be found about the development of Gridrunner but while surfing through his page I found this very interesting information:

Microsoft today confirmed the 2009 availability for the Xbox 360 version of Space Invaders Extreme, a game previously released for Nintendo DS and PSP. This version features revamped graphics with new visualizers exclusive to the Xbox 360 created by Jeff Minter (Llamasoft), upbeat electronic tracks perfectly synched to gameplay and two multiplayer modes (VS and Co-op). Check the fact sheet for details and the first batch of screenshots from our gallery.

Jeff Minter doing Space Invaders???

Now this I gotta see!!

MJR · Post by **MJR** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 2:44 pm

mr_m0nks wrote:revamped graphics with new visualizers exclusive to the Xbox 360 created by Jeff Minter (Llamasoft)

Jeff Minter doing Space Invaders???

Now this I gotta see!!

No, he's not developing space invaders. He is simply delivering visual effects for the background.

antares · Post by **antares** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 2:49 pm

MJR wrote:
antares wrote:Who cares about the PC version? Jeff should have worked on Gridrunner ++ instead.
I care, considerably, since I don't own Xbox 360.

I don't meant it literally I just wished he would have worked on the new game instead of rereleasing an old one.

mr_m0nks wrote: Jeff Minter doing Space Invaders???

Now this I gotta see!!

It's done by Backbone afaik but apparently they are using (new) Virtual Light Machine effects created by Jeff.