The Revolution controller, revealed at last

it290 · Post by **it290** » Fri Sep 16, 2005 7:20 pm

I'm excited. I do think the controller looks a little funky, and perhaps it won't be the best choice for the traditional game types we all know and love, but it is innovative, and hey, at least I'll actually be able to justify the price of Nintendo's system at launch.

I think the cool thing about this controller is that if the software is designed correctly, it should be pretty intuitive. That will be a big boon for Nintendo. Just think about all the people you know who aren't really into video games -- I've seen tons of people who won't play a lot of games because the controls are too confusing. Then think about some of the games that these people do enjoy playing - Super Monkey Ball, Katamari Damacy, Golden Tee, Marble Madness, Puzzle Bobble, etc. They all have simple, intuitive controls. If Nintendo can make controlling a 3D character in a 3D world feel more natural (and I'm not saying this device necessarily does that, but it has the potential to with good game design), they may sell the system to a lot of people who aren't really into games otherwise.

Super Laydock · Post by **Super Laydock** » Fri Sep 16, 2005 8:14 pm

at first glance: "WTF, this can't be it. It sucks big time!"

After reading up a bit more: "hmm could be cool!"

After watching a vid on the controller: "Kick ass!"

This shows a lot of potential. Now, if only they can use it to it's fullest!?

iatneH · Post by **iatneH** » Fri Sep 16, 2005 8:35 pm

Actually, thinking about this a bit more, yeah. I think it will be cool to see what kind of new games can be done with it.

Although I'm guessing many developers will just end up programming to use a GameCube controller as the main input device.

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Fri Sep 16, 2005 8:52 pm

Hahaa. I just saw the video of the controller in action. What was an interesting possibility from that? Imitation light gun, swatting flies... having to flick the remote upwards to "jump?" More repetitious tasks get to be more life-like! It's like a 5%/1 arm ridiculously awkward virtual reality. I can't wait until 2D shooter devs get with it and realize d-pad/stick control is boring.

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Fri Sep 16, 2005 9:50 pm

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=11573

Here's what I was saying:

Interestingly, Iwata also described the controller as providing a "new standard of gameplay for FPS games", pointing out that it allows a fresh degree of control over shooting and movement in such titles, while another demonstration suggested a survival horror game where the player could "intuitively explore in the dark with a flashlight".

YES.

SILENT HILL 5 WITH THIS, PLEASE.

gameoverDude · Post by **gameoverDude** » Fri Sep 16, 2005 9:58 pm

One interesting possibility with the controller is a console version of Konami's Tsurugi~The Sword. Simulating the sword motions from the arcade game would be a snap. Hopefully someone at Konami is thinking this as well and will decide to greenlight a Revolution port with juiced-up graphics.

TWITCHDOCTOR · Post by **TWITCHDOCTOR** » Fri Sep 16, 2005 11:20 pm

I don't think it will work very well for "traditional" games, but maybe for "virtual reality" type stuff...
I guess its a wait and see type deal here, as I've never been interested with virtual reality shit before.

So, you hold the controller like a toy plane and "fly" it through rings on the TV?
Maybe there is some potential there...if not, you will undoubtedly look like a dork for sure!!!
They should just let you hold a sensor in each hand, and with your arms outstretched and play "airplane" that way. Yes, tilting your arms to turn etc,etc...

BrianC · Post by **BrianC** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 1:51 am

http://cube.ign.com/articles/651/651559p1.html The controller with have a special shell for it to function like a Wavebird, though the picture shown is a mock up.

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 2:18 am

BrianC wrote:http://cube.ign.com/articles/651/651559p1.html The controller with have a special shell for it to function like a Wavebird, though the picture shown is a mock up.

Mock up or not, that's exactly the worst thing about the new controller: when you choose a direction, you must be sure of it and follow without compromises.

If they say "don't worry, it will have an add-on so it can turn into a traditional pad" then I feel insulted.

Since Revolution is already compatible with NGC pads, the remote pad should stay true to its nature.

It kind of when Microsoft announces retrocompatibility "but only to a certain extent", or when it says the 360 will have HD "but only the expensive version of it"... I feel this is very negative message to the audience.

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 2:27 am

BrianC wrote:http://cube.ign.com/articles/651/651559p1.html The controller with have a special shell for it to function like a Wavebird, though the picture shown is a mock up.

They really thought this out.

The n00b · Post by **The n00b** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 2:30 am

I really don't think this controller will kill Nintendo. After all, Nintendo can just pump out "innovative" stuff like "Mario Party 89: Who gives a shit we're making money off this crap so shutup, Mario Tennis, Mario baseball, Mario Croque, Mario Sexadvice, Mario What the hell ever, etc.

BrianC · Post by **BrianC** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 2:46 am

Turrican wrote:
BrianC wrote:http://cube.ign.com/articles/651/651559p1.html The controller with have a special shell for it to function like a Wavebird, though the picture shown is a mock up.
Mock up or not, that's exactly the worst thing about the new controller: when you choose a direction, you must be sure of it and follow without compromises.

If they say "don't worry, it will have an add-on so it can turn into a traditional pad" then I feel insulted.

Since Revolution is already compatible with NGC pads, the remote pad should stay true to its nature.

It kind of when Microsoft announces retrocompatibility "but only to a certain extent", or when it says the 360 will have HD "but only the expensive version of it"... I feel this is very negative message to the audience.

The pointer will still remain on and the shell will have dual analog, so it won't be exactly like the GCN controller. I acutally like the idea since it allows more freedom and it's not like all games will require it.

The n00b wrote:I really don't think this controller will kill Nintendo. After all, Nintendo can just pump out "innovative" stuff like "Mario Party 89: Who gives a shit we're making money off this crap so shutup, Mario Tennis, Mario baseball, Mario Croque, Mario Sexadvice, Mario What the hell ever, etc.

n00b, not everyone who plays a Nintendo product is a mindless idiot. Many of those games aren't bought just becuase they have Mario in them, but becuase they are actually well designed games. BTW, Hudson makes the Mario Party games, not Nintendo and their similar games without Mario actually turned out far worse. News flash, n00b, many people who buy Nintendo products have a mind and don't buy them only becuase a familiar character is in them or only becuase they are made by Nintendo. In fact, most people here that play Nintendo products, including me, own plenty of non Nintendo systems too.

The n00b · Post by **The n00b** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 3:09 am

BrianC wrote:
Turrican wrote:
BrianC wrote:http://cube.ign.com/articles/651/651559p1.html The controller with have a special shell for it to function like a Wavebird, though the picture shown is a mock up.
Mock up or not, that's exactly the worst thing about the new controller: when you choose a direction, you must be sure of it and follow without compromises.

If they say "don't worry, it will have an add-on so it can turn into a traditional pad" then I feel insulted.

Since Revolution is already compatible with NGC pads, the remote pad should stay true to its nature.

It kind of when Microsoft announces retrocompatibility "but only to a certain extent", or when it says the 360 will have HD "but only the expensive version of it"... I feel this is very negative message to the audience.
The pointer will still remain on and the shell will have dual analog, so it won't be exactly like the GCN controller. I acutally like the idea since it allows more freedom and it's not like all games will require it.

The n00b wrote:I really don't think this controller will kill Nintendo. After all, Nintendo can just pump out "innovative" stuff like "Mario Party 89: Who gives a shit we're making money off this crap so shutup, Mario Tennis, Mario baseball, Mario Croque, Mario Sexadvice, Mario What the hell ever, etc.
n00b, not everyone who plays a Nintendo product is a mindless idiot. Many of those games aren't good just becuase they have Mario in them, but becuase they are actually well designed games. BTW, Hudson makes the Mario Party games, not Nintendo and their similar games without Mario actually turned out far worse. News flash, n00b, many people who buy Nintendo products have a mind and don't buy them only becuase a familiar character is in them or only becuase they are made by Nintendo. In fact, most people here that play Nintendo products, including me, own plenty of non Nintendo systems too.

Breaking news BrianC: Nintendo can sometimes be worse than Bungie and Electronic Arts when it comes to whoring out franchises. While many of those games don't exactly suck, far too many are just average franchise titles. I count Mario Sunshine among these titles. Nintendo might be prone to innovation at times but surefire sellers are still their bread and butter.

Thunder Force · Post by **Thunder Force** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 4:15 am

gameoverDude wrote:One interesting possibility with the controller is a console version of Konami's Tsurugi~The Sword. Simulating the sword motions from the arcade game would be a snap. Hopefully someone at Konami is thinking this as well and will decide to greenlight a Revolution port with juiced-up graphics.

Indeed let's hope. That's one of my favorite arcade games. I'm sure we'll see plenty of exciting titles like that on the new Nintendo system. I really hope 3rd party developers will come to the table for this one, and support Nintendo's hardware to bring us exciting new game concepts.

I don't see much application for shmups, but plenty of new genres waiting to be born.

username · Post by **username** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 5:26 am

You know, when I saw the controller unveiled I figured that the "hardcore" gamers and the "cool" gamers would be the ones to react the most violently against it. Seeing the responses from many "hardcore" shmuppers here confirms this belief.

First off, this controller may outright suck for many older traditional genres. While it should be godly for FPS or RTS games, I don't see how a traditional fighting game would work with it. Heck, I don't see traditional shooters working on the system, although I would be interested to see how the genre could be adapted to this controller.

I like how it could be argued that we are all starting over. Whether you've played games for a couple of weeks or a couple of decades, you'll all be starting fresh with this. I like that. Let's try a new direction. It's not like the PS3 and 360 won't be there for your traditional gaming needs.

We are also forgetting the economics of this. The Revolution is supposedly underpowered, and I don't think it even supports high definition. However, I'd bet good money that the system will be cheaper to make, and it's launch price should be a good $100+ less than the launch price of either the PS3 or 360. In addition, gaming budgets on those two systems are expected to go through the roof, with 8 figure budgets becoming increasingly frequent (that's $10+ million, although i'm sure many games will "just" cost several million). Now, given that it is less powerful, and the fact that the graphics seem to be secondary to the controller, gaming budgets will probably be notably smaller on the Revolution, with the more important factor being the ideas theoretically. Add in that Nintendo is sitting on top of 6 or 7 billion dollars and still has their profitable portables, and I think the rumors of their death have been greatly exaggerated.

Now, does this mean I think it'll work? I don't know. PS3 is probably still my next-gen system of choice. However, Nintendo wasn't well suited to fight for the exact same territory as Sony and MS, and I don't think that they really wanted to. They've gone on their own path and have already carved out an identity. They've set themselves out as different, they have the entire back catalogue of Nintendo games that can be DL'd onto the system, and it'll probably be cheaper to buy and develop on. It's... an interesting strategy, but it is definitely not without logic.

I do worry a bit about arm strain, although supposedly it is sensitive to very slight movements, requiring only a small flick of the wrists and not full waves like shown in the videos, although we won't know for sure for a little while now.

So yeah, it's different, many old types of games won't work with it, but there is a thought process at work, and it just may work out for them.

Specineff · Post by **Specineff** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 5:56 am

It supports VGA, and VGA=HDTV.

Bkeela · Post by **Bkeela** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 6:21 am

Awkward control mechanics aside, what I fear is that if I want to play Super Mario 128, I will be forced to use the remote control. Nintendo will force this innovation on all the new games, whether we like it or not. Same problem seems to exist for the DS. It will be the same old game play, crippled with new control mechanics.

I don't know about anyone else, but the DS's innovation hasn't blown me away. I feel ambivalent towards getting one. The idea of Nintendogs certainly doesn't get me too excited. The idea of having to sit at a table to play because my left hand becomes tired from holding the stupid thing kind of negates the entire purpose of hand held gaming.

As a marketing strategy, this is probably Nintendo's only option. They obviously cannot compete with the two big boys, and who would want them to anyway?

One aspect of this has me curious though. When the joystick was replaced with the game pad, I barely noticed. It just seemed right. Likewise, as controllers were improved upon, I just accepted it as a natural, organic progression. Why am I so revolted by this new control scheme?

Specineff · Post by **Specineff** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 6:32 am

I think it's because it's more limiting than liberating. At least that's how I'd feel if I was a developer. ("Dang. I have to make sure my game works with this controller")

sethsez · Post by **sethsez** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 6:57 am

Specineff wrote:It supports VGA, and VGA=HDTV.

VGA is 640x480, right? That's not HD, it's just progressive scan. HD is 720p or 1080i minimum, which is why TVs that support progressive scan but not those higher resolutions aren't called HDTVs.

Specineff · Post by **Specineff** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 7:09 am

Oh, ok. I mixed up VGA and SVGA. (That's gotta be HDTV, right?)

Marc · Post by **Marc** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 7:15 am

Turrican Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 2:18 am Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

BrianC wrote:
http://cube.ign.com/articles/651/651559p1.html The controller with have a special shell for it to function like a Wavebird, though the picture shown is a mock up.

Mock up or not, that's exactly the worst thing about the new controller: when you choose a direction, you must be sure of it and follow without compromises.

If they say "don't worry, it will have an add-on so it can turn into a traditional pad" then I feel insulted.

Since Revolution is already compatible with NGC pads, the remote pad should stay true to its nature.

It kind of when Microsoft announces retrocompatibility "but only to a certain extent", or when it says the 360 will have HD "but only the expensive version of it"... I feel this is very negative message to the audience.

Won't be exactly like the Wavebird if the pen thingy still functions though will it? Now an FPS where I'm only using one stick to move and the actual movement of the pad to aim would be a lot closer to keys/mouse control than our current alternatives. Or again, the Slient Hill example mentioned several times above.

As long as the option of standard control is offered where possible, instead of Nintendo forcing their idea of the way the game should be controlled on me, I'm game.

AAA · Post by **AAA** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 7:29 am

i'm going to keep an open mind about this, some great games will still come through

i have to ask who will make games specifically for this controller - nintendo will for sure and have doubtless had designs in mind for a while now.
the 3rd party publishers though, who release games on multi-platform? theres a strong chance the revolution version could now be ignored in favour of 'more conventional' consoles/controls.
not everyone will have or want to buy a separate gamecube controller, theres added cost and theres a perception that by buying a GC pad to play rev games is a step backward. great marketing ploy nintendo!

those who make games especially for the controller could reap big reward - but there needs to be a lot of innovation/risk management which i don't think many publishers can truly handle.

personally i want a shit hot Star Wars one on one lightsaber fighting game........
i'm sure that would be viable

MOSQUITO FIGHTER · Post by **MOSQUITO FIGHTER** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 8:33 am

I think a Castelvania game with accurate whip physics would be fun on the Revolution. Imagine whipping those skeletons into oblivion. I think innovation is the way to go for Nintendo. But then again my DS would probably be collecting dust if it did not have Meteos.

Dandy J · Post by **Dandy J** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 8:42 am

1. Don't diss Mario Party, for it is the shit.
2. For anyone saying "oh developers have to conform to the controller!", are you serious? Nintendo consoles have always been about the exclusives, and that goes double now with this new controller. The developer will conform to the controller because they will want to do new and exciting things with the platform, not because they want to port GTA5 to the Revolution. Did you seriously think that you'd be buying a Revolution for 3rd party ports?

Specineff · Post by **Specineff** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 8:45 am

AAA wrote:personally i want a shit hot Star Wars one on one lightsaber fighting game........
i'm sure that would be viable

I thought of it first! I PWN T3H IDEA!

TWITCHDOCTOR · Post by **TWITCHDOCTOR** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:27 am

MOSQUITO FIGHTER wrote:I think a Castelvania game with accurate whip physics would be fun on the Revolution. Imagine whipping those skeletons into oblivion. I think innovation is the way to go for Nintendo. But then again my DS would probably be collecting dust if it did not have Meteos.

When I read this I get a very bad feeling...

The only other "gimmick" type controller to succed was/is the light gun. These can be quite fun, and accurate.
But still, they can be quirky, and most of the time aren't 100 percent accurate.

So much for whiping skeletons in virtual reality with a flick of the wrist.

I can see it now, analog controller in one hand, and the "Flick-Stick" remote in the other. How would you jump? Press the HUGE A button?
It just doens't seem right to me.

The new Nintendo is for a new audience of video game players.
Which is why some of us "hardcore"(I don't like that term anymore, as its been abused, and mis-used) gamers see it as less than ideal. Because we now realize that things are changing. It seems to me that Nintendo is heading towards the "WOW" effect of Virtual Reality worlds and experiences...yes, "experiences", beacuse they sure won't be "traditional" games as we once knew.

it290 · Post by **it290** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 3:57 pm

Twitch, I think you're forgetting something that has been mentioned by many others -- the fact that Nintendo has been behind virtually every significant controller development since the NES days. The d-pad, the analog stick, vibration, and shoulder buttons were all popularized by Nintendo. Those could be branded as 'gimmicks' as well, but they're now accepted and necessary parts of modern controllers. If this thing takes off, we may well see it being imitated by the competitors once again, maybe even as add-on controllers for the PS3 and 360.

Specineff · Post by **Specineff** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 7:21 pm

BUT, all of those were created by Gumpei Yokoi. That man did a lot for the company. Nintendo hasn't been the same since he left them and then passed away.

Vibration and real force feedback were available before on PC's. I hadn't been implemented in a single controller the way Nintendo did. But kudos to them for doing so.

Dylan1CC · Post by **Dylan1CC** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 7:33 pm

bloodflowers wrote:First comment from Stormwatch - nails this right on the head.

What an idiotic idea for a controller. If anything at all was needed to _ensure_ the absolute failure of the Revolution outside of Japan, that is what it would look like.

No offense, but some of you folks are overreacting and need to do a little research. You DON'T have to use the "remote" to play games like Metroid and Mario. Both Iwata and Jim Merrick, one of Nintendo's marketing execs confirmed a traditional controller "shell" will be available at launch which will allow you to play games traditionally while still allowing you to gently move your wrist for looking, pointing, control camera, strafing, ect using all of the the motion sensor features yet in a "normal" controller.

Yes, it'd be better if the "shell" was included with the system but Nintendo needs to give devs at least some forced incentive to make games that utilize its unique functions. Mock up from IGN based on limited details that they already know:

So IOW, the "remote" is like a really high tech Dreamcast VMU from the future. At first I thought "This is stupid." But when you figure out all the applications it has, flashlight in a mystery game, a sword, a lightgun, and the fact it can be put into a traditional shell as mentioned before or simply turned around to be used for NES games...I dunno about you but I think that is really cool.

But of course people who wanted a more traditional controller are now pissing and moaning that "wahhhh, it's just a GC controller, I hate the remote but a GC pad isn't different enough."

When I first saw nothing but the remote I was really put off too but I now think Nintendo is really on to something here. And all the editors who have tried it say that it feels amazingly smooth and intuitive.

kemical · Post by **kemical** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:11 pm

this is cool and it can be cool, it depends on what games are made and how they use it , it will offer better immersion and interactivity opportunities